# dura ceramic



## sparky9999 (Jul 6, 2006)

I thinking about purchasing dura ceramic. It looks better with grout but the store installers tell me that grout is a problem. It will either crack or discolor. Have any of you had any dealing with this product.


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## floorman (Mar 21, 2005)

in my opinion this stuff is junk and would direct you to real tile.This is someones attempt to get to the cheaper side side of the ceramic market and try to sell you somwething that is going to fail you in a year or 2 .If you are going to spend this money on tilelike products spend a lil mo money and go witrh tile


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## metamel (Jul 17, 2006)

*ceramic tile substrate*



floorman said:


> in my opinion this stuff is junk and would direct you to real tile.This is someones attempt to get to the cheaper side side of the ceramic market and try to sell you somwething that is going to fail you in a year or 2 .If you are going to spend this money on tilelike products spend a lil mo money and go witrh tile


Floorman, I had ceramic tile put down in my kitchen and the regular grout is cracking all over the place. The cement board is 1/8 inch thick, but maybe there weren't enough screws put in. I was wondering if take up the tile and put in more screws (I read where screws shouldn't go into joists, is this true? or do screws weaken the joists too much?). Would more screws firm up the floor, which is over a basement. Is there anything else that I could do, like use a rubbarized grout that bends without cracking, or a fiber glass mesh that stiffens when cemented between the tile and cement board? What should I use for the adhesive between the tile and cement board? Mastic stuff was used before, but there are a lot of cracks, say 50% of the tile where we walk.


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## floorman (Mar 21, 2005)

The first questions i would ask is what thickness is the subfloor?And what type is it?(particle board,osb,plywood)Then what size are the joists and the spacing?Lets answer those first and then we can proceed with how fix the problem.


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## metamel (Jul 17, 2006)

The Joists are 16 inch over center, and are probably 2 x10s with 3/4-inch plywood over the top. The joists are 12 to 14 feet long with no support posts during that span. The cement board is 1/4-inch thick.


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## metamel (Jul 17, 2006)

Maybe this Ditra product is something to consider for my floor with the tile grout cracks. Have you had success with this product or something similiar?


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## Floorwizard (Dec 5, 2003)

> I thinking about purchasing dura ceramic. It looks better with grout but the store installers tell me that grout is a problem. It will either crack or discolor. Have any of you had any dealing with this product.


Duraceramic has performed on all jobs for months now. if installed correctly, there should be no more problems than that of a tile.

Duraceramic is alot more affordable, and not all clients are ceramic clients.
It is definately not in the ceramic category as far as value and durability, but it is also far away from the "Junk" category as well.


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## cmanley (Nov 28, 2006)

*Sparky9999 did you put down the DuraCeramic?*

i heard the same thing about the grout but that it smears. Well, i had it put down and it does smear. the contractors didn't wipe it up so now i have to do it. 
From what i have heard th grout is supposed to be more stain resistant because it is acrylic and Congoleum has a warranty against staining. 
i was torn between ceramic and this Dura Ceramic more for pratical reasons than money. I hated the idea of the permanance of the subfloor and the hardness of the ceramic.
So far i like the look but i need to get up the smear. My contractors were terrible. I have had them back several times for glaring mistakes...I should have let me husband do it himself but I was impatient.


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## dougrus (Sep 16, 2006)

In your kitchen where the grout is cracking was the cementboard screwed AND thinsetted to the subfloor? It should be.


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## installer1 (Apr 16, 2007)

*Need Help Asap!!!!*

Has anyone gotten sick when installing dura ceramic??? Particularly with the *ds100 duraset glue*??? 

My husband has been installing carpet/lino for 20 years, installed the tile for the 2nd time and got dangeriously ill!!! Felt dizzy and then experienced a Grand Mal like seizure ( was not a grand mal though). He had these sympotms for 48 hours. 

If anyone has any info or has become ill when installing this product please email me.... I can really use some help!!!


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## Floorwizard (Dec 5, 2003)

I have not heard of the illness at all.
So far no complaints....


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## Zel1 (Mar 21, 2007)

Up above, I seen someone mention 1/8" and 1/4" thick cement board. I didnt even know they made it that thin, and I would think neither is a good choice for floors, maybe only walls. IMO

When we did the bathroom recently, we used backer board screws every 8" to start, then added more as needed, in the joists and wherever there seemed to be some play. We also thinsetted all the seems and edges.


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## jproffer (Mar 12, 2005)

Zel,

The cement board screws should NOT be into the joists, if it's at all possible to avoid them.

And hopefully you thinsetted under the entire sheet, not just the edges and seams.

1/4" Rock works fine for floors and (although I've never even heard of) 1/8", it would be OK too. The purpose of the cement board is to "decouple" the tile from the plywood...that's all..nothing more. Contrary to popular belief, it's not meant as a "flex stopper". You should have the floor within flex tolerances before the rock is installed.


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## Zel1 (Mar 21, 2007)

This is the first tile project I've ever been involved in. My Dad was a carpenter for many years and he was the "foreman" on my project. He said he has always done it that way, screwed to the joists, not thinsetted, except for the seams and edges, and he has never had a problem. I'm not saying what is right or wrong, but he is extremely meticulous and I trust his opinion. The tile work he has done in his parents house and his is still looking good after 20-30 years. JProffer, I respect and value your opinion and will keep it in mind when I do the other bathroom floor. :thumbsup:


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## R&D Tile (Feb 6, 2006)

zel said:


> This is the first tile project I've ever been involved in. My Dad was a carpenter for many years and he was the "foreman" on my project. He said he has always done it that way, screwed to the joists, not thinsetted, except for the seams and edges, and he has never had a problem. I'm not saying what is right or wrong, but he is extremely meticulous and I trust his opinion. The tile work he has done in his parents house and his is still looking good after 20-30 years. JProffer, I respect and value your opinion and will keep it in mind when I do the other bathroom floor. :thumbsup:


You NEED thinset under the boards and NEVER screw them into the joists, he's been very lucky up until now, that's all, use Ditra, alot easier to install and faster, better product as well.


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## sewpie (Jul 3, 2007)

We have applied this product in our kitchen w/grout. We are very happy and are planning on doing the bathroom next.

About the grout smearing, it will smear, even after set, if cleaned with an ammonia product.


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## ktkelly (Apr 7, 2007)

jproffer said:


> Zel,
> 
> The purpose of the cement board is to "decouple" the tile from the plywood...that's all..nothing more.


Please explain this one to me. How is it decoupling the tile from the plywood when the tile is bonded to the backer board with thinset, and the backer board is bonded to the plywood with screws AND thinset?

The logic defies me.



jproffer said:


> Contrary to popular belief, it's not meant as a "flex stopper". You should have the floor within flex tolerances before the rock is installed.


On this we will definitely agree.

In my opinion, using a 1/4", 3/8", or even a 1/2" backer board over a single 3/4 plywood subfloor is a sure way to have to much flex (depending on the floor span of course), which will can cause the grout cracking issues.


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## lesneb (Aug 1, 2007)

*problems with DuraCeramic*

I had Congoleum Duraceramic professionally installed in 2004 - I love the look and the feel. But after only one year, the tiles began to get little holes all over the surface! Has anyone had a problem like this? What started as maybe a dozen holes is now more than 75! After more than a year of calling, waiting, and inspectors coming and going, Congoleum decided I must have made the holes myself and refuses to stand behind their warranty. They claim no one else has had this problem, is there anyone out there who has? At this point, I would never recommend duraceramic to anyone any more! As for the epoxy grout, it was a mess and took the installers three trips to get it right. Then I still had to clean it off my tiles on my hands and knees with a scrubber, but it has never cracked or stained.


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## lknecht (Mar 2, 2009)

*Duraceramic tile is NOT durable*

Do not buy this product and do not be taken in by Congoleum's so-called lifetime warranty. We are two adults who wear slippers in the house. No pets. No children. After less than a year, there are spots on our Duraceramic kitchen floor where the surface has come off. I bought this product because of Congoleum's lifetime "will not wear out" warranty, but Congoleum says the damage to my floor is not covered by the warranty. In fact, they suggested that we had caused the damage by dropping or dragging heavy objects across it. All we have done is walk on it for less than a year.


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## ccarlisle (Jul 2, 2008)

If you get into a shouting match with a flooring company, look up "Independent Floor Inspectors" in the YP. they're out there and this is what they do. They give independent analyses of flooring problems and their cause. May be worth $250 to have one in...


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