# Insulating Aluminum Window Frames



## waynerlee

I have dual pane aluminum windows. The frames are very cold in the winter when I'm near them, and condensation builds up from time to time, especially in the bathroom, despite the use of the power ventaltion. Is there anything I can do other than sealing the draft with silicone that can minumize the conductivity of heat? I was courious if there is any durable paint barrier or veneer products out there that can coat or cover the aluminum that will reduce the heat loss and avoid the condensation.


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## joewho

I don't think there is a painting product that will help solve the problem.

As far as veneer, wood is always a better insulator than aluminum, however, not sure a veneer is viable for this situation.


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## waynerlee

I also have a case of Great Stuff expandable foam. I noticed the aluminum window frames have hollow chambers and cavities, and I wonder if they would better if filled with the expandable foam to deaden noise vibration and to minimize draft.

Please comment if you have any insight on this process.


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## handy man88

The aluminum frames themselves are not structurally designed to withstand the pressure caused by expanding foam. Plus, it would void the warranty on your windows. 

Your best bet is to buy some shrink film for the windows during the winter. More expensive windows already have existing hard foam to prevent heat loss.

http://www.frostking.com/windowweather.php


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## AtlanticWBConst.

waynerlee said:


> I also have a case of Great Stuff expandable foam. I noticed the aluminum window frames have hollow chambers and cavities, and I wonder if they would better if filled with the expandable foam to deaden noise vibration and to minimize draft.
> 
> Please comment if you have any insight on this process.


Yes, this can work, However, make sure that it is not the rigid expanding foam. As stated, it will cause warpage in the flexible vinyl window frame and void warranties. 

Use the foam that is soft-rated. It won't expand and warp frames. We have used it, I can't recall the name brand or what exactly the label says....But it's out there being sold.....


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## handy man88

From what I've seen, one of the biggest issues with windows today is the cheap weatherstripping used, which is typically the flimsy furry tape.


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## rjordan392

I had a simular problem with a basement glass block window. The cold glass caused the air to drop down causing a draft.
What I did to solve this was to build a wood frame out of 1 x 3's. I would rout out the four pieces of the frame first, about 5/8 inch from the edge with a router bit sized to accomodate spline material. Then I would assemble the frame using four 1/2 inch wide corner angle brackets. Then attach my clear plastic sheeting with spline material. After this was done, then I attached a strip of adhesive foam, about 3/8 inch wide to the perimeter of the frame. Then this was attached to the window frame using screws.
In the Spring, its removed and put away untill the next season.

Now in your case, you may need to build a frame that will be permently attached to the inside area of the window, so that your new assembly can be attached to it and removed when needed.

If you have a router and tablesaw with some hand tools, you can build these yourself and save plenty or hireing a handyman to make them.

I did the same thing in my bathroom which has a skylite and I had to build a separate frame around the perimiter of the ceiling area surrounding the skylite. Then I built the new window as described above to fit it.


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## RickT

Is replacing the windows an option?


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## Amber

Yes replacing the windows is an option. A replacement window will go over your existing frame.


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## AtlanticWBConst.

Actually, replacement windows go 'into' your existing window frames.


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## sasocek

Hi 

I had the same problem with aluminum frames with almost all windows in my condo. I found a
quick fix. For the window glass you can use the shrink film (works very well), but bigest problems are the aluminum frames (they are "sweating") when the weather is very cold.
You can use foam tape (self adhesive) to insulate the aluminum frames. They can in different sizes and thickness. Easy to apply. I bought mine in Home Depot http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/...Ntx=mode+matchall&recN=0&N=0&Ntk=P_PartNumber

it's called Closed-Cell Foam Tape Self Adhesive Weatherstripping
from TAGO Canada


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## Stephen S.

What sasocek said. Insulate using foam tape on the Al frame. Since you have double pane so you don't really need the film for your windows.


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## Wesrick

When I tried installing similar foam tape, the aluminum sliding glass door, and the sliding window, wouldn't close. It seems if I were to use something like this, it would require a pretty thin strip of this.

Does anyone know of any possibilities of a thin foam strip available?

Additionally, my windows seem to leak from all around - I'm guessing from the fur strip being old. What else can I do? Maybe caulk around the edges of the stationary windows? What should I do on the sliding window?

I've been looking around for fur stripped to try to seal the part where the window and door slides, but I'm pretty unsuccessful in my Google searches...


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## Giles

I have aluminum windows in my 20 year old home. When I first moved in we were using unvented gas fireplace and the moisture was unreal. I run the celing fans and set the central heat on constant fan, it was basically the same.
Later I found out that my wife was not using the range vent while cooking because she didn't in the home we moved from.
We figured this home was much tighter then our older home so she started using the range vent.
Ninety percent of the moisture stopped in our 3,400 sq.ft. home.


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## handy man88

Giles said:


> I have aluminum windows in my 20 year old home. When I first moved in we were using unvented gas fireplace and the moisture was unreal. I run the celing fans and set the central heat on constant fan, it was basically the same.
> Later I found out that my wife was not using the range vent while cooking because she didn't in the home we moved from.
> We figured this home was much tighter then our older home so she started using the range vent.
> Ninety percent of the moisture stopped in our 3,400 sq.ft. home.


The gas fireplace probably wouldn't be the reason for the moisture as it pulls moisture from the atmosphere, unlike propane.


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## Wesrick

In case anyone was wondering, I did find out what to search for when looking to replace the "fur strip" - it's called "pile weatherstrip" or "pile weatherstripping". I can't find it at Home Depot, Lowes, or most hardware places - however, there happens to be a local Ace Hardware that carries it in many sizes. How convenient!

So, if anyone ever needs to know here's a record of what to look for.

Wesrick


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## Pigoff

*Windows and Duckwork*

I had an energy audit preformed on my house and found out that I am losing over 75% of my energy through the windows and the duckwork. I am trying to figure out how to insulate the old metal windows (house was built in the early 60's).

I am also working on the duckwork (boy did I get taken by my home inspectors as they never went under the house, dryer vented into the wall, not under the house, master shower not hooked up and emptying under the house etc.). One duct is not attached to the bathroom vent. It is hanging down about 9-12 inches below it. I am going to Lowes to see what I need to reattach it. I have some insulation missing from one duct that I am going to fix too!

I haven't been on the other side of my house to see that ductwork as I have to crawl under the ducts to get over there so am going to do that this weekend.

My brothers are helping me. they are both on disability so they can't help me money wise so I have to get this done the least expensive (we all do in this economy) possible. My brothers, my 7 year old granddaughter and myself are going to be working on this for a while I guess. I'll let you know what the other side of the house looks like after this weekend. I only have Sunday off so that is where I will be on sunday. I am going to use that insulating foam on some daylight cracks that I saw last weekend under the house.

We bought the string of grey play dough looking stuff for the window but it won't stick to the metal my brother said so we are using caulk around the window. What do you use on the sash where it goes up and where it meets the window seal is my main question I guess. It has some old felt on it but I didn't think that was very effective.

Any suggestions on the windows. I can't afford to hire anybody and I have been taken by the best so now if I do have to hire anybody I cry for days cause I know I am going to get taken again. Ha!


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## joecaption

Without a picture of what your windows look like it's anyone guess what to do.
Most often all you need for the ducts is a roll of foil tape (not duct tape) and some hex head short screws. There both sold in the ventalation area in Lowes or HD.


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## Tom Struble

AtlanticWBConst. said:


> Yes, this can work, However, make sure that it is not the rigid expanding foam. As stated, it will cause warpage in the flexible vinyl window frame and void warranties.
> 
> Use the foam that is soft-rated. It won't expand and warp frames. We have used it, I can't recall the name brand or what exactly the label says....But it's out there being sold.....



without a thermal break i don't think insulating the inside of the extrusion will do much good


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## Windows on Wash

Pigoff said:


> I had an energy audit preformed on my house and found out that I am losing over 75% of my energy through the windows and the duckwork. I am trying to figure out how to insulate the old metal windows (house was built in the early 60's).
> 
> I am also working on the duckwork (boy did I get taken by my home inspectors as they never went under the house, dryer vented into the wall, not under the house, master shower not hooked up and emptying under the house etc.). One duct is not attached to the bathroom vent. It is hanging down about 9-12 inches below it. I am going to Lowes to see what I need to reattach it. I have some insulation missing from one duct that I am going to fix too!
> 
> I haven't been on the other side of my house to see that ductwork as I have to crawl under the ducts to get over there so am going to do that this weekend.
> 
> My brothers are helping me. they are both on disability so they can't help me money wise so I have to get this done the least expensive (we all do in this economy) possible. My brothers, my 7 year old granddaughter and myself are going to be working on this for a while I guess. I'll let you know what the other side of the house looks like after this weekend. I only have Sunday off so that is where I will be on sunday. I am going to use that insulating foam on some daylight cracks that I saw last weekend under the house.
> 
> We bought the string of grey play dough looking stuff for the window but it won't stick to the metal my brother said so we are using caulk around the window. What do you use on the sash where it goes up and where it meets the window seal is my main question I guess. It has some old felt on it but I didn't think that was very effective.
> 
> Any suggestions on the windows. I can't afford to hire anybody and I have been taken by the best so now if I do have to hire anybody I cry for days cause I know I am going to get taken again. Ha!


75% through windows and duct work? That is awfully high.

They didn't know any air leakage to the attic via top plates, penetrations, lights, etc?


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## Pigoff

Windows on Wash said:


> 75% through windows and duct work? That is awfully high.
> 
> They didn't know any air leakage to the attic via top plates, penetrations, lights, etc?


Okay. Went under the house. Everything looks good. All the duct work is insulated. I repaired one that was torn with the help of Lowes. Ha!

The master bath floor vent wasn't attached to the floor. It was just hanging down and we got that fitted and nailed back in the vent hole in the floor.

The report says I need to insulate the attic fan and attic door too!

Going to Lowes to get stuff to do that too!


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## Pigoff

Half the house I already insulated the light switches and plug-ins so have to do the rooms that I haven't painted next. That is an easy fix.


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## Pigoff

Tom Struble said:


> without a thermal break i don't think insulating the inside of the extrusion will do much good


Not sure if this is what you are talking about but a we are going to get some wood and plastic and make an inside window cover (think picture frame with plastic) and line it with felt to see if that will keep heat in this winter. I can't afford to buy new windows right now.

The windows in the livingroom don't open so not sure how to do those other than caulk them really well. No indention to put the frames in those windows.


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## Windows on Wash

Pigoff said:


> Okay. Went under the house. Everything looks good. All the duct work is insulated. I repaired one that was torn with the help of Lowes. Ha!
> 
> The master bath floor vent wasn't attached to the floor. It was just hanging down and we got that fitted and nailed back in the vent hole in the floor.
> 
> The report says I need to insulate the attic fan and attic door too!
> 
> Going to Lowes to get stuff to do that too!


Insulate attic fan?

Do you mean install? Even still, attic fans are not preferred when passive options are available.


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## Pigoff

joecaption said:


> Without a picture of what your windows look like it's anyone guess what to do.
> Most often all you need for the ducts is a roll of foil tape (not duct tape) and some hex head short screws. There both sold in the ventalation area in Lowes or HD.


I got a roll of duct insulation for $20 and some foil tape and repaired the tear. Still got some left in case I find another tear but everything looks good under there so I guess the energy loss is from the windows, attic door and attic fan. I feel better after crawling around down under the house. Didn't find any scary things like Holmes on Homes talks about. Whew!


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## Pigoff

Windows on Wash said:


> Insulate attic fan?
> 
> Do you mean install? Even still, attic fans are not preferred when passive options are available.


Insulate. Heat or air is escaping I was told and the infraray pictures he took show it to I guess.


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