# Old eljer toilet with flush ball (no flapper) leaks



## cbrc5eric (Mar 15, 2010)

I have an old Eljer toilet in my old house :laughing: there's a date on there stamped in 1967. I bought my house just over 2 years ago but hardly used this toilet. I noticed it was leaking a little from the tank to the tub, so I replaced the flush ball from Home Depot. It doesn't have a flapper. 

The replacement part looks to be the correct size etc of the other one. But to my dismay, it made the leaking even worse. I've played around with the positioning of the flush ball several times but it leaks  It's leaking into the bowl, so every 5 minutes the flush valve will come on. I also made sure it was nice and clean where the water outlet is in the tank.

Any other suggestions? It's only a $2 part and I replaced the fill valve just fine. Should I just give up on it and replace the toilet?


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

Flapper seat corroded would be one of my first guesses, second would be miss aligned of sticking rod that's attached to the flapper.
Go on the Fluid Master web site to see other options avalible that would work better then what you have now.


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## plummen (Jan 10, 2010)

Try sanding the area that it sits against,if all else fails slop some plumbers grease or vaseline around the area it seals against


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## ben's plumbing (Oct 6, 2011)

try a plumbing supply house ask for eljer triple seal ball Iam sure its still available..but may be hard to find...even can try ebay?


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

Fuild Master sells glue on seats is that's what's pitted.


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## cbrc5eric (Mar 15, 2010)

I'll try the suggestions  There's no metal down there on this toilet, it's all ceramic (or porcelain...)


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## Javiles (Dec 12, 2011)

The leak may not be from the seal. See your over tube from the fill valve, that comes with a plastic clip, the over flow tube must be above the water line in the tank. If its below the water line it will siphon the water from the tank and into the bowl through the over flow, thus causing the fill valve to run on and off to replace the water. You think it’s the ball but it’s not. That being said that’s a poor and problematic flush valve on those toilets recommend you replace the toilet.


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## cbrc5eric (Mar 15, 2010)

Javiles said:


> The leak may not be from the seal. See your over tube from the fill valve, that comes with a plastic clip, the over flow tube must be above the water line in the tank. If its below the water line it will siphon the water from the tank and into the bowl through the over flow, thus causing the fill valve to run on and off to replace the water. You think it’s the ball but it’s not. That being said that’s a poor and problematic flush valve on those toilets recommend you replace the toilet.


It's definetely not this- this toilet is so old it doesn't have the over flow valve separate, it's molded into the tank (see above). I just stuffed the fill tube down the hole like you see in the picture of the original post. The water level does not rise above this. I have it set to where it says "water level" molded into the tank. I had used some penetrating oil to loosen the adjuster for the tank ball and the sheen of the oil I could see how it was leaking from the seal at the tank ball. 

I'll give one last ditch effort to save this toilet, if not it's getting replaced. With the tank ball design it takes too much force to flush it :laughing:


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## Javiles (Dec 12, 2011)

You did not understand me the little black hose that comes off the fill valve goes into that cast in over flow aim looking at it in the picture, I run in to this all the time on running toilet calls that hose is below the water level in the tank. Take that little black hose and find a way to hold it in place above that over flow tube the fluid master comes with a clip and if you notice that clip would clip on to a plastic over flow that’s attached to a standard flush valve about a ¼” above the over flow creating an air gap, may not be your whole problem but its part.

http://www.plumbingsupply.com/how-to-replace-fill-valve-fluidmaster-400a.html


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## Javiles (Dec 12, 2011)

Also depending on the new rubber seal you got, if its old new stock or depending on the manufacture the rubber may be stiffer, it may take a couple days before it soften and molds to the seating area


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## Javiles (Dec 12, 2011)

They also make a retro fit kit for that toilet if the problem is the wire and guide assembly. If you still want to hang on to that toilet, I have used these before and they worked well never got a call back on them. About 20 bucks. it attaches to the tank to bowl toilet bolt, the one next to the fill valve. they make 2 one with touch handle and one with trip lever


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## cbrc5eric (Mar 15, 2010)

Javiles said:


> You did not understand me the little black hose that comes off the fill valve goes into that cast in over flow aim looking at it in the picture, I run in to this all the time on running toilet calls that hose is below the water level in the tank. Take that little black hose and find a way to hold it in place above that over flow tube the fluid master comes with a clip and if you notice that clip would clip on to a plastic over flow that’s attached to a standard flush valve about a ¼” above the over flow creating an air gap, may not be your whole problem but its part.
> 
> http://www.plumbingsupply.com/how-to-replace-fill-valve-fluidmaster-400a.html


Yup I did this for the upstairs toilet but the downstairs toilet the molded in overflow tube I can't put the clip onto. I should note the fill valve has been in that configuration for a while, but I will correct it. 



Javiles said:


> Also depending on the new rubber seal you got, if its old new stock or depending on the manufacture the rubber may be stiffer, it may take a couple days before it soften and molds to the seating area





Javiles said:


> They also make a retro fit kit for that toilet if the problem is the wire and guide assembly. If you still want to hang on to that toilet, I have used these before and they worked well never got a call back on them. About 20 bucks. it attaches to the tank to bowl toilet bolt, the one next to the fill valve. they make 2 one with touch handle and one with trip lever


Good advice, thanks.


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## plummen (Jan 10, 2010)

Try the vaseline/plumbers grease trick around the area where it seats


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## sixrealms (May 17, 2012)

plummen said:


> Try the vaseline/plumbers grease trick around the area where it seats


Thanks guys. I just replaced the ball on a '69 Eljer, similar in design, only the ball connects to a perpendicular arm attached to the toilet/tank bolt on the right (is that called a flapper?). The universal replacement ball would not slip into the outlet, rather it sat at an angle. As suggested by Javiles, the new ball felt stiff (old stock). As suggested by Plummen, I applied vaseline to the bulb and the ceramic outlet rim and the ball is plugging fine. You guys are great:thumbup:


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## jcrain12 (Apr 19, 2014)

Hello, What was your final solution for this? I have the same issue driving me crazy. I'm going to try the vaseline tip and I'm going to order that kit. I would imagine to really update it the ceramic base needs some sort of new seat glued to it. I have sanded mine in the past, just a little because I didn't want to compromise the size of the drain. Thanks!


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## sixrealms (May 17, 2012)

jcrain12 said:


> Hello, What was your final solution for this? I have the same issue driving me crazy. I'm going to try the vaseline tip and I'm going to order that kit. I would imagine to really update it the ceramic base needs some sort of new seat glued to it. I have sanded mine in the past, just a little because I didn't want to compromise the size of the drain. Thanks!


As mentioned, the vaseline did work. I cannot remember what happened after a period of time, if the vaseline needed to be reapplied, if the bulb eventually softened, or if I purchased a new bulb, but it is working fine. I didn't need or buy a 'Kit'.


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## Oso954 (Jun 23, 2012)

Why waste money fixing 40+ year old toilets.
The water consumption is costing you money every time you flush.

Depending on your water/sewer rate it can be a couple of hundred a year difference when you compare a 1.28 gpf with a 5 gpf toilet.


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## plummen (Jan 10, 2010)

Oso954 said:


> Why waste money fixing 40+ year old toilets.
> The water consumption is costing you money every time you flush.
> 
> Depending on your water/sewer rate it can be a couple of hundred a year difference when you compare a 1.28 gpf with a 5 gpf toilet.


Water is a lot cheaper here in Nebraska than California.
The biggest advantage of the old toilets is that you can flush things with a larger diameter than a marble,anytime I see somebody walking out of menards with one of those new water saving $75.00 toilet in a box kits I cant help but think they should get a "good" plunger for free with it!:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Oso954 (Jun 23, 2012)

> anytime I see somebody walking out of menards with one of those new water saving $75.00 toilet in a box kits I cant help but think they should get a "good" plunger for free with it


I don't know why so many people get "cheap" when it comes to buying toilets. 

If you buy a good water saver, you can retire the plunger to gathering dust in the garage.


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