# LB or elbow



## Plumbvoltage (Dec 2, 2008)

I was wondering what everbody use after you enter the building under the panel to transition up to the panel. I know you use a lb on the outside but what do you use on the inside. I think a short say about 6-8" piece from the outside lb to another inside lb would be best looking. :icon_confused:


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## 300zx (May 24, 2009)

Plumbvoltage said:


> I was wondering what everbody use after you enter the building under the panel to transition up to the panel. I know you use a lb on the outside but what do you use on the inside. I think a short say about 6-8" piece from the outside lb to another inside lb would be best looking. :icon_confused:


LB Looks the best to me. :wink:


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## spark plug (May 5, 2009)

*Defining Terms!*



Plumbvoltage said:


> I was wondering what everbody use after you enter the building under the panel to transition up to the panel. I know you use a lb on the outside but what do you use on the inside. I think a short say about 6-8" piece from the outside lb to another inside lb would be best looking. :icon_confused:


You can really Coin a Phrase or paraphrase the following; Every LB is an Elbow. But not every Elbow is an LB. There is also LR, LL and others. They all stand for something. I think Left-Right (LR); Left-Left (LL); (Or. the First "L" in each case could stand for "Load". Eliminate confusion :yes::no: Through Education! :drinkon't Drink and Drive, Ever!!!


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## nap (Dec 4, 2007)

spark plug said:


> You can really Coin a Phrase or paraphrase the following; Every LB is an Elbow. But not every Elbow is an LB. There is also LR, LL and others. They all stand for something. I think Left-Right (LR); Left-Left (LL); (Or. the First "L" in each case could stand for "Load". Eliminate confusion :yes::no: Through Education! :drinkon't Drink and Drive, Ever!!!


L stands for L as in the general shape of the fitting.

the second letter denotes where the cover is:

LB cover on back
LR cover on right as you hold the fitting like a gun (long part would be barrel)
LL cover on left as you hold it like a gun.

you also have "N" fittings, "T" fittings and "X" fittings.

and technically they are called; condulets

and then there is the Arlington anybody:
http://fl2.shopmania.org/files/imag...body-universal-metal-conduit-body~7424878.jpg


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## spark plug (May 5, 2009)

nap said:


> L stands for L as in the general shape of the fitting.
> 
> the second letter denotes where the cover is:
> 
> ...


You are 100% right. But sometimes a name sticks and (mistakenly) carried over to other, similar products. For example. "Channellock" is really a name of a manufacturer of adjustable pliers. alternatively, they were called "Water Pumps". But on the Condulets, the second letter stands for the shape and use. Lately, one major distributor (who shall remain nameless for logical reasons) is featuring a "Universal" Condulet, which can be converted to any shape, in order to speed up the work at construction sites!(No matter what) Don't Drink and Drive, Ever!!!


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## nap (Dec 4, 2007)

spark plug said:


> You are 100% right. But sometimes a name sticks and (mistakenly) carried over to other, similar products. For example. "Channellock" is really a name of a manufacturer of adjustable pliers. alternatively, they were called "Water Pumps". But on the Condulets, the second letter stands for the shape and use. Lately, one major distributor (who shall remain nameless for logical reasons) is featuring a "Universal" Condulet, which can be converted to any shape, in order to speed up the work at construction sites!(No matter what) Don't Drink and Drive, Ever!!!


check the link. That is the Arlington anybody I linked to.

and yes, condulet is actually a trademarked name owned by Crouse Hinds. My mistake. It would generically be referred to as a conduit body.

the second letter does not stand for the shape and use. The second letter signifies the location of the opening (cover side). . The first letter is the shape of the body. Just as when you look at a "T" (three conduit openings) and a "X" (actually more of a cross with 4 conduit openings). there is a couple that are not quite as self explanatory:

"C" fittings. They are simply connector with an opening and a cover and an "E" or "end" depending on who is calling it out which only has one conduit opening.

on a T body , the cover is generally on the side although I believe I recall one where the cover was on the back (TB?) In my perusing of the web, I saw a body I could only call a TLR. It was a T with openings on both sides.


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## spark plug (May 5, 2009)

nap said:


> check the link. That is the Arlington anybody I linked to.
> 
> and yes, condulet is actually a trademarked name owned by Crouse Hinds. My mistake. It would generically be referred to as a conduit body.
> 
> ...


Yes. But the LB, LR and LL are self explanatory. As far as Condulet being a Trademark (as opposed to a generic name) I remember, one of the first books I read about Electricity, in 1965, was Audel's Book on Practical Electricity. There, they called the Conduit Bodies, "Condulets"!:whistling2:


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## nap (Dec 4, 2007)

spark plug said:


> Yes. But the LB, LR and LL are self explanatory. As far as Condulet being a Trademark (as opposed to a generic name) I remember, one of the first books I read about Electricity, in 1965, was Audel's Book on Practical Electricity. There, they called the Conduit Bodies, "Condulets"!:whistling2:


wow, you learn something new everyday. The wordmark (a trademark consisting of a word) is in fact expired per the USPTO.

http://tarr.uspto.gov/servlet/tarr?regser=serial&entry=71015647


http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/gate.exe?f=doc&state=4003:30qp1l.2.1

It appears CH allowed it to expire (2006) for some reason although in 1965 is was still legally owned by CH. I suspect the use in the manner Audel used it may be an acceptable use such as the trademark fair use doctrine since it was not being used in a commercial use by it's inclusion.

If another manufacturer had called their bodies "condulets", then CH would have had an actionable grievance against them.


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## wirenut1110 (Apr 26, 2008)

If the wall is going to be finished, I sometimes add a female adapter to the LB, then use an angle connector and FMC up to the panel to avoid having an LB inside that has to be accessible. 

Depending on how high it is outside, I'll just come in the back of the panel. I try not to use back to back LB's.


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## nap (Dec 4, 2007)

Female adapter and FMC?

Something sounds a bit incongruous.

Sounds like you might be mixing in some metal conduit with some non-metallic parts. Really need to be cautious about that and be sure the metal is bonded to the grounding system.

but yes, that is a (essentially) reasonable installation. and yes, avoiding the LB's altogether is often preferable. Not knowing what the OP has going for an install, the panel opposite the meter is always a good placement, if possible.


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## HandyPete (Mar 23, 2008)

nap said:


> L stands for L as in the general shape of the fitting.
> 
> the second letter denotes where the cover is:
> 
> ...



Hey Nap! That is exactly the phrase my instructors said forty years ago in trade school (LATTC)..and I can honestly say there are a whole lot of journeyman electricians out there that mix condulets up all the time! (until I say your same little phrase)

__pete:thumbup:


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## Plumbvoltage (Dec 2, 2008)

nap said:


> Not knowing what the OP has going for an install, the panel opposite the meter is always a good placement, if possible.


It will be a detached garage with the pvc conduit coming out of the ground and going into the garage just above the foundation and then up about 3'-4' or so into the bottom of the panel on the inside. I plan to use a LB on the outside but what should I use on the inside?


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## 300zx (May 24, 2009)

Sometimes a pvc 90 will work don't know how much space is there if that wont work use another Pvc LB


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## wirenut1110 (Apr 26, 2008)

Plumbvoltage said:


> It will be a detached garage with the pvc conduit coming out of the ground and going into the garage just above the foundation


That's why I suggested what I did. In your original question, there was no mention of this being service or a meter being involved.

When I run a circuit to a garage, I LB with a short nipple just inside the wall and convert to FMC with an angle connector. There's enough room inside the studs for the angle connector to make the turn and straight up to the panel. If the customer decides to put sheet rock up they can without cutting out for the another LB cover.

I'm not sure how changing from pvc to FMC is incongruous.(had to look that up)


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## nap (Dec 4, 2007)

wirenut1110 said:


> I'm not sure how changing from pvc to FMC is incongruous.(had to look that up)


because FMC is metal and it must be bonded. I was simply reminding whomever installs in this manner to be sure the metal is bonded. 

regardless though, I just happened to notice something you should check out wirenut:

nec 2005 378.42


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## nap (Dec 4, 2007)

Plumbvoltage said:


> It will be a detached garage with the pvc conduit coming out of the ground and going into the garage just above the foundation and then up about 3'-4' or so into the bottom of the panel on the inside. I plan to use a LB on the outside but what should I use on the inside?


based on what I just realized after looking through the code about FMC, a angle fitting is not allowed to be used where it is covered so that limits your install to a 90º bend, if you have the room. (generally not but may be possible depending in the size of the conduit), an LB. I would use the LB.

is this an existing garage or it is a new garage? If new and you have not poured the floor, just bring it up through the floor right under where the panel will be.


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## wirenut1110 (Apr 26, 2008)

nap said:


> regardless though, I just happened to notice something you should check out wirenut: nec 2005 378.42


It's 348.42 Thanks for pointing that out, I've never been called on it but I'll keep it in mind next time.:thumbsup:


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## Plumbvoltage (Dec 2, 2008)

nap said:


> is this an existing garage or it is a new garage? If new and you have not poured the floor, just bring it up through the floor right under where the panel will be.


 It is existing so it will come up on the outside and through the side of the garage.


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## nap (Dec 4, 2007)

wirenut1110 said:


> It's 348.42 Thanks for pointing that out, I've never been called on it but I'll keep it in mind next time.:thumbsup:


I can't type worth a dang. yes, it's 3*4*8.42 and I knew that when I typed it.


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## nap (Dec 4, 2007)

Plumbvoltage said:


> It is existing so it will come up on the outside and through the side of the garage.


then I think you may be relegated to an LB inside unless you are really into drilling and want to drill the floor and run the conduit down through the floor.

I think the double LB's is better than running the conduit high outside and straight into the back of the panel. I prefer to keep the outside stuff low in a situation like this. It it was a service entrance, it would not be as big of a deal, to me at least.

You still can't cover an LB so the angle fitting and flex would work like wirenut suggested. Personally (and it is a personal choice only and in no way intend to speak disparagingly about wirenut's install method) I stay away from flex unless I really need it.


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## zpm (Jan 6, 2009)

A plastic access panel can be used to get to the LB in the wall.

http://www.accesspanel.com/


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