# Basement Toilet Venting Question



## scottgibson (Oct 6, 2009)

Hi, I am looking to add a toilet in the basment. I am near a 4" Vent stack. The diagram shows it best, does what I propose look ok? Or do I need a vent dedicated for the toilet.

Thanks,

Scott


----------



## Plumber101 (Feb 25, 2009)

What is the distance from the toilet flange to the stack?


----------



## scottgibson (Oct 6, 2009)

Its a 24" run from the flange to the stack


----------



## Plumber101 (Feb 25, 2009)

Shouldn't be a problem but I still would put a relief vent in


----------



## scottgibson (Oct 6, 2009)

Is a relief vent the same as a cheater vent?


----------



## Plumber101 (Feb 25, 2009)

I don't know what a cheater vent is

You really don't need a vent for a toilet being 24" away from the stack


----------



## plumber Jim (Mar 30, 2008)

I would guess what he means by a cheater vent is an AAV.


----------



## Plumber101 (Feb 25, 2009)

plumber Jim said:


> I would guess what he means by a cheater vent is an AAV.


 
That's what I was thinking as well....

A DIY vent


----------



## scottgibson (Oct 6, 2009)

Yes, I was referring to an AAV (I just couldn't remember the proper name at the time). 

Thanks for all the advice, definitely helped determine the feasibility of my project, now its time to cut up some concrete.

Scott


----------



## Boston Plumber (Apr 12, 2008)

Hi Guys:

I am unclear here...? What code allows a toilet to be installed at the base of a *WASTE* stack without an individual vent? My code and any others that I know of do not allow this.

Finally, how is a relief vent different than an individual vent in this case?

Thank you!!

Boston


----------



## Plumber101 (Feb 25, 2009)

Thanks for the imput Boston if can quote the code section for me


----------



## md2lgyk (Jan 6, 2009)

Boston Plumber said:


> Hi Guys:
> 
> I am unclear here...? What code allows a toilet to be installed at the base of a *WASTE* stack without an individual vent? My code and any others that I know of do not allow this.
> 
> ...


The applicable code where I live (West Virginia) is IRC 2003. It does not require individual vents for any toilet, no matter how far from the stack.


----------



## Boston Plumber (Apr 12, 2008)

Thank you MD2LGYK...I was unaware that such a code existed. It seems to me that the toilet would siphon/bubble/let gasses escape when the toilet/tub/sink from upstairs rushed by the unvented toilet at the base...ya know??

Plumber101...my question was very specific and asked YOU or Plumberjim to let me know what code allows a toilet to be installed at the base of a *WASTE* stack without an individual vent? Md2lgyk came up with a code, but I'm betting it is a code specific to West Virginia, and is not common practice in most states. Now I am just wondering if you know of another code. I'm quite sure that the UPC, the IPC, and the USPC will not allow such things... However, I don't know all codes (obviously...huh?).

Finally, I also asked how a relief vent is different from an individual vent in this case.

Being someone that answers alot of questions here (817) I figured you could answer my questions without much trouble. However, you answered by asking me to quote my code to you. Clearly, if my codes don't allow it I can't quote a code to you. 

So, can you tell me what code allows this in your area. 

Thank you for your time...

Boston


----------



## Termite (Apr 13, 2008)

Boston Plumber said:


> Thank you MD2LGYK...I was unaware that such a code existed. It seems to me that the toilet would siphon/bubble/let gasses escape when the toilet/tub/sink from upstairs rushed by the unvented toilet at the base...ya know??
> 
> Plumber101...my question was very specific and asked YOU or Plumberjim to let me know what code allows a toilet to be installed at the base of a *WASTE* stack without an individual vent? Md2lgyk came up with a code, but I'm betting it is a code specific to West Virginia, and is not common practice in most states. Now I am just wondering if you know of another code. I'm quite sure that the UPC, the IPC, and the USPC will not allow such things... However, I don't know all codes (obviously...huh?).
> 
> ...


 
Boston,

Don't be offended when someone asks you to cite code. Sometimes we have to qualify the statements we make, especially when you mention what your code does and doesn't allow. 

The IRC code being referenced is the International Residential Code. It is an ICC model code and its plumbing sections are derived from the IPC (international plumbing code)...*Verbatim*. The IBC/IRC/IPC is the model code in pretty much every state in the country these days. There are still of course some UPC and CABO holdouts however. 

I don't have an IPC here at the house but I'd call your attention to IRC section P3108.4, _vertical wet vent_. Your IPC will have a similarly titled section. I'd also suggest looking at section P3106,_ individual vent_, which gives the option (not requirement) to individually vent each fixture. Section P3107, _common vent_, also makes allowances for not individually venting a fixture.

In the IRC and IPC it isn't safe to say that water closets don't require vents. There are many cases that the fixture drain itself doesn't have to be directly vented though, but the fixture must generally discharge into vented plumbing. In this case the water closet would discharge into the line downstream of the vent for the sink. An AAV could serve to vent that bath group if permitted by the municipality. A 3" water closet trap can be 12' from a vent at 1/8" per foot slope.

It bears mentioning since we're talking basements here....
Has backflow been considered on this project? If you basement fixtures are situated below the upstream sanitary sewer manhole at the street the basement bath group will need to be protected from backflow by the installation of a backflow preventer BEFORE THE CONNECTION TO THE STACK DRAINING THE UPSTAIRS FIXTURES (presuming they're above the upstream manhole).


----------



## laz001 (Feb 18, 2010)

*Distance of toilet to stack. Waste stack vent*

IPC:


*906.1 Distance of trap from vent. 
*Each fixture trap shall have a protecting vent located so that thc slope and the developed length in the fixture drain from the trap wcir to the vent fitting are within the requirements set forth in Table 906.1.
​*Exception: *​
​
*The developed length of **the fixturc drain from*

*the trap weir to thc vcnt fitting for self-siphoning fixtures.*
*such **as, water closets, shall not be limited.*​
910.1 *Waste stack vent permitted*. ​​​​​​​​​A waste stackshall be considered a vent for all of the fixtures discharging to the _stack_​_
_where installed in accordance with the requirements of this section​
910.2 *Stack installation.* ​​​​​​​​​The waste _stack _shall be vertical, and
both horizontal and vertical offsets shall be prohibited between
the lowest _fixture drain _connection and the highest _fixture drain_​_
_connection. Every​​​​​​_fixture drain _shall connect separately to the
waste _stack. _The _stack _shall not receive the discharge of water​
closets or urinals.

Everything above the toilet is waste. After the toilet is soil.


----------



## canadaclub (Oct 19, 2006)

*Interesting thread...*

I have never heard of an "AAV" for a toilet. How does it work and where would it be located? The only alternate vents I have installed were for kitchen sinks...you know those under the counter jobs.

Thanks guys.


----------



## Alan (Apr 12, 2006)

Just for the record UPC would not allow that.

That would be considered a wet-vent, and no wet vent shall receive discharge from another floor.


----------



## Alan (Apr 12, 2006)

canadaclub said:


> I have never heard of an "AAV" for a toilet. How does it work and where would it be located? The only alternate vents I have installed were for kitchen sinks...you know those under the counter jobs.
> 
> Thanks guys.


I would never use one on a toilet for a couple of reasons. You'd either have to have it exposed, or in the wall. Leaving it under the floor is kinda silly, since you SHOULD be running it above the flood rim. If it gets stuck open and sewer backs up, its going to come out of there before the toilet overflows.

If it's exposed, it's going to be ugly. If it's in the wall, there's a chance that a spider is going to crawl into there and get it stuck open. Then you have sewer gas escaping into your wall, and that = demo. to fix it.


----------

