# Leaking Ceiling, Do I Need a Roofer?



## OldNBroken (Jun 11, 2008)

Yes, typically that is a flashing/counterflashing issue.
Call a different roofer


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

Is there something temporary I can do until a roofer comes out? That was my problem last time, we called 4-5 roofers to come out and look and only 1 did.

What is a typical price range on a flashing job? Is it or could it be a DIY project?


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## seeyou (Dec 12, 2008)

Phreek said:


> Is there something temporary I can do until a roofer comes out? That was my problem last time, we called 4-5 roofers to come out and look and only 1 did.
> 
> What is a typical price range on a flashing job? Is it or could it be a DIY project?


Is this a full masonry fireplace or a pre-fab (metal) fireplace in a brick chase? If it's the latter (I think it might be since you said you heard "pinging"), you might have a bad chase cover rather than a flashing issue.


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## dougger222 (Feb 25, 2011)

Keep calling roofers to come out and look at it. What source are you using to locate roofers? If you are using clist for example don't expect much! If your using alist on the other hand you should expect a "better" roofer.

Try to get three roofers to come out and see what they say. Have each one draw up an estimate so you know exactly what they plan to do. Don't look at the price first but rather the scope of work when comparing.

As far as my prices to re-flash chimneys? From a repair only stand point and not doing one while already replacing the roof my prices have ranged from $250-2,000. Some chimneys are small and only take an hour or so to re-flash. Some on the other hand are huge and can take a whole day for one guy.

Once you re-flash a chimney you own it and if and when it should leak again you know who will be getting a call!

One thing to keep in mind for a roof repair. Most companies will not warrant there work on a roof repair only. Most will warrant it with a full replacement but with a repair you typicaly won't see a written warranty.

Good luck!!!


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

seeyou said:


> Is this a full masonry fireplace or a pre-fab (metal) fireplace in a brick chase? If it's the latter (I think it might be since you said you heard "pinging"), you might have a bad chase cover rather than a flashing issue.



Mine is the pre-fab metal within a brick chase. I wouldn't figure it would be that because that wouldn't cause leaking within the ceiling, right just leaking in or around the fireplace? I may be thinking about it all wrong though.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

dougger222 said:


> Keep calling roofers to come out and look at it. What source are you using to locate roofers? If you are using clist for example don't expect much! If your using alist on the other hand you should expect a "better" roofer.
> 
> Try to get three roofers to come out and see what they say. Have each one draw up an estimate so you know exactly what they plan to do. Don't look at the price first but rather the scope of work when comparing.
> 
> ...


I am sorry but I don't know what alist is. I assume clist is Craigslist, no? My source for roofers has been the Yellow Pages, the local newspaper and Google search.

Like I said, I've contacted 4-5 roofers and only 1 came out. I'm not sure how many more there are to contact as the town I live in isn't big and the closest major city (Memphis) is an hour away.

Wow, $250-2000? I wasn't expecting that but you seem to know more about the job than myself. I'm not really worried about warranties or anything at this point, I just want to get the roof fixed.

The mason who came out and patched the chimney stated he knew other people in the construction business and if I needed anything else to give him a call and he'd try to hook me up with somebody who could do the job. I guess I will start there.


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## dougger222 (Feb 25, 2011)

Yes, clist is craiglist, not the best place to find a contractor!

Alist is angieslist. Unlike clist you have to pay to be member on alist. It's only a few dollars a month but it will allow you to read reviews from other consumers in your area.

Without a picture hard to guess on your chimney style. Could be a few different styles.

Metal cricket or saddle custom built on top of chimney (side towards the peak) with brick or stone around the main part of chimney. 
Metal wrapped around the entire chimney.
Metal wrapped around the lower portion of chimney.


If you have a metal pan flashing around your chimney it's totaly different from a typical stone chimney with metal flashing. Have not done a lot in this style only one or two in 15 years of roofing. When we did the last one recall lifting up the bottom a little to allow ice and water to get under it. 

You may want to have the metal area inspected for rust.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

dougger222 said:


> Yes, clist is craiglist, not the best place to find a contractor!
> 
> Alist is angieslist. Unlike clist you have to pay to be member on alist. It's only a few dollars a month but it will allow you to read reviews from other consumers in your area.
> 
> ...



Here are the only pics I have of the chimney not sure if they help, you probably need pics of the flashing on the roof, right? Just checked alist and it is not available in my area.


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## OldNBroken (Jun 11, 2008)

That chimney is going to have a cricket behind it and from experience, 9 times out of ten the leak is at the bottom of the valley of the cricket. Inexperienced roofers don't know how to properly flash the corner of the chimney where that all meets up.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

OldNBroken said:


> That chimney is going to have a cricket behind it and from experience, 9 times out of ten the leak is at the bottom of the valley of the cricket. Inexperienced roofers don't know how to properly flash the corner of the chimney where that all meets up.



Could you explain that a little more for me? I barely know what a flashing is and I have never heard of a cricket. Can you explain the design for me and the problem, if you can? Is this something that I may be able to do myself? Thanks for all the information, it is appreciated.


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## OldNBroken (Jun 11, 2008)

because of the width, there will be a cricket. It is basically a dormer (small roof) built between the chimney and the main roof. There is a valley on either side. that is where the two roofs meet. These valleys terminate at the corners of the backside of the chimney. Properly done, these valleys and flashings should extend a few inches wider than the actual chimney. Either way, right at the point where the valley meets the chimney many inexperienced and/or careless roofers do not know how to properly tie in the roofing and flash it properly or they just pump it full of caulk expecting it to last. These corner points have a high volume of water coming into a very small point right there and, if not done properly, will always leak. 

You could possibly temporarily slide some step flashing under certain shingles in the area to temporarily divert the water away from the chimney for now. I can't really explain where to put them without actually being there though, sorry.

Not a great example but this should give you an idea what a cricket is.


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## Roofmaster417 (Jun 9, 2010)

Is there definitely a cricket? With the width as it has been mentioned it "should" have a cricket.I did a repair recently that had a chimney the same width that had several issues.One being no cricket and the other the shingles crossing over the pan were to high.A course was under the pan when it should have been over.

The shingles were sealed to the pan but with ice back up it separated the seal in a couple areas allowing seepage.Another problem was the metal used for the pan had worn areas within the brake allowing water entry.Without seeing roof top one can only speculate.

And Old'nBroken is right, if a cricket is in place the typical novice installers don't drop the flashing off the crickets valley far enough or create a slight bend in the lower lap area with flashing benders.They pump as much sealant humanly possible to try and seal it.Another issue with crickets is the issue of not lacing the crickets valley like a typical valley.


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## seeyou (Dec 12, 2008)

Phreek said:


> Mine is the pre-fab metal within a brick chase. I wouldn't figure it would be that because that wouldn't cause leaking within the ceiling, right just leaking in or around the fireplace? I may be thinking about it all wrong though.


I agree with needing a cricket. But, since you have a chase, the brick is probably not continuous down to the foundation on the high side. They have either bolted a lintel to the framing at the roof sheathing (sometimes they bolt it on slightly below the sheathing) and started the brick there or they have started laying the brick on the wall top plate. 

Conventional flashing is only cut into the chimney an inch or so. In a very long, hard rain, the brick may become saturated and the water can bypass the flashing. If the brick went to the foundation, this would not be an issue. It would exit through the weep holes or leech out at the brick seat. But since your brick stops above the ceiling, if it gets saturated, the moisture drips off the lintel onto the ceiling.

A situation like this needs to be through-flashed, in which case the flashing is installed with the brick and extends back through the brick to the framing and pushes any saturation moisture back to the surface. Keep calling roofers until you find one that knows what through flashing is. They'll be able to determine if you have it. If not, they'll probably know a mason that can help them retrofit it (it's not that big of a deal in the right hands). We do it frequently. If through flashing exists, then something may have gone wrong with the base flashing.

I've attached some pics showing how through flashing would be installed if a cricket were added. Another option would be to add a cricket and seal the back side of the chimney. This will require re-coating at regular intervals, though.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

So, let me ask this and I may be done because I don't want to become a pest. Based on the info and pics I have shared, am I right in assuming this is a job for a roofer and that I shouldn't need to call the mason back?


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## seeyou (Dec 12, 2008)

*am I right in assuming this is a job for a roofer and that I shouldn't need to call the mason back?

*Can't really tell from your pics. You might need both. You need to find an experienced roofer that's interested in solving your problem vs just trying to pull a paycheck. There are 4-5 things that might be causing the leak. Figuring out which one is the key. 

edit: Put your location in your profile. Some of us might know someone qualified in your area.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

seeyou said:


> *am I right in assuming this is a job for a roofer and that I shouldn't need to call the mason back?
> 
> *Can't really tell from your pics. You might need both. You need to find an experienced roofer that's interested in solving your problem vs just trying to pull a paycheck. There are 4-5 things that might be causing the leak. Figuring out which one is the key.
> 
> edit: Put your location in your profile. Some of us might know someone qualified in your area.


My location is Jonesboro, Arkansas. I'll be sure to put it in my profile. Thanks.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

OK, well roofer came out and did some work about a month ago. We have had a few good rains here and during one of those.....the ceiling leaked again! I called the roofer back and he came out today, after another good rain during the first half of the day today. 

1. First he checked the ceiling where the leak was coming through and it was dry. He even let me on the step ladder to feel myself and it was indeed dry. The bucket under the ceiling that we've been using to catch water was also dry, not moisture at all. He also was able to take pieces of the ceiling (drywall) and crumble them like they were dried leaves.

2. He went up in the attic and checked around the fireplace. The insulation was dry but he noticed this about the fireplace immediately:










You can see the flue and inside the chimney. It's like whoever built the house simply created the 4 walls of the chimney.....until the point where it connected to the house. I am assuming it is like that all the way down too. The roofer wasn't sure who I should call about that but he was pretty certain that was where my leak was coming from.

Here is a pic of the chimney still wet a few hours after the rain had ceased.










Could this possibly be it or did this roofer just take me? I kind of find it hard to see him being dishonest because the ceiling and attic were dry as can be after some good storms today. Who would I need to call or how can I alleviate this issue? He suggested temporarily placing a tarp or plastic over the chimney and seeing if it still leaks but he was pretty certain that was the problem. Why would it leak one time but not another?

To be honest, I'd like to tear down the chimney and rebuild it with siding like that around the house and not the brick, as you can see from the photos in this thread but I figure that cost thousands of dollars but this leak is going to cost me too.

Any suggestions, thoughts, questions, etc.??? I'm pretty desperate now.


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## seeyou (Dec 12, 2008)

If the roofer couldn't find fault with the flashing, then you've got limited choices. The brick is saturating and there is no provision to drive the water back to the surface. 

You'll have to through flash it for a permanent fix or seal the brick which will probably need to be repeated every 3-4 years.

Or as you mentioned, you could strip the brick and install siding on the chase.


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

I’m still not convinced it’s not a roofing/flashing issue despite what your roofer had to say.

If you zoom in on the attic picture you can see right behind the white bucket the OSB and top plate have been wet. Looks the same on the other side too. At least that’s what I’m seeing.

Did your roofer stick his head in that opening and take a look?

Did he peel back any insulation to expose the top side of the sheetrock and trace the water back?

Was it determined that there is indeed a cricket?

Has anyone been up there with a hose and tried to make it leak? That’s the first thing I do when I don’t see the obvious.

I’d call another roofer out to take a look and this time send him up there with your camera and get some good pictures of the area and post them here.


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## seeyou (Dec 12, 2008)

kwikfishron said:


> *I’m still not convinced it’s not a roofing/flashing issue despite what your roofer had to say.*
> 
> If you zoom in on the attic picture you can see right behind the white bucket the OSB and top plate have been wet. Looks the same on the other side too. At least that’s what I’m seeing.
> 
> ...


Ron - 

I fix about 20 of these a year. The problem is that the brick ends above the sheathing on the back and part of the two sides, either supported on a lintel bolted to the framing or more likely laid on the framing itself. The flashing is only cut into the brick about an 1" in most cases. In a hard or prolonged rain, the brick saturates and moisture bypasses the flashing flange. When it gets to the bottom course, it has no where to go but onto the roof sheathing. Even with a cricket, the moisture can bypass the cricket counter flashing. It's not water coming down the roof, but water moving inside the brick. 

If the brick went all the way to the foundation, like it does on the front of the chimney, the water will travel down to the brick seat and dissipate there. The only way to cure this is to through flash which brings the water back to the surface or seal the brick which keeps the water from by=passing the flashing.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

kwikfishron said:


> I’m still not convinced it’s not a roofing/flashing issue despite what your roofer had to say.
> 
> If you zoom in on the attic picture you can see right behind the white bucket the OSB and top plate have been wet. Looks the same on the other side too. At least that’s what I’m seeing.


I do not see that but then again I am no expert and have little idea of what I am looking at.



kwikfishron said:


> Did your roofer stick his head in that opening and take a look?


Yes, he did do this.



kwikfishron said:


> Did he peel back any insulation to expose the top side of the sheetrock and trace the water back?


He did this too, this was actually when he handed me some of the insulation to show that it was dry.




kwikfishron said:


> Was it determined that there is indeed a cricket?


Actually there is a cricket which surprised me because I did not think one was up there. The roofer took me to higher ground and I could easily see it there.



kwikfishron said:


> Has anyone been up there with a hose and tried to make it leak? That’s the first thing I do when I don’t see the obvious.


That's one thing that was not done. I'd like to do that myself but I truly believe this is an issue of the brick no going all the way down the house. I could be completely and totally wrong but it looks feasible to me.



kwikfishron said:


> I’d call another roofer out to take a look and this time send him up there with your camera and get some good pictures of the area and post them here.


What type of additional pictures would help? I mean I have called one brick person and 3 roofers, the last one came highly recommended in the area. I really don't want to keep throwing money at the problem but I do want the problem fixed. 

Thanks for your input, it is greatly appreciated.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

seeyou said:


> If the roofer couldn't find fault with the flashing, then you've got limited choices. The brick is saturating and there is no provision to drive the water back to the surface.
> 
> You'll have to through flash it for a permanent fix or seal the brick which will probably need to be repeated every 3-4 years.
> 
> Or as you mentioned, you could strip the brick and install siding on the chase.


Would you suggest having another roofer come out or is this a job for another specialist?

Through flash? What exactly is that?

How is the brick sealed and why does it need to be repeated?

Probably wrong forum but how much would a strip and replace cost? I'd like to go that way because the chase is actually leaning. Instead of a 90 degree angle, the top 10-15 feet of the chimney is leaning at about an 85 degree angle toward the house. I'm sure this is not helping with the leak either.


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## seeyou (Dec 12, 2008)

Phreek said:


> Would you suggest having another roofer come out or is this a job for another specialist?
> 
> *Through flash? What exactly is that?*
> 
> ...


Through flashing goes all the way through the brick back to the sheathing behind the brick. That way, and moisture that gets in the brick is sent back to the surface. It needs to be installed when the brick is laid. It can be retrofitted (we do it often), but you have to find a mason who will think outside the box and a roofer who will work along with him. 

Sealer is applied (normally sprayed) on the outside. It must be re-applied because it wears away or gets broken down by UV rays - like any other coating.

If the chimney (chase, actually) is leaning back toward the house, you've confirmed my suspicion that the brick is likely resting on the roof framing/sheathing. The weight has settled some or there is some rot from the moisture infiltration. This is something I see far too frequently.

Don't know about the cost to strip the brick and re-side, but you'll probably have some minor structural repairs to deal with. But stripping/re-siding is not that big of an operation.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

seeyou said:


> Through flashing goes all the way through the brick back to the sheathing behind the brick. That way, and moisture that gets in the brick is sent back to the surface. It needs to be installed when the brick is laid. It can be retrofitted (we do it often), but you have to find a mason who will think outside the box and a roofer who will work along with him.
> 
> Sealer is applied (normally sprayed) on the outside. It must be re-applied because it wears away or gets broken down by UV rays - like any other coating.
> 
> ...


It sounds like I need to start doing some research in the strip and replace option.

1. I have had a difficult time getting a mason or roofer to come out. I can't imagine the trouble I'd get in to try to get both to come out.....at the same time.....to think outside the box AND work together! I'd actually go that way if I knew I could get 2 to do the job.....RIGHT!!

2. The chase is already leaning which doesn't look good and definitely won't if it is put back on the market anytime.

3. The sealant seems like a good temporary fix, at least until we get some idea of the cost of replacing the chase and get it started. What specialist can do this? Could I buy the material myself at a home improvement store and diy? If so, materials would I go in looking for? Do you just apply it to the outside of the chase down to the point where it meets the house? Where does the water go then?

4. It seems like you see this rather often. My question is, why build a chimney like this? It seems destined to leak and it seems like it could be a major fire hazard as well. All other pics I have looked at show the flue covered in attics. I just don't understand the point of doing it half way.

seeyou, I'd like to take some time to offer my extreme thanks for all your past/present/future input. I wish I could do something for you because I feel like I owe you a favor. All the info has been greatly appreciated. Thank you!


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## seeyou (Dec 12, 2008)

Phreek said:


> It sounds like I need to start doing some research in the strip and replace option.
> 
> 1. I have had a difficult time getting a mason or roofer to come out. I can't imagine the trouble I'd get in to try to get both to come out.....at the same time.....to think outside the box AND work together! I'd actually go that way if I knew I could get 2 to do the job.....RIGHT!!
> 
> ...



3)Siloxane is the sealer we use. I'm sure there are others. Don't get it at the home center. Go to a brick yard and ask them. You just apply it with a pump sprayer. Very DIY'er friendly if you can get on the roof. The water does not penetrate the brick with the sealer on it.

4)It's inexpensive to do it this way, but it's not necessarily wrong if some simple rules are followed. But, without a savy supervisor watching, some corners can and often do get cut. As long as the metal flue is installed correctly with the proper clearances, it's not a fire hazard. But if it's not flashed right, it will leak.

Hope you get it under control. The leaning concerns me some. Glad I could help.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

Thanks again for the reply.

Is Siloxane relatively expensive? Is this a good or bad deal ($130 plus shipping for 5 gallons): http://www.troweltrades.net/product...ium=product_search&utm_campaign=google-simple

How much do you apply to the brick when applying it? Should it go around the entire chase or the upper portion.

The leaning chase concerns me as well. I figure with a good storm with some strong winds it could possibly tumble over onto the roof causing even more extensive damage. Is this the concern you have or is there something else I am missing?

Thanks again!!! :thumbup:


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## seeyou (Dec 12, 2008)

Phreek said:


> Thanks again for the reply.
> 
> Is Siloxane relatively expensive? Is this a good or bad deal ($130 plus shipping for 5 gallons): http://www.troweltrades.net/product...ium=product_search&utm_campaign=google-simple
> 
> ...


That's a good price. I've bookmarked it for future reference. However, you won't need a full gallon per application. Here's a link to gallon quantities:

http://www.grantlogancopper.com/ind...ct_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=981

The chase probably won't fall over any time soon, but as it moves the leaking will worsen, accelerating the structure damage.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

I've got another question regarding the brick. If the brick did go all the way down on the backside (the side on the house) would it not eventually stop where the fireplace is and leak in or on the fireplace? I just don't see how the water would disperse if the brick continued all the way down just to the fireplace.

Also, the link above to the S31 siloxane has the following directions:



> APPLICATION: A silane/siloxane base impregnator of excellent stability against alkali, infiltration of dirt and water, frost damage, and efflorescence for all interior and exterior natural and cast stone. HMK® S31 is an invisible below surface seal, with 100% vapor permeability which leaves a natural appearance. Note: Do not allow S31 to dry on surface since cured S31 may need mechanical removal. DIRECTIONS: Apply to chemically clean and dry surface with natural bristle brush, or HMK® ZI70-171 Sealing Brushes. One or two thin and even applications wet on wet are usually sufficient. Allow 5-10 minutes between each application for penetration. Repeat process for more absorbent surfaces. Thoroughly remove excess S31 5-10 minutes after last application with white terry cloth; add solvent if necessary to facilitate the excess removal. Protect from water/rain for the first 2-3 days curing time. S31 may require up to 28 days to fully cure under very dry air conditions. A humid, but not wet, climate helps and expedites the curing process. Do not apply S31 with temperatures above 85 F or below 50 F. COVERAGE: 35 - 65 sqft., 3-6 square meters per 1 liter (34 oz.) container. WARNING: Chemical product. Contains Turpentine Substitute. Flammable. Use with adequate ventilation. Avoid eye and skin contact. If exposed, wash/flush with water. Keep out of reach of children. See Material Safety Data Sheet. STORAGE: Store in cool place. Keep lid tightly closed. TESTING: Perform testing on a sample tile and actual installation to determine number of coats necessary to protect particular stone, visual appearance of tile after S31 application and stain protection against water and dirt infiltration. DISCLAIMER: Limitation of liability: The liability of HMK® for defective products and any claims for damages whatsoever is limited to the purchase price of the products. HMK® shall not be liable for any consequential damages. No other warranty or representation is made or implied.


Seems confusing to me.....


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## seeyou (Dec 12, 2008)

*If the brick did go all the way down on the backside (the side on the house) would it not eventually stop where the fireplace is and leak in or on the fireplace? I just don't see how the water would disperse if the brick continued all the way down just to the fireplace*.

OK - here's where terminology is very important. You have a pre-fab fireplace and chimney. In your case, the chimney is the metal pipe. You have a wooden chase built around the fireplace. That chase has brick veneer on it. That brick veneer could have been vinyl or any other type of siding or masonry. Everything outside of the metal prefabricated chimney is strictly decoration. 

If you had a full masonry fireplace, the whole thing would be built out of brick/block/stone. It would have much mass and need it's own foundation. 

A lot of people don't know the difference between the two type units. All they know is they bought a house with a wood burning fireplace. What you have is much, much cheaper to install than a full masonry fireplace. Maintained and operated properly, it's no less safe and in some instances can be more efficient. But they are two different animals and the flashing details are completely different. But many roofers just see a chimney and can't differentiate between the two. 

What's so confusing about the installation instructions? I'll translate.

*excellent stability against alkali, infiltration of dirt and water, frost damage, and efflorescence *

It keeps the water out. It also does other things.

*HMK® S31 is an invisible below surface seal, with 100% vapor permeability*

It penetrates instead of dwelling on the surface. If water gets in some other way it can get back out. You can't see it after it's applied.

Brush it on. Wait 10 mins. Brush on another coat. Remove any runs. Don't get it on anything you don't want it on. Don't let it rain on it for 2-3 days. Don't apply above 85F or below 50F. Don't drink it or smoke when you're applying it. Wear gloves.

Look at any can of paint. Pretty much the same instructions. Good luck.


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## Phreek (Dec 8, 2010)

seeyou said:


> If the brick did go all the way down on the backside (the side on the house) would it not eventually stop where the fireplace is and leak in or on the fireplace? I just don't see how the water would disperse if the brick continued all the way down just to the fireplace.
> 
> OK - here's where terminology is very important. You have a pre-fab fireplace and chimney. In your case, the chimney is the metal pipe. You have a wooden chase built around the fireplace. That chase has brick veneer on it. That brick veneer could have been vinyl or any other type of siding or masonry. Everything outside of the metal prefabricated chimney is strictly decoration.
> 
> ...


Thanks again for the info. I realize that my fireplace is prefab and cheaper than a full masonry. I was just thinking that what we discussed before, the brick on the chase ends where the chase meets my roof, as seen in the pic above taken in my attic. It was mentioned if the brick continued down, the water would disperse lower into the ground. Wouldn't the brick of the chase stop before actually getting to the ground, at least on the backside because of the prefab insert? Maybe I'm over thinking it but I just want to make sure I don't sound like a fool to contractors giving estimates.

Thanks again for all the info. Sorry if I'm becoming a pest with all the questions.


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## seeyou (Dec 12, 2008)

Phreek said:


> Thanks again for the info. I realize that my fireplace is prefab and cheaper than a full masonry. I was just thinking that what we discussed before, the brick on the chase ends where the chase meets my roof, as seen in the pic above taken in my attic. * It was mentioned if the brick continued down, the water would disperse lower into the ground.* Wouldn't the brick of the chase stop before actually getting to the ground, at least on the backside because of the prefab insert? Maybe I'm over thinking it but I just want to make sure I don't sound like a fool to contractors giving estimates.
> 
> Thanks again for all the info. Sorry if I'm becoming a pest with all the questions.


The only instance where the brick would "continue down", would be if you had a full masonry fireplace. You don't.


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