# Help Fix This Roof Flashing Conundrum?



## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

You need a kick out but it wants to go behind the first flashing at the bottom.


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

#1, Toss those vinyl gutters in the trash and have seamless gutters installed.
#2, That siding never should have never been installed tight to the shingles!
#3, Gutters should have been installed under that drip edge, not attached to it!
#4, There should have been a kick out on the roof to direct the water away from that corner.
Really want to get rid of this issue once and for all, have the fashias wrapped with coil stock.


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## carpdad (Oct 11, 2010)

1980 is new, not vintage.:smile: Photo 2 shows the step flashings under the siding. Step flashing ends with the eave because the framing went up without a thought for this kind of area. Fix is to remove some roofing and siding. Then cut a kerf, a thin cut line, into the facia against where it butts the wall. https://www.finehomebuilding.com/20...-flash-troublesome-roof-to-wall-intersections


You could flash over the siding with sheet metal or tape (eternabond tape), since gutter will hide most of it anyway. But you still have to add kickout flashing that goes under the last step flashing. If possible, change to a larger gutter and slope it away from that corner.


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## Steve Sr (Mar 7, 2013)

joecaption said:


> #1, Toss those vinyl gutters in the trash and have seamless gutters installed.


This may happen down the road but I don't see this as a direct contributor to this issue.



joecaption said:


> #2, That siding never should have never been installed tight to the shingles!


Well there is about 1/4" - 1/2" gap and there is no rot above the shingles, only below. How big should the gap be?



joecaption said:


> #3, Gutters should have been installed under that drip edge, not attached to it!


Are you referring to your seamless gutters? While this may not be ideal the air gap between the current gutters and the fascia board has kept the fascia board rot free. This is obviously the high end of the gutter run which is why that bracket is into the drip edge.



joecaption said:


> #4, There should have been a kick out on the roof to direct the water away from that corner.


BINGO! House was built like this and the flashing wasn't corrected when a new roof was installed about 20 years ago. So how does one integrate the kickout with the piece of siding? Cut a vertical slot in the siding? Got any photos or drawings?



joecaption said:


> Really want to get rid of this issue once and for all, have the fashias wrapped with coil stock.


I am assuming that "coil stock" is just sheet aluminum that comes in a coil?


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)




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## ChuckF. (Aug 25, 2013)

Wall to roof flashing is a common trouble area, look at youtube, there are dozens of videos on how to do it.


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)




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## Steve Sr (Mar 7, 2013)

carpdad said:


> 1980 is new, not vintage.:smile: Photo 2 shows the step flashings under the siding. Step flashing ends with the eave because the framing went up without a thought for this kind of area. Fix is to remove some roofing and siding. Then cut a kerf, a thin cut line, into the facia against where it butts the wall. https://www.finehomebuilding.com/20...-flash-troublesome-roof-to-wall-intersections


Great article and video for doing it right the first time! I'll have to tear into the piece of siding and see if I can retrofit a kickout diverter (after I find one!).



carpdad said:


> You could flash over the siding with sheet metal or tape (eternabond tape), since gutter will hide most of it anyway. But you still have to add kickout flashing that goes under the last step flashing. If possible, change to a larger gutter and slope it away from that corner


The gutter capacity and slope is already sufficient on this part of the roof. This wasn't a gutter overflow issue.


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## romeojk27 (Jul 26, 2018)

Wow. Good catch Joecaption with that drip edge. 

Say, Steve Sr., Joe is correct. The drop edge needs to drop into the gutter not behind it. Take the gutter clamp out, bend the drip edge up, and then screw it back in and let the drip edge go over it (if it will). 

I recently had a problem with my fascia board and realized the drip edge was flat against it so I bent it away a bit.

Good luck!


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## Steve Sr (Mar 7, 2013)

romeojk27 said:


> Wow. Good catch Joecaption with that drip edge.
> 
> Say, Steve Sr., Joe is correct. The drop edge needs to drop into the gutter not behind it. Take the gutter clamp out, bend the drip edge up, and then screw it back in and let the drip edge go over it (if it will).
> 
> ...


Thanks for the tip! I'll see what I can do when I re-paint everything. That gutter design is somewhat problematic. At least the gap to the fascia allows any water to escape and the fascia to dry. 

The metal gutter that was originally installed had issues with with any water getting behind the gutter would stay there and rot out the fascia board. Neighbors house had this issue big time.


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## Steve Sr (Mar 7, 2013)

Thanks for everyone's comments and advice. Now that I know the correct path to take and the specific name of the hardware everything gets much easier!

Best regards,
Steve


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## Steve Sr (Mar 7, 2013)

Hello,

After a vacation break I found and sized the kickout flashing as shown in the attached photo. BTW, there will be a piece of drip edge fixed to the top of the lower wall fascia board.

However, I am still in a quandary about how to fit the siding around it. Part of the siding should go behind the kickout but there is no room. And then there is the piece that goes over the kickout and existing flashing.

I guess that I could cut the siding out around the kickout and then caulk it up. Then use a second piece of siding to go on top of the existing flashing.

Anyone have any better ideas?

Thanks,
Steve


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## Steve Sr (Mar 7, 2013)

Sorry for the upside down photo . It is correct on my screen. I don't know how to fix it here...


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## Gregsoldtruck79 (Dec 21, 2017)

……………...


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## carpdad (Oct 11, 2010)

2 images. In both, finish siding goes over the top of the kickout flashing. But siding goes under the flashing on the sides and the ends. In your case, image 1 should make more sense. The drawing shows little bit of space where the siding is cut around the flashing. You can protect this space by slipping a metal sheet under the siding and the flashing. If the spacing worked, you should have installed the siding first so that the kickout flashing could be installed over the siding, and next course up would be overlapped over the flashing for positive drain (image 2).
For multiple protection, there should be a housewrap on the plywood and under that white flashing. You can still put flashing there. Use thin aluminum sheet and cut tight to the frame joints, try to slip it in so that the sheet goes under the step flashing. Do the best fit you can and caulk the joint with osi quad or tape with eternabond tape. This flashing overlaps the siding underneath. I would make the overlap wide enough 1-1.5" even if some of that flashing shows under the finish siding but you can hide it under the next course siding.


I think the flashing in image 2 is better than the one you're showing.


This is tricky area and retrofitting can leave a leaky joint. That is why the finehomebuilding article which over sticks a large area. I think that is bit overdone, but it leaves nothing to chance.


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## Steve Sr (Mar 7, 2013)

carpdad said:


> 2 images. In both, finish siding goes over the top of the kickout flashing. But siding goes under the flashing on the sides and the ends. In your case, image 1 should make more sense. The drawing shows little bit of space where the siding is cut around the flashing. You can protect this space by slipping a metal sheet under the siding and the flashing. If the spacing worked, you should have installed the siding first so that the kickout flashing could be installed over the siding, and next course up would be overlapped over the flashing for positive drain (image 2).
> For multiple protection, there should be a housewrap on the plywood and under that white flashing. You can still put flashing there. Use thin aluminum sheet and cut tight to the frame joints, try to slip it in so that the sheet goes under the step flashing. Do the best fit you can and caulk the joint with osi quad or tape with eternabond tape. This flashing overlaps the siding underneath. I would make the overlap wide enough 1-1.5" even if some of that flashing shows under the finish siding but you can hide it under the next course siding.
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for the tips! Yes, this is a retrofit so I can't remove any shingles or more siding without destroying it. Looks like cut around and caulk is the way to go. The issue, of course, is where the siding has to transition from behind the siding to in front of it. The siding is probably 1/4" - 3/8" thick at this point. With cedar shakes instead of bevel siding this would be MUCH easier!

Do you have any preference for either OSI Quad or OSI Quad Max. Both seem to be readily available at the local big boxes.

Thanks,
Steve


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

I would do a little surgery with small saw so you could lip the kick out flashing under and behind the step flashing.
https://www.google.ca/search?q=mult...dpr=1#imgrc=Up0E03LFuKadLM:&spf=1538342271112


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## Steve Sr (Mar 7, 2013)

Nealtw said:


> I would do a little surgery with small saw so you could lip the kick out flashing under and behind the step flashing.
> https://www.google.ca/search?q=mult...dpr=1#imgrc=Up0E03LFuKadLM:&spf=1538342271112


Got one of those tools... Great for surgically cutting out sections of cedar bevel siding to replace!

However, I don't really see what you mean as the kickout is already under and behind the step flashing but also right up next to the sheathing.

Thanks,
Steve


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

Steve Sr said:


> Got one of those tools... Great for surgically cutting out sections of cedar bevel siding to replace!
> 
> However, I don't really see what you mean as the kickout is already under and behind the step flashing but also right up next to the sheathing.
> 
> ...


 Sorry; I missed that little detail.


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## Steve Sr (Mar 7, 2013)

Nealtw said:


> Sorry; I missed that little detail.


Hard to see upside down... unless you are standing on your head! Wish I could fix that.

Steve


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

Steve Sr said:


> Hard to see upside down... unless you are standing on your head! Wish I could fix that.
> 
> Steve


:wink2:


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## Steve Sr (Mar 7, 2013)

Nealtw said:


> :wink2:


Care to share how you did this so that I can fix in the future?

I went looking for my photos in my profile and couldn't find them. It just wanted me to create a new album.

I opened a new response so that I could get into the "Manage Photos" page. All it would let me do is upload a new photo and not edit the previous ones.

Does one need special permissions to see/edit photos?


Thanks,
Steve


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

Steve Sr said:


> Care to share how you did this so that I can fix in the future?
> 
> I went looking for my photos in my profile and couldn't find them. It just wanted me to create a new album.
> 
> ...


 I down loaded it, flipped it, loaded it back up.:biggrin2:


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## carpdad (Oct 11, 2010)

steps:
1. Remove white kickout.
2. Metal flashing. Img a.

3. Metal flashing butts to facia and slips under the step flashing.
4. Butt corner: cover with angle. 4-6" overlaps. These are what I'd use even if shows. Corner flashing bends over the existing lower siding.
5. Install blue siding.
6. Corner flashing again over the facia and siding. Go Higher than the kickout.
7. Kickout install.
8. Siding install. 

Img b: where siding butts the kickout, you can seal with good quality tape. No caulk.
You may end up with small area that's not covered (?). Another tape or flashing over that. You may also end up with flashing that shows like a sore thumb. Again, imo, better than no flashing.
9. Previous post photos show gutters butting to the siding. I'd not do this by protecting the whole area with metal flashing. OVER THE SIDING. Water will splash and snow will sit around. Builders in past tried to make the flashing decorative. Maybe flashing can be cut in some animal shape, etc. Some 3D shape.


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## carpdad (Oct 11, 2010)

Happy Halloween.:smile: Another flashing shape.


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