# Need help wiring old 220v fan motor



## Ultrarunner2017 (Oct 1, 2008)

The drawing is unreadable. I copied it into Adobe Photoshop, enlarged the hell out of it, and I still couldn't read it well enough to be able to offer any help based on it.

Maybe try Googling the make and model and see what you get?

FW


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## Stubbie (Jan 7, 2007)

Connect L1 to Black (high speed). The capaciter has both the common (c) for the mains winding and brown for the start winding the single wire coming from the fuse block to the capaciter will be your L2.


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## HotTommy (Feb 11, 2009)

OK, here's another photo of the wiring diagram. I can't get much better because my camera's focus won't let me get closer. But I can email you the photo so you can see it better than on the web hosting site.


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## HotTommy (Feb 11, 2009)

Stubbie said:


> Connect L1 to Black (high speed). The capaciter has both the common (c) for the mains winding and brown for the start winding the single wire coming from the fuse block to the capaciter will be your L2.


I don't know what L1 and L2 are. Explain please.


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## Stubbie (Jan 7, 2007)

Your fan is 240 volt (you said it was) you will have 3 wires the hots are L1 and L2 and you will have a ground wire. Be sure the motor is 240 volt and not 120 volt it could be either but the diagram your showing is 240 volt.


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## HotTommy (Feb 11, 2009)

Let me say this back to be sure I've got it right. One hot wire will go to the capacitor. The other hot wire will go to the black wire on the motor. The neutral wire will go to the capacitor. One white wire from the motor will go to the neutral fitting on the capacitor. One brown wire from the motor will go to the hot fitting on the capacitor. (In other words, the brown and black wires from the motor will go to the hot wires, the white wire from the motor will go to the neutral and the capacitor will be wired in parallel with the motor). The remaining red, blue and yellow wires from the motor will not connect to anything. Is that right?


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## Stubbie (Jan 7, 2007)

Yes except the white is not a neutral. It is just the common hot for the motor windings when the start winding is energized and the main winding is energized. The start winding will be removed from the circuit by a centrifugal switch inside the motor when it gets up to speed. 240 volt needs no neutral only 120 volt loads need it.

If you look at the diagram a low voltage relay closes a contact to energize one hot line to the motor and start it. You will need a switch that will manually or other wise do the same thing. The circuit is from black through the white to the other line hot once the brown is out of the loop.

If the motor was 120 volt the black would be your neutral and the hot going to the capacitor would be your ungrounded conductor. Then the common would connect to your speed wire. A neutral would not connect to a capacitor.


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## HotTommy (Feb 11, 2009)

I didn't fully understand Stubbie's above post, but I tried wiring the fan according to my last post above. When I switched the power on, the fan started and ran quietly. When I shut off power to the hot line going to the capacitor/brown wire to the motor, the fan immediately jumped to a much higher speed. If I reconnect that hot line, the fan again slows. If I disconnect power to the hot line connected to the black wire on the motor, everything stops. This makes me think the fan motor runs better on 110 volts than on 220 volts. I'm confused and Stubbie's explanations are little above me. Can someone offer a explanation/suggestion about wiring this motor?


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## ctsmiths (Jan 17, 2009)

HotTommy said:


> I didn't fully understand Stubbie's above post, but I tried wiring the fan according to my last post above. When I switched the power on, the fan started and ran quietly. When I shut off power to the hot line going to the capacitor/brown wire to the motor, the fan immediately jumped to a much higher speed. If I reconnect that hot line, the fan again slows. If I disconnect power to the hot line connected to the black wire on the motor, everything stops. This makes me think the fan motor runs better on 110 volts than on 220 volts. I'm confused and Stubbie's explanations are little above me. Can someone offer a explanation/suggestion about wiring this motor?


 You have the wires jumped wrong, Can you get a bigger and clearer pic than what you have? of the print.


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## ctsmiths (Jan 17, 2009)

From what I can see I belive you need to wire the brown & black together and to one side of the 240, the white & blue together, and then only the red to the other side of the 240. You also need a 2 pole single throw motor switch for this so it only comes on with 240 and breaks both lines when off. Again this is only going by the print you have posted and its hard to read no guarantees.


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## ctsmiths (Jan 17, 2009)

The yellow could either be capped or tied to the red im not sure.


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## HotTommy (Feb 11, 2009)

ctsmiths -

Thanks for taking time to reply. 
Tommy


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## Yoyizit (Jul 11, 2008)

I Thought L1 and N and L2 are 120v and neutral (0v) and 120v with 240v from L1 to L2.


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## Stubbie (Jan 7, 2007)

Ok I thought you understood but I guess I misunderstood that you did.The wiring diagram is for 240 volt motor.

Black = High Speed
Blue = Meduim speed (cap this wire off it is unused)
Yellow = Medium low (cap this wire off it is unused)
Red = Medium (cap this wire off it is unused

Connect the black (high speed) to one hot wire

There is a white wire coming from the motor it is common and goes to the main run winding. At the capacitor this wire is connected on a spade with another wire this other wire is your other hot wire.
On the other side of the capacitor is the brown it goes to the motor start winding. 

For a 240 motor the windings are in series not parallel. Parallel is for 120 volt motors.

A centrifugal switch in the brown wire (inside the motor)will take that series circuit out when it opens after the motor gets up to a certain rpm then the white coming from the motor connected to the capacitor with the other hot wire becomes your series run circuit at high speed....clear??

You keep mentioning 220 and 120 and neutrals so what does the motor nameplate say??

Furnace blower motors are one or the other.. most are 120 volt but there are 230 volt models also. It would be extremely uncommon for the motor to be dual voltage rated for a furnace application.

Maybe you could post a diagram of how you wired it and we can give you the corrections.

If you connect all those other speed wires in any way you will burn your motor up and it will be toast. When you install the furnace it is usually wired medium. If you want to change speed you disconnect the medium speed from the hot and reconnect to the speed wire you want as identified on the diagram. It really is easy to see it on the diagram. You never change the wiring at the capacitor.


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## Stubbie (Jan 7, 2007)

ctsmiths said:


> From what I can see I belive you need to wire the brown & black together and to one side of the 240, the white & blue together, and then only the red to the other side of the 240. You also need a 2 pole single throw motor switch for this so it only comes on with 240 and breaks both lines when off. Again this is only going by the print you have posted and its hard to read no guarantees.


This will not be liked by the motor.....:no:


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## HotTommy (Feb 11, 2009)

Stubbie said:


> Ok I thought you understood but I guess I misunderstood that you did.The wiring diagram is for 240 volt motor.
> 
> Black = High Speed
> Blue = Meduim speed (cap this wire off it is unused)
> ...


Thanks for your patience. My shop wiring has a four wire setup. I understand them to be two hots, one neutral and one ground. I understand how to attach the two hot wires (L1 and L2) per your instructions. I assume the neutral is not used and the ground is attached to the motor/fan housing. I'll try it tomorrow and report back.

The nameplate on my motor allows me to read everything but the voltage. That is covered by a support bracket that is riveted to the motor. The furnace system it was taken from is clearly labeled as a 240 volt system. The system is also labeled as a Bryant model 320-960D. The system is so old that I have found no reference to it on the Internet.

The good news is that I have about ten more of these old fans to play with, so it's no great loss if I cook one along the way.


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## Stubbie (Jan 7, 2007)

Ok...the diagram is very hard to read so just to make sure I am correct look on your diagram and tell me the colors that are connected to the capacitor. I know one is brown I'm reading the other as white...is that correct?

Black is a no brainer but it is possible that I have the white wrong.


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## HotTommy (Feb 11, 2009)

There are six wires coming from the motor. The colors are red, black, white, blue, yellow and brown. The two wires from motor to the capacitor are colors white and brown.


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## Stubbie (Jan 7, 2007)

Ok how did your wiring differ from this if it did??


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## Yoyizit (Jul 11, 2008)

HotTommy said:


> so it's no great loss if I cook one along the way.


Make ohmmeter measurements before you apply power so you can tell if it's cooked later or just not running for other reasons.
With six wires plus the motor shell this is 6+5+4+3+2+1 measurements.


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## ctsmiths (Jan 17, 2009)

Stubbie said:


> This will not be liked by the motor.....:no:


 Well, like I said no guarantees its really hard to see the print and I couldnt tell if wires were jumping or connecting together at the cross points. I see what you re saying about high ,med ,low, couldnt really read the top at all. I havent run into too many 220v single phase, mostly three phase high voltage and 110v single phase, but I do mostly indrustrial. 
But I still think that he should be using a double pole single throw or the motor will be energized if its 220 and the switch, plus the arc from starting is too much for a regular switch, he needs a switch designed for motors.


*Switching*
Low Voltage (110) Use a "Single Pole/Single Throw" switch since only the black wire needs to be switched.






High Voltage (220) Use a "Double Pole/Single Throw" since both the black and white wires need to be switched.
This configuration may also be used on a Low Voltage machine if there is a possibility it will be changed to High Voltage later on.


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## HotTommy (Feb 11, 2009)

The drawing below is how I wired the motor for the test I described in an earlier post. Based on your subsequent post, I should have connected the second Hot lead (L2) to the capacitor post where the white wire from the motor is connected. And I should not have the neutral shop wire connected to any of the motor or capacitor wiring.

BTW, I have been trying without success to figure out how to upload photo directly to his site. In the mean time, I'm uploading photos to Flickr and it insists on shrinking them to eye straining sizes. I'm trying to make it easier for you, but I haven't figured out how yet.


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## Stubbie (Jan 7, 2007)

ctsmiths said:


> Well, like I said no guarantees its really hard to see the print and I couldnt tell if wires were jumping or connecting together at the cross points. I see what you re saying about high ,med ,low, couldnt really read the top at all. I havent run into too many 220v single phase, mostly three phase high voltage and 110v single phase, but I do mostly indrustrial.
> But I still think that he should be using a double pole single throw or the motor will be energized if its 220 and the switch, plus the arc from starting is too much for a regular switch, he needs a switch designed for motors.
> 
> 
> ...



No problem... just pointing it out and yes the diagram is hard to read. Most fan motors have independent leads for both L1 and L2. The most common for 230 volt for high speed is a connection to a yellow and black. With a brown and brown/white stripe going to the capacitor. But this diagram he is showing shows all leads but white and brown as speed leads. I can't tell where the one that comes off the capacitor goes to and we still don't know for sure this motor of his is 240 volt. I'm not sure how he is determining it and he keeps talking 120 and 240 he needs to get the name plate voltage some how some way. So I don't know if he is trying both voltages on the motor or what??

Code only requires one pole to be broken on a 230 volt single phase motor disconnect. 2 pole is fine. This motor is fractional hp so any 15 or 20 amp switch will work


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## wirenut1110 (Apr 26, 2008)

If you're talking about the white capacitor wire it goes to the fuse block and then to the "electric control box"


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## wirenut1110 (Apr 26, 2008)

See if you can see this better


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## HotTommy (Feb 11, 2009)

OK, here's the longer version of what happened on my first test. I didn't invest in a SPDT switch yet because I didn't know if this nearly 40 year old motor and fan assembly would work until I tested it. So, I shut off the two circuit breakers to the 240 volt circuit, wired the motor directly to it and turned the CBs back on. The motor started to run at a low speed. When I went to turn the CBs off, one CB clicked off before the other and the fan immediately went to a much higher speed. Clearly, since only once circuit was hot, it was running on 110 volts and not 240. Being curious, I tried other combinations of CBs off and on and reported them in my earlier posts. I have no reason to believe the motor was intended to run on 110. I was just curious as to why it ran faster on 110 than on 240. Apparently it was because it was wired wrong at that time.


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## wirenut1110 (Apr 26, 2008)

How are these breakers situated in the panel? Top/bottom side by side?


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## Stubbie (Jan 7, 2007)

Wirenuts diagram is much easier to see. Your tests confirm that it ran on 120 volts becaue you had the neutral connected to the capacitor. When the hot connected to the brown dropped out when the breaker tripped the motor only saw 120 volts and sped up cause you had a good circuit.

If you connect as I drew the diagram and forget that neutral and this is a 240 volt motor I'm pretty certain it will run fine. However if this is a 120 volt motor and you see a lot of sparks flying and maybe smoke then it will be too late...just a warning.

EDIT: Just so you understand 240 volts does not use a neutral.


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