# egress window with header required



## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

hello forum. i am looking for some input on an egress window that i will be installing later this summer.

what i have is an unfinished basement with a couple windows needing to be replaced with legal egress windows.

the one in the laundry room is going to be a smaller size of 48*36 and the other i would like to be 72*48.

with both windows i will need to build in a header panel as the walls are bearing walls. 

i would like to know some opinions on what size header to install over both windows. the 72*48 will have 5 floor joists to support with the joists being on 16" centers. the 48*36 will have 3 joists to support on 16" centers.

i am mainly concerned about the larger of the windows needing a beefier header to make up for the 5 joists laying on it and would like to know what i should go with.

thank you in advance for any input. if needed i can tkae a few pictures to show more details.

thanks
steve


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## Gary in WA (Mar 11, 2009)

You do know egress windows have to be 44" or less off the finished floor? http://www.codecheck.com/cc/pg07_08building.html

To size the header you need: the span of the joists from new header to next bearing- is it a center wall?
How many floors will it be supporting? The width of the building? Be safe, G


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

thanks gbar

if i go with the 48" tall it will put the bottom sill at roughly 26". the joist height to floor is only 6'8".

im not sure what you men by new header to next bearing? the window will be going into a hole cut that will be less than 3' from the corner of the foundation.

for floors supporting it will only have the main floor to support. no other floors above that beside the attic which is roughly 1/2 the size of the main floor with no storage or anything going there. 

width i will have to get tomorrow.

the new header i had planned to install would cover the 5 joists plus 9" extra on each end extending out to the joist that will still be support by the original foundation.

i will get some pics and post them here with what it looks like now.

thanks a ton 
steve


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

here are a couple pics of the larger window area.


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

this pic highlights where the floor joists that would need support are.

9" past the outer most lines are the next joists that will still have foundation support.


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

forgot to add that the foundation measure 30'X29' and the window will be less than 2' from the corner of the foundation.

gbar, can i ask you where in washinton you are located. i am in spokane.

thanks again
steve


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## Gary in WA (Mar 11, 2009)

Hi Steve, I'm Gary in Tacoma. My son went to Eastern, in Cheney. He is working part-time with the city planning department over there. 

Small world! I need to know: 1. if the rafters bear on that wall, upstairs? 2. are those joists held up by a middle wall, or beam? What is that span- new window wall to middle wall? 3. Are those joists 2x8? or ? 

The new window location worries me. As it is only 2' from the corner, you would be losing a lot of shear there. Any chance of moving it away from the corner more?

Any thoughts from our forum's *Structural Engineers?*

Until they chime in I can give you this: http://www.burlington.org/Building08/Spans.pdf Notice holding up one floor and ceiling and roof. Also tells you how many trimmers supporting each side, though yours will be concrete. 3- 2x10's will work. That puts you 2' down below ceiling, which is good for trim. As long as bottom of window is 18"+ above finished floor, no safety glazing is required.

Be safe, G


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

i cannot say if the rafters bear on that wall right off hand. i will have to climb into the attic to see but i believe that they do.


the joists are held up by a middle beam that sits 9' 2" away from the new window wall. that beam measures roughly 5" X 7" beam, actually 3 pieces tied together, and runs the entire basement parralel to the new window wall. all of the joists are 1.75" X 7.5" spaced on 16" centers.

as for moving the window over some. the good thing about not having cut the hole yet i can do anything. if i move it as far as the edge of the existing window that would put it 34" from the corner.

thanks for the heloing hand G
steve


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## Gary in WA (Mar 11, 2009)

The bigger return on the wall, the better. I'd go with the 34" to start of opening. That will still give you some good shear for foundation stability. Use 3-2x10's. I did a header similar to yours about 5 years ago. I temporary supported the joists, had the concrete cut out, and installed a 3 piece header. I cut back the old joists the correct amount from the inside of the old rim, with enough room to install each board next to the concrete wall. By the time you lag each header board, the last one is perfect (1/8" gap to old joists) for the hangers last. 

Never mind the rafters, NA. Be safe, G


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

update:

i decide to go with a 60 * 36 window instead of the larger 72*48. the 60 * 36 will still give me legal egress in the future bedroom and will obviously make the span shorter than the 72.

when making a header i have read through a few sources that you should sandwich 1/2" plywood between each piece of the header. is this correct? 

does the 1/2" ply have to be treated like the header boards or just plain plywood?

when cutting the concrete do you start on the exterior of the foundation and cut through as much as possible then move inside? i figure this way would cut down on the amount of dust i would get inside the basement by doing a majority of the cutting outside.

i also plan to anchor the framing into the concrete instead of nailing. my brother nailed his in and had some minor cracking issues from the nails going in so drilling and anchoring in my thoughts should help eliminate this possibility.

looking forward to this week as i am FINALLY getting the floor joist support jacks in place and having the concrete cut by the weeks end.


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## Gary in WA (Mar 11, 2009)

"when making a header i have read through a few sources that you should sandwich 1/2" plywood between each piece of the header. is this correct? " Only to make it fit the bearing below, 2x6, 2x4, etc. http://books.google.com/books?id=s-...esult&ct=result&resnum=1#v=onepage&q=&f=false

I have only ever had the concrete wall cut by a professional with a diamond-tipped 16 or 20" saw. The chunk removed is very heavy (150# per square foot), so be careful. I nailed the first header piece to the rim joist, second to first, etc., no chance of rotation. Use a thermal break at header/concrete. After the cuts, break it into manageable chunks while it is still intact, from the top down. (Have to anyway) Be safe, G


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

i really appreciate all the pointers and helping words. the concrete was cut yesterday and i knocked out the pieces in prep for the framing and window. i will get some pics when i get the frame work complete.

thanks a ton!
steve


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

rough framing complete. everything is laid into place right now for proper fit-up. i must be honest and say that i was a bit intimidated by this project at the start but it has really turned around.

couple pics


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## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

Lookin good
Its amazing how much a bigger window can change a room


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## Gary in WA (Mar 11, 2009)

Good progress! Don't forget to use some sticky window flashing tape on the bottom sill before you install the window on the outside from where it's at. Then use sticky on the p.t. jambs, then caulk, then window, then head sticky over the top flange, then trim. If you forgot to caulk behind the p.t., squirt some in the gap now. (Unless you used sill sealer as a thermal break)
I would use a Simpson H-1 on each floor joist over the new header, to keep the shear flow continuous across the opening made. (or H-2.5's)

Be safe, G


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

thanks for pointing out the h-1. i was looking at some in the store today and was not positive that i needed them but now i will definetly use them.


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

before and after pics....

also the laundry room where window #2 will be installed. had to move the sink, counter and shelf out of the way to get ready for the concrete to be cut friday.


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## Gary in WA (Mar 11, 2009)

Vinyl windows require continuous shim support under them, it's on the installation instructions. Hey, looking good, the window, not the plumber's crack in the middle picture. This is a family friendly site......
Be safe, G


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

thanks again bro. there will be 100% shim support under the window when i finish.


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## nwmod39 (Jul 12, 2009)

2nd window is installed. went tons faster than the first since now i know what to do and what not to do.

i will be doing the well in blocks. i do not like the looks of the metal well tubs. 

thanks for all the helper along the way. i gaurantee i will have tons more questions as we get farther along in finishing the basement.

thanks
steve


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## AdamH (Nov 23, 2011)

*Similar Header Question!!*

Hi,

I'm about to tackle the same project, except I am doing it with a basement window size 48"w x 55"h, so am planning a R.O. width of 51". My house was built in 1900 in MN. I'm trying to determine the type of header I need. The rim joist construction is completely different than the house pictured.

Instead of a flat 2 by sill plate with joists and rim joist sitting on top of it, my framing on top of the 12" wide poured concrete wall is what appears to be a 6" wide x 8" tall beam instead of a sill plate and rim joist, and, the floor joists are notched into this beam about 3-4" inches of the beam cut out it looks like for each floor joist. I hope this makes sense. 

I want to play it safe with the window header- this is almost directly in the middle of the 50' long 2.5 story duplex wall that the gable roof is supported by. I was thinking about using either 3or4 stapled 2x8s or 2x10s as a header for this window. 

I should mention that currently there is a 34" inch wide glass block window where I will be cutting around. The glass block window has no header whatsoever, just a 1x4 barely stapled (i can almost pull out the 1x4 with fingernails) to the sill beam (don't know the proper term for this Sill plate Beam). Over the 51" wide span I'm planning to remove, there are 4 floor joists (16" on center) which are 2x8 in size. (I guess in the old days instead of joist hangers they notched joists into girders/support beams??) 

Lastly, when measuring how close to the floor I am getting when planning for the 56.5" window height+sill-plate 2-by, if I add an extra 9.25" for 2x10 header, this will leave me still up about 20" from the basement floor. Is this too close to the floor? I am going to be digging well below the frostline 42" in the outside soil. It is going to be a hell of a dig through the limestone soil mix outside! (when I dug out other egress wndws, it was common to find 2'x1'x2' limestone random blocks in the soil, a good 60lb rock!).

One last question I thought of, do the headers need to be treated wood or regular? Perhaps just the exterior 2 by on the header? Any ideas to Trim out the exterior header ? maybe a big piece of flat PVC moulding?

Any ideas for the correct header support? Thanks!! Adam


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## AndyGump (Sep 26, 2010)

Hi Adam, and welcome to the site.

Could you start this as a new thread please.

I think you will get more responses that way.

Andy.


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## AdamH (Nov 23, 2011)

Andy-

good idea, and I just started the new post at: 

http://www.diychatroom.com/f19/need-determine-proper-basement-window-header-size-124353/#post777308

thanks-


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