# Rotten wood under tub



## bjbatlanta (Jul 16, 2008)

It appears that your inspector is proposing is a "band aid" fix, I'd get a new inspector. The proper way to do it would be to replace the subfloor, which would require removing the tub unfortunately. I would insist on the repair being done prior to closing (I assume you have not closed yet) or get your own estimate and have the price deducted from the selling price. This looks like a very costly repair if it's to be done right.


----------



## DangerMouse (Jul 17, 2008)

the floor joists look to be ok, so i'd have to agree with the inspector. replace the water damaged/rotted boards.

DM


----------



## DangerMouse (Jul 17, 2008)

oops, he said reinforce/repair? nonono, move tub and replace water damaged/rotted boards. sorry, i thought i read replace

DM


----------



## bjbatlanta (Jul 16, 2008)

Whew! You had me worried for a minute there Mouse. Agree the joists "look" solid enough, just be sure whoever does the job is satisfied with their integrity. Don't want the tub in the basement.


----------



## DangerMouse (Jul 17, 2008)

sorry, long day playing with my homemade drywall lift! lol 
once the rotten floor is up and the tub moved, i'd inspect the joists closely to be sure they did not suffer as well.

DM


----------



## Termite (Apr 13, 2008)

Been there, done that. Gotta remove the tub to replace the rotted/water damaged floor sheathing. Depending on the condition of the joists they may need to be replaced or reinforced with additional joists next to the existing.


----------



## avicenna (Oct 24, 2008)

Thanks for the feedback guys. Yeah common sence kinda says the tub needs to go to really to be able to fix this properly. We have to see how to advance from here, wifey and the realtor still thinks this is a great deal but when i gave my bid i was oblivous of this water damage issue. 

bjbatlanta Yeah, it definitely sounds like a band aid fix and yeah this could get costly.
I am not thrilled by the idea of moving the tub at all. We haven't closed the deal yet luckily.

I will bring up theese suggestions to my realtor first of all and we'll see where we will go from there. 
Thanks again guys!


----------



## bjbatlanta (Jul 16, 2008)

If it's a REALLY great deal, it may be worth negotiating a compromise....but get a couple of bids to see where you stand. Best of luck!


----------



## wombosi (Apr 22, 2008)

guys, this is not a big deal.
moving the tub is a simple job of unbolting it and pulling it aside.

remove whatever finished floor is under the tub, then just rip up the rotten boards, screw down some good 3/4" plywood, replace finished floor material.

then sister those joists in the basement.

this is a day's work and can be done yourself. definitely not a deal breaker, in my opinion.

i'm almost inclined to agree with the inspector, in fact. you could do something goofy like install a new subfloor from underneath with sistered joists and leave the dang thing where it is.
whatever you do should be deducted from the asking price, sure.


----------



## bjbatlanta (Jul 16, 2008)

Kind of hard to just "unbolt" the tub and pull it aside if it's got a tile surround.....


----------



## buletbob (May 9, 2008)

I have to agree. it is a big deal. you will have to remove the bottom two rows of tile and the cut the wall board or tile backer board from around the lip of the tub. you will have to disconnect the drain. and try to lift the tub up over the mud , or ceramic tile floor. most likely you will be taking up the floor also, because the rot could of gone under the ceramic flooring its self. 
plan on re-doing the bathroom over. BOB


----------



## AtlanticWBConst. (May 12, 2006)

As b-bob has stated, this is, in fact, a big deal repair, because it affects an area of a bathroom that is the most costly to repair. There are many aspects to address (possible tile as stated), as well as the plumbing. Generally, if you are in there, it's good to replace the plumbing valves, in addition to fixing the actual cause of the leak...The overall work is going to take more than a day (possibly as much as a week, for a novice DIYer) to: remove/replace-repair/put back together, and then all the finish work (tile, etc) to complete.


----------



## DangerMouse (Jul 17, 2008)

you know, that flooring COULD be simply stained by soap scum, etc., and not be rotted at all! all we have to go by is the one pic. the inspector could be correct in his suggestion for a repair. he had eyes and hands on, after all.... just an after thought. my advice to avicenna would be check for himself how rotted the wood is, if at all! in which case, a much simpler/cheaper repair could be done.

DM


----------



## wrangler (Oct 9, 2008)

Unless that bath upstairs is in really great shape, I'd consider removing the tub and updating the plumbing as well. I'm not really fond of those 2 fernco couplers when doing it right would have been so easy with the access from below. THat's an odd looking p-trap...


----------



## bjbatlanta (Jul 16, 2008)

Those couplings probably replaced the original problem (leaking joints). Maybe the seller "rigged" it to, at least, get the leak stopped?? No telling. Sounds like this could be a foreclosure/repo?? No lights in a finished basement makes me think so.......power is off I'd guess.


----------



## jimmy21 (Jul 2, 2008)

if it were me, id be happy finding that before closing the deal. You now can get a free bathroom remodel out of the deal. But ya, as you probably already know, Its not the replacing the subfloor thats going to be spendy, its the refinishing of the finished floor and finish over the tub.


----------



## davitk (Oct 26, 2008)

Take a closer look at those supply pipes, they are stained from leaks in addition to the drain pipes, and show no signs of repair? Also look at the location of the stains on the subfloor, they appear to be under the wall, not the tub; I would go back and run that shower for an extended period, then check the wood with a moisture meter. A flashlight aimed into a mechanics mirror might help you see the whole picture, and if there is an additional bath above this one, check it out as well. 

Looks like a good 5K discount, to me :wink:


----------



## bjbatlanta (Jul 16, 2008)

5K on the conservative side I'd say. There's damage to be repaired in the basement too. I'm assuming it's finished. So drywall repair, paint, & flooring at the minimum..... If it's unfinished, insulation (if not heated) and ceiling repair/paint.


----------



## avicenna (Oct 24, 2008)

Hi everybody! 
Sorry for not noticing this before, have been off. I appreciate the feedback and pointers. 

The power is on, there is light now in the basement. The switchboard in the basement is not working. It's an estate sale. 

We have had 2 contractors look at it and the verdict is that the structural is fine but some of those subflooring planks are bad lol. They are soft to the touch infact. 
There have been small leaks from between the wall tiles due to missing grout in several places. God knows how long it has been that way, that may be why the damage is so extensive and wide spread. Possibly some of the walls need to be replaced aswell because of this. 

We got the price down before we knew about this. 
One of the contractors whould change the floor tiling, put new grout on top over the old on the walls, repair the subframe and put new floor tiles for $2K. I am not sure right now if that included moving the tub. 
Some of those really bad planks continue in under the bedroom closet btw. 

Around $400 is what a band-aid fix whould cost, where they only reinforce the structure. One of the contractors said that could hold 10 years, he didn't think the tub whould fall down. The sellers wants to pay for the band-aid fix and that is where we are standing now pretty much. 

I do agree that we sure are glad we found out about this mess before hand.


----------



## Ron6519 (Mar 28, 2007)

I don't agree with the accessment of the 2k guy. If water has been getting behind the tile, I would gut the tub area completely. I'd also remove all the flooring. The damage will extend to the stud wall and sheathing. There's a good chance there is mold growth behind the walls. The problem is the damage you see is only the tip of the issue. It usually is.
Ron


----------



## DangerMouse (Jul 17, 2008)

personally, if i were a buyer, i think i'd just walk away from this one....

DM


----------



## wrangler (Oct 9, 2008)

Actually. there really is not any damage there that can not be repaired. Most of the hard work would be in the demolition. As this is a do-it-yourself site, you really should consider doing it yourself. It is not all that hard, and since you would be providing the labor, you could do it for well under $2k (depending on what replacement materials you use). It's a little hard to tell from the picture, but it looks like that is a cast iron tub. It takes a little bit of elbow grease, but a sledge hammer will break it up into easy to carry chunks. Be sure to wear proper safety gear (eye protection, gloves ) as the porcelean will shatter into tiny little shards that will fly everywhere. If it is steel, then you can cut it in half with a reciprocating saw. Since, as you said, you do not know how long the tile grout has been bad and letting water pass, just plan on tearing that out as well and putting up new dura rock and update the tile. You can either put in a new tub, (I'd go with acryllic) or convert it to a shower if preferred. You have easy access to the plumbing, so that can be replaced easily as well. Depending on it's age and condition, I'd seriously consider replacing the valve while you have the walls open. 
It does look as if the subfloor damage will require removing the existing floor as well. Another opportunity to update the flooring too! lol
If you do not know anything about laying tile, alot of the home centers have free classes on setting tile. You can save alot of money doing it yourself, especially if you can borrow some of the tools that you need but do not already own. 
And of course there is the wealth of information that is available on this site.
Good luck, and let us know how it goes!
Brett


----------



## Marvin Gardens (Sep 30, 2008)

Water damage can cause the problems seen in this photo. As the water evaporates it will leave residue. This does not mean it is rotten. Rotting wood only happens when it is exposed to constant water and is not allowed to dry out. Contrary to popular opinion dry rot is not dry. It is created when excessive moisture and lack of air movement allows fungus to grow that lives off cellulose. It has to have moisture to survive. Take away the moisture and the fungus dies.

Stick a screwdriver in the wood. If there is any flaking or soft spots it will need to be replaced.

Another thing is what was the problem and was it fixed. Bad pipe, bad drain, leaking tub, flooring not sealed well??? I see no indication that the problem was resolved.

Above all get a second opinion by another inspector.


----------



## Crewell (Sep 4, 2011)

*Fix Rotted Wood Floor Without Removing Bathtub*

Here's how I replaced my rotted wood floor beneath the tub on the 2nd story of my house... 

 Cut out the rot to w/in 6 inches of the tub wall. Opening should be big enough to allow you to hammer inside hole. Edges must terminate in the middle of joists. (In my case, it was about 3'x3'.) It's a good idea to drop a small test hole first to make sure you're not going to hit any plumbing or electric.
 Liberally paint remaining rotted wood with antifreeze. This kills living rot/bugs, and stays in the wood without discoloration.
 After antifreeze dries, drill a 1 inch matrix of holes in rot. (If wood is 3/4 inch, hole-depth should be 1/2 inch - 5/8 inch).
 Fill with epoxy wood penetrant. This strengthens and stabilizes the wood.
 Install solid braces 16 inch o.c. between the joists. If the joists are 2x10, use 2x8 so you have room to maneuver. Place braces on outside edges of hole to support both old floor and new. The braces will likely run under the tub. (If space is too tight for toe-nailing, your lumber yard sells sheet metal corners designed for this purpose. Apply with roofing nails and/or deck screws.) Pull the braces up to the old floor with deck screws running through the old floor into the braces.
 Clean old OSB off exposed joists, then glue+screw-in new OSB floor.
 Make the repaired area level with old floor by topping it off with a cement-based leveling/patching compound. (Fills gaps up to 1/2 inch)
 Install new floor covering. Live long and be happy.


----------

