# Paint peels right off like rubber ! Help



## JackVa1 (Jul 29, 2009)

My son painted a bedroom 6 months ago. It was a shiny old colored paint on walls and ceiling. The home is all plaster not drywall.

He primed ceiling and walls with white Latex Kills Primer.

He top-coated ceiling with Ceiling paint and walls with Lowes Valcor Satin blue colored latex.

He now wants the room pink for a new baby. He notices the paint is sort of blistery in one area so he scrapes it and large areas just start pulling off the wall like rubber. 

What could have caused this? The primer is not coming off, just the blue. I told him to find a spot and stop removing the blue, smear drywall compound over the edges he created by pealing then again primer the place covering the Blue and the joint compound yet again with primer, then apply the pink.

How does this happen? I thought this only happened when you out glossy over glossy.

Oh and add to this; when he was pulling off the blue, it came off right up to the ceiling and the ceiling was coming off too! Ceiling flat white! 
I am completly puzzled and want to give him good advice going forward - thanks in advance.


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## NAV (Jun 2, 2009)

it sounds like total loss of adhesion of the finish coat. your first problem is buying paint from a big box store. they sell very low quality materials (you get what you pay for)

there are a few things that will cause the material to peel like that.

the first is bad material like i mentioned. 

if he waited over 30 days to paint over the primer that can cause loss of adhesion - or if he painted too soon after the primer (like same day) but that is less likely

there can be moisture in the walls, even condensation from the interior of the house being a different temperature than the outside with no insulation. 

I would put my money on the finish coat he used. I have been in the painting industry for over 15 years and have never heard of Valcor paint. 

I would bet that if he doesnt get 100% of the Valcor coating off the walls and ceilings it will be a re-accruing problem. also, if he paints over that failing coating the water in the new coating will activate the old paint and it will bubble up rather quickly. tell him to call the manufacturer and explain what has happened. they may have a solution that doesnt involve tearing the walls out.


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## JackVa1 (Jul 29, 2009)

NAV said:


> it sounds like total loss of adhesion of the finish coat. your first problem is buying paint from a big box store. they sell very low quality materials (you get what you pay for)
> 
> there are a few things that will cause the material to peel like that.
> 
> ...


Sorry, the paint was Valspar and yes it's sold by Lowes and I have painted many rooms with it myself with much sucess. I'm not certain about the interior walls and moisture but the room does border a bath so there is a possability there. 

We did paint the primer and cover coat in the same day, but I have done that before without problems as you mention.

I appreciate the reply and advice although your bias towards big box paint seems unwarrented IMO. It sounds like a good idea to contact the vendor about the paint.


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## Matthewt1970 (Sep 16, 2008)

Nav is right on the money when it come to the big box store paint and you are just now finding out why. If you are having a moisture problem that would cause the paint to fail like that, then you would see some other signs like water marks, paint that chipped off would be wet, musty smell or soft drywall. The cheapest paint in the world should have stuck to that primer. You now see why a lot of us put Lowes and Home Depot paint below that. If I were you I would peel off as much of that as you can as you are going to have a lot more bubbles when you try and paint over it again.


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## JackVa1 (Jul 29, 2009)

Ok, you guys are convincing me, but what is the problem with this paint? Sometimes it's great . Honestly I did an entire 7 room remodel with this Valspar stuff and found it fine. Is it a quality control problem that is intermittant? It's not all bad all the time or I would have noticed. Thanks guys


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## Matthewt1970 (Sep 16, 2008)

They use the cheapest ingedients possible, and when you use the cheapest ingredients possible you end up with inconsistent quality in paint. Sags, runs, streaks, improper curing, and in your case improper adhesion. If you want to stay in that price range there are plenty of paints that will outperform the big-box store. This is what I would suggest if you must stay below $25 a gallon, in order; Pittsburg Mannor Hall, Benjamin Moore either Pro Spec or the new Ben Line; Sherwin Williams Promar 200.


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## bob22 (May 28, 2008)

I don't understand how every paint problem on this site is due to buying it at "a big box store". Most paint problems are due to poor surface preparation and not the paint.


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## housepaintingny (Jul 25, 2009)

Hi,
I am a house painting contractor, N.Y. I agree that it could be a few things, moisture, poor prep, painting before the primer dried, putting a second coat on before the first dried, or cheap materials. A lot of the paints from box stores are not 100% acrylic. In general we always only use Sherwin Williams paints, and we will not guarantee our work if its a different brand of paint, the quality of materials goes a long ways for a quality long lasting paint job. I have never seen this problem before.


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## housepaintingny (Jul 25, 2009)

There also could have been high humidity in the room, not allowing the coats to fully and completely dry.


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## Tess (Aug 3, 2009)

<CHOPPED! just re-read your original post and see that the primer isn't peeling so ... yea... my comment wasn't helpful =) >


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## NAV (Jun 2, 2009)

bob22 said:


> I don't understand how every paint problem on this site is due to buying it at "a big box store". Most paint problems are due to poor surface preparation and not the paint.


Bob, 

if you say everyone that is having paint problems on this site bought their material from a big box store don't you think thats why they are having the problems?

I dont see much complaining about Superpaint, Duration, A-100, Ultra-Hide, Benny Moore etc. 

I have used the junk sold at Home Depot and Lowes and was not impressed with the application or performance. 

I will say this about Home Depot Ralph Loren Paint - they have a great selection of colors and you can never get them matched exactly at SW or ICI. So I do use that material inside on accent walls. the only problem is you can not clean it and it skuffs easily. But, I am a painter so to coat a room or wall only take me a short amount of time vs a homeowner taking a week and making a mess.


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## AndrewD (Aug 12, 2009)

Hi I am JackVA's son, the guy with the peeling paint. I joined diychatrom because I am painting a lot and learning as I go

So far I have peeled 2 1/2 walls in 2 days. I am well on my way to peeling the rest off (that is 1 gallon of paint!).

I have some clarifications about this:

The paint being peeled is Valspar Signature Series latex. I have used it in other rooms with good results.
The walls were painted *18 months ago*.
It was painted the same day, but at least one hour after the primer was applied.
Also the FLAT ceiling paint can be peeled off fairly easily, but I'm trying to avoid doing that.
I am peeling off large sheets of paint. No scraper necessary! It is flexible and will bend and fold when I pull it off. The primer underneath is chalky and flakey.

I thought that normal paint CHIPPED (not peeled). It's almost as if it never really cured. But why?? This bedroom does not have high humidity. There was a humidifier used occasionally during the winter ((6 months after the room was painted). 

I can't remember what kind of primer was used. It might have been the cheapy Olympic "Fast Hide" primer. Still, that does not seem to justify this crazy situation.

Any ideas please share. This is going to be a baby room and I need to have some paint stick to the wall.


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## NAV (Jun 2, 2009)

Hmm. now it sounds like the primer is the problem. you know, it has a shelf life of about 5 years.

You should keep stripping off everything that you can. prime it with an oil based stain blocking primer if available. if you can not get that use BIN.

then you should be good to go. 

Oh, and buy Sherwin-Williams Pro-Mar 200 for your finish coat. it is the contractor grade interior paint. it performs well and costs less than superpaint or duration.


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## deb110761 (Sep 22, 2011)

*paint peeling*



AndrewD said:


> Hi I am JackVA's son, the guy with the peeling paint. I joined diychatrom because I am painting a lot and learning as I go
> 
> So far I have peeled 2 1/2 walls in 2 days. I am well on my way to peeling the rest off (that is 1 gallon of paint!).
> 
> ...


Same thing just happened to me using the same paint w/ primer from Lowes. After about 2 weeks I wanted to do a faux finish on one wall
using glaze and a hint of folk art copper paint which I had done with much
success in the past. I didnt like the way it turned out so I immediately
wiped it off with a soft cloth and water and it peeled off like rubber back
to the existing color that it was when I started. How frustrating! Maybe
the base coat needed more curing time? Pls. advise. I need a quick fix!


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## jsheridan (Jan 30, 2011)

Deb, welcome, sorry about your predicament. How long had it been between painting the walls the failure you experienced? Was there any indication of failure prior? Try another area to see if you can get it to peel *without using the water*. Maybe use a sharp blade to gently try to pick some up to see if it will peel comparably. If it's the water that is penetrating and causing the failure, you may need to apply an oil base primer barrier coat. Do your test and check back. 
Joe


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## artsyswitzer (7 mo ago)

Matthewt1970 said:


> They use the cheapest ingedients possible, and when you use the cheapest ingredients possible you end up with inconsistent quality in paint. Sags, runs, streaks, improper curing, and in your case improper adhesion. If you want to stay in that price range there are plenty of paints that will outperform the big-box store. This is what I would suggest if you must stay below $25 a gallon, in order; Pittsburg Mannor Hall, Benjamin Moore either Pro Spec or the new Ben Line; Sherwin Williams Promar 200.


I have had adhesion issues with some of the "Big Box Stores" but the worst time was when we used Sherwin Williams so I will have to disagree on it being just their paints.


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