# Drywall - Horizontal or vertical



## moneymgmt (Apr 30, 2007)

I've learned it depends on dimensions and where the seams fall. If your wall is +/- 8' then you want to go vertically so you have no end seams, which are harder to mud.


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## yummy mummy (Sep 11, 2006)

The correct way of hanging drywall, (what the pros do) is hanging drywall horizontally. (horizontal seams are less noticeable to the eye and easier to mud) Though I have seen them hung vertically also.

I have just finished hanging my drywall horizontally. I placed a couple of nails 48 1/2 inches (need a little extra room to situate it on the wall) from the ceiling and then I got my very unhandy husband to help me lift it up on the wall and let it rest on the nails so that I can screw the sheet in. 

Very easy. 
(If yummy mummy can do it, so can you......:laughing: )

Good luck.


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## AtlanticWBConst. (May 12, 2006)

Residential work is always horizontal (Sheets laid down). 

Think about it:

Example: 12' wall x 8' high.......You install a 12' sheet laid horizontally = *12'* of seam to tape and coat.

12' wall x 8' high......You install sheets standing up = 3 vertical seams x 8' high = *24'* of seams to tape and coat.


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## AtlanticWBConst. (May 12, 2006)

moneymgmt said:


> I've learned it depends on dimensions and where the seams fall. If your wall is +/- 8' then you want to go vertically so you have no end seams, which are harder to mud.


Yes, there are other factors that affect sheet layout too.


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## kgphoto (Dec 2, 2007)

There are commercially available devices to hold drywall in place while you attach it. These can be as simple as little clips or crank operated drywall lifts.
Check out TelPro and Hercule lifts on YOU-tube.


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## slinku2020 (Nov 8, 2007)

Thank you all for your suggestions. 
My basement is going to be one big open area (L-shaped) without rooms. Becase of space restrictions (along the stairs), the largest drywall sheet I could get into the basement was 4x8. 

Reading all the responses, it seems like structurally it doesn't matter whether I hang the sheets vertically or horizontally. It's only the ease of finishing that makes horizontal more preferable. 
Also, I'm going to put in drop ceiling so I don't have to worry about wall to ceiling finishing (which seems to be one of the more difficult tasks).

Thanks!


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## kgphoto (Dec 2, 2007)

Actually there is a structural betterment from putting them in horizontally. It also reduces cracks and reduces the amount of seams to finish and hides imperfections in the framing more easily. Since your walls are load bearing, do them horizontally.


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## ThunderCAT (Jan 29, 2009)

Because of my basement stairway configuration, I do not believe I can get even 4x8 drywall sheets down and around the corner of the staircase - my staircase makes a 180-degree turn halfway down). I brought 4x8 sheets of extruded styrene down, but had to bend them a bit to get them down and around the corner. My house is built on a flat lot, so I only have one small egress window, so the staircase is the only option.

My thoughts are that I would have to get 12' sheets and cut them in half to get them downstairs in 4x6 sheets. Are there any better options for me? I know this means more taping, but I just don't know what else to do...


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## perpetualjon (Jan 30, 2009)

Ouch!! Well just try and get as few seams as possible. Sure, it's better in general to use longer sheets and run a single seam through the middle of the wall --but not everyone can drive home with a few 8' x 12' sheets of drywall strapped to the top of their car!! Is it worth it to rent a truck just to bring home a few longer sheets? I think so (then again, I just borrow a friends truck to get the job done). In your case, I'd recommend that you try and get the longest and largest strips down those stairs as possible (meaning, I'd even go from 4x6 to 4x12 if you can get them down the stairs). This means, if your walls are no longer than 12', you will have no points where all 4 corners are meeting on the wall... Good luck and let us know what you manage to do!!


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## comp1911 (Jul 20, 2007)

moneymgmt said:


> I've learned it depends on dimensions and where the seams fall. If your wall is +/- 8' then you want to go vertically so you have no end seams, which are harder to mud.


8'+ to 9' use 54" wide rock.

These walls are 8'6". 48" sheet on top and a ripped 54" sheet below. I did it all myself even with 12' sheets. Well I did have help hauling it in.


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## Willie T (Jan 29, 2009)

I typed out a long, long post on some of the ways to make hanging drywall easier, but the forum gremlins ate it before I could hit <ENTER>.

But I will repeat one thing here:

Hang the top sheets first, and do it all horizontially. No wall is flat, and vertical D/W will only help show up this fact. Horizontal sheets (offset top and bottom) hide much of this classic problem.
Measure up from the floor 49" (assuming 8' or less ceilings) and make a level line from left to right, all the way to the corners.
Screw 2 x 4's beneath this line. This will give you a resting place for the top sheets while you screw. (The pros don't do it this way, but they are used to holding up those heavy sheets. You are not.) Let the 2 x 4" do the work for you.
After all the upper row is in place, take the 2 x 4's off.
Then install the lower row of sheets, offset by half the length of the top sheets. Use a couple of friends with pry-bars (crowbars work well) to hoist these sheets up tight against the top sheets while you screw.
I went into a lot more in the lost post, but this should be enough to keep you from hurting your back or making wavy walls.


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## perpetualjon (Jan 30, 2009)

Willie T said:


> Hang the top sheets first...


Stupid question, but wouldn't hanging the lower sheets first be easier since you can just lay the sheets on top of each other?


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## yummy mummy (Sep 11, 2006)

By hanging the top sheet first, you can get a nice tight fit to the ceiling and any gap that you may end up with will be at the bottom where the baseboard will hide any irregularities.

(I can't believe I'm actually answering a question instead of asking one.....:laughing


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## perpetualjon (Jan 30, 2009)

Ahhhh... That makes total sense!! Now I really feel stupid!!


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## yummy mummy (Sep 11, 2006)

............don't feel stupid........you see all the stupid questions I've asked in the last 2 years........

....and probably more to come.......:laughing:


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## krazni (Jan 6, 2009)

And sheetrock actually has a grain to it, like wood does. If you take a 4x8 sheet and cut it into two 4x4 pieces, you can see this take place.

Place two buckets under the ends of one piece, and two more under the sides of the other piece. Then place equal weight in the middle of each of them. Check back later and you'll find that the ones that are supported at the ends bow less than the ones supported at the sides.

Remember the old modular and double-wides that ran the sheetrock parallel with the joists from the middle of the ceiling to the exterior walls? You could always tell where the joists were, cuz the rock sagged in between them.

Of course most walls don't sag very much ... :wink: But the general rule is perpendicular to the supporting members.


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## Willie T (Jan 29, 2009)

Also, You never want to place your sheets of drywall directly on a concrete floor. This is a concrete basement floor? It will attract mold when the drywall later sucks up moisture from the colder floors. Besides, not that many floors are truly level, and that will throw off the alignment of all your sheets.


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## Willie T (Jan 29, 2009)

perpetualjon said:


> Ahhhh... That makes total sense!! Now I really feel stupid!!


By the way, it's not a stupid question at all. Since you are hanging your ceiling in later, you very well could place the bottom sheets first. But here are the problems involved: 
You want to be certain to seal the top edge of the drywall to the ceiling (upper floor bottom) above to eliminate the creation of possible "flame chimneys" in the case of a fire down there. If you do not contain the fire in the lower sections of the house, it will find an opening into the wall cavities and QUICKLY spread upward to the rest of your house.
Because the floor is not going to be level, you would still have to make a level line on your studs and then lift up each lower sheet to align with that chalk line.
With the bottom row in place, you would have to be certain that you left exactly enough room to squeeze in those top sheets. This is even difficult for a pro to do. Better to have any gaps hidden behind the baseboard.
The 2 x 4's seem like a lot of additional work, but it's really only about ten minutes per wall. And it will save you a ton of straining.

BTW..... Leave some gaps in that run of 2 x 4's so you can grip the bottom of the sheet if you need to for slight adjusting movements. And this particular 2 x 4 setup is being mentioned because you don't have to be right up tight with this specific installation due to the hanging ceiling. You just need to assure that there is still a taste over 48" available above the 2 x 4 to get that top sheet in place... the few gaps at the top can be taped and mudded.


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## Willie T (Jan 29, 2009)

Here’s a small drywall hanger’s trick:

Ever notice how some ceiling edges seem to undulate up and down for the length of a wall? This is obviously because the joists or trusses where the drywall is nailed along the edges aren’t level, one with another. Some sit high. Some sit low. So the D/W goes up and down.

Now, quality professionals fir down the whole ceiling with 1 x 3’s installed perpendicular to the joists or trusses. And they shim the whole ceiling level with thin strings called “jet line”. It’s very lightweight, and looks like dental floss. It can be pulled extremely tight so that it is almost perfectly level. This process results in two positive things.

One, it gives you a perfectly flat, level ceiling everywhere. And, two, it helps eliminate the ceiling cracks that eventually develop when temperature or settling cause trusses or joists to move and shift a little. But this process also adds somewhere about 1,500 to 2,000 dollars to the cost of the home. Is there a way around this for us poorer folk?

Yes. At least in part. Providing your building department will allow it (some won’t), you do have a way to make your edges more straight and level than they might otherwise be. We can’t really help the truss or joist movement, but we can help the edge problem.

It is based upon leaving the last 10”, or so, un-nailed along the edges of the ceiling. Now wait... we’re not done.

There are 90 degree clips made just for this purpose. They fit over the backside of the ceiling sheet for an inch or so, and have a parallel lip that fits just under the bottom side of the ceiling sheet to hold it in place on the edge of the sheet... much like plywood clips fit over the edge of a sheet of plywood. But, in addition, there is a 90 degree leg or strap that hangs down the wall in front of each stud.

So, fully installed (it’s much easier than it sounds) you have all these little clips hanging down in front of all the studs, and the 10 or 12 inch edge of the ceiling drywall. The whole edge sags just a little bit.

But... as you install each top sheet snuggly against the ceiling, you lift the ceiling that ¼ to ½ inch so it’s level and straight. It really looks good. Then you simply make sure to get a screw through each clip (They are there behind the wall sheet, waiting to be screwed through, right at the top of each stud.)

Of course, today being the day of the cheapest route possible, most dry wall hangers don’t even know about this method or these clips. And if they DO try to level that edge by leaving that last 10 to 12 inches un-nailed, (some of them have learned this trick) they unfortunately depend upon only the tape and mud to hold the top edge in place. Honestly, that will usually be enough. But it’s not good practice, nor professional.


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## perpetualjon (Jan 30, 2009)

Very helpful and interesting stuff Willie T!! Thanks for the help.


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## Willie T (Jan 29, 2009)

One of the most important reasons for hanging horizontally may not have been stressed enough.

Wood stud walls are not often flat walls. Prove this yourself by placing a good long straightedge across several studs in your wall, in any direction you choose, either horizontally, vertically, or diagonally. You're going to find bows, warps, and sags. These surface distortions can largely be eliminated or at least reduced by placing your Sheetrock horizontially.

You've just read about the directional strength of Sheetrock. But did you really question why? After all, what's it got to be all that strong for? It's not supporting a thing but its own weight. And it is screwed into place just about everyplace you can see.

The main reason for that horizontal strength is those very wood studs you just checked out. Horizontally placing your board is going to help flatten and level out those studs. It will push in the bows and it will pull outward, the dips and sags. Watch the studs carefully as you screw in a sheet of drywall. You will see the pressure from the screws actually push and pull most of those studs closer into line with each other, making a much more flat and smooth wall surface.

And you stagger the joints for the very same reason. If you should happen to place two butt joints directly above and below each other on the same stud, those two flexible ends would conform to the shape of that one single stud. If it was bowed out, your wall would bow outward there. If it was dipped or sagged inward, your wall would end up with a vertical depression there.

But if you stagger joints, the inherent horizontal strength of the sheet spanning that problem stud will tend to force it into a flatter plane when it is fully screwed into place.

So, there you have it. The main reason to hang horizontally on wood studs is to help make, and keep, the wall flat and straight. If you will notice, almost all commercial work, which is just about always on metal studs, is hung vertically. Why? Because metal studs are engineered to be nice and straight, so there is no reason to go horizontal.


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## 220/221 (Oct 9, 2007)

> Reading all the responses, it seems like structurally it doesn't matter whether I hang the sheets vertically or horizontally


Horizontally will be more structurally sound. Your studs are vertical and you can tie 12' of them together with a horizontal sheet.


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## sawduststeve (Feb 1, 2009)

They actually make a aluminum drywall lift that is made to put your foot in. It has a rocker so that when you step back on the heel it will hold your sheet and leave you with both hands free. I believe you should be able to get one of these at a hardware store or possibly where ever you get your drywall. Steve


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## cocobolo (Dec 16, 2008)

If your ceiling is not already covered, you should do that first.
Then you just push the top row of drywall up against it for a perfect fit.
Get a buddy to help you get the sheets up, put 4 nails in each sheet, then he can go home. Use drywall screws to do the rest. The pros can hang an entire house in half a day, they're amazing to watch.


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## dguy (Apr 8, 2010)

I've taken 12 foot sheets and "knived" the back side so it can be bent a little to get around corners. When it is put up the "bend" isn't noticeable if it isn't "creased"


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## kgphoto (Dec 2, 2007)

*Building code regarding ceilings*

The comment about fire stopping drafts got me to thinking. Have you checked the code where you are as it applies to basements in your situation? 

We don't have basements here, but are required to have 1 hour ceilings between garages and houses. This is due to both carbon monoxide from the cars as well as gas fumes and we have our hot water heaters and furnaces there. 

Do you have these in your basement? Most dropped ceilings wouldn't meet that requirement. Just something to confirm before you get underway.


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## TrafficCopSmith (Dec 23, 2009)

I hung my last drywall job horizontally and it worked better than when I hung it vertically. It was harder to mud when I got higher up the wall, but it was easier to get the seems looking nicer.


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## Iggyocracy (Oct 21, 2020)

*Vertical Only*, here’s the proof & truth!

*Why and How Horizontal’s Wrong* (and why Vertical’s right)...don’t ruin new from the start:

1 – *Defective Seam* - Horizontal rows needing more than one drywall panel *creates* (instead of avoids) butt-joint humps, which are not flat and are a twice (minimum) the effort *defect*. Outlet and switch cover-plates, window and door trim, baseboards, pictures, mirrors and cabinets don’t sit flat. Using any "butt-joint product" erases all "claimed" benefits of Horizontal!

2 – *Unsupported Seam* – Horizontal’s tapered edge is *90%* unsupported, only 10% (instead of Vertical's 100%) contacts framing, the seam will and does crack. Light switch and countertop electrical boxes within the seam equals more weakness and butt-joint doubled, minimum, efforts.

3 – *Structural Defect* - Horizontal only reinforces a wall height of 4’ or less, a full-height wall's top-plate is *never* connected to the bottom plate. As in and due to #2 above, Frictional Contact is minimized (instead of maximized by Vertical).

4 – *Seam Deception...4'x8' Panels* – Example 1: 48” tall by 102” long wall, Horizontal = 48” (technically) and it’s a *24” wide* butt-joint or a minimum of *doubling* the 48" (Vertical = the same, generously, 96” but they’re easy 6” wide joints). Example 2: 96” tall by 102” long wall, Horizontal = 222” with *50%* being 24” wide butts (Vertical = 192” of 6” wide easy joints, yes less)...in a Kitchen Horizontal = 100% of 24” wide butts (Vertical = 0%). Yes, Horizontal does the taper area twice (minimum) in order to hide its butts, so *very* minimally just another 24” was added and #5 below was not factored into Horizontal's monumental fraud.

5 – *Self-Defeating Angles* – Horizontal only uses one of a panel’s tapered edges and puts the other taper at the ceiling corner and baseboard *creating* (instead of avoiding like Vertical) a twisted angle that must be shimmed or additionally mudded. This too, instantly erases *all* "claimed" benefits of Horizontal by doubling the seam amount, patching itself to equal Vertical!

6 – *Unfriendly Seams* – Horizontal celebrates the chest height seam and *pretends* there’s no 24”-wide floor to ceiling butt-joint and the ever present baseboard bevel of *unfinished work*. (Vertical has easy joints and the top's screwed, taped and mudded later with the ceiling corner and the baseboard spots can also be done separately).

7 - *Fire Hazard Liability* - Horizontal only fills the coin-thin seam's face and has no back blocking, *causing* smoke and fire’s spread by inviting fuel air for a fire's growth (Vertical is full depth and airtight once *simply* screwed-in).

8 - *Unsafe Installation* - Horizontal needs 2-people for a safe installation and the panel is airborne, literally *creating* the chance to *cause* injury (Vertical easily tilts-up with just 1-person). Using a panel lifter isn’t even as easy and safe as Vertical’s tilt-up.

9 - *Additional Waste* - When correctly covering a knee wall, half wall, tub front, column or soffit by first removing both tapered edges, Horizontal *can't* use the tapers elsewhere (Vertical can and does). *And*, Horizontal wastes *4-times* the mud on their completely unnecessary butt-joints and baseboard bevels...if ever done.

10 - *Destructive Ignorance* - Foundation and Framing crews go to great pains to make everything flat, level, plumb and square. Horizontal *destroys* those efforts with their defective humps and baseboard bevels (Vertical keeps the perfection).

11 - *Grasping At Straws with Outright Fraud* - Horizontals falsely and unknowingly wave the absurdly invalid (FPL439) 1983 testing *“Contribution of Gypsum Wallboard to Racking Resistance of Light-Frame Walls”* by the self-convicted fraud Ronald W. Wolfe. FPL439 found that all tapered paper wrapped edges must be *fully* intact for Horizontal to beat Vertical, period. In the real-world, Horizontal's bottom paper wrapped edge is *removed* by law, for spacing from all floors and thereby completely negate Wolfe’s inexcusably deceitful and worthless "study" (*laughable*) and summation.

12 - *Joint or Seam Treatment* - According to the ASTM's C840 8.2, Horizontal's seams *must* be mudded to provide *any* fire, smoke and air travel resistance (Vertical's *so good* that it's not required to have its seams treated at all).

13 - *Costly Slow Complication* - Horizontal's depend upon pricey special muds and even messy tape or taping tools that waste mud. Taping tools still require a 2nd step of knifing the tape and the muds require a mixing step. That's *more* expense, *more* time, *more* tools and equipment and *more* water...for an *inferior* job! Vertical's superior with the cheapest ready-mix bucket muds and dry self-adhesive tape. Again, Vertical's seam treatment is *just* for looks.

14 - *Fire Rating Fail* - Most Single-ply or Single-layer drywall for Commercial Work is *required* to be installed *Vertically*, to obtain drywall's actual rating. This is well-known by the majority of Horizontals, but you and your children *don't matter* to a Horizontal. And for what, to honor the *frauds* that taught them wrong?

You've now seen that *Vertical's faster* overall and immensely *better* in every way.

Only promote *Horizontal as wrong* and confidently cite the above incontestable facts.


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## anyacolo (Oct 3, 2016)

Willie T said:


> Also, You never want to place your sheets of drywall directly on a concrete floor.


true

i did my bottom sheets first,

i got around this problem by hammering a few nails (temporarily) into the bottom base studs at the concrete floor level,

then i put my drywall sheets sitting on top of the nails,

this holds the drywall up off the floor slightly while i screw it in place,

after its screwed in place i remove the nails

EDIT****

ooppss....i didn't realize how old this thread was....Lol


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## mark sr (Jun 13, 2017)

It's always best to hang the top sheet first. That way you can shove it up tight against the ceiling. If the wall framing isn't tight enough to give the bottom sheet clearance at the floor - rip however much off of the bottom.


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## anyacolo (Oct 3, 2016)

mark sr said:


> It's always best to hang the top sheet first. That way you can shove it up tight against the ceiling. If the wall framing isn't tight enough to give the bottom sheet clearance at the floor - rip however much off of the bottom.


true in some cases,

in my situation the top doesn't matter, i am putting in a t-bar ceiling


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## Mike Milam (Mar 3, 2017)

Willie T said:


> Screw 2 x 4's beneath this line. This will give you a resting place for the top sheets while you screw. (The pros don't do it this way, but they are used to holding up those heavy sheets. You are not.) Let the 2 x 4" do the work for you.


69 years old and that never entered my mind, lol. Thanks for the tip. Hope I never need it.


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## anyacolo (Oct 3, 2016)

Mike Milam said:


> 69 years old and that never entered my mind, lol. Thanks for the tip. Hope I never need it.


you don't even need to use a 2 x 4....just screw a few screws into the studs sticking out a bit and rest the drywall on top of the screws


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