# looking for condensate vent cover



## bellaboob (Jan 3, 2010)

We experience a problem during high winds where it appears that our gas fired furnace fails.

Quite annoying, we have theorized that a missing condensate vent cover is the problem. During high winds an internal pressure switch shuts off the gas to our furnace as wind creates a pressure difference if it blows "just right." And "just right" is any high wind whipping around our house.

Our neighbors have a "baffle" covering their vents, however we do not (we had one that the builder "kindly" left under our deck;the deck framing prevented its attachment; in the intervening five years it has been misplaced/lost/thrown away/stolen).

The photo attached shows the vent "baffle." 

The condensate vent is a dual-pipe, larger pipe enveloping a smaller pipe. The cover shown seems to allow the inner pipe to exhaust, while the cone allows intake and provides some wind protection.

*We have not been able to find a similar cover at Lowes, Home Depot, Ace, or other builder supply.* It's possible because we do not know what it is called (other than "vent cover"/"baffle"). We have taken pictures to stores only to "baffle" the salesforce (pun intended).

Any help in finding this cover would be appreciated. Any thoughts on our theory would be nice too.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Thats known as a concentric vent.

The end piece is not sold separately.
You will need to buy the entire thing($$$$). And then just use the end cone.

Without it. Most likely the wind is blowing the exhaust fumes back into the intake pipe. And causing a flame failure.

Another solution as a temp fix. is to get 2-PVC 90° ells, and a 12" long piece of 2" PVC(guessing your vent pipe is 2") And attach one ell to 90 the exhaust up or to the side. The 12" piece to extend it away from the intake. And use the other 90 to direct the vent fumes from the house.

Generally, they should not exhaust under a deck.


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## bellaboob (Jan 3, 2010)

Thank you! After giving it a name, other than baffle, I could find it on "Google"!

$$$$ is right. Ugh.

Regarding the deck exhaust... it doesn't do this now, we replaced the deck sometime ago. Now, I have a 45 down on the outside pipe to provide some "protection" though I don't think it does much for the flame outs in the wind.

Much thanks again!


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Post a pic of how you have it venting now.


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## Home Air Direct (Jan 6, 2009)

Been is correct. The cone is not sold separately. I have had this request several times this year and have not been able to locate a source for the cone only.

***deleted by Home Air Direct*** 

Good Luck


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Home Air Direct said:


> I always get my post deleted for self promotion, but I have to ask in cases where I am offering support and help and it just so happens that it is also my company that sells a certain item, why is it ok to post a link to someone else not forum related who offers the same item?


If you have no affiliation with them. Yes it is.


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## Home Air Direct (Jan 6, 2009)

beenthere said:


> If you have no affiliation with them. Yes it is.


I get it, but I don't GET IT. As I said, it is my company, so there is a lot of affiliation. I will remove my post so someone here can promote someone who does not contribute or support this forum.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Home Air Direct said:


> I get it, but I don't GET IT. As I said, it is my company, so there is a lot of affiliation. I will remove my post so someone here can promote someone who does not contribute or support this forum.


You can leave your post.

I believe it has to do with self free advertising.


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## Home Air Direct (Jan 6, 2009)

beenthere said:


> You can leave your post.
> 
> I believe it has to do with self free advertising.


 
But, because I am a forum member, I am prohibited from saying what I just said (crap...did it again). So, what ultimately will happen is that someone else will post a link to a company that sells CV kits to help the OP, and this will be a company that is not affiliated with the forum. Where my frustration comes into play is when this happens, I have to watch the missed opportunity, while I am involved in offering DIY support.

Now, with that said, I do GET IT. Without this policy, the forum would be filled with self promoters and would become a watered down version of Craig's List and not the resource that is today. ...Still Frustrating Though....

OK, sorry OP for the thread hijack. Let's get back to the business at hand. your vent will be either 2" or 3" at the furnace. From that you can order your next CV Kit if that is what you decide to do. If you get the correct size, and order one like you see in your picture, you will be fine. they are all basically the same (of that configuration) for standard home gas furnaces.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Imagine how some pro's must feel when they see you giving advise to someone that is in their area. And they miss out on a service call that would have made them money.

No difference, since they can't promote themselves either.

Besides. Your screen name will let posters find you on the net.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

I assume that is the neighbors pic. Without the hood it will never work properly. Get the installer to come back and replace the kit and have it flush to the house. A DIFFICULT job for an DIYer to do as both sets of pipes need connecting in the house at the SAME time and a skilled plumber/installer to do that or it will leak etc.


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## Marty S. (Oct 31, 2009)

If the intake hood will not fit because of the deck location then run the intake and exhaust seperate. Take them past the deck to avoid recirculation and insulate the exhaust that's outside.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

Gotta be careful with the length of run, # of elbows etc. Depending on type of furnace some are finicky. Carriers like a certain configuration which is different than the Goodmans etc. Need to follow the manufacturers recommendations or have more problems later. Uninsulated exhaust pipe under a deck is tricky! Must be sloped back properly and insulated REAL well or it will freeze up. I avoid them like the plague.


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## bellaboob (Jan 3, 2010)

@yuri, et al., The deck is no longer there. Yes, the photo is a neighbor's vent. The neighborhood as a whole has a varied selection of these vents. The first 5 or 6 homes built seem to have the CV "option." The remainder, have a separated exhaust/intake piping on the exterior.

A CV vent cover could be easily added today... if I could get one. 

@beenthere, HAD, what we have now on the exterior of the home is a DIY's misunderstanding of what the vent was to begin with. Sometime ago, I added the 45 elbow shown in the attached (after we removed the old deck and replaced with one that no longer obstructs/blocks the vent and lost the termination cover). Note that the elbow only directs down. No piping is provided to for exhaust pipe directly.

*I only determined last night, after reading the furnace op manual, that it was the condensate vent* and that exhaust blowback or blockage could create a flame out, as designed by the manufacturer. Note, that this situation has intermittently existed for five years, I do not believe it has been damaging, just annoying when the furnace won't stay on in bitter cold and windy weather (just when you need it) :blink:.

Looking at CVs online, it is *very unlikely* that myself, or a contractor, is going to replace the CV whole. I won't have it, or pay for it. The basement is finished and to replace is to demo the ceiling into the joists for access.

I really only need the cover. If there were not an intervening 5 years (since the house was built) I might argue to the building contractor (listed on the furnace) that "they owe me a CV cover."

I'll look around for CV parts, but as HAD notes, if as a contractor it is nigh impossible to buy, it might mean purchasing whole for just for the cover. 

Thanks for all the replies! :thumbsup:


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## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

Home Air Direct said:


> Now, with that said, I do GET IT. Without this policy, the forum would be filled with self promoters and would become a watered down version of Craig's List and not the resource that is today. ...Still Frustrating Though....


You have the option of paying to advertise on this site
And what you mentioned is the problem...the forum filling up with people just advertising their product
There are probably 1-5 people banned every day who come on here just to advertise
We do have to apply the rules across the board


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## hvac benny (Dec 29, 2009)

Just so I get this straight- the first pic is your neighbors' exhaust/intake and the second pic is your exhaust? If I am understanding you correctly, you want the "baffle"- as you call it- like in the first pic? If I am correct, then you are misinformed as to what the function of the end of your neighbors' venting is- the exhaust goes straight out the end, and the combustion air is drawn in around the base of the cone.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

You may be recirculating the exhaust gases back into the intake air supply and that is HARMFUL to the furnace. Like shooting your car exhaust pipe into the air supply for your car motor. Will corrode your burners etc and possibly damage the heat exchanger. It needs to be fixed properly!


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

bellaboob.

Get rid of that 45.
And run a temp vent like I said.

The concentric cover, is removable. And can be replaced.

But, at this time. They don't fail. Its not a consumable part. It as a rule doesn't wear out.

PS: As you have it now. You may very well be shortening the life of your furnace. As it isn't burning as clean as it should. Since its always drawing some exhaust back in.


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## bellaboob (Jan 3, 2010)

hvac benny said:


> Just so I get this straight- the first pic is your neighbors' exhaust/intake and the second pic is your exhaust? If I am understanding you correctly, you want the "baffle"- as you call it- like in the first pic? If I am correct, then you are misinformed as to what the function of the end of your neighbors' venting is- the exhaust goes straight out the end, and the combustion air is drawn in around the base of the cone.


You are correct: 1st pic = neighbors, 2nd pic = my two year old hack.

I'm not misinformed (unless you read that in the thread somewhere). I understand that the inner pipe is exhaust, outer pipe is intake. I think I always knew that. The precise function and type of venting was not known.


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## hvac benny (Dec 29, 2009)

So the second pic is your exhaust? Where is the intake? Is it direct vent?


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

Bella: I would put 2 self tapping sheet metal screws into your new replacement hood, thru the inner pipe so no one steals it. Cover them with white silicone so they don't rust, get noticed by thieves.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

hvac benny said:


> So the second pic is your exhaust? Where is the intake? Is it direct vent?


What your seeing is his concentric vent pipe covered with a 45.
The exhaust is in there. Along with that ell being part of the intake.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

VERY BAD. Will corrode the heck out of everything.:furious:


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## hvac benny (Dec 29, 2009)

Ok, I think I got it now, lol. I though the black around the 45 was a gasket, not a hole.


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## bellaboob (Jan 3, 2010)

I removed the 45 (never glued it on). It's probably better that way anyhow.

When the house was built, the deck had to be "moved" from the planned position due to setbacks. This placed the deck over the concentric vent on the exterior of the home. The vent had to be exposed through the deck hanging joist, but it was too close to the decking itself and prevented the "baffle" from being mounted (the contractor "kindly" left the cover under the finished deck where it stayed for a couple of years).

Two years ago, we demo'd the deck. The concentric vent was now exposed, but sometime in the three years before the new deck, I removed the vent cover from under the old deck and misplaced it (I don't think it was stolen, as much as thrown away).

Any misunderstanding on my part about the purpose for the vent was not the operation of the exhaust and intake piping, but the need for the "baffle cover" (or CV termination hood). After the deck demo, my uncle and I cut the exposed piping flush to the house and put the 45 on. Prior to our cutting, the piping was just two PVC pipes, the inner about 2 or 3 inches longer than the outer, something like:

*=======*
<------- intake
*==================*
-------> exhaust
*==================*

*=======*

All said, this has been the situation for 5 years. It was never properly terminated.

We only ever experienced a problem when we had high winds (@beenthere lives in the area, only 40 miles from me), and it has been windy for 48 hours plus.

I know what needs to be done.

Thanks everyone! :thumbsup:


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## hvac benny (Dec 29, 2009)

Too bad I'm in Canada- I actually have the concentric termination cone in my van (one of my co-workes did somthing with the outer pipe, so the kit as a whole is useless). Good luck finding a new one.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

Good luck selling a mid Benny. :no:LOL. All 90% or higher or electric now. Fun times ahead.:wink:


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## hvac benny (Dec 29, 2009)

LOL, Maple Ridge, BC is still allowing mids to be installed in NEW constuction! How crazy is that?


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## bellaboob (Jan 3, 2010)

Should anyone reading this have a "spare" CV termination hood (for reasons not unlike @hvac benny mentioned), I would be very interested... naturally.

My CV has 4" O.D. (intake). The exhaust has 2.25" O.D., so it's probably measured 2" I.D.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

Benny, it is a FEDERAL law, the 90%. BC has to follow that I would believe. (Current inventory can be used up/installed). I'll send you some -32C later.:thumbup:


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## hvac benny (Dec 29, 2009)

I know it's a federal law, the builders know it's a federal law, the city knows it's a federal law. They've just chosen to ignore it, for who knows what reason. Maybe now that 80s are out completely they'll comply, but considering they've been putting them into new construction for the past year I'm not going to hold my breath. You can send me some of that -32C, but only if it comes with clear blue skys- it's been raining here for weeks!


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

The law took effect Jan 1, 2010. 
BC, nice place to visit but I get severe depression if I don't see the sun in 3 days, seriously. Thats what happens when you are used to the Prairie landscape/big skies/sunsets. I lived in Calgary and when the sun went below the top of the mountains it was like the lights went out. Lots of people in Calgary have no A/C for it cools off quickly in the evening when the sun disappears and is windy and very dry there.

Cheers :thumbup:


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## hvac benny (Dec 29, 2009)

80s have been forbidden in new construction since Jan 1 2009, this years law bans them outright.


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## bellaboob (Jan 3, 2010)

*Have found CVs, what size?*

Grainger has CVs... but what size? Can't tell how they size them.

Comes in 2" and 3" inch models.

The dimensions of my exhaust is 2" I.D. The intake has a 4" O.D.

Thoughts? Hints?

Much thanks again! :thumbsup:


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## drtbk4ever (Dec 29, 2008)

beenthere said:


> Thats known as a concentric vent.
> 
> The end piece is not sold separately.
> You will need to buy the entire thing($$$$). And then just use the end cone.
> ...


If you can't find the correct piece, Beenthere's suggestion makes the most sense.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

2 " ID is a 2 inch CV kit. See if they can/email fax you a picture with dimensions.


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