# Trying to figure out layout in roughed in basement bathroom



## vseven (Dec 2, 2009)

I bought a house 3 years ago and one of the selling points was a large unfinished basement with a roughed in bathroom. I'm assuming everything is properly trapped/vented (although once I uncap I'll check). The thing is I can't figure out why there are 4 drains.

There is a toilet already existing (assuming they used it for construction so they didn't have to rent a porto potty). To the "right" of the toilet is a 2" diameter stup about 3 inches off the floor then a few feet from that is a 3.5" diameter drain almost set into the floor. To the "left" of the toilet a few feet away is a 2" diameter 8" stub coming off a 3" drain pipe thats going up to the first floor and also down into the cement. 

Attached is the layout.....am I correct to assume that the drain on the "left" is for a sink, the small drain on the right is for a stand up shower, and the larger drain on the right is for a tub? I'm planning on finishing the basement myself and just stuck on this 4 drain thing...mainly which I should use and how to cover up one I don't use (if I don't use one). Also if I put a utility room to the "left" of the bathroom can I have a utility sink go into the same drain stub, bathroom sink on one side of a wall and utility on the other side? There are currently no walls up so I can put things where ever they make sense.

Thanks in advance for any advice....I've read through plenty of construction books, electrical code books, drywall books, etc but I can't find some of the answers to this plumbing stuff.

-Allan


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## pyper (Jul 1, 2009)

It sounds kind of like a floor drain. Are the hot and cold supply lines stubbed in? Their locations would probably tell you what was intened to go where.

Maybe it's just to make mopping easier -- like in an elementary school -- drains in the floor.

Or maybe a steam shower or sauna or something. It's too far out from the wall to be a tub, and it's too big to be a utility sink.


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## vseven (Dec 2, 2009)

No, no supply water lines were roughed in which is why I'm kinda in the dark with this (the toilet is feed using flexible line run over to the main 15' away...). I thought the same thing with it being too far off the wall and that's why I posted.  Only thing I could figure is it's about 13" off the wall so maybe I would have a choice of toilet locations but why would they go through the extra expense of roughing it in like that. There is a floor drain already about 10 feet away at the furnace/hot water heater where the AC and humidifier drain to (3" dia. in floor with small grate).

Should mention the big floor drain is "flanged" and I'm measuring the outer diameter...the cap is screwed inside of it and I'd say its 3" - 4" (can't remember)


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## pyper (Jul 1, 2009)

Maybe it's for a bidet?


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## vseven (Dec 2, 2009)

doubtful....it's not that nice of a house.  I suppose it could be a tub against the right wall and then you'd cut down and cap the existing 2" line. Otherwise I was thinking a stand up shower in the back right corner and then I could build a little wall for the piping to make it easier.

Could it be a cleanout for the sewers? I think I have a big T in one of the other pipes going floor to ceiling that has like a 3" screw cap so I would think that is the clean out and not this thing on the floor. I guess a better question is do I need to worry about it and am I right about the sink connecting to the stub coming off the one pipe?


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## pyper (Jul 1, 2009)

The one in the upper right appears to be in about the right spot for a 48" shower, with the opening facing the toilet. If that was the plan, then the bigger one in the floor would only be 1 foot from the shower, and it's still too far off the wall for a tub. Unless they were maybe planning on building a large tile shower in the lower right and the upper right was for a utility sink.

If you want to put a tub in the lower one you could build out the right hand wall to have a place to put the supply lines though.

I'm still thinking the lower one was originally intended to be a floor drain.

The one at the left appears to be for a sink. It's at the proper height.


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## vseven (Dec 2, 2009)

Ok....so I'll put the sink on the left and hopefully put a utility sink on the other side of the wall. I'll probably put a linen closet over the bottom right drain since I'm not using it but might need access to it (I can tile around it...with it in a closet it won't look that bad or stand out). Then I'll look at some stand up showers that will line up well on the existing drain. I don't really care for the idea of the shower opening right to the toilet but oh well. There are no walls yet so I guess I can play around.

Is that bottom left drain too big for a toilet? I mean its a foot off the wall (The walls are Reward Wall System so I can route a cold water supply "in" the wall for more clearance). If a toilet were against that wall I think I would have more options for a shower, maybe a larger corner unit. I'm not real sure...I need to look at more bathroom floor plans.

Would a photo of this area help explain the connections better?


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## vseven (Dec 2, 2009)

I went over my measurements and the first picture is a little off so I resubmitted it. Also attached is a photo of the area. I've been going online looking at different tubs and stand up showers....the closest thing I can find that will fit decently would be a corner shower and even then I would have to have it a couple inches off the wall if the drain is in the back corner and it won't work at all if the drain is centered. Plus to use the upper right drain the entry would be right in front of the existing toilet so now I'm wondering if the toilet isn't in the right place but hopefully someone cal tell from the updated layout and attached photo.


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## Ishmael (Apr 24, 2007)

My guess is that the extra 3" pipe could just be a clean-out extension? If I'm reading you correctly, it will be in the utility room where there's already a floor drain. By extending the 3" waste pipe to an accessible location w/clean-out, you could snake that bathroom (if you ever needed to) without pulling the toilet. Just a guess. If you can't track down the original installer to ask him, maybe rent a "see snake" to actually see where it goes and how it's connected.

P.S. - It's always a good idea to make your first fitting on a pipe stubbed out of the ground/slab a clean-out...(just in case).


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## vseven (Dec 2, 2009)

Yeah, I didn't even think of that. There are three main drains that I could count in the house. One on the far other side of the basement (30+' to the left of this photo, the "main" sewer line about 15' to the left long this back wall (which has the same 3" cap so I'm thinking that's a clean out), then another drain about 5' down form this 3" thing in the floor. So yeah I guess this could be a clean out for this set.

The original builder was also the Realtor and she has been a PITA to get information from. Simple things like paint colors or wood types has been easy but anything details like original blueprints or who did what has gotten me nowhere in 3+ years so it may be easier to figure it out on my own. So that 2" stub coming out of the floor in the upper right probably is for a shower/tub? If so isn't it really close to the toilet?


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## tpolk (Nov 7, 2009)

2x4 wall left of toilet, 2x4 wall behind toilet 2x4 or 6 wall across from toilet tub/shower to right of toilet. my guess is some demo required to make this work as toilet looks tight to wall and shower drain iffy. vanity to left of toilet


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## pyper (Jul 1, 2009)

The drain seems to be positioned properly for a 48" Sterling shower stall. Put a sliding glass door in it, and you walk in a straight line past the front of the toilet to enter the shower. Seems like a pretty decent layout to me. :thumbsup:


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## vseven (Dec 2, 2009)

The walls are "Reward Wall System" ICF so I can put the pipes directly into the walls if needed and attach drywall right to it. It's how I figured I'd get away with the small clearance behind the toilet (there is about 1 1/2" right now so 1/2" drywall will leave a 1" gap). I'd probably put in a 2 x 4 or 2 x 6 wall where the showers piping would go if I can fit it and still match up the drain. This way I could run the toilet supply line from the right off that wall and make most of the plumbing easier. I have no desire at all to reposition the drain pipe.

I didn't even think of putting in a tub with doors and having the opening away from the toilet....I couldn't picture it at all so now I'm pretty happy I posted. Thanks for everyone's help, I'll probably end up doing that.

Probably could put in a tub too and build out the corner a bit more to fit it better. I guess the question becomes is it ok to put a tub over the "cleanout"?


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## pyper (Jul 1, 2009)

This is the shower:

http://www.sterlingplumbing.com/bat...l?productNumber=72220100&resultId=297246266-0

It woudln't cover the cleanout. You'd build a wall at the bottom end (opposite wall of the toilet) to contain the plumbing, and then probably a closet over the cleanout like you were thinking.


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## vseven (Dec 2, 2009)

Question: If I went with a actual 5' shower and built up the wall on the top right corner for the supply lines would it be a huge deal to cover the "cleanout"? Now you have me thinking of the shower door idea and if I built out the upper corner a foot or so then put a tub with a left hand drain (so it's at the top in my layout) I could have shower doors and the shower wouldn't be so "close" to the toilet. I could still build a small closet at the far end also. Although I'd lose a lot of bathroom real estate to a empty wall it might be worth it to me to space it from the toilet a bit better. That and with the toilet being so close to the right wall the tub/shower is thinner and will also be spaced a bit more off it.


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## pyper (Jul 1, 2009)

To put in a 5' shower you have to move the drain.

I don't understand. Based on your measurements there seems to be plenty of clearance -- what issue are you seeing?


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## vseven (Dec 2, 2009)

If I put, for example, the shower and surround you listed (72120100
and 72220100) it will tuck in the corner very nicely. Problem is aesthetically I don't think it looks great with half the entrance covered by the toilet. Assuming I can't (don't want) to move the toilet it's going to be a real tight fit as in the first image.

However if I go with a bath/tub (like 71140112) I would have it left handed and build a wall behind the controls for plumbing and to get it away from the toilet as in the second image.

Both are laid out using the existing 2" drain and not moving it but as you can see the tub will cover the "cleanout". Or I'll give up and make it a half bath. :icon_confused:


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## pyper (Jul 1, 2009)

I guess the main differences between the plans comes down to would you rather have a tub or a shower?

From a design standpoint, I don't care for the tub layout because your new wall points at the middle of the toilet. Straight lines draw the eye, and that corner is always going to make you look at the middle of the bowl. With the shower layout, your toilet is in the middle of the space occupied by the shower, and it _probably _won't be as prominent -- you'll see "through" the toilet as you look "at" the shower. Especially if you have attractive doors on the shower and no red, furry, toilet seat covers. :whistling2:


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## vseven (Dec 2, 2009)

Kohler has a decent "virtual designer" program on their site and I mapped both plans out in that so I could "look" at the final product. I understand what you mean with the corner pointing at the center of the toilet but looking at both in the planner....the toilet in front of half the shower just doesn't look right. Plus the wall back there would make it a lot easier to do the plumbing, for me at least, as the supplies are right above their (although I might do PEX from the mains 12' to the left, also along that back wall).

The real solution in my head would be to move the toilet drain to the left a foot and then put in a nice corner shower unit but being realistic I don't see me doing that. 

So if I do go with a tub/shower is there a issue covering up what we're assuming is a cleanout? Also if I unscrew the cap from it and there is water that means its trapped right and not a real cleanout? Although if it has a screw capping it chances are it's a cleanout as a actual drain would be capped I think.


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## vseven (Dec 2, 2009)

I opened up the cleanout to confirm that's what is was and it is. It dropped down a good 2 feet then does a 30* to the "right" wall and then connects into a tub that's going left to right (water flow is). Right is the outside wall so I'm assuming it meets the main. I flushed the toilet and it definitely goes through this cleanout. 

Here's where I'm confused. In the layout picture there is a main stack that is 5 feet "down" from the cleanout and right up against the right wall. If I run water in the bathroom above this future bathroom I hear the water in this main stack BUT it flows left to right inside this cleanout. In other words it's coming down from the first floor to the basement along the right wall then after it enters the slab it goes left and up to met the pipe that I can see from the cleanout. Is that normal? That means I have more then one connection to the sewer system because I have another cleanout about 15' to the left of this area and running the water in other parts of the house DON'T flow through this cleanout. (or they both meet up and then go out...I'm about 90' from the street).

Also does this mean I shouldn't cover the cleanout since it seems that it does both this future bathroom and the bathroom above it? The main stack coming down the wall to the right has another cleanout (a sani-tee?) about a foot off the ground that I'm assuming I could snake out from there instead of this one in the floor. It's obvious that the two are connected and I'm assuming they put that 30* in this cleanout so that if someone were going through the one T'd off the main stack they wouldn't get stuck. That make sense?


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