# Attic installed air handler



## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

Where are you located ?


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## Bob Mariani (Dec 1, 2008)

moisture can be drawn in from many sources. What is the average humidity in your home? Is the roof vented? if so is the airflow balanced? Do you have and use a pellet or wood stove? Do you use unvented gas space heaters? Are the baths and kitcen vented to the exterior? Is the crawlspace floor covered? Are the rim joists sealed with spray foam? Is the attic floor completely air sealed? Is the roof insulated or the attic floor? If it is the latter, you have other issues also. HVAC equipment should not be in unconditioned space. If it is you must check for air leaks and the proper amount of insulation.

Fix the above issues and you problem is solved.


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## Tluther (Apr 13, 2010)

We are located in Ohio. The air handler is located in an unheated/cooled attic space. I will add that we have burned out one blower motor already.


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## fabrk8r (Feb 12, 2010)

If I were you I would first inspect the duct in the attic to see if there is an outside air opening, sometimes called an "economizer" which is not covered with hardware cloth and is therefore allowing debris into the air-handler.

Also check to make sure the condensate drain is flowing freely...if plugged it could cause the condensate from the evaporator coil to be pulled into the duct.


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## Tluther (Apr 13, 2010)

I do know for a fact that the condensate pipe is flowing freely. The unit sits in an overflow pan with a pipe directly through the side wall of the house and outside. On a hot day when the unit has been running a good bit; the water flows pretty heavily through the pipe. 

Most of the ductwork is above the upstairs rooms with only one vent going through additional attic space between two bedrooms. I will check these as much as I can. Sounds like maybe I need a professional to come out and advise me on this.


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## Bob Mariani (Dec 1, 2008)

remove one of the registers and place a light in the duct. Then go to the attic and see if you see the light. Or get an incense stick and a small fan to blow the smoke through the ducts.... look for or smell for the leaks.


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## Tluther (Apr 13, 2010)

That sounds like a plan. Great idea.


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## COLDIRON (Mar 15, 2009)

Check the return air ductwork there should be no openings to let air in the system from unwanted areas.

You might have a problem with the attic and the vents make sure they have screens in them you should not have leaves in your attic that can enter the system. Besides it's a closed system.

Air handlers can be installed anywhere attic, basements, crawlspaces, closets, outside.
Millions are in fact most are.


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## Bob Mariani (Dec 1, 2008)

they can be but should not be installed in unconditioned space. billions of tax dollars are being spent for building performance specialist to fix this very thing. 70% of duct work tested has leaks, and these leaks are heating or cooling the vented attic. And rarely are they insulated enough, to the heat transfer must fight the extreme climate of the attic or crawlspace. In CA where codes demand things be done right the duct work always goes down the middle of the building with equal distribution. These are all in conditioned space and work very efficiently.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

I saw a TV show on a house in California. The ducts where in the attic. And they weren't ran down the middle of it. And it was a crappy install. Cali isn't perfect in their attempt to be perfect.
And other other HVAC forums. The guys from Cali confirm that systems ARE installed in unconditioned attic still today.

As others have said. Check to see if your system has a fresh air intake. If it does, it probably isn't screened.

Check your homes humidity. If after the A/C is done running it is still high. What can happen. Is that the warm moist air is rising through your supply vents. And condensing on the cool metal.

The register boxes/boots should be sealed to the attic ceiling. If they aren't. Unconditioned attic air can be pulled in while the blower runs. This also can cause condensation on the registers.
See if the boots/boxes were caulked/sealed to the attic floor.


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## Tluther (Apr 13, 2010)

What if we built a small room around the a/c unit in the attic? We could insulate it and keep the temperature a bit more constant.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

You need to seal the registers/boots to the ceiling, or in the attic its self.

Building a room around the air handler won't help much for the condensate on the registers.


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## Bob Mariani (Dec 1, 2008)

it may help make the room more comfortable if during this process you identify the existing leaks in the ducts. Insulation around the air handler and the duct work will save energy but not effect room comfort. It is just part of the process. How big is the attic? many times we retrofit an attic with HVAC equipment by insulating the roof with spray foam. This brings your ductwork and HVAC unit into an intermediate zone which makes it provide more efficient operation since it is not fighting against temperature extremes.


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## COLDIRON (Mar 15, 2009)

As already mentioned just tighten everything up in the entire system.

Seal all ducts, trunks, openings around ductwork, keep filter clean, keep return air system sealed so as to not suck hot attic air in the system.

Like I said there are millions of air handlers in attics around the country in all kinds of climates that operate just fine.

Good Luck


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## Earnie (Jan 24, 2008)

I have to disagree also.

As a home owner and not in the HVAC business, installing the air handler in the attic or crawl space is a big mistake. I too have replaced an air handler do to corrosion. 

Sure, you can place the air handler anywhere. Depends upon your motivation I guess. Good for business it replacing those every few years? And I really don't understand why the duct work would be insulated to R8 but the big AH box is at R2 or 3 at best.

Nope, doesn't make ANY sense to me.


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## Bob Mariani (Dec 1, 2008)

COLDIRON said:


> As already mentioned just tighten everything up in the entire system.
> 
> Seal all ducts, trunks, openings around ductwork, keep filter clean, keep return air system sealed so as to not suck hot attic air in the system.
> 
> ...



I am in Austin Tx today at a national energy performance seminar. Strange how all the engineers disagree with you on this. Yes codes allow it. but the unit is fighting to work. Temps in an attic can reach 180 and more. The unit now needs to work in these temps, and with 70% of ducts leaking (this is the stats) this hot air needs to be cooled making the unit work much harder.

Bottom line....
Ductwork and equipment is BEST to be in conditioned space. And server energy loss will incur when it is not. Go to any home improvemnt semniar in the country and someone will have a display showing them spray foaming the attic to fix the work by this type of Posting's advise.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Earnie said:


> I have to disagree also.
> 
> As a home owner and not in the HVAC business, installing the air handler in the attic or crawl space is a big mistake. I too have replaced an air handler do to corrosion.
> 
> ...


Air handlers for attics and crawlspaces, have R values of 6 or better.
You or who ever installed it, used the wrong air handler.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Bob Mariani said:


> Bottom line....
> Ductwork and equipment is BEST to be in conditioned space. And server energy loss will incur when it is not. Go to any home improvemnt semniar in the country and someone will have a display showing them spray foaming the attic to fix the work by this type of Posting's advise.


Spray foaming the attic is becoming more common even at houses with the equipment and duck work in the conditioned space.

Knocks off 1000's of BTUs for both the heating and cooling load of the house.


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## Earnie (Jan 24, 2008)

_Air handlers for attics and crawlspaces, have R values of 6 or better.
You or who ever installed it, used the wrong air handler. _

BT, I do remember you pointing that out to me in another post. 

I will be sure to mention it to the HVAC company next time they come out to once again replace the rusted AH.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Factory and distributor sales reps often fail to mention this to companies.
So many don't know that air handlers for unconditioned space have more insulation in them.

One thing that can be done for air handlers that have R4.2 insulation. And are installed in unconditioned spaces. Is to add insulation to the outside of the jacket. Specially to the bottom of the air handler.

Air handlers with a short blower off delay. End up with the cold air from the coil laying on the bottom of the inside of the air handler. Making the exposed jacket bottom very cold. And causing a lot of condensation to form.

Adding any insulation to the bottom(bubble wrap, 1/2 fiberglass wrap, etc), will stop that condensate from forming. And extend the life of the jacket/air handler.

In an area that has an outdoor condition of 95° and 60%RH. An air handler and or duct work in an unconditioned attic will sweat if their surface temp drops below 79°F.


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## COLDIRON (Mar 15, 2009)

To each their own. 

I have been installing air handlers in attics for 40 years, no problems other than getting to them sometimes because of space limitations.

:thumbsup::thumbsup: To beenthere.


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## Bob Mariani (Dec 1, 2008)

COLDIRON;I431489 said:


> To each their own.
> 
> I have been installing air handlers in attics for 40 years, no problems other than getting to them sometimes because of space limitations.
> 
> :thumbsup::thumbsup: To beenthere.


I appreciate very much contractors with this attitude. It keeps me if business fixing houses.

:no:


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## COLDIRON (Mar 15, 2009)

Bob you got it wrong it's not an attitude it's the way it's done in the HVAC business.

So please lighten up and keep on remodeling and answering op questions I respect your opinion.


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## Earnie (Jan 24, 2008)

Then the "HVAC business" needs a paradigm shift.

The attitude, "that's the way it's been done for forty years" no longer applies. HVAC is deep in math and science and those in the business need to adapt to it through education and application. 

Applies to home builders and home designers too. They are the ones leaving out the HVAC mechanical room/closet and conditioned ductway.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Earnie said:


> Then the "HVAC business" needs a paradigm shift.
> 
> 
> 
> Applies to home builders and home designers too. They are the ones leaving out the HVAC mechanical room/closet and conditioned ductway.


All they have to do. Is seal and insulate the attic. Then it becomes a conditioned space.

No duct loss or gain.

Foaming the attic is the best way.


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## Bob Mariani (Dec 1, 2008)

one speaker the other day from the Canadian Home Mortgage says that it is even illegal to do this in Canada. It really is bad that so many other countries are more advanced then we are in the US>


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## COLDIRON (Mar 15, 2009)

Bob Mariani said:


> one speaker the other day from the Canadian Home Mortgage says that it is even illegal to do this in Canada. It really is bad that so many other countries are more advanced then we are in the US>


There's millions of speakers out there telling people what to do and not what to do that's why they are called speakers they speak for a living I install Air Conditioner's. I don't go around speaking on how to because it took too many years to learn the trade.


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## COLDIRON (Mar 15, 2009)

*Air handler*



Earnie said:


> I have to disagree also.


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