# Sealing gaps between new door trim & drywall



## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

Last week I got a new deck door installed.

The carpenter advised me to keep my old storm door for it would protect the deck door from the elements. Also, since my door is not standard size, if I wanted a new storm door, it, like the deck door, would be custom ordered (meaning more money). He took my storm door to a store and got new screens and glass for it. So I can use the screens in the summer and the glass in the winter. He also got new hardware for it (knob and closer). I think I will be painting my screen door white. 

Anyway, I now need advice on how I should seal the narrow gaps between the drywall and inside door trim (this was not part of the carpenter’s contract). I figured I could do it myself. Before the carpenter put in the door, he put in quite a bit of door insulation from a tube. He also put in a lot of flashing under the new door threshold.

I was planning on using joint compound between the door trim and drywall. But before I do this, should I stuff the gaps with regular insulation, the type you get at Home Depot or Lowes that comes in a roll? Or should I use something else? Or is this not the way to go?

I’ll really appreciate any feedback.

Below are some photos to give you an idea of what I’m trying to do.


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## Sir MixAlot (Apr 4, 2008)

Can you get a picture of the entire area and door from the inside of the home?


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

It was very tricky getting a photo of the inside because my two kitchen windows are temporarily blocked because I've moved stuff around to paint the baseboards. So all the photos I kept taking were coming out dark.

This was the best I could do.


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## Sir MixAlot (Apr 4, 2008)

You could stuff some backer rod in the gap. 

Have you put a level on that to see if it was installed square? 
Something is odd how the door is sitting recessed back from the drywall...


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

Use low expanding foam to fill the gaps.
Why did he butcher the sheetrock on the walls and ceiling like that?
Why was sheetrock not wood used on the sides of the door?


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

Yes, he definitely used a level. It's just the way the house sits. It's a very old building (built in the 1920s).

The old door trim was also partially behind the drywall.

Below are photos of the old door.

By the way, what do you mean by backer rods? I'm very interested (thanks).







Sir MixAlot said:


> You could stuff some backer rod in the gap.
> 
> Have you put a level on that to see if it was installed square?
> Something is odd how the door is sitting recessed back from the drywall...


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

I don't understand. The old door's trim was also partially covered by sheetrock. Are you suggesting that in addition to the wood trim he put up he should also have put up additional wood?

By the way, I didn't know that there was such a thing as low expanding foam. The only stuff I know is this:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/GREAT-ST...Door-Insulating-Foam-Sealant-248312/100068117



joecaption said:


> Use low expanding foam to fill the gaps.
> Why did he butcher the sheetrock on the walls and ceiling like that?
> Why was sheetrock not wood used on the sides of the door?


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

Sir MixAlot,

Is this what you mean by backer rod:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Crack-St...Hm8wz1rJzVQ1YS8N94HXSxoC-6Pw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

If so, would this be better than the foam stuff that expands?



Sir MixAlot said:


> You could stuff some backer rod in the gap.
> 
> Have you put a level on that to see if it was installed square?
> Something is odd how the door is sitting recessed back from the drywall...


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

stripedbass said:


> By the way, what do you mean by backer rods?


Technically, if you're doing a search for it, it's called backer rod, not backer rods. You would say "put some backer rod in there", like you would say "put some caulk in there", not "put some caulks in there".

Anyway, it is also sold as "caulk saver", such as at Home Depot.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Frost-King-E-O-3-8-in-x-20-ft-Caulk-Saver-C21H/100067266

The gap is borderline too big for caulk to work well, so you fill the gap with, well, a filler


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

Thanks. Is backer rod better than the foam stuff that expands?



jeffnc said:


> Technically, if you're doing a search for it, it's called backer rod, not backer rods. You would say "put some backer rod in there", like you would say "put some caulk in there", not "put some caulks in there".
> 
> Anyway, it is also sold as "caulk saver", such as at Home Depot.
> http://www.homedepot.com/p/Frost-King-E-O-3-8-in-x-20-ft-Caulk-Saver-C21H/100067266
> ...


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

By the way, the real problem is the way the door trim is installed next to the drywall. I was going to say the door guy did it wrong. But it looks like he didn't touch the drywall, he just worked around it? What should have been done is new drywall put in along the sides of the door, and the trim installed over the drywall, not next to it. That's why you're having this problem.


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

stripedbass said:


> Thanks. Is backer rod better than the foam stuff that expands?


Yes. That stuff work well in this case because it will expand past flush with the drywall. Then you'd have to cut it back with a utility knife. Then caulk wouldn't look good.

What you're supposed to do is install the door, foam between the door jamb and stud frame, trim that back after it expands, then trim over that gap and over the drywall. Then very minimal caulk is used between the trim and drywall. Caulk is good at filling 1/32" gaps like that.

But now you're trying to fill a large gap, and also make it look smooth and consistent. That gets very difficult with 1/4" gaps and larger. The backer rod will help, but it will still require some fooling around to get the caulk nice and smooth on top of it.


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## Sir MixAlot (Apr 4, 2008)

stripedbass said:


> Sir MixAlot,
> 
> Is this what you mean by backer rod:
> 
> ...


It's similar. But this is what I meant http://www.homedepot.com/p/MD-Building-Products-1-2-in-x-20-ft-Caulk-Backer-Rod-71480/202066515

The foam in a can would work too. But it can be tricky around doors and windows. If it expands a little to much, it could prevent the door from opening and closing properly. That's why I recommended the backer rod instead.
Just looking out for my DIY peeps! :thumbup:


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

Thanks. I just got back from Home Depot and picked up the caulk backer rod you suggested.

Now let me make things even more complicated than they have to be. While at Home Depot I also picked up this:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Owens-Co...MERCH=REC-_-nosearch2_rr-_-NA-_-100320315-_-N

What would you prefer: pink insulation or the caulk backer rod? Is there any difference?



Sir MixAlot said:


> It's similar. But this is what I meant http://www.homedepot.com/p/MD-Building-Products-1-2-in-x-20-ft-Caulk-Backer-Rod-71480/202066515
> 
> The foam in a can would work too. But it can be tricky around doors and windows. If it expands a little to much, it could prevent the door from opening and closing properly. That's why I recommended the backer rod instead.
> Just looking out for my DIY peeps! :thumbup:


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

Insulation is for insulating. Backer rod is for caulking over. Use the one that does what you want.


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## Sir MixAlot (Apr 4, 2008)

stripedbass said:


> Thanks. I just got back from Home Depot and picked up the caulk backer rod you suggested.
> 
> Now let me make things even more complicated than they have to be. While at Home Depot I also picked up this:
> 
> ...


Two different purposes. The backer rod lets you caulk that big gap. You could stuff some insulation in there first and then the backer rod.


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

I'm confused. 

I thought that since this is a deck door I should want to have as much insulation as I can get.

Also, the discussion got away from joint compound which is what I intended to use once I sealed the gaps which is ok (if this is a better method). So, if you don't mind, can I ask whether it's better to caulk the gaps as opposed to using joint compound?

I really appreciate the feedback and please bear with me as I ask what must seem to be very stupid questions.



jeffnc said:


> Insulation is for insulating. Backer rod is for caulking over. Use the one that does what you want.


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

Personally I'd think about trimming over those gaps with some sort of shoe moulding. Quick, easy and it would clean things right up.


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

Kwikfishron,

I have never heard of shoe molding so I quickly googled it. Very interesting!

It comes in different sizes. Maybe this is what I need. I need to do some more research and also try to visualize how it would look next to my door. I'm really grateful for your suggestion. In fact, there's a store near me that specializes in moldings (http://www.andersonmcquaid.com/). I'll definitely head to this store tomorrow to see whether they have a show molding that can work for my needs. 

This is why I love asking for tips. One never knows what will come back.

I'm very thankful to EVERYONE who has responded to my thread.



kwikfishron said:


> Personally I'd think about trimming over those gaps with some sort of shoe moulding. Quick, easy and it would clean things right up.


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

stripedbass said:


> I'm confused.
> 
> I thought that since this is a deck door I should want to have as much insulation as I can get.
> 
> Also, the discussion got away from joint compound which is what I intended to use once I sealed the gaps which is ok (if this is a better method). So, if you don't mind, can I ask whether it's better to caulk the gaps as opposed to using joint compound?


OK, so I'll repeat  Insulation is for insulating, backer rod is for caulking, joint compound is for drywall joints.

You probably should have some insulation in there. This works for insulating. However expanding foam will overspill the gap and get in the way of your finished caulk look.

You probably should have backer rod in there next. This works for caulking. Caulk after insulating, not instead of.

Joint compound will not work well here. It will look like it does at first, but a few months later you will have cracks all over. Caulk is flexible so it won't crack (assuming you don't use too much - that's the reason for the backer rod.)

Since the door is already installed and the drywall is not behind the trim, then I like the idea of quarter round (aka shoe molding). This will conceal the gap better. Then use caulk around the much tinier cracks along the shoe molding/door and shoe/molding/wall interface.

http://inmyownstyle.com/images/2014/08/What-is-the-best-caulk-to-use-for-molding.jpg


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

Very stupid question. If I go the shoe molding route, will I attach the molding by nails? If so, they will have to be very thin and long. Do the nails have to go all the way through till they enter any wood behind the drywall or can they simply remain within the drywall? I've never attached molding which is why I ask.



jeffnc said:


> OK, so I'll repeat  Insulation is for insulating, backer rod is for caulking, joint compound is for drywall joints.
> 
> You probably should have some insulation in there. This works for insulating. However expanding foam will overspill the gap and get in the way of your finished caulk look.
> 
> ...


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## Gymschu (Dec 12, 2010)

You will need to nail the shoe mould into actual wood, not the drywall. There should be plenty of framing around that door in which to nail your moulding to. It would be very easy if you had a compressor and a nail gun. Trying to hammer in finish nails in such a tight area can be highly frustrating. If you don't have a compressor and a nail gun, perhaps a neighbor or relative does and will let you use it.


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

Damn! The carpenter who installed the door used a compressor. But he's now gone and busy with other clients.



Gymschu said:


> You will need to nail the shoe mould into actual wood, not the drywall. There should be plenty of framing around that door in which to nail your moulding to. It would be very easy if you had a compressor and a nail gun. Trying to hammer in finish nails in such a tight area can be highly frustrating. If you don't have a compressor and a nail gun, perhaps a neighbor or relative does and will let you use it.


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

stripedbass said:


> I'll definitely head to this store tomorrow to see whether they have a show molding that can work for my needs.


They should have samples of diffrent profiles that you can take home with you. You could then stick a few to the wall and stare at them for a day or so to see what you like.


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

I will definitely head to the store tomorrow. I've been to this store and they are very helpful. Thanks.



kwikfishron said:


> They should have samples of diffrent profiles that you can take home with you. You could then stick a few to the wall and stare at them for a day or so to see what you like.


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

It's also an option to "glue" the shoe molding. This is what's done when you need to install it next to something that can't be nailed, such as a tub, or tiling. The adhesive is actually like caulk.

However if you go this route, you'll probably tear off drywall if you take it off in the future.

You could use adhesive and simply glue the shoe molding to the door trim, and not to the drywall. You don't need a whole lot. No one is going to be putting any force on it. Then just caulk the edges as usual.


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

By the way, the shoe moldings that I saw when I googled have a rounded profile on one side. But this was after a quick search. There are probably all kinds of shapes. I'll check them out at the store tomorrow.


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

stripedbass said:


> By the way, the shoe moldings that I saw when I googled have a rounded profile on one side. But this was after a quick search. There are probably all kinds of shapes. I'll check them out at the store tomorrow.


Measure the gap you're wanting to cover and maybe even take a picture with you showing what you're wanting to do. Those two things should help them in helping you.


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

Thanks. Will definitely take a photo of my door with me. And the measurement of the gap width. Good suggestion.



kwikfishron said:


> Measure the gap you're wanting to cover and maybe even take a picture with you showing what you're wanting to do. Those two things should help them in helping you.


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## mae-ling (Dec 9, 2011)

When you go look at the mouldings do not get stuck on shoe moulding - another profile may fit and catch your eye.


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

mae-ling said:


> When you go look at the mouldings do not get stuck on shoe moulding - another profile may fit and catch your eye.


Right.


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

I went to Anderson & McQuaid today (the molding store).

After explaining my need to a kind and helpful salesperson and showing him photos, we chose a molding sample to take home and try out. I like the sample. It's in sapele wood but if I choose it, I'll get the molding in poplar. My only question is why the salesperson feels that the molding will need to be cut at the base at a 90 degree angle. I will need to go back to the store tomorrow to clarify this. To give you an idea of what I'm talking about, look at this other molding that already has a similar cut:



This is the molding that I plan to get (if it works):



I finally got a better photo of my door:


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## stripedbass (May 2, 2014)

Went back to the molding store yesterday. The nice young man simply misunderstood me or my photos. He thought the wall to the right of the door led to a hallway when it actuality its perpendicular to the door.

Anyway, we were able to select a better molding and smaller molding. Also, he should me the right way to lay the molding. The largest flat part goes against the door frame (not the wall). See the photos below. And by the way, the corners of the molding will be mitred (I learned this from the store).


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