# should I switch from natural gas to electric water heater



## NHMaster (Dec 21, 2009)

Stick with the gas unit


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## moopey (Sep 14, 2010)

if you really want to get rid of the tank, get a gas fired tankless.


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## supermaxhd (May 12, 2010)

moopey said:


> if you really want to get rid of the tank, get a gas fired tankless.


can't justify the cost


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## AllanJ (Nov 24, 2007)

Is the 6 cents per kwh for the energy only or does that include the delivery costs and other per-kwh charges?

As a rough rule, the cost per gallon of electric hot water is somewhere around twice that for gas. Less where there is cheap hydro or nuclear power and more where the power is generated using coal or oil.

But your situation is unusual where the water heater is the only gas appliance and the fixed costs (monthly fee, minimum charge, etc.) are spread out over fewer mcf or therms of gas usage.


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## supermaxhd (May 12, 2010)

AllanJ said:


> Is the 6 cents per kwh for the energy only or does that include the delivery costs and other per-kwh charges?
> 
> As a rough rule, the cost per gallon of electric hot water is somewhere around twice that for gas. Less where there is cheap hydro or nuclear power and more where the power is generated using coal or oil.
> 
> But your situation is unusual where the water heater is the only gas appliance and the fixed costs (monthly fee, minimum charge, etc.) are spread out over fewer mcf or therms of gas usage.


My six cents per kwh for electricity estimate was a little low. If I take my total electric bill and subtract the $8.50 basic service charge and divide by the kwh used the cost is about 7.9 cents per kwh. 

My summer month gas bills show usage of .7 to .9 mcf for hot water.


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## High Gear (Nov 30, 2009)

Have you looked at a Marathon electric unit ??

I have one .

Na/gas is a cheaper way to go initially around here as electric is around 

10 cents per k .( gas I think is around 45+ cents per therm varies with the 

season ( can be almost double that some times)

The marathon has a lifetime guarantee ( against leeking ( no anode needed ), plus being super insulated and not 

using conditioned air ( combustion air )you should be ahead in the long run ( I believe anyways.)

Either way it looks cool :laughing:.

http://www.marathonheaters.com/

http://www.marathonheaters.com/consumers.html


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## Know It ALL (Nov 13, 2010)

If you like warm water and spending money electric is the way to go.
I have never personally heard someone complain about a gas W/H.
Propane rules. Buy it in the summer when rates are lowest. 
Really, If anyone in your home takes long showers gas is the only option. Another thing to consider, How often does your power go off?


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## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

I have a 50g electric HW heater, plenty of hot water & I take long showers
And mine is set around 130 degrees
It will cost you a min of $15 more per month w/electric..probably more
So over a 12 month period that's $180 a year min extra cost
So you will really not save any $$ over the year
And actually monthly cost for electric might be $30+ a month
That's $20 a month more = $240 a year....more then you would save in the off season cost of gas

Not sure where you are located or how many people use HW at your house
I'm going w/solar heat for HW in the non-heating season
Last year I was heating my 400g+ hot tub to 108+
....one day it made it to 114 f


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## supermaxhd (May 12, 2010)

My local electric utility has a fuel comparison for water heating on their web site. Heating with with electricity is $14 per million btu's. Natural gas about 70% more or $24. Propane is triple natural gas cost. 

This would mean my cost for hot water would go up $5-6 per month to switch to electric with current rates and usage. If I turn off my gas service for 9 months a year my net savings would be about $100/year. I feel like natural gas cost is more volatile than electric and more likely to increase sharply than go lower which increases my savings but who knows.

Lowes has the the GE Hybrid heat pump model $200 less this weekend for Black Friday but I still can't justify that upgrade. My total cost would be about $1900 (includes installation and electrical work and one $250 tax credit this spring) vs $1100 for non hybrid electric heater installed (also including electrical work). Best case scenario for the hybrid is it saves extra $100/yr over non hybrid model. With it being inside the house I would also be concerned that it cancels out any savings by increasing my home heating cost.


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## kenmac (Feb 26, 2009)

water heaters have an energy guide decal. The energy will give you the yearly operational cost of the 2 based on national adverage utility rates.

Based on this decal.... the elec. water cost more than the gas. check the rates for your area & compare


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## bob22 (May 28, 2008)

Google the whirlpool water heater from Lowes; I doubt you will still want to buy it.


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## the_man (Aug 14, 2010)

bob22 said:


> Google the whirlpool water heater from Lowes; I doubt you will still want to buy it.


Agreed. american water heaters (the company that makes the whirlpool brand) are junk. if you're gonna get one from a box store, get a ge (made by rheem) the control box on the whirlpool can easily fail, and you have to get parts for them by mail.


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## supermaxhd (May 12, 2010)

bob22 said:


> Google the whirlpool water heater from Lowes; I doubt you will still want to buy it.


 
I know, I have. The reviews on the Lowes web site are not that good either. But are they really that bad or is it just because Lowes sells a zillion of them? I bet a large number are sold to the DIY community who have never installed one and is then having problems. Someone having a problem is more likely to publicly complain. When was the last time you wrote about a good experience with a water heater? I doubt Whilpool is really using any proprietary parts or technology that would make them worse but I could be wrong.


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## High Gear (Nov 30, 2009)

Rudd/Rheem make the Marathon heater and its endorsed by many electric co-ops.

Menards and Grainger also sell them.

A Marathon electric over an old type gas unit I'd probable y take the gas.

The MODERN heaters have such a short life span that you will lose out $$ 

wise when you have to replace them let alone any water damage from leeks.

I'll take my chances with a polybutyl tank ( no anode rod needed ).

An electric doesn't need make up air that needs to be heated/cooled ( this 

closes the gap $ wise a bit .


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## NHMaster (Dec 21, 2009)

1) The Whirlpool unit is junk. We have serviced more of them in the past 5 years that I can count. The equipment sucks, the service from Lowe's and Whirlpool sucks too and parts take a long time to get which sucks when you havn't taken a bath in a week or so.

2) A.O. Smith, and Rheem both make very nice stuff

3) Tankless heaters suck, all of them. Servicing and repairing them accounts for a hefty part of our monthly income so let that be your guide.


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## bob22 (May 28, 2008)

Agree with NHMaster; bought one for my mom, installed it, and about a month later it needed a new board that after much wrangling over the phone with support, had them mail me a new one. I think I had to do this twice if memory is correct before one they sent didn't burn out. I wouldn't get one again.


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## kenmac (Feb 26, 2009)

NHMaster said:


> 1) The Whirlpool unit is junk. We have serviced more of them in the past 5 years that I can count. The equipment sucks, the service from Lowe's and Whirlpool sucks too and parts take a long time to get which sucks when you havn't taken a bath in a week or so.
> 
> 2) A.O. Smith, and Rheem both make very nice stuff
> 
> 3) Tankless heaters suck, all of them. Servicing and repairing them accounts for a hefty part of our monthly income so let that be your guide.


 

I agree on all of these statments. Working on tankless makes for a good payday:yes: I wished everyone had 1:laughing:


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## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

I actually have a 50g whirlpool water heater...12 year warranty
Its been 5 or 6 years & no problems...knock on wood
Old one failed when I was not home
So I did not have much choice.....it needed to be replaced ASAP
If I had a chance to research I would not have purchased it
But the old one was oil fired & they wanted $1900 to install another oil fired water heater :no:
I'm going to be converting to solar for most of the year soon


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## Know It ALL (Nov 13, 2010)

I bought this from Sears April 09.
State Ind. made in Tn.
Item # 33948
Brand, Power miser 9. 40 Gallon. Seems like I remember paying around $375
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_04233948000P?prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1
What I do remember is that the price difference was anywhere from $300 to $1500. My original propane unit is a 96 model State and has worked perfect.
I have the above listed unit stored because if my old 96 model were to fail I could be out of $1000 or more depending if I were not around and wife had to pay an installer.
My point is, if your water heater is more than 10 years old, it might pay off to have a new one sitting in the corner.


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## supermaxhd (May 12, 2010)

Taking another look now at the GE Hybrid after finding I can get it for about $1150. I've read a lot of reviews and most are positive. Anyone here have any experience wit it?


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## rjniles (Feb 5, 2007)

supermaxhd said:


> Taking another look now at the GE Hybrid after finding I can get it for about $1150. I've read a lot of reviews and most are positive. Anyone here have any experience wit it?


For the price difference between a $400 electric and a $1150 hybrid, I can pay a lot of electric bills. I do not believe a hybrid will last long enough to pay for itself.


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## supermaxhd (May 12, 2010)

rjniles said:


> For the price difference between a $400 electric and a $1150 hybrid, I can pay a lot of electric bills. I do not believe a hybrid will last long enough to pay for itself.


I've estmated my savings at about $100/yr which is far less than the $320/yr that GE says it can save. I still have access to one $250 tax credit this spring (I already used my 30% federal tax credit on windows). The break even should be 5-7ears or less as electricity cost increase.


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## Bob999 (Mar 4, 2010)

How are you computing the savings associated with a hybrid water heater? The hybrid heater uses a heat pump and the heat pump takes heat from the surrounding air so if you live in an area with a long heating season for most of the year you pay for the heat and then pay for the electricity to transfer the heat to the water. During the air conditioning season the hybrid water heater will save you some electricity on your A/C --if you have A/C.

You also need to factor in exected life and expected maintenance costs. Heat pump systems are a lot more complex and a lot more expensive to maintain than a traditional water heater and the replacement costs are also a lot higher.


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## supermaxhd (May 12, 2010)

Bob999 said:


> How are you computing the savings associated with a hybrid water heater? The hybrid heater uses a heat pump and the heat pump takes heat from the surrounding air so if you live in an area with a long heating season for most of the year you pay for the heat and then pay for the electricity to transfer the heat to the water. During the air conditioning season the hybrid water heater will save you some electricity on your A/C --if you have A/C.
> 
> You also need to factor in exected life and expected maintenance costs. Heat pump systems are a lot more complex and a lot more expensive to maintain than a traditional water heater and the replacement costs are also a lot higher.


My home heating and colling cost should be about equal so the added cost heating my house should be offset by the reduced cooling cost.

I estimate my electricity cost will be about $16/month for a standard electric model or $8/month with the hybrid heat pump for a savings of about $100/yr. As I have said in a previous post I will be switching out my 16 yr old gas water heater. This will allow me to turn off my gas service for 9-10 months per year without any reconnect charges. This will save me additional about $175/yr.

I can't find where the GE Hybrid has any additional required maintenance. I realize some added risk.

I go to Lowe's once a week and can't see where they are selling many of these. With the full $480 federal tax credit, $250 state tax credit, and $400 (visa cards for cash for appliances in my state that have ran out). These should pay for themselves for many families in a year or less. With the tax credits ending at the end of the year it will be interesting to see if they become deeply discounted clearance items.


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