# Paint Crown Molding Before or After Installation?



## gmhut

Painting interior and installing new crown molding (walls are one color, ceiling and crown molding another). Is it better to paint the walls, cut molding to measure, paint new crown molding, install crown molding, touch up; or is it better to install the crown molding, paint ceiling and crown molding, tape, paint walls.

I imagine there will be caulking involved at some point that will need to be painted one of the two colors at the edge of the two-tone paint transition?


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## RegeSullivan

Paint the walls and ceiling. Prime and paint the crown before you install it. I always paint before I cut and fit molding. Once you have it up it often only takes a little caulking to finish it up.

Rege


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## gmhut

Every "how too" article I've read strongly suggests using a coping saw for one of the pieces when fitting the corners. This seems like a time consuming pain, although I've never done it, so maybe it's faster and easier than I imagine it to be.

How important is using a coping saw to cut the matching profile of one end of a piece butted to the uncut end of another vs. just cutting each piece at a 45 degree angle with a chop saw?

Do most professionals use the coping method as the articles I've read suggest, or is that not as prevalent as the "how to" articles seem to imply?

Does using the coping method impact the "paint before cutting" method as far as marring the paint around the coped cut?

Is the priming on pre-primed molding from HD enough, or should I prime it myself anyway?


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## Leah Frances

I am just this week learning how to do this sort of stuff. Here's my $.02:

- Prime, but don't paint before installation - you're going to have to paint after you caulk anyway.

- Coping is WAY easier than you think. Get a coping saw and go for it. I found it much easier if I clamped the molding within 6 inches of the end being coped. My first few weren't picture perfect (I chose less visibly conspicuous corners for my novice attempts). By my third or fourth it was fairly quick and easy.

Give it a go!


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## Gary in WA

The seasonal changes really show an open miter, but not so much a coped, because of the area of end grain when they shrink opposed to a thin line on coped.

Check out the homemade tool: http://www.taunton.com/finehomebuil...arpenter/coping-crown-molding-techniques.aspx

And complex: http://books.google.com/books?id=7XUs4lCZhfEC&pg=PA146&dq=crown+moulding Be safe, G


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## vsheetz

Crown, casings, base, and doors are in progress right now on our remodel. Here is what is working out really well for me. Pre-primed MDF moldings, pre-paint with SW waterborne enamel, install, caulk, minimal touch-up needed. The pictures are before touch-up.


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## chrisn

Looks good from here. Personally, I would prime first and do the finish coat(s) after nailing and caulking.


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## TJLoop

*Paint Before you Install*

It's always a good idea to paint your ceiling, walls and crown molding before you install it. This way you don't have to try to paint around the various components. After you paint everything separately and install it you are done.

TJ


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## sirwired

gmhut said:


> Every "how too" article I've read strongly suggests using a coping saw for one of the pieces when fitting the corners. This seems like a time consuming pain, although I've never done it, so maybe it's faster and easier than I imagine it to be.
> 
> How important is using a coping saw to cut the matching profile of one end of a piece butted to the uncut end of another vs. just cutting each piece at a 45 degree angle with a chop saw?
> 
> Do most professionals use the coping method as the articles I've read suggest, or is that not as prevalent as the "how to" articles seem to imply?
> 
> Does using the coping method impact the "paint before cutting" method as far as marring the paint around the coped cut?
> 
> Is the priming on pre-primed molding from HD enough, or should I prime it myself anyway?


Coping helps to disguise the joints better as they expand and contract with the changing seasons. If you perform a simple chop, the gap between the pieces will be twice as large, and probably too big to reliably bridge with caulk.

SirWired


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## Thurman

I'm sure I'm "old school" but I learned under my Grandad and now I'm 60. I have friends who do trim carpentry who are my elders. One thing I have learned is to prime and paint crown and base before even starting the project.I believe it makes things go easier in the long run,just a little touch-up. As far as coping, it's the only way to go for me. Thanks, David


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## Matthewt1970

TJLoop said:


> It's always a good idea to paint your ceiling, walls and crown molding before you install it. This way you don't have to try to paint around the various components. After you paint everything separately and install it you are done.
> 
> TJ


I have never painted a ceiling or wall before I put it in :thumbup:

Generally if you have nice true walls and ceiling then you can paint the trim before putting it up. If you forsee a lot of caulking, prime it first, then paint it after it is up.


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## gmhut

For some reason I just assumed you caulked the edges automatically. Is it the case that you only caulk if the walls are wavy enough to need cosmetic surgery at the with a calk gun?


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## RegeSullivan

I have never been lucky enough to have 4 walls in a room not need to be caulked with painted trim. Even casing which tends to pull tight to the wall can use a little caulk to fill in gaps most of the time. I have installed stained trim that looked pretty good but I ended up taping the trim and filling in with caulk and it looked even better...

Rege


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## Matthewt1970

The thing about caulking is that if you caulk after it has been painted, dirt will penetrate the caulk a lot more than the painted trim so it will discolor. Same goes for smoke if you are a smoker. If you have painted over the caulk it won't do that.


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## cej22

1. Pre-prime and paint your trim (not required, but saves time in the long run)
2. Absolutely cope your joints. Don't even consider not doing it.
3. Spackle and sand nail holes. Prime the spackle if your paint calls for it. Caulk all seams.
4. Paint ceiling
5. Paint an entire coat on your crown (don't skimp by just trying to touch up caulk and spackle)
6. Paint your walls


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## sirwired

Heh. My brother didn't cope, just hacked away with his fancy compound miter saw. Wondered why it didn't turn out right and gave up on the crown. I guess he figured that all those instructions about coping were some kind of ancient runes passed down from the days before miter saws... I informed him there was a reason there was an entire trade called "trim carpenter".

SirWired


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## cej22

sirwired said:


> Heh. My brother didn't cope, just hacked away with his fancy compound miter saw. Wondered why it didn't turn out right and gave up on the crown. I guess he figured that all those instructions about coping were some kind of ancient runes passed down from the days before miter saws... I informed him there was a reason there was an entire trade called "trim carpenter".
> 
> SirWired


Yeah, crown can be extremely aggravating if you don't know what you're doing. It's not the simplest of jobs.
http://www.dewalt.com/us/articles/article.asp?Site=woodworking&ID=2


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## sirwired

If you look at that DeWalt page, you will notice it makes no mention of coping (you sell fewer miter saws if you tell folks they still need to do fine manual work.) With their instructions, it'll look okay if you are _real_ precise at the beginning, but later after the trim changes dimension at all, you'll open up bad-looking gaps. Coping still leaves you with gaps, but they look more "natural".

SirWired


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## cej22

I think their instructions presuppose that you know you have to cope the joints. It just gives you the angles you need for the crown. This is especially helpful if your crown is large enough that you have to cut it with the trim flat on the saw. It's also helpful is your walls aren't square.


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## BigJim

When installing ceiling mold wall to wall, I would cut the mold about 1/8 inch longer than the measured wall was. When coped and 1/8 inch longer, the joint looks like it grew there. You will want to bow the mold out in the middle and fit the mold at the coped end and nail it there. Push the mold in at the bow and it will tighten up nice and tight.


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## gmhut

Thanks for all the great advice!

Another couple of stupid questions:

Is it necessary to use blocking or can you just nail the molding directly to the studs? Without the blocking, does nailing to the wall studs at the bottom of the molding, then to the ceiling studs at the top create any issues from the joists and the studs expanding and contracting separately over time?

Also, I'll be installing crown molding on new kitchen cabinets, the molding will butt against the ceiling, same question for the cabinet molding as above. I have straight 1x2s attached to the top of the cabinets but not 45 degree face on the front side of the blocking, so I'd be nailing the bottom of the molding to the blocking on the top of the cabinets and nailing the top of the molding into the ceiling joists; or, do I need to add additional blocking to the face of the 1x2s to build a 45 degree face on the blocking to follow the back of the crown molding?

I'm guessing I should cope the kitchen cabinet crown molding as well? (I have a corner cabinet with the face of the cabinet at a 45 degree angle to it's adjacent cabinet faces)

-----------------------------

Also, I'm doing all the work by myself (as in one man, one pair of hands). I plan to put a temporary finishing nail at the ends of the wall, hang a loop of string loosely to it, and slip the ends of the crown molding in the loop to be my second pair of hands while working alone—comments about this technique or better ideas are much appreciated.

Any tips for measuring the walls for one person? This may sound stupid, but I'm planning on cutting a long strip of brown paper from a roll (trimmed to a manageable width) to measure with, hoping that because it is light but not super thin, I can tape one end of the paper strip to one end of the wall and pull it relatively tight (assuming brown paper won't stretch) and mark the paper at the other end of the wall. Then use the paper as a template to mark the cut on the molding. I'm considering this because I'm not sure I can find a way to get one end of a tape measure securely attached to the end of the wall I'm not holding, or be attached securely enough to pull the metal measuring tape taught enough to get an accurate measure without detaching it from the wall opposite the one I'm measuring to. Any tips better than what I'm planning with the paper template would be much appreciated (unless you think that will work).


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## cej22

You only need blocking if your joists run parallel to your wall and you don't have anything to nail into at the ceiling.

I've always relied on a tape measure. The Stanley Fat Max has a pretty long standout. 

As for installing, get your length of crown snugly in place and nail it in the center first. It will stay in place while you nail in the rest. 

Crown is a job where I definitely prefer to have a helper, but it isn't impossible to do alone.


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## adeyoe

I am avid about priming and painting before hand myself. I am getting to really enjoy the use of the new adhesives out there that are nailess for such items as Crown molding. (which I am not apt to replace anytime soon). I also like the use of a coping saw, and will often use my disc/belt sender for a smooth fit on edges. this takes some practice to make sure you don't over do it. Once installed, if necessary, I fill any gaps and if nails were used, with a light spackle putty which can be lightly sanded, and then touch up with paint for a smooth blend (also a nice cover for being lazy in my own home when I am tired of messing with "weird angles"..  If those are your pics so far, they look good. I like to work top to bottom. I just have a tendency (per the wife) to get carless in my home carrying things.. I find it a means to buy more tools. ~!


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## charlie C

I have had good luck with crown and base molding. Prime and paint prior to cutting and I always cope inside corners. Suggest you check for 90 degree angles with a square. Mark the bottom edge of where the molding is to fit all around the room and if a good 45 or 90 degree angle it will work fairly good. By all means use a brad nailer and use a helper to hold the molding in place. It is also a good idea to mark where the studs and rafter are to save time when attaching the molding. caulk the corners and brad spots. Maybe touch up with paint on those spots if needed.


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## jordy3738

Prime first and finish paint after the crown is installed.


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## laurie58

is it typical to have a gloss or semi gloss paint on the molding so it off sets from the flat paint on the ceiling?


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## mathmonger

laurie58 said:


> is it typical to have a gloss or semi gloss paint on the molding so it off sets from the flat paint on the ceiling?


I've seen it glossy. I've seen it flat to match the ceiling. Maybe personal preference. Maybe a regional thing. Maybe the flat ones are just cheap/lazy paint jobs. Personally, I think if you are going to have crown molding, you should put some gloss or semi-gloss on there.


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## chrisn

laurie58 said:


> is it typical to have a gloss or semi gloss paint on the molding so it off sets from the flat paint on the ceiling?


Semi gloss is pretty standard


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## laurie58

Thank you both so much. My husband was putting it up with flat finish and it looked unfinished so we will definitely be going with the semigloss.


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