# Need a programmable thermostat. LUX or Honeywell.



## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

_*You get what you pay for*_. The Honeywell and White Rodgers products are the ONLY thermostats I use. I have replaced many many of the Lux, Hunter, Noma etc etc and have never had problems with Honeywell or White Rodgers.


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## speedster1 (May 13, 2009)

yuri said:


> _*You get what you pay for*_. The Honeywell and White Rodgers products are the ONLY thermostats I use. I have replaced many many of the Lux, Hunter, Noma etc etc and have never had problems with Honeywell or White Rodgers.


I certainly have no problem paying extra for it if it really is a better product. I'm not familier with White Rodgers products. Where can I buy them? Are they homeowner friendly or do I need a qualified HVAC guy to install one. 

All things considered equal, what thermostat would you recommend to someone in my situation? I need a 7 day model thats reliable and easy to use. I don't need the most high tech and obvisouly I'm concerned about price. But not at the expense of buying a bad product.


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## mrairflow (Oct 25, 2009)

i like the honeywell focus pro 8000 it is very easy to program


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

copy and paste

http://customer.honeywell.com/Honeywell/UI/Pages/Catalog/ComponentCategory.aspx?Catalog=Homes&Category=Digital+Programmable_2034&ChannelID={2EB2F178-20ED-44E0-97FB-CCFB4218DD64}

Any of the Focus Pros are good. The higher end touch screens are nice but not the easiest to see in dim lighting. White Rodgers are usually sold by contractors. Don't want to deal with HDepot I guess. They are homeowner friendly as long as you 1) shut off the power first 2) label the wires B4 removing them from the old tstat 3) follow the instructions carefully LOL:thumbup:


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## speedster1 (May 13, 2009)

mrairflow said:


> i like the honeywell focus pro 8000 it is very easy to program


Are you referring to the Vision Pro 8000? The only Focus Pros I see are 6000 series.

I found this site that has good info on higher end thermostats.

http://www.prothermostats.com/searc...n=&vacation_hold=&temp_limit=&keypad_lockout=

The Vision Pro 8000 has a 5 star rating. The Pro1IAQ T905 is another one with good ratings.


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## hennyh (Nov 14, 2006)

I would not go "cheap" with a thermostat. It's one of the lowest cost components of an HVAC system and you don't want the "brains" of a system failing. Honeywell is all I'll ever use.

Besides that, the latest thermostats can save their own cost in energy savings.

I just bought a Honeywell Prestige with the remote O.D. Sensor.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

Good point. Spend $5-6,000 on a furnace and slap a $50 thermostat on. Makes no sense.:laughing:


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## Home Air Direct (Jan 6, 2009)

yuri said:


> Good point. Spend $5-6,000 on a furnace and slap a $50 thermostat on. Makes no sense.:laughing:


To me is speaks to the problematic issues that plague the industry. Just like the new construction market will slap the cheapest crap into a $500,000 home, it is more the norm for the replacement contractor to say, "just give me a cheap basic stat to go along with that 18 SEER, $4000 heat pump system. The homeowner won't know the difference


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

The new homebuilder/owner is only concerned with granite countertops/fancy lighting and plumbing fixtures. :yes:The "green" box in the basement that throws heat is not a glamor item. :no: Lots of installers couldn't program an IAQ stat to save their life so they ignore them. I work in $500,000 and up homes and ductwork is never balanced, furnaces "setup" is straight from the box. Asked one builder about why they don't commission/setup anything. His answer: they have a one year warranty and will call if they notice anything wrong. Too bad, great underused technology in those units.:wink:


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## speedster1 (May 13, 2009)

I was all set to order the Vision Pro 8000 until I noticed it doesn't have a swing function. I'm trying to learn what all this stuff means but from what I read it's a feature I'd like to have control of. Any other recommendations for thermostats that will allow me to adjust swing.

Also, what are your thoughts on having an independent fan control that will allow the forced air system to just run the fan in order to help clean the air in the house? Is this a good worthwhile feature that is commonly used?


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

What brand and model # of furnace do you have?


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## mrairflow (Oct 25, 2009)

speedster1 said:


> Are you referring to the Vision Pro 8000? The only Focus Pros I see are 6000 series.
> 
> I found this site that has good info on higher end thermostats.
> 
> ...


i was thinking vision pro and typed focus pro


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## speedster1 (May 13, 2009)

yuri said:


> What brand and model # of furnace do you have?


I'm not sure of the model number. I haven't closed on the house yet so I don't have possession. I know it's a Temp Star that I think is 12 years old. The AC Unit is an 11 year old Heil 2 Ton unit.

I guess it's single stage heating and single stage cooling. but I'm not HVAC expert.

EDIT: I just pulled up the inspection report and the Furnace was installed in 1991 and is a TempStar model NUGG100DF03. Can anyone tell me more about this furnace? Not familiar with Tempstar products. Did a google search for that model number and it came back with links to Heil products. Is this furnace a rebadged Heil? Are these decent quality furnaces? Can anyone tell me the effiency rating?


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## APJ (Nov 10, 2009)

speedster1 said:


> Just bought a home that has a basic digital thermostat. The heat is forced air gas and the AC is a Heil 2 ton model. It's an older house and in addition to addressing the insulation I want to buy a 7 day programmable thermostat.
> 
> I've read a lot and it appears that both Honeywell and Lux make exactly what I'm looking for. I've looked at all the features and aside from the touch screens they all seem really similar. Are the Honeywell units worth the added cost? The LUX units are nearly 40% cheaper than the Honeywell. If you read reviews fo the units at Amazon.com all of the LUX units rate 4.5-5.0 stars out of 5 while the honeywell units rate 4-4.5 out of 5. Not that Amazon means anything but it was interesting none the less. I guess what I'm asking is, are the LUX units quality? I'd prefer to save every penny I can and as long as it works well and is fairly user friendly I don't care what brand it is.
> 
> ...


I have a Honeywell ,heat and air, never had a problem with it . Owned it for about 3 years . I just changed the battery's in it about a month ago,they lasted 3 years ,,,wow.... It was a bout $60 for the unit. It does everything I need it too except pay the gas bill .lol..


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

When that Lux stat's buttons stop working a couple years down the road. You'll wish you got the Honeywell.

As far as swing. Are you looking for a thermostat that keeps you comfortable. Or one that lets you have chills between heat calls.


All upper Honeywell stats (Vision pro) have fan circ ability that you asked about.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

beenthere said:


> When that Lux stat's buttons stop working a couple years down the road. You'll wish you got the Honeywell.
> 
> .


Thats the trouble with the online shopping comparisons. They don't survey all the unhappy people who threw or had to throw away their el cheapo thermostats.
LOL:laughing:


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

speedster1 said:


> Also, what are your thoughts on having an independent fan control that will allow the forced air system to just run the fan in order to help clean the air in the house? Is this a good worthwhile feature that is commonly used?


If you have a newer furnace with an energy saving ECM motor (you don't) you may be able to afford to run the fan continuosly. If not it costs at least a $1 a day to do so ($365 a yr) or more.


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## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

I have a Lux 9000 that I have had for around 12 years - no problems
Heat only, no AC, no Touch screen

My mom, MIL, wife's grandmother do not want a fancy thermostat
On, Off - dial set point = that's all they want


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Scuba_Dave said:


> I have a Lux 9000 that I have had for around 12 years - no problems
> Heat only, no AC, no Touch screen


Statistics say, at least one out of every 10,000 made has to last more then 10 years.

ROFL :laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing: :whistling2:


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

Theres always the exception to the rule.:thumbsup: Saw a 40 yr old gas valve the other day, works fine. 28 yr old Lennox G8E with original parts, works fine. Not something you can count on though. :wink: Now if I could just figure out which auto manufacturer I want to buy from.:huh: If I could just find someone who could plot charts and statistics I won't go wrong.:no:


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

yuri said:


> Theres always the exception to the rule.:thumbsup: Saw a 40 yr old gas valve the other day, works fine. 28 yr old Lennox G8E with original parts, works fine. Not something you can count on though. :wink: Now if I could just figure out which auto manufacturer I want to buy from.:huh: If I could just find someone who could plot charts and statistics I won't go wrong.:no:


Can't imagine where to find someone like that. 

Just heard, Toyota has a 3.8 million car recall.


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## APJ (Nov 10, 2009)

*heating*

Getting back to heating, My furnace is 36 years old , forced air , gas . My neighbor had a new one installed , cost him over $3000 for everything . His gas bills are still higher than mine. We both have good insulation and windows plus the square footage is the same. But thats not the kicker , his furnace has broke down twice since the install . It has needed parts two differnt times . Like they say they don't make them like they used too ... In the past twenty years I've lived here I have replaced the motor once ! I get it cleaned every other year !:thumbup:


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## Home Air Direct (Jan 6, 2009)

APJ said:


> Getting back to heating, My furnace is 36 years old , forced air , gas . My neighbor had a new one installed , cost him over $3000 for everything . His gas bills are still higher than mine. We both have good insulation and windows plus the square footage is the same. But thats not the kicker , his furnace has broke down twice since the install . It has needed parts two differnt times . Like they say they don't make them like they used too ... In the past twenty years I've lived here I have replaced the motor once ! I get it cleaned every other year !:thumbup:


Your neighbor's issues are probably not the fault of the furnace (regardless of brand). The installation is as important as the product.

As far as the compared fuel bill is concerned, sounds like your neighbor's furnace could be oversized. Also keep in mind that lifestyles and temp tolerance can be big factors in the comparison.

Your statement about "they don't make them like they used too" is flawed. Basically, you are correct. They do not make them like they used too. They used to be 60% efficient. They are now 95%. Because of that difference alone, they used to last 30 years. They now last 14 years. That is not all related to "how they build them". It is more a matter of physics. In order to attain a 95% burn efficiency, the unit has to operate at a much higher fire rate. Heat is a killer of all things mechanical. We also need our furnaces to be much smarter then they used to be, henceforth, more technology and more things to break. Again, i don't see this as a problem, just a shift in the how we need to view comparison.


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## Home Air Direct (Jan 6, 2009)

I want to respectfully disagree that some brands are "Junk" and others reign supreme. Sometimes the perception of quality is clouded by personal comfort. That is not a bad thing, just a thing. As to honeywell being superior to Lux, that may be a true statement, but keep in mind that apples to apples comparisons may not be taking place.

My point. When Been or Yuri speaks to the Honeywell, they are talking about the product that they purchase and install. So they are comfortable with the history that they have had. That is a good thing. But, you need to understand that there are two different lines of stats on the market with the same brand name. Honeywell, Braeburn, Lux, White-Rodgers all have parallel product lines that are marketed into two different arenas. There are contractor/pro grades that are marketed through distribution to the pros, and the homeowner line that is usually marketed through home centers and box stores. In most cases, these are not identical products. Lux is good example. I sat with Gary Bosma (National Sales Manager for Lux) and we discussed this very issue. He showed me the quality and warranty differences between the two lines. The LUX line is in the box stores. The LUX PRO line is usually not. Different product, different quality.

Do your research. Take the recommendations of the pros to heart and make your decision based on that along with a personal comfort level about who will be there to back up your choice if something should go wrong. Good luck.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

The Honeywell and White Rodgers pro grade have 5 yr warranties so are built well. Not sure about the consumer grade.


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## Home Air Direct (Jan 6, 2009)

yuri said:


> The Honeywell and White Rodgers pro grade have 5 yr warranties so are built well. Not sure about the consumer grade.


You are correct. They are built better than the consumer grade. Why they would ever do that is beyond me, as I would think that would erode the brand, but they are smarter then me, so what who am I to say?

The warranty thing is a game. All the stat manufacturers play follow the leader, and added quality is probably not at the top of the list when it comes to "how long" a warranty should be. In and around the year 2000, most stat warranties were in the 3-5 year range. Around 2003, almost all the manufacturers went to 1-2 year. Now we are seeing 5 year warranties. This is a combination of marketing and actuarial science.

And then to add to that, you have the division of contractors. Half love the 5 year warranty, and the other half hate it because it cuts into their service income. There are always more than one way of looking at something. Half empty? Half Full?


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

Home Air Direct said:


> Your neighbor's issues are probably not the fault of the furnace (regardless of brand). The installation is as important as the product.
> 
> As far as the compared fuel bill is concerned, sounds like your neighbor's furnace could be oversized. Also keep in mind that lifestyles and temp tolerance can be big factors in the comparison.
> 
> Your statement about "they don't make them like they used too" is flawed. Basically, you are correct. They do not make them like they used too. They used to be 60% efficient. They are now 95%. Because of that difference alone, they used to last 30 years. They now last 14 years. That is not all related to "how they build them". It is more a matter of physics. In order to attain a 95% burn efficiency, the unit has to operate at a much higher fire rate. Heat is a killer of all things mechanical. We also need our furnaces to be much smarter then they used to be, henceforth, more technology and more things to break. Again, i don't see this as a problem, just a shift in the how we need to view comparison.



You know your stuff man. :thumbsup: At 15 yrs old most people do a cost of replacement vs repairs scenario. Most of my customers don't want to spend $1000 on repairs for a furnace that may last 5 more years. In a harsh climate like mine a 15 yr old unit may have 18 yrs of actual running hours. Reliability, comfort of a 2-3 stage unit. Better filtration capabilities with an ECM motor and high grade filter are what sells a lot of high end G71s in my area. Plus my good looks.:thumbuplaughing:


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## Home Air Direct (Jan 6, 2009)

yuri said:


> Plus my good looks.:thumbuplaughing:


Of course :wink:


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

APJ said:


> Getting back to heating, My furnace is 36 years old , forced air , gas . My neighbor had a new one installed , cost him over $3000 for everything . His gas bills are still higher than mine. We both have good insulation and windows plus the square footage is the same. But thats not the kicker , his furnace has broke down twice since the install . It has needed parts two differnt times . Like they say they don't make them like they used too ... In the past twenty years I've lived here I have replaced the motor once ! I get it cleaned every other year !:thumbup:


Probably used a contractor that just put in the same size furnace as was there.
Newer units need to move more air per BTU of output.
This can cause lots of trouble when they are installed on old duct systems.

Including part failure and high heating bills.


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## SirCharlie (Dec 5, 2009)

I used to have a Lux TX1500 thermostat until a few days ago. I walked over to it to adjust it, and when my hand got about 3 inches away from it a big spark flew from my hand to the thermostat. The screen on the stat went dead and there was no resetting it. Burial services were completed immediately.
Since I don't know squat about electricity, I called H & C (not the real name) and they came out and told me what I already knew. He said they have two different thermostats they sell, which were White and Rogers programmable and non-programmable. He said that the non-programmable one was $159.95, and I stopped him right there. I told him that I would go buy my own, so I took 5 minutes and went down the street and bought the Honeywell 5+1+1 RTH6400 Programmable for $60. I was very upset just thinking about what they were trying to do to me. Anyway, I handed him my new Honeywell and he installed it in about 5 minutes. I found out that on my system the red wire was the one to be afraid of. Since then my house seems much more comfortable with hardly any temperature change. I am very happy with the Honeywell, and I'll be sure not to touch it again without touching something else first to take the static out of me. The lesson learned is, if your thermostat shocks you and it dies, don't let the repairman shock you with the price of a new one from his truck!


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

So what did he charge to install it./Or what was his total bill. that you paid.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

I wonder how much they charge you at the restaurant if you bring your own pizza for them to cook? :whistling2: We still charge the $95 callout and a flatrate that would be used to change a warranty part and give NO warranty and I would charge for waiting time.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Yeah. Often with the service charge, its still cheaper to have us install our thermostat. And get the 5 year warranty.


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## Marty S. (Oct 31, 2009)

We're time and material. Twenty bucks for the call and $84 an hour with a half hour minimum, one hour minimum for overtime calls at time and a half. Like yuri said no warranty on a homeowner supplied thermostat so if it fails you get to pay labor again or read the directions and install it yourself. Flat rate guys have labor priced into the part instead of seperate parts and labor charges.


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## Home Air Direct (Jan 6, 2009)

Nhecko said:


> I am using TX9100E because it has good features than the other. It offers a programmable keypad lock and temporary temperature override . It is also compatible with more people's homes.



Subtle:no:


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## SirCharlie (Dec 5, 2009)

beenthere said:


> So what did he charge to install it./Or what was his total bill. that you paid.


He ended up just charging me for a $60 service call.
I understand companies need to make a profit, but not 800% on one little item.
Chuck


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

That wasn't an 800% mark up. Let alone profit.

You traded a better warranty for a cheaper programmable thermostat.
Box stores make more money per thermostat then we do. And have a shorter part warranty.

You happy, so enjoy.


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