# Is it my Phillips screwdriver or its just me?



## dumbengineer (Aug 15, 2012)

I'm having a very hard time screwing in a 2-inch long screw through my ceiling wood joist. I'm trying to hang a ceiling fan.

Looking at some do it yourself videos online, I'm surprised at how easy this woman is able to put the screw inside the joist.

I was wondering if my screw driver is worn out (don't know how to tell) or putting 2-in screw inside a joist is never easy.


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## jeffsw6 (Oct 28, 2012)

Sure, your screwdriver bit can be worn and then it will slip out of the screw more easily. It might also be the wrong size bit for the screw. It is not easy to sink a 2" screw with a hand-screwdriver, though. Especially when you are standing on a ladder. An impact driver would make short work of it. A regular drill will still make it easier.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

if your driving long screws that require torque,, dont use philips you need robertsons or grex


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## ToolSeeker (Sep 19, 2012)

If memory serves me right driving a 2" screw by hand without pre drilling is not fun whice ever screwdriver you use.


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

Still trying to figure out exactly what it is your trying to do.
Why are you trying to use that long a screw?
I've never seen a 2" screw used when installing a ceiling fan.
More details would sure help.


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## dumbengineer (Aug 15, 2012)

that's an existing screw that i removed (dont know how they were able to screw it in. dont know why they used that long). i'm using the existing holes also but still cant get it in.

they used it for ceiling lights only but has pre-wire for ceiling fan in case i add one which what i'm doing.

i guess i wont try to screw back that long screw in. instead i'll buy a shorter screw, drill a new hole on the joist.

how long do you think is long enough for a standard living room ceiling fan and what size of screw?


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## Larryh86GT (Feb 2, 2013)

I would pre-drill for a 2" screw. Tough going with out it.


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## dumbengineer (Aug 15, 2012)

after searching online i found i should use #10-32 screw. but coudnt find the length i need. is 1/2" length ok?


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## Dorado (Feb 7, 2013)

A slot head screw and screwdriver would work better. Phillips head screws are made to cam out so they're not tightened too much. And lubricate the threads with beeswax or a screw lubricant. And check that your screwdriver is the right size. It shouldn't fit too loosely but it should fit all the way into the head of the screw. If you drill a hole larger enough to easily drive the screw with the wrong screwdriver, it won't be strong enough.


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## jeffsw6 (Oct 28, 2012)

#10-32 is a common machine screw but it is not what I would use for hanging an overhead load in a wooden beam, especially a vibrating, live load like a ceiling fan. It will eventually fall down. You need something with fewer threads-per-inch and ideally you should have a self-tapping wood screw.

Also, don't pre-tap a screw hole with a drill bit when hanging an overhead load if you aren't already pretty "handy." Don't want the fan to fall down on your family members or anything!


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## Dorado (Feb 7, 2013)

dumbengineer said:


> after searching online i found i should use #10-32 screw. but coudnt find the length i need. is 1/2" length ok?


The equation I have for determining pullout strength requires a 3/4" length for a #10 screw.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

a slotted screw is useless for trying to drive into wood. their for machine screws and electric switch plates.. you need robertsons to drive into wood


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## dumbengineer (Aug 15, 2012)

Dorado said:


> The equation I have for determining pullout strength requires a 3/4" length for a #10 screw.


the existing screw is #12 x 2"L sheet metal screw.

I used #12 x 1-1/2"L sheet metal screw instead of machine screw.

formula based on wood handbook:
p = 15700 G^2 D L

i assume G as 0.3
D = 0.22in for #12 screw
L =1 inch penetration

p = 310 lbs... weight of ceiling fan is 35 lbs so even if i multiply weight by 3x for dynamic it still ok..

can someone correct this calculation if i'm wrong. i've never done wood calcs.


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## jproffer (Mar 12, 2005)

We've never done any either :jester:.

We just grab a screw and drive it in there.


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## Dorado (Feb 7, 2013)

dumbengineer said:


> the existing screw is #12 x 2"L sheet metal screw.
> 
> I used #12 x 1-1/2"L sheet metal screw


I think that length works with the equation but I didn't check it. It's still a major screw and the wood is strong and I can't imagine a ceiling fan requiring anything more. But is the entire weight held with just that one screw through the wood? Is this a custom mount thing you're doing or is it made to be hung with just one screw? I never hung a ceiling fan but I hung a chandelier and I think it required several screws in the ceiling plus one bolt through a steel bracket.


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

Really need a picture so everyone's not having to just guess what it is your trying to do.
There's 4 or 5 differant fan rated boxes you could be trying to use.


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## Dorado (Feb 7, 2013)

And we have to know how much of the screw is actually going into the wood.


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## dumbengineer (Aug 15, 2012)

It has 2 screws actually so pullout capacity is 2x my previous calcs. Everything is good now. I was able to install it. Thanks to all who replied.


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## Dave88LX (Nov 10, 2011)

Most of the Hunter fans that I've bought have a pair of ~2" long screws for use when you have a framed-in 2x4 for the box mount. The long screw lets you go into the mounting plate, take up the gap depth of the electrical box, and get you deep enough into the wood. Course, the boxes I had to add in myself use threaded bolts (or are they still considered screws? 10-32 I think... Whatever!)


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