# Torch Down vs. Cold Process



## pookietookie (Aug 9, 2012)

Hello everyone,

This is not quite a DIY question but I am hoping someone here might be able to advise me on the best material (and application) for my condo building's flat roof. We currently have a granulated rubber roof that was applied 4 years ago (it was a new roof --- tear off) by a company using cold process (this was before I moved to the condo building). The roof is in pretty bad shape for its age and has leaked since day 1 of my move-in. According to new roofers, things weren't done as well as they could have been and most people recommend a new roof atop the existing.

Now, my issue is that half the roofers who I talk to recommend a torch down roof with a silver or white coating on the top. The other half say that torch down is the wrong way to go because the seams begin to crack within 5 years and the application can be dangerous if not done properly. These guys instead are proposing using a cold process with a slightly thinner material (typically Tamko Awaplan rubberized roll with elastomeric adhesive).

With such a divided view on the correct roofing material for our building -- all from people who seem very qualified -- it's become very hard to make my decision for who to go with. The cost is about the same, give or take a few hundred bucks, and the warranties are comparable.

Any advice for which type of roof application and material should be used? Who should I go with? The torch down people or the cold process people? Help!


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## roofnron (Dec 7, 2011)

At first glance I say neither. But I don't know the market you are in. You are only talking about one type of material, modified, and there are several other roofs types. Have you looked at the benefits and/ or disadvantages of PVC, TPO, EPDM, SPF roofs.

Do you know if the roofers can install other types of roofs, so you know you are getting the honest opinion of what type of roof you building would truly benefit from? Torch down roofers often bother me the most, (this isn't the case all the time), but they run around with a torch and a propane tank and this is all they know how to do. 

Both torch down and cold applied can work well, the seams will not crack in 5 years. There are not so great products though and not so great installers. I moved away from using torches on roofs a long time ago because of the liability. There have been thousands of roofs caught on fire from good companies and good roofers from a torch. Do a search and you will find many stories. 

If you were to choose a torch applied roof, you need to get a copy of the insurance certificate. Then call the agent listed and confirm you are covered and understand the process if something happens. Make sure the roofer you contract with isn't subcontracting to another roofer. If he is, get the subs insurance certificate as well and do the same thing. 

If you are stuck on using modified, understand you are likely talking about the difference between APP and SBS modified, and the roofers should be talking with you in the correct terminology, (if a roofer called the existing roof granulated rubber, go ahead and throw his bid in the trash). You can do some research for yourself on the differences, just try to stay away from roofers websites that may be biased, and stick with trade or manufacturers info.


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## hotrod351 (Jun 15, 2012)

granulated surface torch down is the best, if done right. the companies that are against it are the ones that dont know how to do it. ive always recommended to coat the torch down with 4 layers of elastomeric roof coating about 4 or 5 years after. then you have a roof that will last forever. the other way would be to tear the roof off completely and install elastomeric system, thats 4 layers, first layer then membrane then second layer, this is done in one step, then followed up with two more coats, again a roof that will last a long long time


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## roofnron (Dec 7, 2011)

Only issue with hotrod is an elastomeric coating is a roof. You are suggesting putting a roof over a roof. The granulated APP should last on its own. Elastomeric coatings are a roof on their own and can be applied by themselves over insulation boards. They often come with a 10 year warranty and you just need to re-coat in 10 years for an extended warranty. With that logic I can apply a coating to any type of roof after 5 years and it will last a long time. 

The is my opinion only. Modifieds of today are not the modifieds of 2 decades ago. I know of a US Intec 20+ years old that I put on that is still there. I know other roofers have similar stories. No elastomeric coatings. Today's modifieds are different as formulas have changed to compensate for the high cost of oil. Also things are made "cleaner" and "greener" which also doesn't always yield an improved product. 

Years ago we only thought about adding a cheap fibered aluminum coating for non-granulated, nothing for granulated.


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## roofermikeinc (Feb 4, 2012)

*Miami Roofer Mike Sez...*

If you have a 4-yr old roof you should be under warranty. If not, you should be taking estimates for a repair. The material is almost new. Any descent roofer can re-enforce the seams and correct workmanship defects at the flashings and penetrations.
Of course, most roofers won't tell you that if your asking for a new roof quote.
Call a company claiming to specialize in commercial roof repair.
Whatever you do, if the roof isn't torn off it's holding moisture which requires a 1-way vent/100'sq.

Roofer Mike 

www.roofermikeinc.com 

www.Facebook/pages/roofermikeinc.com


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## dougger222 (Feb 25, 2011)

Done a lot of granulated torch down and it's worked great (with a little bit of pitch). If the roof it totaly flat and can collect water torch down is not the way to go (learned the hard way).

If you ever watch that tv show with the Canandian dude you'll see his roofing subs put torch on almost every flat roof... That Canadian contractor knows a lot of stuff.


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## JWilliams (Sep 22, 2010)

ive installed tons on torch down on totally flat roofs and never had problems.


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## pookietookie (Aug 9, 2012)

Thanks for all the great feedback from everyone!


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## EJW (Sep 3, 2012)

*Ejw*

The best suggestion that I could give you as a Contractor is to check out some companies that specialize in those products that you are interested in and pick one that has a material and labor warranty that is 10 years or more with no fine print. Two of these companies are Sherwin Williams and their have a product and a system for that (uniflex). The second company is Hydro-Stop and they have the premium coat system. Both have rep's that come out to the jobsite and tell you what they require for that system to be qualified to receive their warranty. With Hydro-stop, the rep will take pictures before, during, and after of the job and you are provided with a cd with those on it for your records. you receive those pictures after the rep turns in all of his paperwork to the company and the company issues the warranty with the pictures. I have worked with both companies and have had great success with both.
I hope this helps.


pookietookie said:


> Hello everyone
> This is not quite a DIY question but I am hoping someone here might be able to advise me on the best material (and application) for my condo building's flat roof. We currently have a granulated rubber roof that was applied 4 years ago (it was a new roof --- tear off) by a company using cold process (this was before I moved to the condo building). The roof is in pretty bad shape for its age and has leaked since day 1 of my move-in. According to new roofers, things weren't done as well as they could have been and most people recommend a new roof atop the existing.
> 
> Now, my issue is that half the roofers who I talk to recommend a torch down roof with a silver or white coating on the top. The other half say that torch down is the wrong way to go because the seams begin to crack within 5 years and the application can be dangerous if not done properly. These guys instead are proposing using a cold process with a slightly thinner material (typically Tamko Awaplan rubberized roll with elastomeric adhesive).
> ...


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## pookietookie (Aug 9, 2012)

Hi guys,

I'm meeting with my condo board tomorrow night and looking over 4 or 5 different quotes I got from roofing companies. There's still the question of torch down versus cold process, since at least 3 of the 5 roofing companies seem to be reputable and guarantee either for 12 years.

Several are referencing "GAF RUBBEROID" as the material and since I know nothing about this I thought I'd ask what the consensus is on this. Is that a good material to use atop an existing roof? I figure it has to be half decent if it comes with a 12 year warranty. Also, in most cases, this material is applied via torch down and I seem to have a choice of the standard silver coating or (for more $$$), a white coating which I'm told does the best job reflecting the sun, etc...

Also, noticed that one roofer is recommending the following material "US. Ply 160 plus polyester 4.5mm.white granular roof." Again, with a 12 year warranty.

Thoughts? Really appreciate everyone's insight!


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