# Thermostat - Nest install



## roughneck (Nov 28, 2014)

I'd avoid the nest. IMO, it's more of a fad then a groundbreaking technical accomplishment. Honeywell makes the better product.


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

leave the iaq alone - it can do many things that a crappy nest can't, like slow the fan down to increase dehumidification.

nest is an apple-like produce -> designed to look nice, overpriced, limited in real functionality. maybe if you like apple products u may like the nest, otherwise stay away from it.


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

> have replaced the original Hoenywell humidifier after 3 of them broke, disconnected it from the IAQ HUM, and have recently disconnected the HRV from IAQ VNT


if your house is tight enough to need an hrv, it doesn't need a humidifier.


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## VincentS123 (Sep 23, 2015)

*Still thinking...*

I'll see if I can provide any more info and get any more / specific insights... I'm a bit concerned about the iaq, and would like wi-fi access (which I guess doesn't mean I need to move away from Honeywell)... our house is very dry in the winter... the HRV is the only thing to vent the bathrooms (and it's not easy to put normal vents in washrooms)... The house has a number of windows... so not as tight as it could be (64 points on EnerGuide rating). And it's big enough to require a lot of humidification - at one point when one of the humidifiers broke (at this point, the iaq was running them), and I had unplugged the HRV just in case, it got so bad the panels inside our new cupboards shrank (they're okay now), lips and noses chapped and dry... I think Honeywell humidifiers are not build well (at least for large houses)... but that's another story - and quite happy with the Aprilaire Model 800. 

At this point I have disconnected the HRV from the iaq (was hooked up to VNT), and it only runs when it is turned on from a bathroom on a 20 min timer - I have it hooked up to turn on the furnace fan at the same time (HRV uses common return ducts with furnace)... anyway, the iaq still turns the heat / AC on every now and then, I guess thinking (based on inputs I provided in iaq programming such as number of rooms, etc.) my air quality needs improving... at 64 - the house is leaky enough to have me not worry about it... so rightfully or wrongfully, I'm thinking I want to replace to iaq once and for all - at this point it doesn't necessarily play nice with the non-Honeywell humidifier, so I have the Aprilaire hooked up with its own switch, and similarly, don't want the HRV turning on more than it needs to (putting moisture out, even though the heat stays in... and I'm not going to consider an ERV at this point), so it is hooked up manually (actually it's off unless manually turned from bathroom). I did consider letting the HRV run (at least through the summer) on low, but I hooked the HRV up to run the furnace fan (at it is not smart enough to know furnace fan low or high)... and I didn't want the furnace fan on all the time (but I did want the furnace fan on - supporting the HRV - when I was trying to get the moisture out of the bathrooms)...

So that's it... I can't seem to tweak the smart (maybe too smart for me) iaq well enough, it's disconnected from humidifier and HRV right now, (have seen at least one way to hook the Aprilaire up to the Nest), want wi-fi... (and really like apple products). Not 100% sold on Nest, but like Nest Protect and have a few Dropcams... I'm thinking it's all I need (but don't know how to hook up fan connections for furnace, etc (as per original message)... any thoughts welcome and appreciated.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

Nest is probably a bit better than the vision pro iaq (at least from a consumer point of view) but if you're running vents as well as humidifiers then the nest may not be your best option. It only has one auxiliary input.

The Honeywell Prestige 2 IAQ is one of Honeywell's high end stats which has multiple programmable inputs including a heavily detailed venting program (more so than the vision pro). It also has internet ability (with an additional gateway) and contains "redlink"... a wireless technology which allows you to connect additional wireless temp sensors (both indoor and outdoor)... which nest presently doesn't have.

Because the prestige offers way more options and does a lot more, it's a bit more difficult than the nest to install and set up. Nest is definitely easier to install and more "plugN'play"

https://www.forwardthinking.honeywell.com/products/thermostats/prestigeiaq/prestigeiaq_feature.html


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

How are you running your HRV now?

Best practice would be to put push-button timer controls in the bathrooms that switch on the hrv when showering. They may even make wireless ones if running wires isn't an option.

That, and a humidistat that cycles the hrv on only when the indoor humidity gets too high.

If you're running the hrv full time or even half the time, you're probably over-ventilating the house. Except for when showering, the hrv and humidifier should never be running at the same time - the HRV's dehumidistat would be set 10% or higher than the humidifier's humidity control so they don't "fight" each other. 

With an energuide score of 64, you probably don't need an HRV to provide general ventilation. HRVs originally came out in the late 70s or early 80s for the new generation super tight, energy efficient homes built to meet r-2000 standards. (it's a canadian invention, btw)

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Disconnecting the humidifier and hrv are fine if you're not happy with how it's operating them.

My point was, the iaq is a good stat even just for controlling a two-stage furnace with variable speed blower. For anything to work the way you want it to, it has to be fully configured.

If you insist on something that looks fancy and has wifi, look into the eco-bee 3. It's priced the same as the nest but has a lot of features; also ships with a remote sensor to get a second reading and average them out.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

user_12345a said:


> How are you running your HRV now?
> 
> Best practice would be to put push-button timer controls in the bathrooms that switch on the hrv when showering. They may even make wireless ones if running wires isn't an option.


One of the add on accessories to the Honeywell Prestige 2 iaq happen to be wireless fan booster controls for ventilation systems. If you have multiple bathrooms then you can wirelessly connect more than one.
https://customer.honeywell.com/en-US/pages/product.aspx?cat=HonECC Catalog&pid=HVC20A1000/U#


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## VincentS123 (Sep 23, 2015)

*Feedback*

Thanks guys for the feedback. @Bob Sanders - knew about the 1 aux port, but thought I'd just use if for the humidifier, since the HRV really doesn't seem to be required for air quality... my concern with doing anything with the venting (eg besides leaving HRV off except when showering) is the dryness of the house... I'm still concerned the iaq is venting more than I want based on some internal algorithms. I will take a look at the prestige 2 and see if I can figure that out... if I thought it could play nice with the HRV with a wireless sensor, I'd get it in a minute (I have a strange feeling it won't even mention a Venmar Constructo 2.0 in its manual).
@user 12345a - Venmar seems a bit behind on controls... but wired them in a few years ago (when I bought the house, they weren't using the HRV, even though that was the only vent for the bathrooms?). One of the install guides says to run it all the time at min... I didn't consider that... esp since I decided to get it to turn the furnace fan on... and with you re the HRV and humidifier fighting each other - so HRV is off, except when turned on in bathroom (not the intake ducting is separate). Agree with 64, don't need HRV... my house was built about 25 yrs ago, but I guess the windows are what makes it so un-tight (and the HRV not really required).

I am interested in the point re iaq controlling a 2 stage furnace with variable speed blower... the nest and ecobee have connections for that... is there something they don't support? I chose the nest over ecobee as I had other nest products (and thought it was cool when the fire alarm went off with too hot of a frying pan, it e-mailed me a picture of what's going on outside my front door with the dropcam... okay, I know, toys, and not that useful...). I still don't get the ecobee remote sensors... I'm thinking since i have 5 in my family, (and one furnace) extra sensors don't do much for me.

One of my original, really stupid questions, was, assuming a set-up close to my current one, do I just put all the fan controls into the same connector / tie them together. Right now I have going into the G (fan) in the equipment interface module, 3 wires all stuffed in there - one straight from the furnace, one from the humidifier to turn the fan on when it goes on, one from the HRV to turn it on when the HRV gets switched on from bathroom... I also have multiple wires going into R and C for the humidifier and HRV as required... If I get the nest (or ecobee), do I just tie all these together before feeding the thermostat (since there is no more equip interface module)... it seems low tech / not sure if I have these right. If anyone is curious, I'll try to attach a wiring diagram (not including AC). 

Thanks again!


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

I'm not going to comment on the specifics of your hrv controls, since i'm not familiar with them. 

Ideally you would only want the HRV coming on at regular speed when there's actually a call for ventilation, no continuous low speed. Some may say otherwise, I say keep it simple. 

Check to see if there's a way to set it up so that it runs that way. Hopefully there's a set of high speed 24vac contacts that you can connect to a regular dehumidistat. I do recommend that; could come in handy in the fall. (could also wire in a parallel switch or something to turn it on on special occasions -> having people over and need fresh air, etc.)

You don't need the furnace fan running with the HRV ducted to the bathroom btw; fresh air will find it's way into the living space naturally through the ductwork. You only need that when pulling stale air from the return air as well.

Was the HRV put in when the house was built, or did you put it in?

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I think all of the stats you're considering have a W2 connection. (which may not be connected if your typical residential contractor did it) The nest probably doesn't have a slow down to dehumidify connection, where the board cuts the cooling speed by something like 20% when the humidity exceeds a certain point.

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If you want a cleaner installation, put a 18 gauge wire with many conductors (maybe 10-12) from the interface module to the furnace and make all the humidifier/ventilation connections at the furnace control board. You may need some wire nuts, labelling would be nice so whoever opens the furnace knows what's what.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

You need to check your local codes on ventilation. There are some locals which require a certain cfm and air exchange for a given house size.

The prestige can either be set up to run vents to meet that ASHRE standard or it can be set up to run on a time percentage of your choosing. It's a pretty detailed algorithm which includes that ability to lock out ventilation under certain unfavorable weather conditions.



> *Ventilation Control Methods (ISU 10050)*
> Ventilation can be setup to meet either ASHRAE or Percent On Time settings. To meet these settings, the thermostat will ventilate during calls for heat, cool, and fan. If the required ventilation has not been achieved for ASHRAE or Percent On Time, the thermostat will force the ventilation equipment on.
> •ASHRAE
> The thermostat operates ventilation equipment to meet the ASHRAE 62.2 ventilation standard based on CFM, number of bedrooms, and square footage of the house. ASHRAE
> ...


Other thermostats like Nest, vision pro, ecobee... etc, simply don't have this level of ventilation control to them.

Of course if you're not connecting VENT to the system then it's all moot.

There is one other thing to think about. The vision pro IAQ (if I remember correctly) uses only 3 wires between the stat and the module downstairs so you may only have 3 wires at the thermostat (you will have to check) The nest and ecobee require all connections to be made at the thermostat, which means all control wires need to be run to the thermostat. In other words you may end up having to pull more wires if you go with Nest. The prestige only requirres 2 wires at the thermostat. Everything else connects to the module which is usually located at the furnace.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

VincentS123 said:


> I am interested in the point re iaq controlling a 2 stage furnace with variable speed blower... the nest and ecobee have connections for that... is there something they don't support?
> 
> Thanks again!


They all support multi stage heat. The IAQ however comes with inlet and outlet duct temp sensing ability, which can be used to detect (and send alert) on individual stage malfunctions or problems.


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

Codes are more for design/engineering when a house or building is being put up - when you already have a system, you apply common sense and do what's needed. Codes for ventilation are there to make sure that there's enough for the most extreme conditions.

If you want to get technical and make sure the house has enough ventilation *in theory*, would have to do a blower door test, convert the cfm50 value to natural air changes per hour and see how much ventilation is needed. Even that isn't accurate, because number of people and weather vary.

Most accurate would be a control that monitors humidity and co2 - triggers ventilation when either is above a threshold. Could also do fancy stuff with occupancy sensors.

None of this stuff is really necessary in a simple house that likely gets enough ventilation by itself and through the use of exhaust fans; it's not like you're dealing with a hospital or electronics clean room. Even with a very tight house, all you need is a dehumidistat - humidity is a pretty good gauge of air exchange and occupancy. 

Keep it simple.

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IAQs ventilation features are overkill. I think it's a good product, for it's dual fuel heatpump controls and supporting two stages of backup heat on top of a two-stage heatpump. most people don't need something so fancy though.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

user_12345a said:


> -------------
> IAQs ventilation features are overkill. I think it's a good product, for it's dual fuel heatpump controls and supporting two stages of backup heat on top of a two-stage heatpump. most people don't need something so fancy though.


The Prestige comes with some heavy detail because it is not just for residential applications. It has two modes of operation "residential" and "commercial" (there are some internal programming changes for each of the 2 modes) and the rules are pretty tight for commercial applications.


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## VincentS123 (Sep 23, 2015)

*Honeywell Prestige 2 IAQ*

Re: Honeywell Prestige 2 IAQ 
After some investigation, I'm thinking this could work if not stupid impractical to buy. Does anyone know where to buy this... I'm not a professional, but think I can figure out the install... Ideally would like a Cdn seller, who I could call if necessary... ideally a full service seller / retailer (eg could get the main kit, plus gateway, plus remote temp monitor, plus vent timer... which actually could work I think..)... main web sites (amazon, ebay) not my first preference, and don't want to pay for install (given it's going to cost a ton to get all pieces I'd need)...


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## VincentS123 (Sep 23, 2015)

Not sure if the title of my last message came through... I'm talking about the Honeywell Prestige 2 IAQ


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

Is it just to add wifi?

There are less expensive stats that will do it if you don't need the iaq features.

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Where to buy pro stats:

1. Ebay
2. A local appliance repair place that also does some furnaces/acs will may be more willing to sell parts
3. Some here have used alpine indoor air


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## VincentS123 (Sep 23, 2015)

A few reasons... I'm swayed a bit by a lot of people not giving nest a lot of love... and am thinking that things are a bit un-integrated. The wireless remote timer for the vent might actually come in handy for the one or two areas that I didn't hard wire... and I never thought of controlling them from the iaq, as right now the wired ones go to the HRV... and the HRV controllers are limited (as are the HRV controls, which I think I could do more of from within the iaq). I also don't like the way I had to resort to hooking up the humidifier - totally independently. That might be my bad, but have found difficultly getting experienced installers in town with this range of equipment (my wife still hasn't gotten over when this stuff was installed, seeing the installer out in the truck in our driveway for way too long reading the manual - and that was the premium supplier)... having multiple replacements and repairs (re honeywell humidifers) didn't help much either. I also like the (wireless) outdoor temp hook-up... which might come in handy. So yes, wi-fi, and maybe the dream of actually having an integrated system (as advertised with the old iaq)...


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

VincentS123 said:


> Not sure if the title of my last message came through... I'm talking about the Honeywell Prestige 2 IAQ


It's a nice machine... if you can get over the sticker shock.

I'm in Canada as well and by the time you finish paying the various shipping charges on the stat and accessories, you're talking around $500. I think it's still cheaper going through ebay in the USA though... at least that's where I got mine. Fast, good shipping on all products I ordered.

You will need:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Honeywell-2-Wire-Prestige-IAQ-Kit-model-YTHX9421R5085-/161836177572

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Honeywell-T...-Thermostat-/191508320967?hash=item2c96c912c7

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Honeywell-C...sor-RedLINK-/181706855462?hash=item2a4e929426

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Honeywell-Re...-HVC20A1000-/191477093804?hash=item2c94ec95ac



You may want to go through ebay and look for better prices. I just threw the stuff together so you will know what you need (although the thermostat kit is a bloody good price and the shipping is reasonable.)

Sorry... I just edited. That last one was wrong. I showed you an entry/exit remote instead of a vent timer..... been corrected now.


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

> I also don't like the way I had to resort to hooking up the humidifier - totally independently.


What kept on dying on the humidifier? the solenoid?

You sure it's getting the correct voltage? Not normal to have these things dye.

Normally the humidifier is done from the control board connects through a humidistat. iaq may have separate contacts so you can maintain the interlock with heating. there's no point of running a flow-through without the heat running as well.

Better to control humidifiers and HRVs separately. You can get a wireless sensor and wi-fi with a regular vision pro redlink - would prob set u back $250 us total.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

I don't know if you have heard of KINEK? It's a series of US freight offices close to the Canadian border which you can have all your American goods shipped and then just drive down over the border and pick it all up. You still have to pay taxes (and duty if applicable) but sometimes it's a lot cheaper to go pick it up rather than paying separate shipping charges for each item into Canada.

Of course I'm only an hour away from the US border (Pemibina USA where my Kinek is located) so it pays off for me to do it. I used Kinek a few times and had no issues with them. In fact I shipped a $4000 Goodman heat pump to them earlier this Summer with no issues. (The heat pump was free shipping in the US but not into canada) They even helped me load up!

Just an option to consider....

https://www.kinek.com/


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

user_12345a said:


> Better to control humidifiers and HRVs separately. You can get a wireless sensor and wi-fi with a regular vision pro redlink - would prob set u back $250 us total.


That sometimes isn't true. When it's all integrated to one control center you can control it all as one. That's important so that you don't have devices competing with each other. Vent and humidifier for example. Rarely do you want these things on at the same time... or for what ever reason maybe you do. Either way though it can easily be done if it's all integrated into one control system.

In other words a single controller will let you coordinate all these devices with each other much easier.


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

Will the IAQ strictly dehumidify on demand in the winter based on indoor humidity? Will it know to not attempt to do that in the summer and bring in tons of humidity? (with a dehumidistat on an hrv you simply turn it to off. with the humidifier, simply set it 10% below the hrv setting)

Will it do that and still give the option to dehumidify on demand by slowing the fan down in a/c mode?

If the controls are too complex, the equipment owner won't know how they function and the installer may not know how to set them up to work right and not waste energy. There are lots of bozos in every field and most homeowners are clueless.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

user_12345a said:


> Will the IAQ strictly dehumidify on demand in the winter based on indoor humidity?
> It depends on the equipment installed. If you have a separate dehumidifier then yes. If you are using the central AC to dehumidify then no. When you do your setup the IAQ will ask you what type of dehum system you have and depending on your answer another set of questions will come up, so everything you connect has a slightly different operating mode.
> 
> Will it know to not attempt to do that in the summer and bring in tons of humidity? (with a dehumidistat on an hrv you simply turn it to off. with the humidifier, simply set it 10% below the hrv setting)
> ...


......


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## VincentS123 (Sep 23, 2015)

Thanks guys... your back and forth has surfaced things I wouldn't have even known (thought of)... okay, maybe I'm one of those home owners who need to worry about messing it up. I'll do more research (eg review the programming manual)... I think if I go slow enough, I should be okay (and no rush right now).

As an aside, the Honeywell steam humidifier, based on the size of my house (3 stories, 2,000 sq ft / floor), wasn't suited for the load... which the installer never really mentioned. It is a bad design to some extent as well given the electronics sit right on top of the hot water... which was always hot / making steam... the crap the builds up from the water is also really tricky to get out. The Aprilarie model 800 is a much better design, and also lets you deal with the crap in a very efficient (a bit costly manner)... Also needed to up the voltage supply... if you're interested in a good, big steam humidifier - it is second to none. When researching this, I found a lot of other unhappy customers... some wrote up the issues well on Amazon (search Honeywell steam humidifier...) http://www.amazon.com/Honeywell-HM506H8908-Truesteam-Humidifier-6-Gallon/product-reviews/B001DY3VIU...


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

Steam humidifiers can actually run without the heat, just furnace fan

Using electricity to boil water for humidification in ontario is an expensive proposition though. 

Having a large enough regular flow-through model not keeping up indicates over-ventilation or excessive leakage. The steam is only needed maybe on a heatpump application with cool supply air. If you have the full energuide results back post your air changes per hour or cfm 50 value. 

A newer house should be 3-4 ach, no more.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

VincentS123 said:


> I wouldn't have even known (thought of)... okay, maybe I'm one of those home owners who need to worry about messing it up.


There may be a few minor areas where you could go wrong in the programming but not many. it's not a big deal if you do.... just back out and re do it.

for the most part it's pretty easy to program. i think I have seen a few people go wrong where it asks you whether a programmable dry contact should be normally open or closed... but that's about it.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

user_12345a said:


> Steam humidifiers can actually run without the heat, just furnace fan
> 
> Using electricity to boil water for humidification in ontario is an expensive proposition though.
> 
> ...


A 6000 sq ft house with 8 foot ceilings, and an actual .2 ACH would have 160 CFM of fresh air coming into it. Even an Aprilaire 700(its only rated to do 18 gallons per day) would struggle to keep the humidity up.


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

Referring to properly, reasonably sized houses here, not mcmansions. 

Have to consider internal moisture production which can be substantial.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

user_12345a said:


> Referring to properly, reasonably sized houses here, not mcmansions.
> 
> Have to consider internal moisture production which can be substantial.


The OP said he has 3 floors, and each is 2000 sq ft. So I am talking about his house.

6 people(including showering and cooking) won't make enough moisture to keep the humidity up 24/7 in a home that size.


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

I seem to have missed that. Not sure about the us, but here the basement isn't counted, so i would consider it a 4000 sq ft house. 

I've seen 23gpd humidifiers.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Don't know if he is including his basement as 1 of the levels or not.

A steam humidifier puts more moisture in the air then a flow through does, when the furnace isn't running on a heat call.



PS: A 4000sq ft home at a .2 ACH would be 106 CFM. Hard pressed for a flow through to maintain humidity.


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

...probably also burns through something like 10-20kwh+ per day in the winter.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

user_12345a said:


> ...probably also burns through something like 10-20kwh+ per day in the winter.


More then that on the coldest driest days.


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

A really electrically efficient energy efficient house* with gas house these days uses 20 kwh per day, so a steam humidifier would be a totally unacceptable draw to me. 

*I'm talking one energy efficient fridge, all cfl/led lighting, little or no waste, no use of electric space heaters.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

beenthere said:


> A steam humidifier puts more moisture in the air then a flow through does, when the furnace isn't running on a heat call.
> .


Not sure what you're saying here. Are you saying a flow through only works on a heat call, or are you saying you get better humidity transfer with heat?


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## supers05 (May 23, 2015)

Bob Sanders said:


> Not sure what you're saying here. Are you saying a flow through only works on a heat call, or are you saying you get better humidity transfer with heat?


Probably both. Many humidifiers are only wired through w1 anyways, so they only work on a call for heat. They also work better the warmer the air. (humidity is relative, and will fluctuate with temp and other factors) 

The only steam humidifiers that I've worked on, are either 30kwh or 400,000 - 1mill btu NG fired. Houses around here generally only have some form of flow through, if anything at all. 

Cheers!


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

supers05 said:


> Probably both. Many humidifiers are only wired through w1 anyways, so they only work on a call for heat. They also work better the warmer the air. (humidity is relative, and will fluctuate with temp and other factors)


That's not true... or at least it depends on the thermostat I guess. I have the prestige IAQ and the humidifier works both with heat and/or on it's own. It does not connect to W1. It connects to its own dry contact. In the programming setup you are asked if you want the humidifier to work only with heat or at any time humidity is sensed to be too low.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Bob Sanders said:


> Not sure what you're saying here. Are you saying a flow through only works on a heat call, or are you saying you get better humidity transfer with heat?


You can connect them to run without the heat being on. But, very little moisture is added to the air by a flow through when the heat is not on. Connecting it to the hot water line helps a lot. But it still isn't near its per day rating.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

user_12345a said:


> A really electrically efficient energy efficient house* with gas house these days uses 20 kwh per day, so a steam humidifier would be a totally unacceptable draw to me.
> 
> *I'm talking one energy efficient fridge, all cfl/led lighting, little or no waste, no use of electric space heaters.


And your not talking about the OPs 6000 sq ft house either.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

beenthere said:


> But, very little moisture is added to the air by a flow through when the heat is not on.


Well, you certainly get better humidity transfer rate with heat, but I disagree that you get very little moisture without heat. Ours is connected to run independent of heat and it works quite well. Granted it's the old drum style and not the flow through so that may be the difference.

I remember when we had the old floor standing (stand alone) humidifier. Big drum turning with the bottom end dipping into a bucket. That thing used to humidify the entire second floor of our house, and there was no heat to it.

Sure. Heat is better, but it works fine with none.


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Bob Sanders said:


> Well, you certainly get better humidity transfer rate with heat, but I disagree that you get very little moisture without heat. Ours is connected to run independent of heat and it works quite well. Granted it's the old drum style and not the flow through so that may be the difference.
> 
> Time how long it has to run when the heat is not on. And then how long it runs when the heat is on.
> 
> ...


Works fine on many tight houses, but often not on large tight houses. 

It takes the same amount of heat energy to evaporate 1 pound of 50 degree water. Whether the heat is provided by a running furnace, or just by the heat of room air blowing across/through the water panel. The difference is how much heat is provided per minute.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

beenthere said:


> Time how long it has to run when the heat is not on. And then how long it runs when the heat is on.


I've never really timed it so I couldn't tell you. Obviously though it will run for shorter times with the heat on, but that doesn't mean it can't produce adequate humidity with the heat off. I've heard ours go on and then off again between heat cycles which means it's producing adequate levels of humidity without heat.



> It takes the same amount of heat energy to evaporate 1 pound of 50 degree water. Whether the heat is provided by a running furnace, or just by the heat of room air blowing across/through the water panel. The difference is how much heat is provided per minute.


Well, again the drum may be the difference. It's got a larger surface area than most of the flow through's. Our house isn't 6000 sq feet either


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