# Rolling Insl-X Cabinet Coat



## mark sr (Jun 13, 2017)

I wouldn't use a 1" brush! Smallest I'd consider would be a 2" I generally just brush bookshelves although rolling can work. Either use a short nap roller or use any roller cover and tip off the rolled on paint [lightly brush over the wet paint]


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

mark sr said:


> I wouldn't use a 1" brush! Smallest I'd consider would be a 2" I generally just brush bookshelves although rolling can work. Either use a short nap roller or use any roller cover and tip off the rolled on paint [lightly brush over the wet paint]


Thanks Mark. I don't mind to brush the whole thing instead of roll but want to do it right. Is it best to use a heavier coat and maybe back brush? I really want it to level as well as possible but I'm probably overthinking it at this point .

how about whether I can do the whole thing at one time? I have never used Cabinet Coat and hear it is not as bad as BM Advance for sagging, but want to minimize any issues. From what I understand CC dries in about 20-30 mins so it's not a giant deal to do one surface at a time if needed (times five shelves)


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## mark sr (Jun 13, 2017)

I don't remember if I've used that particular coating or not.

The best way to apply the paint can be tempered by your skill level. Those with poor brushing skills often do better by rolling the finish. You should be able to tell by the time you've painted one shelf which method will work best for you. About the worst that can happen is you'd have to sand and repaint.


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## Tyus4 (Feb 10, 2011)

I've actually used inslx cabinet coating before and I was very impressed with it and the leveling qualities were pretty good. I used a foam roller and the finish came out really nice. One problem I had was putting on the product, it was kinda slow with foam roller. The other problem was Inslx says its self priming and I was going over poly'd cabinets...Even after sanding and deglossing it still didn't have the bite I was hoping for. I would have gone with a bonding priming if I had to do it again.


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## mathmonger (Dec 27, 2012)

I don't know if this is a thing, but when I tip off, it seems to me like I get a better finish if I lay the brush down at a real shallow angle - almost parallel to the thing I'm painting. Using the actual "tips" doesn't work so great.


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

mathmonger said:


> I don't know if this is a thing, but when I tip off, it seems to me like I get a better finish if I lay the brush down at a real shallow angle - almost parallel to the thing I'm painting. Using the actual "tips" doesn't work so great.


I've seen posts saying to apply Advance (and maybe it was CC as well) thick, similar to putting on nail polish... I'd love to say I have lots of practice at THAT... but 

Fortunately the way the box is built I can start in a corner and end up rolling off an edge. Only four surfaces of each bottomless box actually needs paint.


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## klaatu (Mar 9, 2015)

Cabinet Coat is engineered in such a way that you actually get better results from brushing than from rolling. Rolling with just about any type or nap of roller will leave a stipple. It also doesn't like to be overworked with the brush. Lay on a good coat and just brush over it one time immediately after. It will lay out to an almost sprayed look. You can try rolling and tipping it like mathmonger suggests.


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

Thanks everyone.

Last question. If you had your choice and perfect conditions, would you still brush or bite the bullet and spray? I actually have access to an airless and some 211/311 tips, I just fear I'll make it look worse and waste a ton of paint in the process. I also have an HF HVLP gun and a Wagner low end control spray, but not sure if those tips are too big.


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## woodco (Jun 11, 2017)

The best way would be to spray it with a 410. I wouldnt use an hvlp, its not thin enough.


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## mark sr (Jun 13, 2017)

I probably wouldn't spray; too small of a job to warrant the prep and clean up. IF it was being painted in a shop versus house - I might spray.


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

I can do it outside (if this crappy weather ever lifts at least lol).

Yeah woodco sorry to be repetitive since we already went through this in the other thread. I am just having some probs finding a 410 tip. Worst case (weather permitting) will a 211/311/411 work? Believe it or not I tried our local paint store but they are out of stock. Amazon has them for like 40 bucks which seems a little steep for one job. I almost picked up that pressure pot HLVP you had recommended but I worry my compressor won't be able to keep up.

The biggest challenge for me spraying would be where the corners meet. I'm sure that it's going to take one smooth move to avoid overbuilding those areas. I am confident I can get it nice with a rattle can or even an air gun set low but I am not sure if a 411 (or even 410) has a comparable volume / rate to either. If it's more than that then probably not a good job to start practicing with, and I should just brush.


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## mark sr (Jun 13, 2017)

A 4/10 has a slightly smaller opening than a 4/11. I probably use a 4/11 more than any other tip when spraying enamel. The first number has to do with the size of the fan.


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

mark sr said:


> A 4/10 has a slightly smaller opening than a 4/11. I probably use a 4/11 more than any other tip when spraying enamel. The first number has to do with the size of the fan.


Thanks and yeah I get the fan size code. These are pretty small shelves (23x45x12 inches) so I was thinking a narrower fan would be better. If I'm off though and in reality one can hit the corners easier with one shot vs. multiple passes, I can use whatever works best.

Total shift... assuming I do not expect to use an airless too often in the future, is the Graco truecoat VSP handheld a good option? I know you can select tips for it similar to the larger models, and unlike the lower end handhelds. If you tell me there's no advantage other than price though, I guess a regular airless is a better all around bet... assuming I use it a few times a year.

Sorry for all the waffling. The reason I can do so is because I needed these ready for the weekend but due to recent storms in our state we are having big power outage problems and frequent cutouts as they repair the lines in town. I may have to lean to brushes simply because I don't have enough time to practice, and no generator


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## mark sr (Jun 13, 2017)

The only handheld graco I've used was over 40 yrs ago. It was heavy and vibrated something awful ...... but that was 40 yrs ago. I've only used hand held airlesses a handful of times.

If it was me, I'd brush or roll - just not a big enough job [IMO] to warrant spraying.


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

I'm leaning that way in fact.. having laid on a crazy heavy coat in the sloppiest manner possible, and having it come out pretty damn flat! I can't say there are no brush marks in the right light, but it's darn near a spray job. For sure it will be a lot cheaper lol.


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

Tried some more sides. I'm having two issues:

1 - keeping paint from sagging on vertical surfaces
2 - stopping the brush from pulling the paint straight off the primer and leaving nuggets

I may just have to do every side laying flat then flip them. Not fun.

Any idea if you can sand CC in less than 24 hours?


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## Tyus4 (Feb 10, 2011)

Doing multiple thin coats will provide better results than
one heavy application. I'm not sure what you mean by nuggets other than foreign material thats not suppose to be in the paint. My guess is either you are not keeping a wet edge and its tacking up and you are trying to go back over it and its dragging leaving your "nuggets". Or you actually have unwanted things in your paint which you can prevent by straining the paint. You should have no problem sanding the same day. You can recoat in 6 hours and tack free in 1 hour.


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

Yes I think that's it... the brush is dragging plus it itself starts to dry... catching the wrong spot rolls off little balls.

Amazingly enough though, as it dries these seem to fall off completely or just sinks into the coat. Even sags seem to disappear if you let them. It's still drying so I have not had a chance to truly inspect, so I hope I'm right.

I will check it tomorrow morning and sand as needed. The real problem I am having with these coats is that it's hard to get a coat thin without working the paint and leaving some spots. it's like if the brush isn't loaded up to a certain point, it won't even try to grab... it just floats over the surface. Again I'll keep practicing, but it is pretty darn goof proof so far!

Thanks again for all the advice thus far!


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## mark sr (Jun 13, 2017)

Sometimes it helps to thin the coating, it's better to do that than brush or roll the paint out thinly. I wouldn't thin the paint unless needed.


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## woodco (Jun 11, 2017)

giansean said:


> Thanks and yeah I get the fan size code. These are pretty small shelves (23x45x12 inches) so I was thinking a narrower fan would be better. If I'm off though and in reality one can hit the corners easier with one shot vs. multiple passes, I can use whatever works best.
> 
> Total shift... assuming I do not expect to use an airless too often in the future, is the Graco truecoat VSP handheld a good option? I know you can select tips for it similar to the larger models, and unlike the lower end handhelds. If you tell me there's no advantage other than price though, I guess a regular airless is a better all around bet... assuming I use it a few times a year.


Narrower fans are actually not better, because a 211, 311, 411, all put the same volume of paint out, but the 211 is more focused, so it seems like its putting more paint out, and a 411 spreads the same amount of paint in a wider area, so its a finer spray, and easier to spray inside cabinets.

IMO, a 410 is the mellowist, finest and easiest spray pattern you can get for latex. 411 is good too. I can use a 411 for cabinets. 

Honestly, spraying takes a lot of practice, so you are probably best rolling it.


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

Ok last question (maybe )

how good/forgiving is CC with spot painting and touchups? Can you fix spots and or paint over patched nail holes on the fly, or do you need to recoat the whole surface?


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## woodco (Jun 11, 2017)

giansean said:


> Ok last question (maybe )
> 
> how good/forgiving is CC with spot painting and touchups? Can you fix spots and or paint over patched nail holes on the fly, or do you need to recoat the whole surface?


That, I dont know. Do it right, you wont ever have to touch it up.


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## mark sr (Jun 13, 2017)

I don't know about that particular coating but as a rule, enamels don't touch up well. Touch ups tend to work better in the corners or ends versus the middle. Often I'll just recoat the panel in question when it needs touching up.


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## Tyus4 (Feb 10, 2011)

I would suggest try using a mohair nap. Almost looks like a sprayed finish with this coating and will put it on nice and thin.


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

Thanks everyone!

I carried on with the brush as the results so far have been pretty outstanding... think I have a groove now. I switched to a 3" Chinex brush which seems to stick a lot better and gives me a wider cut too. Have been doing one downward facing horizontal surface at a time by laying on a medium thin coat, going over it once to smooth, and leaving it alone. In about 30 minutes I can flip the box and do another side. Trying not to let a too-wet surface go vertical, though with this method sags seem pretty minimal.

My plan was to sand anyway so I can try switching to a mohair or foam roller for the 2nd coat and see how it goes. I did try rolling over the BIN a bit and was having a hard time getting the CC to really grab, not to mention trying to keep the roller from sliding around too much. CC is interesting stuff. You need to load up pretty well to get it to stick but once it catches it catches. You just can't work it too long or that's it. I nailed a tacky spot w/ my finger by accident and had to resist all urges to go over it again too early lol. I'll just have to fit it when sanding. Might as well see how well it spot repairs before I do the 2nd coat too... will let everyone know.

Thx again!


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## Tyus4 (Feb 10, 2011)

If these spot repairs consist of using wood filler or patch or such, there is a good possibility it will flash with just one coat. So 2 coats are needed on on top of repairs


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

Noted. I meant more like sanding out an imperfection and putting a swipe of the finish on to rebuild it a little. I am curious as to whether/how much CC will show lap marks.


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## woodco (Jun 11, 2017)

giansean said:


> Noted. I meant more like sanding out an imperfection and putting a swipe of the finish on to rebuild it a little. I am curious as to whether/how much CC will show lap marks.


In general, that never works right. You mess it up, redo the whole face, no matter what kind of paint you use. There are a few exceptions, but DIY's wont be able to do it.


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

Yeah if I do this it will be before the whole 2nd coat, just to experiment whether I need to redo the whole surface if I fill a nail hole or something. 

But either way I think I answered my own question when I checked my most recent side. I had painted up into a corner onto a previously painted side and when both dried, it showed badly where I overlapped. For the final coat I may have to tape a bit to prevent overlapping on the adjacent surface once it is dried. I guess this is an advantage of spraying too


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

So quick update for anyone may follow this thread someday. For giggles today I decided to dump a little Cabinet Coat in both my Wagner electric (basic no-nonsense Control Spray, mostly designed for thin coatings) and my ancient HF (not purple) air pot sprayer. 

The Wagner was a definite no-go. Spat the paint on in big dribbles. Can't say coverage was bad and that it didn't level well (it did) but it was clear CC was WAY too thick for it.

The old HF gun did a better job but still struggled a little keeping a consistent flow. Some blame must be laid w/ my only 10g compressor but I have a feeling it was also too thick for this gun. It also had no problem with levelling where I could get it thick enough.. in fact in some spots where coverage was too little it came out rather rough, so I think a "thick enough" coat is required for CC to work properly.

Back to brushing!


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

One more update

Still getting these done, along with face frames. Brushing with this stuff has been very smooth. I think I did myself a disservice last night by using the product too cold, and for the first time saw some visible brush strokes you could feel. Not a huge deal though.

Rolling has been tough but works with practice. I have only been rolling the face frames with mohair covers and this stuff is so goopy that it tends to just slide the roller along like a paint pad. I can go back over it easily enough but I try not to work it too much. 

Final (I hope) question about finishing. The satin finish is a bit too shiny IMO. What's a good grit to degloss but minimize sanding marks? Did some experimentation and a used 220 sponge gives me the smoothest surface and removes all dust nibs - and minimizes gloss, almost resembling a melamine finish. Steel wool is out because of how CC reacts with metal, stains it immediately.

All told, Cabinet Coat is the shizz!


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## woodco (Jun 11, 2017)

It'll dull with time. I do not suggest trying to dull it.


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## mark sr (Jun 13, 2017)

Sanding doesn't just dull the finish it makes it more prone to dirt/grease. I suspect the satin finish will grow on you.


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## giansean (Mar 4, 2015)

Good feedback. In fact I got so used to rolling I ended up rolling another coat on the boxes and I really like the outcome. Now I wish I started with rolling, though the brushing allowed me to build up a nice base coat. 

One more coat on the face frames and I'm done! Good thing it's going to be like 35 degrees tomorrow


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