# Sinking driveway repair



## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

For it to have sink that far down there has to be something major going on under that slab, not just a poor prep job.
Live in an area prone to sink holes?
Is there a water, sprinkler or sewer line running under that area?
I'd be renting a concrete saw and cutting it up into smaller pieces, sure would make it a whole lot easier on you.


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

I'm here in UT so I should be okay unless my area is now the first sinkhole area on record haha, the saw would be great idea, none where available. I thought there were some rebar dowels in there somewhere also.

I was told there is a city water line near there, but the city said they have not noticed pressure changes, so they said its not them plus the sewer line is too far away according to them. :thumbdown:

I had a flat work contractor come look at it a while ago, the estimator said they have seen nothing like this before in their years of experience and they would not actually do the job. :vs_no_no_no:
They said since they don't know whats underneath it, it could potentially be a liability issue to have their crew or guys with heavy equipment on it, if it was in fact some strange hole to China. Their advice was to seek a geotechnical engineer first. 

...So my travels had brought me to the geotechnical engineer and they said you need to dig down about 10-15 feet or more to find the bottom first, and also said, 

"How far can you dig before the equipment cant go any further is the question, and how much money are you willing to spend to do so, because you need to find the bottom and then we will come out, do sampling and take a look and good luck"


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## Canarywood1 (May 5, 2012)

Any chance of getting a core sample of what's down there, and how deep, instead of digging, those geotechnical guy's should know i think.


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## 47_47 (Sep 11, 2007)

My area is not known for sink holes either, but certain sub developments were built over old gypsum mines and are having issues. 

Demo carefully and determine the extent of the sinking area.


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## joed (Mar 13, 2005)

You need to do some digging to see what is happening. Could be as simple as the original contractor buried all his garbage there. Wood etc. is rotting away and leaving a hole. Could be an old tree stump that was ground off but not dug out.

Call for locates first. Might be a sewer line under there that is cracked and sucking up the dirt.
I think a water line would show up as water coming up.


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

If you have city water where the lines are run should be on file, or Miss Utility should be able to find them.
All the other suggestions are valid ideas on things to look for when digging.
Water leaks in main water lines often do not show above grade.


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

Here is the first video listed below. It takes a while to make these in addition to also doing the work, but ill do my best to provide what information I can on this repair to help others in a similar situation (If ever). 
Video quality is not super high, it being made on a Windows Vista OS and WMM and because I was in a rush to do this project.

Thanks for the tip joecaption about the utility checker, it looks like its safe to dig, my area has a utility checker called bluestakes for this I found out.

Demolition video part one.


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## Msradell (Sep 1, 2011)

You've got something major going on underground if the previous owner dug down 10 feet and put in the correct fill before reporting the driveway. There is no sense in going to all this work and having it happen again. You really need to get a Geotech survey done to figure out what's going on. Another option would be to pour the driveway much thicker than normal and include some hefty rebar in it so that if area settled underneath the new concrete the concrete would act as a suspended slab. Again, to do this correctly you're going to need to involve an engineer on the project.


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

Yeah, major is right alright.

I did talk to the geo guys and they told me to dig to the bottom first and find the source before they will bother with me, which is odd, I don't get that either but I'm a newb. 
I just didn't have a budget for digging out another $3k worth in just digging alone, like the other guy. 

He said a shed was buried? More like barn? haha.

Rebar is a good idea as well as thicker, and you are right, a suspended slab it will be.
I was pulling out a 3-4" slab. There also did not appear to be any base under the slab except dirt and some random chunks of old driveway.

Interesting thing is...the previous owner is a civil engineer, though I don't know how much of geotech engineering crosses over into that field. 

If those other geotech engineer guys would have fully said why I've got to dig so far down before they do anything before them doing samples or what not, that would have helped educate me, I felt kinda left in the dark on that one but maybe they figure I should know this. lain:


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

joed said:


> You need to do some digging to see what is happening. Could be as simple as the original contractor buried all his garbage there. Wood etc. is rotting away and leaving a hole. Could be an old tree stump that was ground off but not dug out.
> 
> Call for locates first. Might be a sewer line under there that is cracked and sucking up the dirt.
> I think a water line would show up as water coming up.


Wood is right! :icon_sad:


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## ZTMAN (Feb 19, 2015)

Wow. That void is cause by more than organics breaking down. Save your self some digging and rent an auger. You should be able to go down at least six feet so you can get a sample of what is there. Looks like you may have to bridge that area.
You already demoed the slab so pressure grout is out.
Look forward to more videos


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## MTN REMODEL LLC (Sep 11, 2010)

My arms are sore after watching your video... maybe you'll find some historic lost city..... or deep enough and find some chop suey...

Good luck.... Interesting !


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

Is there a chance that you have an old mine void under there?

As a teenager in the 70's, I worked in some underground mines in the eastern side of Ut. 

And I know that there were abandoned mines on both the West and Eastern sides.

Do you remember a few years back when Rock Springs Wy. was trying to fill all those old voids underneath the city? Major fiasco.

It is possible that you are built atop an old mine, some of them went for miles and branched off quite a ways either way. 

This is just a thought that I had when reading this, I have seen mines cave in like this and cause havoc on unsuspecting houses built above.


ED


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

We replaced about 900 sq. feet of driveay that was probably worse than that last year. It was on a relatively steep slope where it failed, and the base was bank run sand. Once water had a chance to infiltrate through the joints, it was all over. It wasn't uncommon, near the end, for a 1" rain to deposit a few wheelborrow's of sand on the lower portion of driveway. From your description, you're probably best just trying to bridge the area...........


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

de-nagorg said:


> Is there a chance that you have an old mine void under there?
> 
> As a teenager in the 70's, I worked in some underground mines in the eastern side of Ut.
> 
> ...


I will have to look up that rock springs fiasco, I don't think I remember but
...Oh wow, I hope there is no mine void under here, if so I'm hosed! 

So far its just buried wood and a rumor of an old water well on my block, where that is exactly, I have no idea, a neighbor that has since moved out told me this a while back.


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

Digging down sounds expensive, backhoe, large excavator and auger alike. This hole is huge, almost like its a toilet, literally swallowing up everything, so odd... 
A bridge is not what I want but its probably what it will end up being based on my budget and without proper digging and engineering, I estimated around $1,000-1,200 for a DIY from start to finish.

Here is the next video below, kinda short, but it updates the project a bit, funny how things can end up interfering with a tool rental time, I guess i'm glad I had nothing rented at this stage? Hahahah :wallbash:


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

Oh and the "Boss" I refer to in the vid is my wife. :vs_lol:


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## Fix'n it (Mar 12, 2012)

that is a "digging" shovel. get yourself a "transfer" shovel.

damn, on the door. wth happened ?


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## stadry (Jun 20, 2009)

we repaired 1 where the bldr had created a trash pit under the driveway,,, instead of bringing in a trak-hoe to dig out , we cast a 8" 'bridge' w/dble mat # 6 bar over the trashpit,,, also cast steel-reinforced grade beams on either side,,, worked out well for the last 8yrs

i was for digging out the trash but it wasn't my $$$ OR my house


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

Thanks for the tip on the shovel, I should have bought one! I became down to just hand tossing larger chunks in that wheel barrow though. (I may still get one yet.)
I was thinking about asphalt fill in there, but decided against it later on. 

Yeah so my garage door pulley cable decided to pop off when the door was on the way up without telling me. Then on the way down, it did not wind correctly, ripping the door off and thankfully not on my car. It took a day to get back on but DIY saved some $

I think bridging this is a good idea by others, especially on a budget, but ill do what I can to the subgrade...


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## HDS (Jun 21, 2014)

I know you are trying to save money, but some professional help maybe needed. If that is a low spot, water is going to continue to drain through there and keep undermining whatever you put in there. Where does the water go when it rains? With the concrete up, a drain may be needed to carry that water away. With fill and a good drain, that might help.


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## Msradell (Sep 1, 2011)

After watching a video and seeing those other areas where you probed I really question any type of repair doing you much good. I really think it would be money well spent to get a soils to take a look at your problem. You may even want to just talk to your local building officials and get some feedback from them.


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## ZTMAN (Feb 19, 2015)

I think bridging is a good idea to, but based on your last video, it looks like you have a few more sections of slab to remove in order to be able to bridge


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

In this video the real mystery behind this sinking has been revealed, and a costly one to find out about in addition to the wood being buried. My suspicion was unfortunately confirmed . :detective:
This problem is too costly to be a DIY as far as fixing the real problem is concerned and too much to pay someone else to fix in addition to all the flat work. 
I will do what I am able with a limited budget to fix this as a DIY, my focus has shifted to just trying to fill it up and repair the subgrade the best I can and bridge this area the best I can or know how/figure out.

Soils test would have been nice but geotechnical engineers say they will not touch the project until I dig to the bottom to find out whats going on, and now that I know what the problem is without digging, I'm sure they wont do it until its sealed...which I don't plan to because I cant afford to.

Flatwork contractor says they will do it now on this stage but they say they will not guarantee their work (understandably) still say its a liability and their cost includes my demolition. $1500 quoted plus minus just for the concrete finish work. but its hard work and they need to make a living too so I understand.

I will be doing the flatwork as well on this DIY. I am reading up on concrete finishing at this point in the video as well.:vs_coffee:

Short demolition update video below if you fancy.


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## 123pugsy (Oct 6, 2012)

Wow, that sucks.
Any laws in your state about not sealing the well properly?
The previous home owner should have done so.


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## Canarywood1 (May 5, 2012)

Would that be covered by disclosure law, worth a try.


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## Fix'n it (Mar 12, 2012)

ok, so there was/is a well hole where you were filling , correct ? and this well was washing out under the slab. but, the ground is not wet currently, correct ?
so, how is this well eating out under the slab ? just vibrations from cars getting the dirt/whatever to fall down the hole ?
this well hole, how big is the hole ? is it pipe lined ?


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## 123pugsy (Oct 6, 2012)

Fix'n it said:


> ok, so there was/is a well hole where you were filling , correct ? and this well was washing out under the slab. but, the ground is not wet currently, correct ?
> so, how is this well eating out under the slab ? just vibrations from cars getting the dirt/whatever to fall down the hole ?
> this well hole, how big is the hole ? is it pipe lined ?


If the well is tied to the aquifer, water goes thru the cracks in the slab, down to the aquifer and out. This leaves a constantly empty hole for water to flow and bring soil/dirt with it.


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## dd57chevy (Jun 21, 2015)

_Dyin'_ for more details , here !!!

1. What kind of _well_ was it ? How deep , wide ???

2. Why _can't_ you cap it ? 

3. Unless you have some kind of strange drainage pattern , why would there be wash/erosion ? Doesn't Utah get like 3" of rain a _year ???_

I'm not getting the "big picture" here ..........


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## Msradell (Sep 1, 2011)

I looking at the pictures I'm assuming it's a dug well instead of a drilled well. Dug wells are much larger in diameter but shallower. Many People stop using them they could throw whatever into the hole to fill it up. That's probably what happened here and whatever material they used is now deteriorating and washing away.


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## Bondo (Dec 8, 2007)

Ayuh,..... Insteada stuffin' all that broken up concrete into the hole, resettin' the sub-grade, 'n pourin' fresh concrete surface,...

I'd back a concrete truck up to the hole, 'n start pourin',....

Poured concrete will plug the hole, 'n stop the water, much better than the busted up stuff,....

Had to do that in a local downtown parkin' lot that was built over a torn down buildin', that wasn't properly back filled,...
2, 1/2 yards of concrete disappeared before it stopped goin' down,....


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

dd57chevy said:


> _Dyin'_ for more details , here !!!
> 
> 1. What kind of _well_ was it ? How deep , wide ???
> 
> ...


Great questions on all accounts, id like to know myself :smile:. 
My neighbor on the corner of the block here, wandered up one day wondering what all the stuff I was doing, has told me nothing more then what was on the video, he does not remember what type and how deep or wide. 

I assume I cant cap it without knowing the specs and also because I don't have the money, I am reading that depending on the well specs I can plan on another $500 to $1000 or more on this project to cap/seal it professionally. 
That being said, I am asking the city about something I found out called a "well log" for my area which is a record of wells by previous and current land owners dating back far hopefully. City said they will follow up but will see...

**(That is if the previous land owners logged it, who was a couple that have long since passed away and have had their house demolished and built over again by my neighbor but after my house was built, the guy we bought the house from did not know there was a water well either as far as the disclosure laws go but he did talk about the buried shed there.)

Once I get this "well log" (if the well exists being recorded) I can then take it to the government who I have found _may_ offer free grants to have it capped and properly covered, in some areas and state's up to $5000? wow. They offer other states this type of thing that I've briefly read about so far but I'm not sure it applies to my state. 

If not I'm bust, unless the city owns the water rights to aquifers and then maybe its their bill to fix? 
I'm not sure if the government owns both mineral and water rights or how exactly all that works here and who's responsible, but i'm learning.

Fun project though and learning a lot/got a workout despite the problems with it. :biggrin2:


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

After finding out from older local and current residents that there was apparently a water well in that area before my home was built, I contacted the city to find whats called a well log, I found no evidence of a water well from the logs, but it just may mean that it was not recorded or its a different type of water well. 
Waiting for a response from the state engineer at this point about well sealing grant information, if it exists...

I moved on with the project and I am removing most of the broken concrete. After this I will begin some sub grade work and a little work under the other driveway.

Here is a link for all the Utah visitors to the forum (if ever) if you want to find a well in your area.
http://maps.waterrights.utah.gov/EsriMap/map.asp?layersToAdd=wellsearch

And a video if interested or helpful in your situation.


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## NickTheGreat (Jul 25, 2014)

Wow what a journey. I can't believe you're doing this with a sledgehammer by hand!

I hope you can get that thing sealed. I'm afraid if you don't, you'll have the same problem again in some time.


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## ZTMAN (Feb 19, 2015)

Pull out your homeowners insurance policy and see if you have a subsidence endorsement.


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## Bondo (Dec 8, 2007)

Ayuh,.... Is the guy that shares the driveway, willin' to throw-in, 'n help fix this problem,..??

With that hole open, you could jack his slab to create pitch away, 'n back-fill the Whole thing in 1 pour with SCC type concrete, 'n a big vibrator,... flowable grout,...
With the right additives, the stuff pours 'bout like milk,... barely thicker than water,....
Fill the hole to top of grade, 'n hit it with a vibrator, you can push the mud over, 'n under his slab, fillin' the void,...
The weight of the concrete up at grade will push it over, add more, 'n vibrate again,....
Fix yer driveway, his driveway, hopefully for a long _long_ time, as the size of the concrete plug will be quite large,....


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## Canarywood1 (May 5, 2012)

The slump flow of SCC is 18 inches or greater, so DO NOT vibrate, or you WILL have consolidation problems.


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

Work had began on the subgrade to get it ready for a jumping jack. I have found a nice new deep hole developing... it revealed itself after it had rained overnight. I will also fill this up the best I can.

I will begin to dig out the soil and level it down 4" or possibly more to get it ready to be rammed down and also redistribute it underneath my neighbors driveway to provide some support and fill the void underneath his. 

As far as my neighbor helping, he had looked into the idea of mudjacking or polyurethane filling on his side, but had decided later that this was going to be too expensive for him, especially if his side was sinking over time as well. 
He later opted to wait until he has to repair his anew again due to the water well/sinking issue. My neighbor would at least like to try and stuff rebar underneath the driveway, though, I do not think this will work without being doweled inside the concrete, but however they will be stuffed under, the driveway seems to thin and deteriorating too much for doweling into.

I looked into the SCC and that is a great idea but it seems like SCC is too intimidating to me for my first experience with concrete finishing. So I stuck with conventional concrete as they call it. 

video below if you would like.


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

That is bigger than any well that I have ever seen.

I'm still thinking Mine void, or a natural sink hole, either one is going to be more work than one man and a wheelbarrow can handle in a lot of years. 

In my opinion whomever covered that with a driveway without filling it properly should be ashamed of themselves.

ED 

Ps: What are you drinking to get so speedy at times, Where can I get some. :biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2:?


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## Fix'n it (Mar 12, 2012)

that hole was not there, that you could see ?
then it rained, and the hole was there ?
:vs_OMG:

did you bother to use a flashlight and look down the hole ?


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

Maybe this was asked and answered already, but, why on Earth would you pour concrete over that mess right away? Why not let it sit for a few month and see what transpires? Gravel/subgrade is much easier and cheaper to fix than concrete.

On a side note, it's amazing how well the neighbor's driveway held up with a little bit of rebar. THere's a number of folks on here that continually "preach" that rebar will do "nothing" in a slab that thin, but it's pretty obvious it makes a profound difference in less than ideal subgrade situations.............


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

That hole appeared after raining, it was odd and no I didn't look in it with a flashlight, I should of but just didn't think of it...very strange thing going on, looks like whatever mystery it really is must be buried at this point though. mine or natural sink hole or...entrance to the goblin city :surprise:

City engineer responded and said they would investigate wells on record have not got back to me on the answer. 

As far as filling with gravel and leaving it, I would but the city asked me to get on it once they saw it, in fact those orange cones in the first picture post was their idea, especially since I have to provide off street parking for tenants and also plow snow and with it my gravel. 

I even looked into putting those giant metal plates over the top of it like the ones on the street they use to cover piping trenches but they are a pretty penny.

Here is a quick video with the jumping jack, its another speedy one, speed powered by powerade and otter pops haha:biggrin2:

At this point in the video, the idea of having a concrete truck come began feeling like facing a dragon the first time. :surprise:


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

ZTMAN said:


> Pull out your homeowners insurance policy and see if you have a subsidence endorsement.


Thanks for the tip, I found this on my insurance. Looks like I got a finger? haha


SECTION II -EXCLUSIONS, 

“Earth movement” means earthquake _including_ land shock waves or tremors before, during or after a volcanic eruption; earth expansion and/or contraction; landslide; slipping; falling away; caving in;eroding; earth sinking; settling; rising, tilting or shifting;
 mine subsidence or mudflow; unless direct 
loss by: 
(1) 
Fire;
(2) 
Explosion; 
ensues and then we will pay only for the ensuing loss.


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

I got the middle finger by my insurance I should say, to edit my last post. 
(I could not edit my last post)


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## 123pugsy (Oct 6, 2012)

So, you're planning on pouring concrete soon?


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## Bondo (Dec 8, 2007)

> That hole appeared after raining,


Ayuh,.... While I certainly admire yer tenacity, 'n drive, I believe this is still gonna come back to haunt ya,...

All the rock, 'n fill you've shoveled into yer box-out, is gonna continue to drop into that big hole over time with the ground water,...
That's why I mentioned backin' a concrete truck up to the hole, 'n dump it Full with flow-able fill,....
Once ya had filled it up to within' a few inches of finish grade, 'n it set up before it flowed down anymore, it woulda created a Huge plug, to stop the water carryin' more sand, stone, 'n silts down into the cavern,...
Then you could pour a concrete slab for the wear surface,...

Good Luck with it,...
It's a _Great_ story, 'n I'll be watchin' along,....
again,.... I really admire yer tenacity, 'n drive,.....


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

I agree Bondo, 

I think it may come back to haunt me as well and hopefully not under my garage for some odd reason. 

First time finishing SCC scares me, I had never touched a "trowel" in my life so I better not mess with SCC on a first time DIY concrete project haha.

Hopefully with rebar I can have some longer life with a bridge of some sort but I just had to get this done, I was hoping for more earth info from the city but nothing, they either forgot or don't know.

Here is my gravel pick up video, was a fun day, I sure enjoy the construction stuff, I have to hand to all the guys out there doing concrete manual labor all day long, serious respect & props to you all. Ive got a new appreciation for this trade and for those who do it for a living.


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

Leveled out the 3/4" minus unwashed gravel, it took a while but it happened.

I decided against using a skid steer to push it in and level it out, rentals are quite a bit of money for about 30 minutes worth of using.

I may have gone a bit too precise on leveling the gravel out to get it exactly 5" for the concrete depth and I felt like I was making a rock garden after a while.:wacko:

I also rented a vibratory plate compactor to get the stuff packed solid, the unwashed gravel pit fines helped the gravel to lock together better.


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

Progress is a good thing.

A skid-steer just would have been a waste, your area is small, and they tear up too much surrounding area, spinning their wheels, turning.

Looks near ready for the concrete.


ED


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

Chose #4 Grade 60 rebar and cut into them to size to get them ready to put into to the driveway.

Had some trouble figuring out how to get the giant lengths to my house but it all worked out and found a out a way to save some money on delivery too.

This video was done quick... it has a lot of scrolling info, but I hope the info is useful for someone out there wanting to use rebar. 

Still mystifying why the hardware place would not let me cut them into shorter lengths in the parking lot, even far enough away from the other vehicles but rules are rules. Though I decided that having some of them uncut is better anyways... I think. 







Can anyone tell me if its true that rebar should not be run through control joints in a normal flatwork situation? 
Thinking that dowels are the only proper and normal way to to it, but id like to run all the rebar though the center control joint for a "bridge" work in my case, since this may come back to haunt me.


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

You ask:

Can anyone tell me if its true that rebar should not be run through control joints in a normal flatwork situation? 

A: There is nothing normal about the ground under the driveway falling into a cavity. 

Sure it is recommended to not pin two slabs together because you normally want them to move separately.

But often it is done anyway to prevent a section from lifting or falling .

An example is putting pinning in a driveway to garage entry because they have developed a bump in the doorway. 

I see no reason that you cannot bridge over this with rebar to try to prevent it from becoming a void once more.



ED


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## jlhaslip (Dec 31, 2009)

The rebar can run through the control joint, but make certain it is in the middle of the slab depth.
Control joint should be one quarter of the depth of the concrete.


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

Pterosaur said:


> Can anyone tell me if its true that rebar should not be run through control joints in a normal flatwork situation?
> Thinking that dowels are the only proper and normal way to to it, but id like to run all the rebar though the center control joint for a "bridge" work in my case, since this may come back to haunt me.


I can tell you we have tens of thousands of yards on the ground with continuous rebar, it's not a problem in such a small area. When you start to get long expanses (think roadway, 100-200'+) you'd want to look at slip dowels. Even in your scenario, you could grease the exposed dowl AFTER you pound it into the exisitng concrete, if you really wanted to be technical.

Professionally, I could care less what anything on the internet or any engineer would tell you, I think you'd be crazy NOT to use rebar in your scenario. It's pretty obvious the advanatage when looking at the neighbor's drvieway with rebar...........


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## stadry (Jun 20, 2009)

drill holes into the existing conc IF you must,,, i prefer placing bridge slabs on grade beams,,, likely its only 4 - 5" thick so its difficult placing drill bits in the right spot,,, jo's right - load transfer devices ( 1 1/4" rebar ) does cross contraction/jnts - 1 end is greased to allow slipping as the solid contracts/expands (hi-skoul fizix, remember ?),,, IF you can 'pound' rebar into your existing conc, then the conc's rotten so replace it too

yes, of course use rebar - possibly even 2 mats,,, however, design's far more critical than execution,,, UNLESS you know what you're doing, its a disaster awaiting occurrence,,, 

bridge slabs 'work' because there's steel (2 mats or more) in them,,, pay the $$$, hire a PE, & get stamped drawings,,, then, when you sell your very fine home, you won't face difficulties w/new buyers


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

In this video I went out and got some pavers to set the rebar on. This will put my top most rebar at 2 3/4" into my slab of 5"

I could not find the snap in plastic rebar chairs anywhere for some reason, I could have ordered some but I didn't want to wait for them so I improvised.

Found out about rebar epoxy and gave that a shot as well. Thanks for the tips on rebar.


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## stadry (Jun 20, 2009)

what're the dimensions of this thing you're building ? # 4 bar ??? ONLY 5" thick ??? we find wire 'chairs' here in apron stores but any pro supply house'll have them too,,,


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## Canarywood1 (May 5, 2012)

Geez, when i see you painting all that rebar, it reminds me of all the rusty steel that was used when we started to build the transcontinental highway in Chicago, actually it was the bridges we were building to cross I-90 in 1951, and they are still standing.


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

Slab is 21 x 9 

I chose #4 rebar so that it will rest on the dobies better. 

I decided that larger rebar may make it too stiff when placed in uneven environment and therefore rising it upwards too far into the slab as one stiff, giant, tied structure once the concrete is poured. 
I figured #4 is a bit more flexible yet offering sufficient strength and size for a 5" slab.

(I like the specs on the slab you built over the trash pit stadry, though too much for me.)

Read up hardcore as much as possible during this whole time about concrete work, I think i've boiled my brain... there is just soooo much info out there from ACI to ATSM to websites and forums. Wow
I even practiced bull floating on my carpet haha :vs_blush:
The project may be one of the greatest DIY disasters if it does not work out in the end.

Should this beast defeat me in the short or long term, I have at least enjoyed this trip, it has been fun, challenging and rewarding in all aspects no matter the case!


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

Just for the record, and those that may read this in the future:

- Spray can epoxy paint doesn't perform nearly as well as factory applied epoxy. The spray cans are really meant for touching up ends that are cut.

- If you're going through the process of using epoxy rebar, you really might as well used coated wire ties so as not to wreck the epoxy coating.

- A linesman's plier's would be a much more productive tool to ties bulk wire with. The "twister"' pictures is really meant for loop ties, which are actually pretty cheap.

That said, best of luck with the pour, I'm sure you'll b just fine.


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

jomama45 said:


> Just for the record, and those that may read this in the future:
> 
> - Spray can epoxy paint doesn't perform nearly as well as factory applied epoxy. The spray cans are really meant for touching up ends that are cut.
> 
> ...



Thanks! :smile:

Realized my twisting did mess with the epoxy a bit so I went back and spot sprayed the intersections and actually saw the plastic coated wire ties at a concrete place...right after I finished tying of course haha, but at least they got sprayed.

I looked up the tie twister tool for those loops. Nice

Thanks for the tips, I will put them in my video description later on.


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

This is the last and final video for the DIY sinking driveway repair series! :vs_karate:


I hope visitors to this thread find something useful in this video when looking to do your own concrete project. If nothing else, maybe entertaining or gives you a good night sleep.

I have tried to provide a DIY video on concrete work 
(for my first time doing concrete, it was hard to do and isn't perfect information)

I was offered help finishing concrete and I took it, as fighting this dragon alone would be possible but really hard, especially for camera angles, so thank you. DIY does not mean go it alone with some things haha.

Finishing concrete is an art as well as a science, a beautiful material.

If you have tips I will put them in my video description later on down the road.

Thanks for all the help and information guys.

Happy late Halloween everyone!


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

Great finish.

Did you get the team some extra "otter pops"?

ED


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## 123pugsy (Oct 6, 2012)

Thanks for the excellent thread.

It's too bad the mess is still down there, but you'll probably get 10 years out of this repair easy.


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## Pterosaur (Sep 6, 2016)

Hello forum,

The final video for this thread had become corrupt somehow since I've posted it, so I have had to delete the original one & re-post it for those future visitors to this thread wanting info at some point in time. 

Here is the new video link below (I apologize for the thread bump.) 

With that being said, the slab has done great so far into the freezing weather & Merry Christmas & happy holidays! :vs_karate:


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## JIMMIEM (Nov 17, 2016)

Thank You for taking the time to record and post your project. Hope all your hard work lasts a looong time.
I can relate to your situation as I had and still have a similar one. I have an asphalt driveway which had a spot that began to sink after moving into our new house over 25 years ago. Over the years the spot continued to sink. I planned to have it fixed once the sinking stopped. But, a visitor exiting a car parked beside the depression landed in the depression which was close to 10 inches deep. I had a very reputable asphalt contractor tear up the entire driveway. I thought that maybe there was construction debris or a rotting tree stump or maybe an underground stream....there was no house here prior to ours. The contractor found no evidence of anything and did a complete gravel, base coat, and top coat. Fast forward 4 or 5 years and guess what....it's sinking again. I spoke to the contractor and asked if he wanted to fix it now or wait. He said wait. But, if you'll be coming to Massachusetts any time soon you've got the job!!!!!


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