# Basement bathroom/shower drain/venting question



## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Hello,

I am working on the basement bathroom and wanted to double check a few things. I have a roughed in vent that runs to the roof, would it be possible for me to connect both the sink and the shower to this vent? Below is a diagram of what I am looking to do, please let me know if you see anything off. Thanks! 



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## VIPlumber (Aug 2, 2010)

Do you have any measurements you could add to your diagram? Looks like you want to wet vent the whole bathroom group and you'll need to be careful of the distances. Are you allowed to wet vent where you are? Which code are you under?


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Hello,

There us about 6 feet from each drain to the vent. This vent isn't also being used as a drain however, it will just be venting the sink and shower so I don't believe it would be considered a wet vent in this case. The vent lines I diagrammed in the picture are actually about ground, going through the walls, I should of said that originally. I just wanted to add them to show the direction I want to run the vents.

Below is a picture of the sink drain, I was planning on running the vent out of the top of that pipe and the "T" on the left would be connected to the drain itself. I then wanted to add a "WYE" to the shower drain pipe and basically do the same, and then connect both to the vent pipe that I have in the corner running directly to the roof. Do you see anything wrong with that?



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## jaydevries (Jan 29, 2012)

how far over from the t is the sink going to be and the pipe you are connecting sink to could be called a wet vent if it is being used to venting toilet


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Hello,

The sink is going to be about 2 feet away. I am going to also run a line through the wall from my shower and vent it as well separately I think.

Is it fine for me to connect to the toilet line after the sink, "WYE" in for my shower and then about a foot from the shower drain run a T off that to vent the shower?


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Maybe this one will show a bit better, all I really want to do is connect off of the toilet drain line after the toilet, run the shower drain line and T off the shower drain line for a vent, do you see any problems with this?

Thanks again!



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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Hello,

Just ran the shower drain (haven't glued anything yet) and the vent line is off to the right which I still have to run up to the pipe in the ceiling the builder put in and capped off for me to use as a vent. Just wanted to run this by you to see if you noticed anything that you would suggest I change? Are the elbows in the vent line fine like that?

Thanks again!



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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Also I have the vent line on a bit more of a slope then the drain line


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Anyone got any opinions/suggestions on this?

Thanks


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

tucker16 said:


> Anyone got any opinions/suggestions on this?
> 
> Thanks


Is that a shower or toilet?
If shower, run it in 2", install a ptrap- not a 90
Must use a wye for the vent connection, not a tee
Use 45's instead of 90's on the vent
Vent come off the drain above the center line of drain pipe. that way air can still enter or leave the drain when in use (simplified explanation)


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

TheEplumber said:


> Is that a shower or toilet?
> If shower, run it in 2", install a ptrap- not a 90
> Must use a wye for the vent connection, not a tee
> Use 45's instead of 90's on the vent
> Vent come off the drain above the center line of drain pipe. that way air can still enter or leave the drain when in use (simplified explanation)


Hello

It's a shower, right now it's a 2" with a p trap as well. Everything else good? Basically swap out the T for a WYE and the 90's for 45's?


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Sorry just wanted to clarify a bit, I do have a WYE there for the vent, so do you suggest I just swap those 90's out for 45's?


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

tucker16 said:


> Hello
> 
> It's a shower, right now it's a 2" with a p trap as well. Everything else good? Basically swap out the T for a WYE and the 90's for 45's?


My bad, couldn't really tell from the picture.
The vent branch of the wye needs to be at about a 45 degree angle to the shower pipe (roll it up above the center line of the 2"). This is a must to make the flat vent work properly. The vent needs to enter the top half of the drain to break the siphon on the ptrap. Keep a minimum 1/4" per ft grade on the vent.


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Awesome advice, thanks!

So say my drain pipe was 30" long, should I put the WYE about 10" before the P trap?


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

tucker16 said:


> Awesome advice, thanks!
> 
> So say my drain pipe was 30" long, should I put the WYE about 10" before the P trap?


UPC allows up to 5 ft on a 2" trap arm. Personally, I'd go more then 10" so you have room to do your fitting.


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Thanks again, you've been a huge help!


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## jaydevries (Jan 29, 2012)

ok how did we go from concrete poured around pipes to exposed pipes 

is it possible to stand back and take picture of all pipe with a note saying the size and what you want to use them for


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

jaydevries said:


> ok how did we go from concrete poured around pipes to exposed pipes
> 
> is it possible to stand back and take picture of all pipe with a note saying the size and what you want to use them for


Refer to post #6. I believe the OP is working on the shower branch now.


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## jaydevries (Jan 29, 2012)

ok if post 6 is all new then where did he tie in at and that vent with the improper fitting "a t which should be a wye" for a vent is a flat vent and is not permitted
i took it as post 1 was what was already there and just needed to run vents, post 2 talks about using pipe in wall that has a t on it for a a sink arm and a vent coming off of the top of it. i guess after reading about the wye for the shower again i see why he tore out the concrete at first read i took at as tying vents together with a wye

i think he just did a bunch of unnecessary work if the shower pipe was there and he tore out concrete to add a vent to it since it might not have been needed but enough with the what if's and assumptions and lets get some facts with some pictures and more info about shower drain like where it is tyed in at what size of pipes and length of pipe with a full picture including all pipes at once


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Hello,

No, the shower pipe was never there. I tied into the toilet pipe after the toilet and figured a vent would be needed as well to stop the sewer gases from coming up through the shower.

Below is a picture of where I tied into the main drain:



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Basically I came off that drain, ran a shower run and a WYE off of that shower drain for a vent as well. I didn't glue anything yet however as I wanted to make sure everything was fine first. Any suggestions would be very much appreciated.

Thanks!


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## jaydevries (Jan 29, 2012)

ok i see a couple things wrong that need fixed first can you stand back and take picture of all pipes and post please and distance from shower to tie in and from tie in to sink pipe


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## jaydevries (Jan 29, 2012)

also where are your walls going to be framed for shower distance from shower drain to edge of walls are needed 
we will get you through this


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

jaydevries said:


> ok i see a couple things wrong that need fixed first can you stand back and take picture of all pipes and post please and distance from shower to tie in and from tie in to sink pipe


OK, a new picture. 
Basic drain 101- no tees are allowed on their sides or backs- vertical only when used as drainage fittings. Replace those tee's with wyes.
And why is the toilet rough in shown earlier ABS and the main is PVC? are you sure that is a plumbing main you tied into? Could it be a footing drain(storm water)? Just checking


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Its something that the builder did, I am not sure why he roughed it in like that. Basically when they house was built they were supposed to rough in a 2 piece bathroom, they forgot and had to come back and drill out a trench in the floor and put the 2 piece in so I am connecting off that for the shower. 

I see what you mean about the Tee's now though, I am going to go get those replaced. Is it fine for me to run the WYE's on their sides?

Below is a picture where you can see the toilet and sink rough in as well as where I connected.

Thanks!



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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Can I also run a 90 off of the WYE that will be connected to the toilet drain so I can get the shower drain where I need it or would that impede the draining?


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

tucker16 said:


> Can I also run a 90 off of the WYE that will be connected to the toilet drain so I can get the shower drain where I need it or would that impede the draining?


Use a wye with a 45. That makes the equivalent of a 90. And turn it around, you seem to be pointed the wrong direction. 
What kind of glue are you using? If you're joining PVC(white) pipe to ABS(black) pipe, which I don't like to do, use transition glue. ABS glue will not work on PVC or vice versa.


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Thanks again, yes I got the abs/PVC transition glue, I'll post se updated pictures tomorrow once I get those in. You guys have been a great help!


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## jaydevries (Jan 29, 2012)

i agree do not use transition glue just buy a short piece of abs and place between the two rubber band clamps is one option

the best would be to keep it all pvc and tie into pipe with a wye "make sure the wye is flowing down hill " and a repair coupling"it is a coupling with out the stop in the center" so you clean every thing then glue it together quickly sliding coupling on to pipe after gluing then slide back over pipe stopping half way before glue sets up 


after the wye that reduces down to 2 " you will run it "1/4 inch per foot" till you get to the wall that you will be framing for the shower where that wall is going to sit in the center of it put a 2x2x1 1/2 tee so the 1 1/2 turns straight up for vent then continue the 2" to trap placing trap to the correct location "for the shower pan that you have picked to use" off of the new wall you will be building where vent is and off of back wall which looks like it is already there

buy doing it this way you do not have a flat vent which is not allowed


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

jaydevries said:


> i agree do not use transition glue just buy a short piece of abs and place between the two rubber band clamps is one option
> 
> the best would be to keep it all pvc and tie into pipe with a wye "make sure the wye is flowing down hill " and a repair coupling"it is a coupling with out the stop in the center" so you clean every thing then glue it together quickly sliding coupling on to pipe after gluing then slide back over pipe stopping half way before glue sets up
> 
> ...


I don't think the OP has the depth to vent it as you describe. The horizontal vent will work just fine if he takes the steps I laid out- I do it all the time (floor drains in large rooms) We have a little loop hole in our code that allows for this. It's called structural conditions. In this case I'm assuming the trap arm will end up in the slab if it arms off a santee. But, you're right it is the "proper" method. :thumbsup:


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Hey

I am going to be putting in a corner shower so I wouldn't have a wall right there that I could run the vent pipe up, am I able to run the vent on its side until it reaches the wall if I use a wye?


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## jaydevries (Jan 29, 2012)

e plumber how about having shower be a 3 inch untill after trap reducing it to 2 inch with bushing and calling it wet vented of off sink vent then he would not have to put in vent at all


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

jaydevries said:


> e plumber how about having shower be a 3 inch untill after trap reducing it to 2 inch with bushing and calling it wet vented of off sink vent then he would not have to put in vent at all


You got me:huh:
I've never wet vented horizontally- UPC doesn't allow it. should work in theory though. Same principal as combination waste and venting 
You explain it to him :whistling2: I gotta go clean the basement, my Son is moving back home- wait, he should clean it...:jester:


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

Hey Guys

Just wanted to add 2 more pictures to show you a bit more of the room im working with. The vent that leads to the roof that the builder put in and capped off to be used is in the top right corner.



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## jaydevries (Jan 29, 2012)

hey tucker hold on a little bit and some one should chime in on my idea of using a 3 " instead of using a flat vent


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## jaydevries (Jan 29, 2012)

wow i was thinking by know some one else could give their suggestion


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

I dont think I have much of a choice other then to flat vent it, as long as I use a 45 and have the vent on more of a slope then the drain it shouldn't cause me any problems right?


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## tucker16 (Feb 28, 2012)

* maybe not


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## Rat (Mar 9, 2012)

*30 year plumber*



tucker16 said:


> Anyone got any opinions/suggestions on this?
> 
> Thanks


 Always use two 45's instead of 90's if you can.


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## Rat (Mar 9, 2012)

90's are like adding 10' of piping and slows down the liquids and waste. and air movement


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

tucker16 said:


> I dont think I have much of a choice other then to flat vent it, as long as I use a 45 and have the vent on more of a slope then the drain it shouldn't cause me any problems right?


If you vent as shown your good to go Shower line will be 2". Vent can be 1.5" or 2" Add 45's on vent to match your ditch. Disregard the lav piping shown in the picture.


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## Rat (Mar 9, 2012)

Some codes do not allow wet venting Indiana does Kentucky does not check your local code But they both work !!


TheEplumber said:


> If you vent as shown your good to go Shower line will be 2". Vent can be 1.5" or 2" Add 45's on vent to match your ditch. Disregard the lav piping shown in the picture.


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## jaydevries (Jan 29, 2012)

so for my own education if wet vents are allowed is it legal to run the 2 " over to the 3" and call it wet vented from the sink that is also wet venting toilet


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

jaydevries said:


> so for my own education if wet vents are allowed is it legal to run the 2 " over to the 3" and call it wet vented from the sink that is also wet venting toilet


I'm sorry, you lost me:huh:
In the case of the OP's shower, it's not wet vented as defined by UPC. It simply has a horizontal vent that is below flood rim. Some may call that a wet vent I guess.
Upc does not allow horizontal wet venting- only vertical like a lav trap arm on a toilet vent. However, the picture I uploaded in post 40 is generally excepted practice as long as drainage fittings are used.


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## jaydevries (Jan 29, 2012)

ok thanks i know here that is called a flat vent and not allowed but we follow irc

it some times amazes me how 2 plumbing codes can differ so much and both work fine. it just goes to show that codes are not to protect the health as much as protect ones opinions


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

jaydevries said:


> ok thanks i know here that is called a flat vent and not allowed but we follow irc
> 
> it some times amazes me how 2 plumbing codes can differ so much and both work fine. it just goes to show that codes are not to protect the health as much as protect ones opinions


I got into service side of plumbing about 4 yrs ago, prior to that- 20 yrs of new construction experience. I have to get used to how they plumbed 50- 100 years ago. They didn't use modern codes. Yet it works just fine. Well, most of the time or I wouldn't be doing service:thumbsup:


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## Rat (Mar 9, 2012)

Insome states as dumb as it maysound the shower has to be vented by its self. Not connected to the wet vent of the lav.:no:


TheEplumber said:


> I'm sorry, you lost me:huh:
> In the case of the OP's shower, it's not wet vented as defined by UPC. It simply has a horizontal vent that is below flood rim. Some may call that a wet vent I guess.
> Upc does not allow horizontal wet venting- only vertical like a lav trap arm on a toilet vent. However, the picture I uploaded in post 40 is generally excepted practice as long as drainage fittings are used.


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