# Washing machine is the culprit in excessive water bills.



## Fix'n it (Mar 12, 2012)

my water bill is about $100 a month, includes garbage. 2 people, 2 showers a day and 3 loads a week. 
the bill is not about the water, its about income for the city.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

We do multiple loads a day some days. I forgot to add sewage, thats another $50 a month. We pay about $70 a month just to be hooked up before we use a single gallon of water.


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## Steve2444 (Sep 28, 2020)

Family of Two, 5000 gal a month, cost is not really relevant, as rates are different everywhere, but about $35-40 per month.
Top load washer, but two 43 yr old toilets.


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## quatsch (Feb 4, 2021)

I heard 100 gals per person per day in the US for resi use, but 
"Water use in the United States in 2015 was estimated to be about 322 billion gallons per day", about 1000 gals per person per day.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

Well if thats the case my use is below avg. at 200 gal a day per month for 4 people.
About 6000 gal a month. Just changed out our oldest toilet for a Niagra .8 Gal. Should be good for at least 300 gallons a month reduction. Iv heard we have some of the highest rates in the country and we are swimming in pure water here. Several huge reservoirs that we cant possibly use a fraction of for such a small town.


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## Oso954 (Jun 23, 2012)

quatsch said:


> "Water use in the United States in 2015 was estimated to be about 322 billion gallons per day", about 1000 gals per person per day.


Just for clarity, that 1000 gal/day is a prorating of all US water usage over the population.
It has nothing to do with someone’s residential water usage.

It includes agriculture and other industrial/commercial water usage.


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## gthomas785 (Mar 22, 2021)

High efficiency washers are supposed to use 15-30 gallons per load depending on the washer and the load size. Say worst case yours uses 40 gallons, It would take 10 loads of laundry in a day to use that much water. Of course, you are using water for other stuff at the same time. Do you have any usage from non-laundry days to compare it with?
$100 a month sounds a little high but not extraordinary for a 4-person household.
Have you checked your toilet flaps lately?


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## quatsch (Feb 4, 2021)

For a while our WaCo was saying 70 gal per person per day is the norm but I think this was a Pious Fraud designed to shame us into using less water.

Our GaCo tries to shame us into using less gas, so I wrote them a letter questioning their data & methods. That letter was not well received! 
One time they tried to entrap me into defrauding them so they'd have "dirt" on me. That didn't work, either.

And once in TX the PoCo tripled our bill from one month to the next. They were checking to see if we were paying attention. I was.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

gthomas785 said:


> High efficiency washers are supposed to use 15-30 gallons per load depending on the washer and the load size. Say worst case yours uses 40 gallons, It would take 10 loads of laundry in a day to use that much water. Of course, you are using water for other stuff at the same time. Do you have any usage from non-laundry days to compare it with?
> $100 a month sounds a little high but not extraordinary for a 4-person household.
> Have you checked your toilet flaps lately?


All my toilets are new as of 3 days ago. All are low consumption now. ,2 at.8 and 1 at 1.2 . Definitely the washer. Non wash days 60 to 70 gallons use, wash days 100 to as much as 400. Avg wash day is 200.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

Oso954 said:


> Just for clarity, that 1000 gal/day is a prorating of all US water usage over the population.
> It has nothing to do with someone’s residential water usage.
> 
> It includes agriculture and other industrial/commercial water usage.


Especially when it takes 1000 to 2000 gallons to produce a single 1lb of beef.


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## gthomas785 (Mar 22, 2021)

turbo4 said:


> All my toilets are new as of 3 days ago. All are low consumption now. ,2 at.8 and 1 at 1.2 . Definitely the washer. Non wash days 60 to 70 gallons use, wash days 100 to as much as 400. Avg wash day is 200.


How many loads of laundry would you say you did on those days?


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

In researching washing machines i find that they vary greatly ,even the HE models.


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## Steve2444 (Sep 28, 2020)

turbo4 said:


> All my toilets are new as of 3 days ago. All are low consumption now. ,2 at.8 and 1 at 1.2 . Definitely the washer. Non wash days 60 to 70 gallons use, wash days 100 to as much as 400. Avg wash day is 200.


You could reduce your loads per week, as an added benefit, having 6ft of personal covid space would be no problem.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

gthomas785 said:


> How many loads of laundry would you say you did on those days?


Not sure as the wife does them.But i know there is a lot of small loads which can use a lot more water per item.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

I should go back to a front loader, but they are Sooo heavy. Like 100lbs more going up to the seond floor.


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## Fix'n it (Mar 12, 2012)

the town over from me has a private water supplier. their bills "just" for water are $250+ a month.


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## gthomas785 (Mar 22, 2021)

turbo4 said:


> Not sure as the wife does them.But i know there is a lot of small loads which can use a lot more water per item.


Yeah, the size of the load doesn't affect the water use as much as you might think even for "smart" washers.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

Fix'n it said:


> the town over from me has a private water supplier. their bills "just" for water are $250+ a month.


BIL said he didnt have a meter until recently .Flat rate for all you can use.


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## Fix'n it (Mar 12, 2012)

i told my wife = NEVER do full loads, 3/4 only. it makes the machine last longer.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

I have a house im rehabbing that has a well. Might be 1 solution.


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## Javiles (Dec 12, 2011)

Go to your meter and monitor your consumption check usage on regular days and compare to laundry days. monitor for at least 2 weeks to get a general idea of your usage.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

Javiles said:


> Go to your meter and monitor your consumption check usage on regular days and compare to laundry days. monitor for at least 2 weeks to get a general idea of your usage.


Been doing that for a month. Thats where is got the numbers from "Non wash days 60 to 70 gallons use, wash days 100 to as much as 400. Avg wash day is 200".


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## quatsch (Feb 4, 2021)

> i told my wife = NEVER do full loads, 3/4 only. it makes the machine last longer.


And yet you'd do 4/3rds more loads.


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## Missouri Bound (Apr 9, 2011)

turbo4 said:


> I have a HE GE top of the line washing machine but my water use goes through the roof whenever we use it. Iv already had days at 400 gallons of water in a single day. Not sure if the machine is defective or we just do too much laundry. Avg water bill is around $100 a month 4 people.


How do you know how much water you are using?
How much do you use if you don't use the washing machine?
I'd look at the water meter first.
On average, washing machines use about 20 gallons per load.
I suspect you aren't washing 20 loads a day.


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## joed (Mar 13, 2005)

The first thing is to check the meter with nothing using water. If the needle is moving you have a leak.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

joed said:


> The first thing is to check the meter with nothing using water. If the needle is moving you have a leak.


Brand new meter with a big gallon dial to ck for leaks. Nothing leaking.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

Missouri Bound said:


> How do you know how much water you are using?
> How much do you use if you don't use the washing machine?


No wash days are 100 gallons a day or less. As soon as the Washing machine is involved its 200 and up. I will try to get a idea exactly how much the washer is using when i do my work clothes and no one else is home. The meter is in my finished basement closet.


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## Fix'n it (Mar 12, 2012)

my wife used to turn the hot water on, and walk away from it to do something else.. she has always turned the shower on 5 mins before getting it. she now pays the gas bill.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

Fix'n it said:


> my wife used to turn the hot water on, and walk away from it to do something else.. she has always turned the shower on 5 mins before getting it. she now pays the gas bill.


I dont want to crank on my wife about doing too many small loads and wasting water cuz a divorce would be so much more expensive than any water bill could ever hope to be.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

Javiles said:


> Go to your meter and monitor your consumption check usage on regular days and compare to laundry days. monitor for at least 2 weeks to get a general idea of your usage.


I have one months worth of data and meter readings.Ill continue to monitor now that iv just installed a new lo flow Niagra stealth .8 gallon per flush toilet in the most used bathroom for another month.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

Todays is wash day and im up to 260 gallons already for today. Last 3 days averaged only 64 a day. Definitely the washer. And its an HE washer. Not very HE.


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## Fix'n it (Mar 12, 2012)

well, i'm going to say you have the least stinky family around


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## Chris616 (Dec 31, 2019)

turbo4 said:


> Todays is wash day and im up to 260 gallons already for today. Last 3 days averaged only 64 a day. Definitely the washer. And its an HE washer. Not very HE.


How many loads of laundry? That needs to be known before the blame can be assigned to the machine rather than the operator.


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## Missouri Bound (Apr 9, 2011)

I think your brand new water meter is defective.


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## Missouri Bound (Apr 9, 2011)

Fix'n it said:


> my water bill is about $100 a month, includes garbage. 2 people, 2 showers a day and 3 loads a week.


My water bill is also $100.......but that's a year.
I live in a subdivision with a community well.


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## Missouri Bound (Apr 9, 2011)

The only way a washing machine will keep filling is if your discharge hose is below the water line.
It will just keep siphoning out and refilling.


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## gthomas785 (Mar 22, 2021)

turbo4 said:


> Todays is wash day and im up to 260 gallons already for today. Last 3 days averaged only 64 a day. Definitely the washer. And its an HE washer. Not very HE.





Missouri Bound said:


> The only way a washing machine will keep filling is if your discharge hose is below the water line.
> It will just keep siphoning out and refilling.


Yeah, check the install to make sure it is not constantly dumping water. Do you have a high loop in the drain line?
Otherwise all I can think of is that you must be doing a crapload of laundry.
How long is the wash cycle? To use 200 gallons you'd need to be doing at least 6-8 loads and I didn't think the high efficiency ones could do that many in a day.


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## tribe_fan (May 18, 2006)

I also would look at a siphoning issue. Below link is a couple years old.









Yes, Your Washing Machine Is Using Enough Water


How much water should a washing machine use? Consumer Reports compared three types of washers to find out.



www.consumerreports.org


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

tribe_fan said:


> I also would look at a siphoning issue. Below link is a couple years old.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Good article. All HE washers are not created equal. I used to have a front loader which used a lot less water. I guess i should go back to one the next time around. Water co is now asking for a 20% increase in rates. Electric company will be raising their rates 20% Dec 1. Must be the new math for that 5% inflation rate.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

tribe_fan said:


> I also would look at a siphoning issue. Below link is a couple years old.


My drain is higher than the washer so it cant siphon.
The last 10 days iv averaged bvetween 60 an 80 gallon a day .Wash day is 200 to as much as 330 so i am positive the washer is using the bulk of the water. New toilet will save between 100 and 150 gallons a month. The only possible way to reign in th excess use is a new HE frontloading washer which can use less than 10 gallons a load vs 15 top over 20 for a top loader HE.


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## Chris616 (Dec 31, 2019)

I was looking back at your comments about usage other than the washer. Assuming that the number of people in the house remains constant, here is the usage per person, per day. Except for the washer, your family seems to be doing an unusually good job of conserving water. The EPA estimates US residential consumption at 82 gal/person/day (but that would include washer use and garden irrigation, which you're probably not going at this time of year). Maybe the four people in the house are absent for much of the day?



turbo4 said:


> Well if thats the case my use is below avg. at 200 gal a day per month for 4 people.


If I’m interpreting that comment correctly by ignoring “per month” that is *50* gal/person/day


turbo4 said:


> All my toilets are new as of 3 days ago. Non wash days 60 to 70 gallons use.


Unclear if that data is pre or post toilet change, but that is *15-18* gal/person/day.


turbo4 said:


> No wash days are 100 gallons a day or less.


That is *25* gal/person/day or less


turbo4 said:


> Last 3 days averaged only 64 a day.


That is *16* gal/person/day


turbo4 said:


> The last 10 days iv averaged bvetween 60 an 80 gallon a day .


That is *15-20* gal/person/day


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

Chris616 said:


> I was looking back at your comments about usage other than the washer. Assuming that the number of people in the house remains constant, here is the usage per person, per day. Except for the washer, your family seems to be doing an unusually good job of conserving water. The EPA estimates US residential consumption at 82 gal/person/day (but that would include washer use and garden irrigation, which you're probably not going at this time of year). Maybe the four people in the house are absent for much of the day?


3 of the 4 people are absent much of the day. I have all lo flow shower heads, and all water conserving toilets. Much of the problem is high water rates that are going up again in month or so.. Like is said my only course of action at this point in a front loader HE washer. Our HE toploader is about 15 yrs old so it wont be too long .


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## Missouri Bound (Apr 9, 2011)

The national average is "supposedly" 80 to 100 gallons a day, per person. Of course that is determined by simple math which doesn't reflect individual usage.


https://water.phila.gov/pool/files/home-water-use-ig5.pdf


Now I could check around but I find it highly unlikely that many people I know use that much.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

Missouri Bound said:


> Now I could check around but I find it highly unlikely that many people I know use that much.


Its very possible. Many have old leaky toilets ,hi flow shower heads and old regular washers that use boatloads of water. Also im a builder and at times i dont notice a toilet had been leaking for some time. How much worse for those who dont know how these things work. Iv known people who eventually had their water shut off over it after many months of huge bills.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

So i was right about the GE top loader HE washer using too much water. My avg water use was between 5 and 6k gallons a month. After the first full month of use with the new LG Front loader its hovering between 3800 and 4200. That equals about $15 to $20 a month. Will take about 5yrs to pay off the new washer with water savings. After i bought it for $995 i found a similar one at Sams Clubfor $599.


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## CaptTom (Dec 31, 2017)

Thanks for coming back to update us on the final answer!

You had the opposite problem as I did. When I got our front-loader, I was shocked at how little water it used. Some of the clothes never even got damp. It was great at "saving" water, but it wasn't cleaning the clothes at all. I eventually learned that if I selected the "heavy duty" cycle the clothes would at least get wet during the wash cycle, and would usually come out clean enough.


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

I've avoided the front loaders due to the expense, and also the many stories about required door seal maintenance/replacement and mold growth, etc.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

CaptTom said:


> Thanks for coming back to update us on the final answer!
> You had the opposite problem as I did. When I got our front-loader, I was shocked at how little water it used. Some of the clothes never even got damp. It was great at "saving" water, but it wasn't cleaning the clothes at all. I eventually learned that if I selected the "heavy duty" cycle the clothes would at least get wet during the wash cycle, and would usually come out clean enough.


Our clothes get cleaner than ever in the front loader. Yours may have been defective. Also the spin cycle get so much water out they only feel damp when finished.When washing i can see the water sloshing thru the front door. I bought the first front loader that came out in 2000 a Kenmore made in Germany,lasted 15 yrs. Went to top loader and next and now back to the front loader. This time i went by Consumer Reports reviews which had the LG above the the others including in how clean the clothes get.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

HotRodx10 said:


> I've avoided the front loaders due to the expense, and also the many stories about required door seal maintenance/replacement and mold growth, etc.


Never had that problem with my Kenmore bought in 2000. LG of all models has the best ratings right now i went with what working for the greatest number of people plus a 5 yr warranty. Clothes get cleaner and the washer will have paid for itself in water savings before the warranty runs out.


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## CaptTom (Dec 31, 2017)

I've heard the horror stories about moldy door seals too. We dry them off with a rag when done, and always leave the door open. It's not in a damp basement, so that may help too. Plus, I always throw a little Oxy-Clean in with every load. I even pull out and pat down the detergent and softener tray and leave that open between washes. I've never had any problem with mildew or mold.

I didn't like the newer, water-saving front-loaders at first. I like to see lots of water sloshing around! But I have to admit that if I use the "heavy duty" setting the clothes do come clean every time. Water around here is cheap, so it would take several lifetimes to justify the cost on water savings alone. But as long as it does what it's supposed to do (wash clothes) I'm OK with it.


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

CaptTom said:


> We dry them off with a rag when done, and always leave the door open.


Drying it off would be a fairly easy extra step, assuming I could get the kids to do it, but leaving the door open probably wouldn't work in my house. The washer is beside a hallway; I would foresee alot of bashed knees with an open door there. Thanks for sharing.


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## turbo4 (Jan 30, 2021)

Still tracking water use .Second month and water use is down roughly 1500 gallons a month and more. Amazing how much extra water can be use by a washing machine. Top loaders always use more plus high detergent setting bumps up water levels. Small load but high detergent setting will cause top loader it to fill up half full or more. At this rate washer pays for itself in just over 3 years from water use alone.


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