# pump wiring



## micromind (Mar 9, 2008)

On a 230 volt circuit such as this one, there isn't a neutral. There are two hots, and a ground. One of the hots goes to L1, the other to L2, and the ground goes under a screw (usually green) somewhere on the frame of the motor. 

A 230 volt motor will run on 115, but it'll have 1/4 of its rated HP. Speed will be the same (if it ever gets there). 

Rob


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## konafixits (Jun 17, 2008)

Thanks for the reply Rob. I tried this, the only difference being that I connected the neutral to a screw on the motor body. When I flipped the breaker, nothing happened. I did do a poor job of connecting the bare ground wire to the pump body because the screw was rusted out but I figured if the pump worked then I would correct the ground connection afterward. Could this be the reason that it did not run?


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## BillyD (Mar 15, 2008)

You don't need a ground or neutral for it to work on 220. If I remember correctly to switch a motor from 220 to 110 you have to move a jumper on the start switch. Re-check your wiring plate on the motor.


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

BillyD said:


> You don't need a ground or neutral for it to work on 220.


Billy, I truly hope you included "ground" in this sentence by mistake. 
A motor most certainly DOES need a circuit ground.


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

konafixits said:


> I should add that I'm only using the pump to transfer water from one tank to another, so I'm not concerned with code requirements.


So you are using an electric motor pump at 240v to move water and you are not concerned with code???? 





konafixits said:


> ..., the only difference being that I connected the neutral to a screw on the motor body.


Listen to Rob, there is NO neutral required for this circuit. DO NOT hook up the white to anything.

Did you find the rating sticker on the motor? This will tell you exactly what wires to move to where to convert it to 230v. You DO NOT simply hook the wires up the same as 120v.


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## chris75 (Aug 25, 2007)

One other thing, if you hook the pump up with 240v and the pump is on the 120v setting, it will probably never work again....


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## BillyD (Mar 15, 2008)

Speedy I was just stating that he only needed two hot wires for the pump to run. Not implying it would be safe or proper.


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## J. V. (Jun 1, 2007)

The OP must look for the pump motor wiring diagram if he wants to change the voltage. If it's a dual voltage motor, which it sounds that it is, it could have as many as 8 wires to contend with. It could have start and run caps too. The nameplate should have the wiring diagram on it. As Chris mentioned if this motor is connected wrong, most likely it will never run again. Also, rotation on a single phase motor cannot be manipulated by swapping wires around. In most every case the interchange of leads 5 & 8 will do the trick.

If no diagram is available on the motor, Google "NEMA Terminal Markings and Connections". Then look for single phase motors.
You can also check EASA's website. I think they have the diagrams for all NEMA motors and much more information.


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## chris75 (Aug 25, 2007)

J. V. said:


> The OP must look for the pump motor wiring diagram if he wants to change the voltage. If it's a dual voltage motor, which it sounds that it is, it could have as many as 8 wires to contend with. It could have start and run caps too. The nameplate should have the wiring diagram on it. As Chris mentioned if this motor is connected wrong, most likely it will never run again. Also, rotation on a single phase motor cannot be manipulated by swapping wires around. In most every case the interchange of leads 5 & 8 will do the trick.
> 
> If no diagram is available on the motor, Google "NEMA Terminal Markings and Connections". Then look for single phase motors.
> You can also check EASA's website. I think they have the diagrams for all NEMA motors and much more information.


This nice thing about pool motors, is that they usually go with the KISS method, the last one I wired had a selector switch for voltage selection ..


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## konafixits (Jun 17, 2008)

Thanks for the replies everyone. The faded label on the pump says only 230v. Inside the cap there are only two terminals marked L1 & L2. When I tested the pump on 110v hook-up (hot to L1 and Neutral to L2 with a ground connection) the pump worked albeit slowly and it "pulsed" as it ran, it also got hot very quickly. As far as code is concerned, I live in rural Hawaii and the pump is only being used to transfer water between storage tanks about 120 ft apart. I will recheck all my connections and re-do the ground hook-up, leave the neutral off and see what happens. Stay tuned.


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## wirenut1110 (Apr 26, 2008)

Hawaii? Hell, just buy me a ticket and I'll bring you a pump.:thumbup:


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## konafixits (Jun 17, 2008)

With the cost of airfares, make it two pumps. Well, I tried the hook-up, L1 & L2 to the hots and a good ground, NOTHING. I tested all the connections. I even retested the pump for 110v, it still runs. Now what, could it be an internal issue with the pump, is there a better place to ground, (I just connected to a screw on the back of the plate).


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## chris75 (Aug 25, 2007)

konafixits said:


> With the cost of airfares, make it two pumps. Well, I tried the hook-up, L1 & L2 to the hots and a good ground, NOTHING. I tested all the connections. I even retested the pump for 110v, it still runs. Now what, could it be an internal issue with the pump, is there a better place to ground, (I just connected to a screw on the back of the plate).


The ground wont make the pump run, its a safety feature, anyways, you sure you truly have 220 at the motor, and the motor is correctly wired for 220?

where did you get the 220 to test the pump?


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## wirenut1110 (Apr 26, 2008)

Hopefully he's not using 2 single pole breakers on the same phase or a tandem


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## chris75 (Aug 25, 2007)

wirenut1110 said:


> Hopefully he's not using 2 single pole breakers on the same phase or a tandem



Kinda what I was thinking.


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## konafixits (Jun 17, 2008)

OK guys, I can do a lot of things, but when it comes to 220v as you can see, I'm clueless. Yes, I am pulling two legs off two single pole breakers ganged together. I must add that I'm coming off a subpanel that is about 120' from my main panel. The connection between the panels is 8/3 solid wire coming off of a 40 amp ganged breaker. At the subpanel I split the two hots one to each side. From the subpanel I have 12/3 wire going to my pump about 30' away. So pulling two 110v wires from my panel will not give me 220v? I tried pulling the hot from the subpanel first one wire from each side with two separate breakers, then from one side with a ganged breaker. Same result, Nothing.


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## chris75 (Aug 25, 2007)

konafixits said:


> OK guys, I can do a lot of things, but when it comes to 220v as you can see, I'm clueless. Yes, I am pulling two legs off two single pole breakers ganged together. I must add that I'm coming off a subpanel that is about 120' from my main panel. The connection between the panels is 8/3 solid wire coming off of a 40 amp ganged breaker. At the subpanel I split the two hots one to each side. From the subpanel I have 12/3 wire going to my pump about 30' away. So pulling two 110v wires from my panel will not give me 220v? I tried pulling the hot from the subpanel first one wire from each side with two separate breakers, then from one side with a ganged breaker. Same result, Nothing.


 
Your breakers should be placed on top of one another. not across from one another. and use a meter to double check your work.


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## wirenut1110 (Apr 26, 2008)

Can you test voltage at the pump at make it sure it's 240. Just doesn't sound like it. is there any other 240 stuff running off this panel?


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## chris75 (Aug 25, 2007)

Can you take a picture of what you have hooked up at the panel and the motor?


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## wirenut1110 (Apr 26, 2008)

Come on Kona, we need to get this resolved so I can go watch lifetime with my g/f:bangin:


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## konafixits (Jun 17, 2008)

Believe me, I'd rather be doing anything else but this. I need to get a hold of a voltage meter, I suspect there is probably a voltage drop with that long of a run. However, my 110 stuff all seems to work OK. I operate several power tools off the subpanel with no problems. Not all at the same time however. I do have the breakers stacked, I'll forward a picture of the connections. After the voltage check I'll let you guys know what I come up with. Thanks for all the input. Aloha.


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## micromind (Mar 9, 2008)

I'd bet that the feed to the sub panel is only 120. There may be 2 hots, but I'd bet they're both on the same leg. That would explain why the 120 volt stuff works, but no 240. If this is the case, it must be fixed, not just because of the 240 volt pump, but also because the neutral could easily be overloaded. Neutral current on the same leg will add, on opposite legs it will subtract. There's no overcurrent protection on a neutral, it'll just burn up if overloaded. 

Rob


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## J. V. (Jun 1, 2007)

Chris,
Yes, I have seen the voltage switch type motor and the jumper type. But at that moment we had no idea what he had. Now that we know it is straight 240 this should be corrected in short order.


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