# Computer crashing BSOD - pulling hair out



## AndyWRS

Good lord where do i start. 

This has been an issue for a yr or more and i have yet to discover why it happens.

Background: Win10 64 bit i built the PC, i want to say three years ago.

Random crashes then a few months with no issues. Tested the RAM, HDD, Vid card and PSU with all the top rated test programs everything passes. 

The last 6 months it changed to crashing after loading windows and using the PC for anywhere between 10-30 min. It would vary, i could be playing D3 or reading the news or checking email...it seemed like it would crash based on "up time" rather than what i was doing.

I dealt with the randomness for about the last 5 months. Oddly, after it crashed and i rebooted it would be stable 95% of the time. I began not turning off my PC so i didn't have to deal with the crashing 10-30 min after startup every time. This worked fine for a couple of months then i went back to shutting it down. The problem continued but i just dealt with it...it would do it for a week or two then stop for a bit then start again.

About 2 weeks ago i suspected (after pricing new PCs i figured i better have another go at this issue) it may be a bad HDD so i removed the drive from the PC. Just so happened i had two of the same drives installed but one was unused so i reloaded win 10 on the other drive as a test. Got the PC loaded and updated to win10 again with only the few programs and D3 that i need so i could use it as my primary PC and test my theory of of it being a bad drive. Fast forward 10 days, no issues at all. On Feb 7 it crashed 10-30 after i booting and i was browsing the web. I rebooted and within 2 hours it crashed again. BSOD yes, all different kinds nothing consistant... i was taking pics of them to keep track but i thought it was the HDD and figured it was solved until Feb 7.

So after rage quitting D3 after i login and found my HC char dead on the 7th...a day i didnt even play nor log in to the game...hence the rage quit lol. I removed the game from my PC. On the 8th my PC crashes. 

All i know is its not D3 and its not my HDD.

Reading about the most common RAM, PSU MB problems, none of them sound like they could be my issue. My P6T-SE MB is not even available on NE now, i figured it was cheap and i was going to replace it vs the cost of a new build. Doesn't appear the MB is worth buying at this point.

I am at a loss, refuse to buy a prebuilt, but i cant for the life of me figure out where the issue lies.

I have built all my own PCs and many for others, fixed tons for other ppl and even mine when needed, this however has me stumped.

I am willing to buy a new part, just dont have a clue which to buy.

I7 920 2.67 Ghz
1000 W Antec PSU
GTX 760
12 GB Ram
P6T-SE MB
300GB SSD
Win10 64 bit

No virues or malware, in fact i cant even tell you the last time i had one, i just dont get them but scanned for them many times just to cover my #S%. I have cleaned out the PC and checked the connections numerous times including right before i typed this.

what am i missing here, i'd hate to "rage buy" a new PC, this is a good PC, good parts, PITA issue unresolved though i am at a loss.


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## Drachenfire

In the search box type “Event Viewer” (without quotes) and click on the application.

Expand “Windows Logs”

Click on “Application”

On the right side of the screen click on “Filter Current Log…”

When the filter opens, click on Critical, Warning and Error and click OK. This will eliminate all entries but the ones filtered.

Go through them and see if any are indications of the cause of the BSOD. It will help to locate entries that are time stamped around the same time as the crash.

Repeat the same process for “System”


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## supers05

As mentioned, the windows logs will help. 

Typically this sort of symptom can be caused by;
1) bad drivers. (mostly likely video adapter. Windows had a delayed load mechanism. Some program is invoking a bad driver call after loading. Windows does a slim load after a crash, ignoring optional items.) 
2) a bad ram address or few. (typically not a large portion of the ram, and therefore only exhaustive tests will find it.)
3) memory controller issues. (it works cold, but then stops working when warm, but starts again when hot..... It's a physical circuitry issue, and fairly rare, but does happen once in a while.) 

That's in order of probability. The log will give a better idea. 

PS. Which programs did you use for the system testing? For ram, I like memtest. 

Cheers!


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## ZZZZZ

Do you get an error message on the BSOD or is it just a blank blue screen. Any error messages there would be your best trouble-shooting guide.

Can you run the PC in Safe Mode without getting BSOD?
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## AndyWRS

Thx for posting.

Yeah memtest was one of them.

I did as Drachenfire mentioned and i see two critical events, both around the time the PC first crashed on the 7th and then shortly again within an hour. Kernal power event ID 41, googling that seems to point to the PSU. 

I think it was a tomshardware link i went to and it also mentioned some power setting to try first and to check my surge protector and the PSU cable replacement also. At this point i will try anything so i will see if it crashes again and if so i will get a new PSU.

Thanks for the input, my brain was jello on this one i didnt really know what to look for...everything seemed to work fine.


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## AndyWRS

80% of the time i got a BSOD, others just shut down.

The first was IRQL_not_less_or Equal and the second Kernal security check failure the third time it just shut down no BSOD.


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## ZZZZZ

AndyWRS said:


> 80% of the time i got a BSOD, others just shut down.
> 
> The first was IRQL_not_less_or Equal and the second Kernal security check failure the third time it just shut down no BSOD.


*IRQL_not_less_or Equal *is a memory error. Are you certain that all of your RAM is the exact same type, and they meet the exact specs for the MB?
.
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## AndyWRS

Yes i am positive.


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## ZZZZZ

AndyWRS said:


> Yes i am positive.


Just for kicks, have you tried removing the RAMs and swapping their positions?

And of course just make sure the slots are 100% free of dust.

Is your office/computer room prone to static electricity?
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## AndyWRS

I cleaned it all out prior to reloading windows. No static issues in my room, the PC hangs from under my uplift desk.

Here is a concerning item: After i checked the RAM was identical and restarted the PC i checked event viewer again.

"The system has rebooted without cleanly shutting down first. This error could be caused if the system stopped responding, crashed, or lost power unexpectedly."

This is the same ID 41 Kernal error i thought was pointing the PSU as the issue. The quoted item above is listed in the details but my PC shut down properly no crash. I am not so sure this Kernal power event ID 41 is the issue. And this new entry in the viewer was 15 min ago.


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## Thisiseasy

It sounds like you're not sure if this is a hardware issue or a software issue. From my experience a lot of blue screen errors are actually problems with Windows itself.

One test that might shed light on the problem would be to run Linux from a flash drive. https://getfedora.org/en/workstation/download/ There's an example of one that allows you to use it from USB media.

If your computer crashes under Linux you have evidence towards a problem with the hardware. If everything runs fine, then you have evidence towards a problem with something in software or your SSD.


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## Guap0_

Copy the stop message from the BSOD & google it. As mentioned before, look at the event viewer. Copy the Event ID & it's source, if available. Then go to eventid.net & search it there. There will be others who posted how they fixed it.


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## AndyWRS

Thisiseasy said:


> It sounds like you're not sure if this is a hardware issue or a software issue. From my experience a lot of blue screen errors are actually problems with Windows itself.
> 
> One test that might shed light on the problem would be to run Linux from a flash drive. https://getfedora.org/en/workstation/download/ There's an example of one that allows you to use it from USB media.
> 
> If your computer crashes under Linux you have evidence towards a problem with the hardware. If everything runs fine, then you have evidence towards a problem with something in software or your SSD.



I guess it could be a SW issue. I think i am better off using the info provided to see if i can locate the problem. If the issue continues even after following these post recommendations then fedora becomes an option.

Guap0_ - that is a helpful link thanks.

Today i plan on using the PC as much as possible to see if it will crash then check the event viewer. I assume the critical entries are the ones most likely to cause the blue screen? The errors and warnings will just help to identify the issue? Is it possible for a warning to cause a bsod yet not be related to error or critical events in the log?


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## ZZZZZ

AndyWRS said:


> I cleaned it all out prior to reloading windows. No static issues in my room, the PC hangs from under my uplift desk.
> 
> Here is a concerning item: After i checked the RAM was identical and restarted the PC i checked event viewer again.
> 
> "The system has rebooted without cleanly shutting down first. This error could be caused if the system stopped responding, crashed, or lost power unexpectedly."
> 
> This is the same ID 41 Kernal error i thought was pointing the PSU as the issue. The quoted item above is listed in the details but my PC shut down properly no crash. I am not so sure this Kernal power event ID 41 is the issue. And this new entry in the viewer was 15 min ago.


My guess would be it's a MoBo problem. It would probably cost more to test and repair it than replace it.
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## AndyWRS

My plan was to just replace the MB with the same board. Problem is the board is no longer available and the only other LGA 1366 board they have is a 10 pack for 500+ dollars.

So my choice was to get the same board off amazon, i think they wanted $130 or so or buy a different board. Then i decided to post my problem here and see where this went to help me narrow down the cause and see what others thought about the problem. 

But there is no assurance its the MB. I am hoping i can narrow down the issue so as not to spend a ton of money and time on a part that may not be the issue. I have no problem spending the $ i just want to be sure i am replacing the correct part or parts. I still think its HW but you never know.

Been dealing with this for quite some time i just need it solved. Yes i could buy a new pc and solve it but that would be a foolish waste of funds imo. If i can fix this for under $500 then that is far more appealing to me than spending 2-3k on a new PC.


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## Drachenfire

Windows Kernel event ID 41 error


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## Guap0_

Replacing the MB should be last resort. Why don't you want to try my 2 suggestions that I mentioned in post 12?


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## supers05

Power supplies can be cheap, especially if you're not powering demanding video card(s). If you have a spare, I'd try that first. 

If you brought it to me, that probably would be the second thing I'd try. First, I'd manually download the video card drivers, and install. (the drivers that are auto downloaded can cause issues.) Then I'd try to crash it on each step. The third would be to take out all the ram exempt for one, and try to crash it. Rinse and repeat with the other sticks. Cheap, and only takes time. 

Since the memory controller and a good chunk of the power regulation for the CPU is built into the CPU itself for the last several generations of chips, changing the mobo is not as likely to help. 

Cheers!


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## AndyWRS

Guap0_ said:


> Replacing the MB should be last resort. Why don't you want to try my 2 suggestions that I mentioned in post 12?


I agree about the MB, this is why i am here trying to determine where the problem is, if its the MB so be it i am stuck but i have yet to determine that. I have tried what you put in post 12, and also Drachenfires link above.

I was testing all day yesterday and had no issues but i am not claiming a win atm. Keep in mind, after i did a clean install on this HDD i did not have any issues for about 7-8 days. 

Windows mem test pass, memtest pass. I took some tips form the link you posted in post 12 and are following what i read in there.

I did Dl the Nvida driver also from the manufacturers website.

I am in testing mode i suppose. Atm i don't have a problem.

*A bit more specific background on my issue and probably why i have this particular critical error.*

When i say i get a BSOD i do, but not always. I would say 40% of the time i get hard hang. I don't loose my desk top, its still visible but i loose all control and i get an annoying tone from my speakers. I usually just hold the power button and let it restart. Sounds like this action is whats causing the ID 41 based on what the links you both sent me say. But again, this is just 40% of the time, mostly i get BSOD with varying stop codes and sometimes nothing is listed in the BSOD.

I really didn't think about this until reading from the links posted and it sort of because obvious some of if not all of the ID 41 could be from this action. 

So with some of the suggestion at those to links provided its a wait and see game. I am not sure what else i can do until i get to BSOD again. I will just be taking note as to exactly what i was doing when it happens.

I do appreciate you all posting your comments, this has been a pebble in my shoe for months if not a year.

Supers05 - Pretty much what i have been trying all day yesterday. Updated the vid driver tried most of the day to see if it would crash. No luck yet but today is Sunday and i have all day.


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## supers05

AndyWRS said:


> I ...
> When i say i get a BSOD i do, but not always. I would say 40% of the time i get hard hang. I don't loose my desk top, its still visible but i loose all control and i get an annoying tone from my speakers. I usually just hold the power button and let it restart. Sounds like this action is whats causing the ID 41 based on what the links you both sent me say. But again, this is just 40% of the time, mostly i get BSOD with varying stop codes and sometimes nothing is listed in the BSOD.


Drivers will do this. I said video because it's highest on the list, as is also the most complicated, and most likely to fail. Other drivers will also do this, but it's very hard to track down. 

Try out your changes for a week. Only if you get crashes, then try to install all of your drivers from the OEM. (network, chipset, audio, etc.... I've had problems with network drivers on the later versions of windows.) 

Cheers!


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## ZZZZZ

I've been working with PCs for 30 years, building custom systems and providing tech support pretty much since they came out.

Maybe it can happen, but I've never seen or heard of an outdated driver causing a BSOD *memory error *or a BSOD _*Kernal error.*_

Outdated display drivers will usually work at some level, such as at a lower resolution or color profile, without causing BSODs.
.
.


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## supers05

ZZZZZ said:


> I've been working with PCs for 30 years, building custom systems and providing tech support pretty much since they came out.
> 
> Maybe it can happen, but I've never seen or heard of an outdated driver causing a BSOD *memory error *or a BSOD _*Kernal error.*_
> .
> .


Not outdated, buggy. I've actually rolled back to an older driver in a few cases. 

I've worked as a tech in a store and doing house calls for a long while in the past. I've seen plenty. 

Cheers!


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## AndyWRS

*


ZZZZZ said:



Do you get an error message on the BSOD or is it just a blank blue screen. Any error messages there would be your best trouble-shooting guide.

Click to expand...

*


ZZZZZ said:


> _Sometimes i do sometimes i dont. I am hoping to use these errors to point me to the problem. I am logging each one...only have the two i listed so far._
> 
> *Can you run the PC in Safe Mode without getting BSOD?*
> .
> .



_I haven't tried. On the old HDD this may be a good option, but on this new install to a diff HDD i am not having the consistent BSOD...yet. But it started acting similarly with the only two blue screens i have so far. If it continues this would be a good option. Keep in mind, this is a clean install, i cant get much more "cleaner" than this.

Ran 4 hour stress test today also. no issue, steady temps. Furmark was used...ran it 3 times on the other HDD and it never crashed either. _


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## AndyWRS

One item i did not mention the other day. After looking through the logs i saw that i have a number of Event ID 11 cdrom. Now i didnt think much of it because i dont use it...in fact reinstalling the OS the other day was probably the first time in over a year. So while in the case switching the RAM to diff slots i just disconnected the cd rom drive.

In the last 7 days 478 instances of this same Event ID 11 cdrom are listed. Wouldn't that be a kick the nuts if after more than a year the cd rom that i never use is the culprit. I guess id have put the other HD back in and check the the logs there to see if the same thing was happening there. I will just see if this continues to work for the time being.


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## Guap0_

Download combofix & run it.


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## AndyWRS

Says its not compatible with Win10 and recommends something else not related to my problem. This is not a malware issue i am dealing with, that was the first thing i tried.


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## Guap0_

Combo fix is not just for malware hence the word combo. Open a command prompt & run
sfc /scannow
It may tell you to reboot first


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## AndyWRS

I think i will pass, it says its not compatible. What is that scanning...systems files?


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## supers05

AndyWRS said:


> I think i will pass, it says its not compatible. What is that scanning...systems files?


Actually sfc is a Microsoft program built into the later versions of windows. You don't need anything else installed to use it. You do need to run the command prompt with admin rights. 

It checks all important windows files to an crc image file. If it's different, it replaces it with the "proper" one. Regular windows updates, also update the image file, but the program will have to source the files from the install file instead. (if it's missing, things get challenging.)

It doesn't do any harm, but can be complicated when files aren't available. (most novice users would just cancel it.) It can cause updates to re-download though. However, this probably won't help you, since you've just reinstalled windows.... 

Cheers!


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## AndyWRS

Guap0_ said:


> Combo fix is not just for malware hence the word combo. Open a command prompt & run
> sfc /scannow
> It may tell you to reboot first



Oops, i miss read your post i thought scf whas a cmd in combofix you were asking me run. I am familiar with windows sfc and ran it anyway...passed which i expected as this is a 2 week old install with bare bones SW.


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## Guap0_

Start over. What were the event IDs in the event viewer? Did you search them on eventid.net ? If you get a full BSOD, copy the stop msg & google it.


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## AndyWRS

Only the two i originally posted about. No problems the last 48 hours with heavy use and the stress test.

Its a waiting game at this point. If there is still an issue it should rear its ugly head in a week or two. I am hopeful some of the changes i made based on the posts here have solved it or at least are pointing me in the right direction. Until i get another bsod i am just going to use the pc.

I will keep you posted.

Again, i appreciated all the input and help for all who posted. I will keep updating this post.


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## supers05

AndyWRS said:


> ...Until i get another bsod i am just going to use the pc.
> .


Exactly what I would suggest. One step at a time. 

Cheers!


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## diyorpay

Shocking to hear in Steve Gibson's most recent Security Now podcast that MS did 15 updates/patches to Win10 this past January. All blamed on meltdown and spectre and how there's a major design flaw in many intel chipsets.

Recommended specifically patch KB4078130, not included in the patches.

Maybe give it a look?


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## AndyWRS

At this time i am will assume its fixed unless i get another BSOD. Could it be related...sure why not but that is step 3 and i am on step zero as i don't have a problem atm.

I secretly want to it continue just so i can buy a new PC. The reality is that would not be the best use of funds so i am trying to work through it and get it solved. If it continues and i still cant solve it i my buy a new one out of frustration if i do not get hammered on taxes this year. Then my next thread may be who makes great pre-builts.


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## AndyWRS

In post 24 i reported the CD issue based on what event viewer was showing me for the last 7 days. When i RT click it an "show all instances of this error" i actually have 902 in 11 days...from the time i did a clean install of Win10 until i disconnected the CD drive...DVD really.

I will put the old HDD back in and use it with the DVD connected and it will probably crash, then disconnect the DVD and see if it is stable. Beats waiting for this new install to crash again if at all? This new install has been fine so far.

If it still does crash then i can implement the other changes i got from the links posted. I am thinking i am better off testing the actual windows 10 install i am trying to fix. This new install served its purpose...it still crashed originally so it wasnt my original HDD.


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## AndyWRS

Update: 2/25/18

No issues so it appears the tips i got here worked...Many Thanks. I can't say for sure which it was or if it was a combo of them. It has been running without an issue. 

I have been using windows for a long time but hate the cost of it. I first moved to LibreOffice about 2 years ago and never looked back. With my PC issues the last year it got me thinking. My boss had a Dell Laptop that died and he just bought a new one and he gave me his old one. I fixed it and loaded Mint to play with. I love it. I will be switching over to Mint for personal use.

Thanks to all who posted, i appreciate the help i got here.


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## Guap0_

> I can't say for sure which it was or if it was a combo of them.


I'm sure that it was one of my tips not that I remember them. Have fun w/ Mint.


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## artimuscf

A few thoughts.

1) RAM is my first go to. A bad bit of ram often creates that random issue effect. Some of the strangest issues (including non-crashing ones) I've seen are a result of bad ram. You also mentioned that if you let it crash it seems stable after the fact. While these seems odd, if you are someone restarting without killing power to the ram, you may be experiencing better stability due to error correcting ram.

2) Try shuffling your parts around. for example if you have two pci cards, try moving them to different slots. I've seen issues where a good card on a good board for what ever reason is no good in a specific slot. Moving it to a different one, solves the issue. This is not a one-off bad build issue.. I've had a rack of 20 dell servers that all had a similar issue. Dell came back to me an said my specific card i was using is known not to work in slot 2. I moved it, and every thing was fine across all the servers.

Also make sure you are testing your ram for a long enough time.
I usually use memtest86 boot disk, and let it run over an entire weekend


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## AndyWRS

artimuscf said:


> A few thoughts.
> 
> 1) RAM is my first go to. A bad bit of ram often creates that random issue effect. Some of the strangest issues (including non-crashing ones) I've seen are a result of bad ram. You also mentioned that if you let it crash it seems stable after the fact. While these seems odd, if you are someone restarting without killing power to the ram, you may be experiencing better stability due to error correcting ram.
> 
> 2) Try shuffling your parts around. for example if you have two pci cards, try moving them to different slots. I've seen issues where a good card on a good board for what ever reason is no good in a specific slot. Moving it to a different one, solves the issue. This is not a one-off bad build issue.. I've had a rack of 20 dell servers that all had a similar issue. Dell came back to me an said my specific card i was using is known not to work in slot 2. I moved it, and every thing was fine across all the servers.
> 
> Also make sure you are testing your ram for a long enough time.
> I usually use memtest86 boot disk, and let it run over an entire weekend


RAM was my first thought also, i had tested it a half a dozen times during my attempts to fix my PC. Every time i ran memtest it passed. While i didn't let it run 48 hours i would say it ran 8 hours on the longest test i performed... mainly because the problem continued and a longer test would allow me eliminate RAM as the issue.

I never moved my cards to different slots but i suppose i could have tried that if i was still having issues.

I haven't completely dropped windows yet, i still prefer using Sketch Up on windows and my PW manager is slowly being phased out... I like Dashlane but i am going to just keep my own log. So other than using SU for work i am using Mint. I have a duel boot atm. Also, no issues what so ever while on my Win 10 install. The BSOD was solved, specifically what solved it i can not say, i tried a # of things posted here and one or a combination of them worked.

I should have paid more attention to the event viewer and looked at the logs more. I think winging it, like i did, dragged out a resolution much longer than needed. I was very close to buying a prebuilt custom to resolve this until i saw the $ tags. I just saved $3k guess i will treat my self to a few new tools.


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## Dave Sal

Just read thru part of the first page. The only thing I have to offer is an experience I had with a new Alienware computer that I bought in 2005. It was almost $2800, which I am kind of embarrassed to admit. For the first 4 months or so I suffered with BSOD's constantly. It was still under warranty and I would call their support line and they would have me run all sorts of tests (mem test, HD test, etc). This went on for a few weeks and each time I called back they would try to get me to run the same tests. I finally convinced them to have it shipped to their repair facility, at their expense, and they found that it was a bad motherboard. They replaced that and shipped it back and all was well.


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## AndyWRS

Update


On Sunday Linux locked up, then again the each following day. Didnt matter if i was idle or watching a podcast or typing in libreoffice...it just locks up and i have to hit the power button.


So just to get something done i (dualboot) i switched to windows and doing absolutely nothing but look at the desktop it locked up.


I am convinced it is hardware.


I am too unfamiliar with trouble shooting Linux so i switched to windows to research it...and it locked up in windows. I am pretty fed up with this, i will be looking at getting something new... i have no clue what though but it will include mint most likely.


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## supers05

Mmmmm minty! [emoji23]

It does sound like something hardware. At this point it may be the memory controller or something equally important. I'll agree that it's time for a new machine. 

Cheers!


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## Dave Sal

AndyWRS said:


> I am convinced it is hardware.
> 
> I am too unfamiliar with trouble shooting Linux so i switched to windows to research it...and it locked up in windows. I am pretty fed up with this, i will be looking at getting something new... i have no clue what though but it will include mint most likely.


When my old computer was on it's way out I used PC Part Picker to configure my new system. It ended up being just under $600 and has been great since day one. That website will let you add components and see if there are any conflicts or issues, plus it tracks the cost of each component from different vendors. I played around with it for a couple of weeks until I had what I wanted in my price range. Went and bought most of the parts at a local MicroCenter and ordered a few from Amazon. My son and I put it together from scratch in a few hours. It was an interesting experience and I would definitely do it again. 

https://pcpartpicker.com/


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## AndyWRS

Dave i am not concerned about parts, building a PC the easy part. I am struggling over the Linux / Win10 dual boot and fully converting to Linux.



1. SU make, my PDF editor and games run better or are at least far easier to set up in windows 10 because i know it. I bring work home so its nice to have Windows handy for construction drawings and most of my work stuff is PDF. I don't know a thing about Linux or have really had much chance to get acquainted with it because it's busy at work atm.



2. If i didn't game or at least have the option i wouldn't need Windows and then the choice is simple. I can see gaming on Linux is doable but it appears to require a much better grasp of Linux than i have.


Dave your post may have given me an idea i didn't consider, i think i see what i should try now so thanks for the kickstart to what probably is my best option.


I will replace a few key pcs of hardware on this system in a last ditch effort to fix it. I will maintain this PC for Windows only. I will do some research as to what HW i need for a midrange PC to run Linux...a small form factor or laptop. I hate the small screens and small keyboards of laptops but i am sure i could use my existing monitor, keyboard and mouse set up if i wish. Also, given the two computer option the lap top would fit the available space best. My current PC is a full tower hung under my Uplift desk...no room for an other desktop unless small form factor or best space saving option mid range laptop.


I can fix this PC, i just dont know how many parts i have to buy to do so. The good news is i have an old Dell lap top that is running Linux Mint, i may just utilize it until i resolve this windows PCs HW issue and look for a reasonably priced mid range laptop.


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## KHouse75

Can't remember seeing it...What's the motherboard manufacturer and model? Are you overclocking? Is the RAM on the HCL?


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## AndyWRS

Its an old Asus P6T SE which i just remembered is not available at a reasonable cost also no OC'ing.


I have no idea if it is on the HCL, this desktop used to run without issue, it was just the last 2-3 yrs if i recall that it began this bsod issue on a reoccurring basis. 



I did order new RAM tonight but i'm afraid if that provides no resolution i will need a MB and CPU. This would of course ruin my idea of having a desktop for work and laptop for home if i have to get both, i planed on fixing the desktop but lake of MB options for a LGA 1366 is a problem. If i can get the desk top slightly upgraded for under $800 i will be fine with that, i will still have $ for a better lap top than this free bee Inspiron i got from my boss. Still should be able to do both for what i would end up spending on a new desktop... I'd probably spend 2k or more on a desktop if it were my only PC. 



I will check my office PC Monday, if the RAM is the same i may test with that and return the new stuff i just ordered. i wasn't too thrilled about $130 for 16 gb but what am i to do...besides smash it with my mini sledge which would be quite satisfying at this point.


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## Guap0_

Be aware that even if the RAM is the same, some motherboards may only take specific sizes. In other words, one motherboard may require 2 256s but you can't install one 512 even if the RAM is exactly the same. Compare the specs of the 2 motherboards first. I just picked #s out of the air. Of course, they are way higher now.


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## supers05

Guap0_ said:


> Be aware that even if the RAM is the same, some motherboards may only take specific sizes. In other words, one motherboard may require 2 256s but you can't install one 512 even if the RAM is exactly the same. Compare the specs of the 2 motherboards first. I just picked #s out of the air. Of course, they are way higher now.


It's an asus. It should be fine. But yes, you do need to check size and speed compatibility. 

OP, check local discount electronic stores. It's common to sell off lease computers. They will be a few years old (2-4) but cost peanuts. They are generally in very good condition. Obviously the cost will be higher for the better machines, but I'd expect $150-300 on one of those. The upper end of that is likely open box, new with the stickers still on it. (prices are Canadian, so US will be slightly cheaper for now.) 


Cheers!


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## Guap0_

Another warning: Some store bought computers have secure boot/UEFI & won't allow anything but Windows.


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## supers05

Guap0_ said:


> Another warning: Some store bought computers have secure boot/UEFI & won't allow anything but Windows.


Linux has UEFI capability. Secure boot on the other hand can be a pain. Resetting the bios usually clears it. Gotta hate when someone puts a password on it though. 

Cheers!


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## Guap0_

How are you resetting it?


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## supers05

Guap0_ said:


> How are you resetting it?


Factory settings usually wipes the secure boot. If it's something like a dell, then you can get stuck with it. They have the defaults set to secure boot for the computers they sell to companies. The upside down cmos battery trick doesn't work as often these days. 

Cheers!


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## Guap0_

I thought that secure boot was a factory setting?


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## supers05

Guap0_ said:


> I thought that secure boot was a factory setting?


It's optional for most computers. UEFI is just the boot mechanism. 

Cheers!


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## Guap0_

I changed one secure boot to legacy, if that's what you mean but it didn't help.


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## supers05

Guap0_ said:


> I changed one secure boot to legacy, if that's what you mean but it didn't help.


Legacy under the secure boot or uefi boot? They are usually 2 separate settings on half decent boards. 

Cheers!


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## Guap0_

I forgot if it were a Dell or Toshiba but in the BIOS, there were two distinct choices, Secure Boot or Legacy.


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## supers05

Guap0_ said:


> I forgot if it were a Dell or Toshiba but in the BIOS, there were two distinct choices, Secure Boot or Legacy.


Dell changes things depending on product channel. I've gotten Linux to boot on UEFI enabled dell machines though. I'm no expert on Linux though. 

Cheers!


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## KHouse75

I stopped buying Asus. I started having problems with them. My Media Center PC was Asus and used to run fine then started getting BSOD more and more and eventually, started having issues hanging at the windows 7 black starting windows screen. Being an IT professional with a B.S. in IT and owning an IT outsourcing and consulting company, surely I'd be able to fix it, right? Nope. There's something wrong on the board. I bought a GigaByte board with the same chipsets and swapped everything over to it. Came right up, no issue. Didn't even have to reactivate and I was even able to place copyright protected TV recordings so playready didn't detect any hardware changes. That was probably 8 years ago now and the PC has never had a single issue since.

Depending upon how old the board it, there was a period of time where almost everything made used bad capacitors. When those caps start going bad, strange things start happening. I've even seen the metal covers on the caps shoot off.


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## supers05

Warranty exists for a reason, things aren't always perfect. Capacitors have a lifespan, they do fail with time. I've never had problems with claiming warranty for legit problems. (They even fixed my water damaged board for a small fee.) Gigabyte is also decent. 

Cheers!


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## AndyWRS

Seems the issue has vanished yet again. No trouble at all, how crazy is that.


I ordered parts for a new PC, just waiting on RAM to show up all the rest arrived over the weekend. At least this pc is working and i am not down. I spend $1200 on parts, just a mid range pc nothing fancy. Still trying to pick a lap top for one of the Linux distros. At first it was the Dell then i read a lot of neg feedback on them. Then i looked at system 76 and again i hear negative feedback regarding the os. My brain is fried, not sure what to do at this point regarding the laptop which will be my daily driver. 



I was looking to spend $1200 on a lap top, the freebee inspiron i got is usable but underpowered... i need a newer model laptop that runs Linux. Just when i find one i then find a negative reviews and i am back to sq one. paralysis by analysis kinda of situation.


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## Guap0_

As I said before, newer laptops secure boot may block Linux although super said that it's easy enough to flash the BIOS. That's up to you if you want to take a chance. Aside from all that, I prefer Lenovo Thinkpad. However, the prices can be through the roof.


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## AndyWRS

I hear good things about them but looking at there page i see a ton of options...series they call them which series would you recommend?


Id probably go 1500 as my top end and i see they have a number of options that fit that price point.


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## AndyWRS

I ended up building a mid tower, cost me $1200 but at least i can play games under windows if i choose to. I also bought a system76 laptop for $1200 ( galygos or something), why? good question... no good answer. It is a bit small but powerful enough to browse the web, email, bank ect. Its all i need. I looked at the thinkpads and the comparable dell but being my first lap top i went with system76. No complains so far, had it about 3-4 weeks now and i like it.


Unfortunately i continued my research and now feel the thinkpad would have been a better option. However, i chose the systems 76 based on price and HW... it was cheaper. Tons of bills this month also so i think that had a good bit to do with my choice. Its a risk but if it doesn't pan out i can always give it to my mom who needs an upgrade then get the thinkpad.


I rebuilt the faulty PC in a new case and new PSU and gave it my brother who plays wow a lot and was using something 4 or 5 yrs older. I wiped it clean and reinstalled the OS, if it starts that same bs with him i will just rebuild it for him using the same parts i put in mine. I put mine in a white phantek case, i put my old one in a black phantek case. The old one was running great when i gave it to him and hes been playing the new xpac for a few weeks on it with no troubles.


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## supers05

Interesting. Thanks for the feedback. Which distro are you using? 

Windows now has some fault detection and will work around known ram defects. It would be cool if the new PSU was the fix. 

Cheers!


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## Guap0_

> Unfortunately i continued my research and now feel the thinkpad would have been a better option.


Thinkpads are great. I had 2 or 3 of them. One of them is still going. The last time I looked, the prices were pretty high.


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## AndyWRS

supers05 said:


> Interesting. Thanks for the feedback. Which distro are you using?
> 
> Cheers!



It came with pop os, never heard of it but it seems ok so far. Very basic but i am gonna leave it alone for now. I suspect i will move to a thinkpad but for at least this year it fits my needs. The thinkpad looks to be around 1800 to 2 k so that will have to wait til next year or two. It will depend on how this work one holds up, if its trouble free i may keep it 2 yrs.


It came with an option of Pop!_OS 18.04 LTS (64-bit) or Ubuntu 18.04 LTS (64-bit). I havent used either so i just flipped a coin.


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## supers05

AndyWRS said:


> It came with pop os, never heard of it but it seems ok so far. Very basic but i am gonna leave it alone for now. I suspect i will move to a thinkpad but for at least this year it fits my needs. The thinkpad looks to be around 1800 to 2 k so that will have to wait til next year or two. It will depend on how this work one holds up, if its trouble free i may keep it 2 yrs.
> 
> 
> It came with an option of Pop!_OS 18.04 LTS (64-bit) or Ubuntu 18.04 LTS (64-bit). I havent used either so i just flipped a coin.


ubuntu is nice. Fairly user friendly, compared to the majority of distros. Never used pop. However, from what I've read, it is based on Ubuntu, but it looks to be more use friendly then ubuntu. Let me know how you like it after using it for a while. 

Cheers!


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## Guap0_

Andy, I bought the Lenovo T Series. As far as Linux distros go, they all have good & bad points, mostly bad. I actually started with Unix FreeBSD. That was in 1998 or so before Linux gained popularity.


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## supers05

Guap0_ said:


> Andy, I bought the Lenovo T Series. As far as Linux distros go, they all have good & bad points, mostly bad. I actually started with Unix FreeBSD. That was in 1998 or so before Linux gained popularity.


They've come a long way since then. 

Cheers!


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## Guap0_

> They've come a long way since then.


It's not that I stopped playing with Linux & Unix in 1998. My opinion of those OSes is that they are a good supplement to Windows but definitely not a replacement.


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