# getting a building permit after construction is done



## nap

very situation and location dependent. I have known people that had to raze decks and even small additions and I have known people that were simply allowed to purchase the overpriced permit and have a cursory inspection performed. Which will happen in your situation is going to depend on the locals and what actually was done that should have been inspected. 

Does the older project meet code requirements? was there any structural work done? Did it add square footage to the house?


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## ChrisJJ

nap said:


> very situation and location dependent. I have known people that had to raze decks and even small additions and I have known people that were simply allowed to purchase the overpriced permit and have a cursory inspection performed. Which will happen in your situation is going to depend on the locals and what actually was done that should have been inspected.
> 
> Does the older project meet code requirements? was there any structural work done? Did it add square footage to the house?



Yes, we truly believe the work is to code. Nothing was done that would affect the house's structure and it doesn't add square footage to the house. 

The basic run down of our previous project:
Our washer & dryer were located in our unheated garage. Doing laundry was unpleasant in the winter and it was hard to keep the area clean. And so we had the bright idea of putting walls around the W/D to make a laundry room. In time the simple project of walling in the W/D morphed into a bigger project: add a floor, then make the walls and floor thicker for insulation and then the W/D's orientation was turned around meaning we needed to move the electrical outlet & plumbing lines.

We didn't pull a permit at the start because it was just putting in two interior non-load bearing walls and, well, before we knew it the project was done. 

The laundry room has, honestly, been a big improvement to our lives and we would hate to lose it. My argument with my SO about whether to play dumb or not is that I can't believe an inspector so blind not to notice a laundry room in a garage.


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## nap

if you access the laundry room from the house (and not having to enter the garage) there are some fire codes that would have had to have been considered. The wall between a garage and the living space is typically required to be fire rated so, does it still meet code?


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## ChrisJJ

nap said:


> if you access the laundry room from the house (and not having to enter the garage) there are some fire codes that would have had to have been considered. The wall between a garage and the living space is typically required to be fire rated so, does it still meet code?


We still enter the laundry room from the garage. No penetrations were made between the garage and house when we built the laundry room. The electrical and plumbing penetrations were already in existence (put in when the house was built) and had been caulked with fire stopping caulk at that time. The wall and door between garage and house are fire rated and to code.


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## no1hustler

How long have you lived at the house? Tell them it was done before you moved it.


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## Tom Struble

the guys trying to come clean not lie:no:..i know it may be hard for you to believe but some people are actually honest:wink:


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## joed

Roll the whole thing into the current project and let them inspect now, even if it meant taking part of it down and redoing it.


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## no1hustler

tomstruble said:


> the guys trying to come clean not lie:no:..i know it may be hard for you to believe but some people are actually honest:wink:


Yeah, I understand that. But if you know that it is down right, then why bother giving more of your hard earned money to the government scam artists?


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## Tom Struble

cause it will come back to bite you when you try to sell your house


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## ChrisJJ

joed said:


> Roll the whole thing into the current project and let them inspect now, even if it meant taking part of it down and redoing it.


 Whoa . . . really? That sounds in some ways like an easy solution but I'm trying to wrap my mind around how one would do this. It would mean taking all the drywall down and removing the W/D from the room? Otherwise, wouldn't it be obvious that this isn't new work? 

I thought that since I have the construction progress photos and know exactly where everything is behind the drywall I could use my multi-max and cut out tidy windows to expose wires & plumbing, save the cut-outs and use them to patch up the holes after inspection. But I would think that would be a strong clue to an inspector that it wasn't new work, right? Dang because I'm great at fiddling detail work like cutting out drywall and patching but would have to hire someone to hang drywall if I would want it done in any sort of reasonable time frame. Normally not a big deal except that we would have to have the drywall done before we could hook up the W/D again. 

Sorry if my replies seem to wander into details, I'm thinking things through as I write.


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## ChrisJJ

Considering some the incredible lack of common sense I've seen in the common man throughout my years, I completely understand why we need codes. I believe the old project was done right and so part of me thinks why bother with the hassle of getting it approved. But the new electrical work involves creating new circuits and messing with the breaker box and I, absolutely, want that inspected which means the inspector will be in the laundry room. I see it as we either fess up now or risk getting caught later.

My SO suggested we avoid the whole laundry room permit issue by having the new electrical work done without permit (my SO has a devious mind). I don't agree mostly because I want all major electrical work inspected but also if we did it without permit, it'll mean we'd be in even bigger pile of crap if we get caught. If we come clean now it would mean we would have to remove drywall to expose the wires & plumbing in a dinky 6' x 8' laundry room. Not great but if we got caught later we would have to not only take down drywall in the laundry room but in a 25' x 25' with 10' tall ceiling garage as well. From checking the muni building department, the electrical inspection fees go by square foot which means it'll be a goodly sum to get a normal permit for the garage. If we did it without permit and got caught, the fee would be doubled plus we would have the cost of replacing the drywall. Oh and let's not forget double the wrath of the notoriously crabby code enforcement officer. 

I thought about about this issue last night and it also occurred to me that if anything goes wrong in the laundry room or garage, even if it's has no relationship to the quality of the original work, the lack of permit might give our insurance company an easy way to deny a claim, up our premiums or drop us. 

Am I over thinking this?


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## kwikfishron

You’re right about the insurance company. If you’re going to come clean and do the right thing, then do it.

Go down to the BD “in person” talk to the inspector and confess your sins. Just be honest, sincere, and respectful. Take your lumps if any and move on. If it means removing some sheetrock then so be it. 

That’s better than the insurance company denying your claim when the house burns down.


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## epson

Ok I have seen this time and time again. I would do one of two things here. 

1) Go to a local architect and tell him your situation, hand him your photo’s and any other documentation of the work that was done and have him draw up the plans for your new electrical project which he will tie into the existing laundry room showing all existing wiring, plumbing and work which was done by the previous contractor and hand the plans for permit.

 2) You can open up the wall one side only exposing all the new plumbing and electrical work which was done by the pervious contractor and still have the architect draw up plans for your new work. This way the inspector will see all wiring, plumbing and construction and wont second guess and give you a hard time.


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## joed

The cost of the penalties might more than tearing down part or all of the room for inspection as part of the new work.


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## ChrisJJ

Thanks guys, I guess I know what to do . . . 

Not to complain or anything but you guys never did answer a fairly critical question from my original post: Would groveling help when meeting the Code Enforcement Officer? Gnashing my teeth? Sobbing for forgiveness? My SO suggests cookies. Maybe groveling, gnashing, sobbing AND cookies?


 Just kidding 

Well maybe I'm not completely kidding. I'm not above groveling if I think it'll soften Mr. Code Enforcement Officer's heart.


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## epson

ChrisJJ said:


> Thanks guys, I guess I know what to do . . .
> 
> Not to complain or anything but you guys never did answer a fairly critical question from my original post: Would groveling help when meeting the Code Enforcement Officer? Gnashing my teeth? Sobbing for forgiveness? My SO suggests cookies. Maybe groveling, gnashing, sobbing AND cookies?
> 
> 
> Just kidding
> 
> Well maybe I'm not completely kidding. I'm not above groveling if I think it'll soften Mr. Code Enforcement Officer's heart.


That will only work if you give him a paid vacation so he will look the other way :whistling2:
Just kidding :icon_rolleyes:


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## Scuba_Dave

I would go in & ask how you find out if the prior contractor pulled a permit for the prior work completed
You thought he did...but not sure
Then go from there


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## Cons.Consultan

*Building Permits*

I own a company that specializes in after the fact building permits. And I can say that the building dept. in every jurisdiction is a problem.....I know I worked there for 26 yrs. So come clean and let an expert do the work for you ....that's if you value your time and your sanity.


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## ddawg16

Some really good responses.....the general gist of which is to come clean....in the end, the truth is always better.

One thing to tell the SO....if you ever sell the house....the new buyers might check to see if you pulled permits for the changes....if not....they either back out and get their deposit back....or they talk you down in price.....and that is if your lucky and they don't report it....

Humble stupidity might be your best option....


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## md2lgyk

Tom Struble said:


> cause it will come back to bite you when you try to sell your house


In every thread like this one, your statement seems to appear sooner or later. For the most part, in my experience it's completely untrue. 

In 40 years, I have owned ten houses in seven different states. Some were purchased knowing there was obviously unpermitted work, which I later fixed. I also did some amount of unpermitted work in all of them, including kitchen and bath complete guts. Never once did I have an issue selling any of them. 

I've only ever gotten two permits in my life. One was for a premanufactured Amish shed that just sits on the ground. Ridiculous - the inspector "inspected" it without getting out of his car. A waste of $78. The other was to construct my current house, a log home that my wife and I built almost entirely with our own hands. Tough to slide that by without a permit.


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## 1910NE

md2lgyk said:


> In every thread like this one, your statement seems to appear sooner or later. For the most part, in my experience it's completely untrue. .....


I have to agree with this. I know for a fact that every home that i have ever owned/sold (including the current project) had unpermitted work done to them. I know this because in each case I have been to the building department, and seen what they have on file. Not one of those homes was hard for me to sell because of that. In fact, I have never been asked that question, by a realtor or a buyer.

I think it would be a safer bet to state that "In some areas, the lack of permits might cause issues when selling a home."


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## CoconutPete

Cons.Consultan said:


> I own a company that specializes in after the fact building permits. And I can say that the building dept. in every jurisdiction is a problem.....I know I worked there for 26 yrs. So come clean and let an expert do the work for you ....that's if you value your time and your sanity.


Since you are replying to this *2 Y E A R S* after the last post was made, I have this funny feeling they probably already sorted this out :wacko:


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