# Masking and Blue tape ripping off paint



## LeviDIY (Apr 16, 2009)

I've been reading this forum for long enough that I know >90% of paint issues come from the end user in terms of surface prep, improper application methods and misuse of tools.

I'm assuming I had one or probably multiple errors in the above categories, as I am no where near a pro, but want to know WHICH ONE . I'll start out by saying that I've touched up the problem areas painstakingly with a brush, but I want to learn for the future.... :thumbsup:

I'm wondering, what caused my problem/did I miss something/where did I go wrong:

Redoing kitchen, hung new sheetrock on walls, kept existing ceiling. 

Paper taped joint at top of wall and edge of ceiling with 3 coats of mud (imbedded, then 2 more coats). 

Sealed/Primed 1 coat with Zinsser 123. Waiting 1 day.

Used Behr (I know I know, I had leftover from another project BEFORE I read these forums..) Ceiling Paint 2 coats, waiting about 12 hours between coats.

Taped Ceiling edge with 2 inch masking tape (not the blue kind, regular). 

Did walls with SW Harmony *(separate side comment: first time using non-HD paint... I will NEVER go back... everything I've read on here about coverage, application, etc is all true, no comparison),* 2 coats, waiting 1 day between.

*PROBLEM: when I removed masking tape, it ripped off about 30% of the Behr ceiling paint with it, leaving ugly patches.*

So, I figured I had a couple issues to correct: 1) It was Behr. 2) I used masking tape, not blue "painters" tape.

Knowing I'd want to touch up the ceiling and put another coat on (I figured Behr needed a 3rd), I bought the blue tape and taped off the SW Harmony-covered walls.

Removed tape almost immediately after touching up ceiling... and... it took with it maybe 20-30% of the SW paint underneath it too (I say 20-30% because maybe _slightly_ less than the ceiling).

Suffice it to say, to touch up the top of the wall, I got on my step ladder and with a new brush verrrrrrry carefully touched up the walls.

This problem didn't happen when I taped off the soffit/ceiling (no new drywall/joint compound there, but I did prime the soffit with Zinsser), and it didn't happen on other areas of fresh drywall/primed with Zinsser.

SO... why did this happen on the joints? I love Zinsser 123, is that the problem? Doesn't seem so because other areas didn't have it... was it a problem with my drywall finish not being smooth/flat? The tape underneath the compound and primer it somehow messing with it?

Again, I fixed it using another method... but this has me stumped and would like to know for the future (besides, I'm considering crown moulding anyway now :whistling2. If you need more detail on what I did in steps, etc, ask away...


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## ratherbefishin' (Jun 16, 2007)

You probably didn't let the paint cure long enough before taping it. It can take days or weeks, depending on climate, before you can safely tape it. The primer cures much faster than any paint, that's why it didn't pull off as well.

In the end, it pays to take the time to learn to freehand it. Sometimes, on uneven areas or in corners, a flat art brush comes in handy.:thumbsup:


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## LeviDIY (Apr 16, 2009)

I was kinda thinking that... and you're probably right. The only thing is that in some areas with the same paint it was peeling, and the only difference was underneath the areas it peeled was joint tape/compound UNDER the primer... could that affect paint drying time?


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## NAV (Jun 2, 2009)

here is a tip for next time.....DONT USE TAPE

if you figure the time spent fixing the problems you had you could have taken your time to cut a strait line in half the time it took you to fix it.

and the last guy was probably right, the paint takes up to 30 days to cure.


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## Toe (Nov 26, 2008)

Can you explain the comment about HD paint? Forum software doesn't let me search on two-letter words, and I'm not clear on what you are saying (nor have I read these forums extensively, obviously).

Thanks.


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## LeviDIY (Apr 16, 2009)

Toe said:


> Can you explain the comment about HD paint?


A certain big box home store, you might call a depot :wink:


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## Brandon19 (Aug 19, 2009)

I painted my basement wood paneling with Zinsser 123 then a coat of Benjamin Moore latex. The next day I put on blue painters tape. Took it off two days later and it didn't take any paint with it. 

What I learned on this forum was to use the correct tape. Check out this picture.









The one on the left with the orange centre is actually made for taping walls after just one day of dry time. I used it and it worked very well.

Maybe give that a try next time.


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## LeviDIY (Apr 16, 2009)

Brandon - for some reason I can't view the picture (probably on my end, not yours) - can you describe the product? Thanks!


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## Brandon19 (Aug 19, 2009)

Try this link:
http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/Scotch-BlueBrand/Scotch-Blue/Products/One/

*Scotch-Blue™ Painter’s Tape for Delicate Surfaces – 2080*

Designed specifically for delicate surfaces such as freshly painted walls, Scotch-Blue™ Painter’s Tape for Delicate Surfaces (with the orange core) is ideal for achieving super-sharp paint lines on smooth surfaces. It is also great for decorative painting projects like striping, faux-finishing, and painting on accent walls.


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## Toe (Nov 26, 2008)

LeviDIY said:


> A certain big box home store, you might call a depot :wink:


Ah, gotchya. Didn't even occur to me, because I always just ignore their paint section. Guess I just innately knew not to touch their paint.


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## ksunder (Oct 13, 2009)

FYI I found a great price on blue masking tape at Pac Tape site


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

ksunder said:


> FYI I found a great price on blue masking tape at Pac Tape site


 
??:huh:


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## ratherbefishin' (Jun 16, 2007)

Hey, chris, I searched it and came up with an outfit thats hustles damaged freight and factory rejects by the case (and no brand name on the blue tape)....think I'll pass:whistling2:


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## BMDealer (Dec 9, 2008)

Levi did you wipe down the walls with a damp rag? What may have happened could have been residue mud dust that likes to stay in corners. If you look at the back side of the paint chip is it white and looks like confectionary sugar? 

I think you know the rest of your problems here...tape, Behr........

Good luck on the fix:thumbsup:


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

ratherbefishin' said:


> Hey, chris, I searched it and came up with an outfit thats hustles damaged freight and factory rejects by the case (and no brand name on the blue tape)....think I'll pass:whistling2:


 
thanks


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## n0c7 (May 15, 2008)

I've learned from experience that your issue is tape. NAV nailed it. Only use tape as a safeguard incase you miss. Too many people, including myself always start out thinking that you can just slop paint into a corner and remove the tape even if its wet. This does not work and will leave you with a nasty looking edge from all the paint that bleeds through, dries behind(if you leave it long enough), or what gets ripped off the wall from the tape adhesive. It takes alot of practice to get good at cutting in to edges, but you'll get better results and actually save time and money.


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## Toe (Nov 26, 2008)

n0c7 said:


> It takes alot of practice to get good at cutting in to edges, but you'll get better results and actually save time and money.


Totally agree, but you don't have to be 100% perfect. Even seasoned pros get paint in weird places sometimes; even if everything is taped... it is a liquid after all.

When I started on a painting crew, the first thing they told me was to always carry a putty knife. Shortly after that, they told me to always carry a moistened rag when cutting (not a bad idea when rolling either).

If you slop a little paint where it shouldn't be, especially on wood, just wrap the moist rag tightly around the putty knife blade and gently (but with pressure) scrape off the stray paint. The rag picks it all up perfectly.

The only trick is to do it _instantly_, or the paint starts to bond. That's why you need to have the rag on hand before you even start.

Oh, and of course make sure to use a new part of the rag for every cleanup.


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## n0c7 (May 15, 2008)

Good tips, thanks Toe.


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## LeviDIY (Apr 16, 2009)

All VERY helpful, thanks! I gotta get good at using that cut in technique!


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

Toe said:


> Totally agree, but you don't have to be 100% perfect. Even seasoned pros get paint in weird places sometimes; even if everything is taped... it is a liquid after all.
> 
> So true:yes:
> 
> ...


 
Also good points:thumbsup:


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## Toe (Nov 26, 2008)

LeviDIY said:


> All VERY helpful, thanks! I gotta get good at using that cut in technique!


Another tip for cutting... use a big brush. We used thick 6" brushes on the crew I worked on.

I thought they were crazy at first, but eventually I got it. With a small brush, you carry less paint, so you have to do more strokes, which increases the chances of your going off the line. Not just more vertical strokes, but you also end up doing more strokes for every vertical inch, since you want to build out a little from where the roller will get. Again increasing the chance you'll stray from the desired area.

And the fact that the 6" holds more paint is just plain useful all around.

The only time my crew ever used smaller brushes for interior paint was in spots where it was physically impossible to fit a 6" brush.


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