# Love or hate Corvairs - Chevy, that is



## Bondo (Dec 8, 2007)

Ayuh,..... It was a Great car series, Destroyed by numbnuts nader with designed to fail testing,.....

Didn't own 1, but had friends that did,.......
Most memorable, Sid Gates had a '67 Monza coupe with the twin turbo motor, something like 200+ hp,....
Runner up was 1 of my mentors, D L Reed owned a '67 Greenbriar wagon/ bus,....
A really cool little window van with huge room inside,.....
The Grand dad of today's mini-vans,....


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## DoomsDave (Dec 6, 2018)

Bondo said:


> Ayuh,..... It was a Great car series, Destroyed by numbnuts nader with designed to fail testing,.....
> 
> Didn't own 1, but had friends that did,.......
> Most memorable, Sid Gates had a '67 Monza coupe with the twin turbo motor, something like 200+ hp,....
> ...


Whoa, dude, sounds like the lobsters have got to ya

I mean, like WHOA

Running down the street, fully clothed


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## Bondo (Dec 8, 2007)

Lobsta's,..??..??


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## hkstroud (Mar 17, 2011)

Had two, always like them. The concept that they were dangerous because the motor, therefore the weight, was in the rear was BS. As a mechanic once said to me "My tool box weighs more than that motor". Nader tried to make fame and fortune being a naysayer, failed as a politician.


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## mark sr (Jun 13, 2017)

Never owned one but I remember racing down country back roads behind one where it's rear wheels kind of folded inward which made it look like it would be easy to roll. Most of the safety issues were from those not knowing how to work on them doing something wrong.


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## SPS-1 (Oct 21, 2008)

I have never driven a Corvair, but I did have a car (Spitfire) that had a swing axle like the Corvair. It sure did make driving "fun". Putting the engine in the back must have made the handling all that much more "fun".


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## John Smith_inFL (Jun 15, 2018)

I have had 5 in my younger years. only one was involved 
in a minor wreck. (which was caused by uneven road asphalt).
all in all, I liked them until the floors started to rust out like an
old VW. in today's world with speeds and congestion out of control,
there is no way I would drive one today.
as Ralph said - Unsafe at ANY speed.

.

.


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## chandler48 (Jun 5, 2017)

Never owned one, but the swing arm rear axles scared me a little. Using a radially opposed engine was good, sort of like the Volkswagen dating back 30 years prior. The only problem with the radially opposed engine is that it wasn't in a circle as seen on aircraft, so the balance was somewhat different.


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## Tymbo (Jan 18, 2018)

I actually read the Ralph Nader's book"Dangerous at any speed" about the corvair.
It describes the rear axle geometry and why it was dangerous. GM I believe actually changed the design to be similar to the corvette in later models. (the initial design was much simpler/cheaper to manufacture.


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

As stated earlier, I had a few when I was younger.

A Greenbriar van, a little car, Heck I could pick up the front end and move it around, Did I say that I was a healthy young man.

And being 6'3" and 265 , I had a heck of a time getting in the car, but when it ran, did it ever fly. :vs_laugh:

I see one around town once in a while, still. 

My biggest gripe was the shifter mechanism, was long pipes, that ran from the front lever, to the rear transmission, the sockets wore, and shifting got sloppy, and sometimes actually fell down and would disconnect. 

The drive train made a better dune buggy, than the VW ever dreamed of, more power, faster.

But the gas tank in your lap, was a bad idea, if there was a front end collision.

Oh well, memories, ain't they great?:devil3:


ED


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## HenryMac (Sep 12, 2018)

*Story One*
My Grandfather had one and drove it 56 miles a day for 15 years. No issues.

That's a pretty good car by most folks measures.

Only thing he didn't like was the flat floor pan allowed it to slide up onto snow drifts like a toboggan and leave you stranded.

It was sidelined by extreme rust. Which wasn't uncommon at all in the rust belt.​
*Story Two*
When I was in junior High School my friends sister had a Corvair and we car pooled to basketball practice. She went around a curve in the road and we heard a clanging noise. One of the lug nuts snapped off and was rattling around in the hub cap. The bad news.. one was already broken, that meant only 2 of the 4 lugs were still in place... and yes, it was the 2 right beside each other. We limped on into town at about 35 mph.​


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## Oso954 (Jun 23, 2012)

> I actually read the Ralph Nader's book"Dangerous at any speed" about the corvair.


It was actually called "Unsafe at any speed".

The NHTSA conducted a series of comparative tests in 1971 studying the handling of the 1963 Corvair (original suspension)and four contemporary cars, a Ford Falcon, Plymouth Valiant, Volkswagen Beetle, Renault Dauphine—and a second generation Corvair (with revised suspension). The 143-page report reviewed a series of actual handling tests designed to evaluate the handling and stability under extreme conditions; a review of national accident data, and a review of related General Motors/Chevrolet internal letters, memos, tests, reports, etc. regarding the Corvair's handling.

NHTSA went on to contract a three-person advisory panel of independent professional engineers to review the scope and competency of their tests. The panel then issued its own report, which concluded that:

"the 1960-63 Corvair compares favorably with contemporary vehicles used in the tests...the handling and stability performance of the 1960-63 Corvair does not result in an abnormal potential for loss of control or rollover, and it is at least as good as the performance of some contemporary vehicles both foreign and domestic."

A publicity and money seeking lawyer with zero engineering or auto expertise killed a damn good car with a book based on exaggerated or false claims, that the media and public bought into.


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## ktkelly (Apr 7, 2007)

Oso954 said:


> A publicity and money seeking lawyer with zero engineering or auto expertise killed a damn good car with a book based on exaggerated or false claims, that the media and public bought into.



That was all there was to it.


I inherited a 63 from my grandfather, and other than the starter going out, it was a great car.


The only thing I don't like about the Corvair, is the same thing I don't like about the VW bug. A serious lack of heat.


I remember driving home one evening in a 66 VW bug, scraping ice off of the inside of the windshield.




This makes me want to do an upgrade. A watercooled turbo 4 with about 250HP would make for a fun little car....:biggrin2:


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## DoomsDave (Dec 6, 2018)

Hmm. What about the rust?


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

Speaking of Corvairs.

Today on my weekly shopping excursion, one of the Pickup models, was in the opposite direction lane at a stop light.

Remember those, they were, and are useless for traction, unless you have a load in them. 

Too lightweight in the rear to keep a grip on the road, when wet, snowy, or even at high speed around curves.

It looked to be someone's toy, all shined up.

ED


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## Oso954 (Jun 23, 2012)

Which model pickup was it?
The loadside or rampside ?


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## lenaitch (Feb 10, 2014)

I have never seen or heard of the pick-up version and had to do some research. Interesting. Perhaps they weren't sold up here.


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

Oso954 said:


> Which model pickup was it?
> The loadside or rampside ?


I did not know there are 2 different kinds, I'll research and get back with an answer.

ED

I looked it up, and I can't say, because it was moving through a stoplight, while I was passing in the opposite direction.

And I did not see the passenger side.

SORRY.


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## yardmullet (Jan 6, 2018)

ktkelly said:


> That was all there was to it.
> 
> 
> I inherited a 63 from my grandfather, and other than the starter going out, it was a great car.
> ...



Mine had a gasoline heater, great heat and a great buzz.
bg


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

yardmullet said:


> Mine had a gasoline heater, great heat and a great buzz.
> bg


My Greenbriar had a propane, aftermarket heater in it.

Heated well, but you had to remember to let the Carbon monoxide out, or you would get dizzy.


ED


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## DoomsDave (Dec 6, 2018)

Wow, they really did make Corvair trucks!

Faith and begorrah . . .


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## HenryMac (Sep 12, 2018)

de-nagorg said:


> Speaking of Corvairs.
> 
> Today on my weekly shopping excursion, one of the Pickup models, was in the opposite direction lane at a stop light.
> 
> ...


Useless? Opinions vary Ed. 

For a rear wheel drive vehicle, they had a better weight distribution (front vs rear) than anything being mass produced today.

The motor was *behind* the rear axle. 

And in regard to usable interior space, they were much better than the flat nose vans of that era where the motor cover took up 3/4 of the interior.

VW made the rear engine "Transporters" until 1992, which was also available as a pickup (utility)


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## tinedog (Jun 23, 2017)

HenryMac said:


> Useless? Opinions vary Ed.
> 
> For a rear wheel drive vehicle, they had a better weight distribution (front vs rear) than anything being mass produced today.
> 
> ...


Growing up I knew a VW mechanic who had an earlier one of those pickups. It wasn't unusual to see him hauling an entire VW Bug in the bed. His employment was about 30 miles away over country roads, and it apparently preformed that chore continuously for decades.


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## tinedog (Jun 23, 2017)

Most of my experience was with the later Corvairs that had the Corvette type rear suspension, and didn't deserve the unsafe label. I had a best friend who had a '65 in high school, we had a lot of fun it in, never felt even slightly endangered. My brother-in-law had a bright red '66 convertible, he let me use generously, and again no problems. I did have a maniac friend, with an early model who scared the **** out of me forcing into square turns at speed, but it never ever rolled. He did show me chunks taken out of the sidewall of the rear tires from contact with the ground, & perhaps the wheel opening.


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## KaseyW (Nov 23, 2012)

I’m a baby-boomer so I was in college when my boyfriend owned a Corvair. Oh, how I hated that car! Until he got rid of it, our relationship revolved around a little blue car. It would run for a few weeks and then something would break. He was a good mechanic so, after investing the time and money, he’d get it running again, drive it for another few weeks and something else would go wrong. He lost 2 jobs because breakdowns made him unable to get to work and I lost track of the number of canceled dates. For significant periods of time, the only way I could spend time with him was being the go-fer while he fixed the latest problem. The one good thing that came out of it all was that I learned quite a bit about working on cars. For years, I did all of my own maintenance and a lot of my own repairs.:thumbup:


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## ionized (Jun 8, 2012)

I had a great uncle who had a little dealership. Back in the early 20th century, apparently it was common to have a place with just a handful of cars in the showroom and he held out far longer than most, I think. He had a little collection of personal Corvairs, van, PU, sedan, coupe,..... My grandfather owned a couple of them as well. That's what fit in his garage.

Corvairs were just the worst of a bad situation back then. Automakers kept making cars more powerful and faster and the safety did not keep up. They were relatively unsafe. Corvair was just a bit worse, especially with the fold-up wheels. As soon as the public was convinced, by Nader and others, that safer cars were possible and a good thing, the demand increased and the automakers complied.

I an surprised that no one mentioned the leaking pushrod tubes. I never saw one on the street or in a garage that did not have an oil puddle under it from that source.

About the Corvair that was always broken. That was typical of most cars back then, always broken, but not broken down. I don't yearn for that age. Now, cars are much more reliable, but when they do break, you are stranded. Back then, they'd typically run ragged for a long time before they quit. I'm thinking weak fuel pump, clogged carb, sticky choke, bad plugs fouled by lead deposits or orderly-rich mix, cracked distributor cap, weak condenser or burned points, arcing plug wires,.... Now when a module blows out, you are parked. When a COP quits, you have to park it or burn up the converter.


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

Copied from ionized: cracked distributor cap, weak condenser or burned points,


Wrong, any of these, and you would not start.

ED


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

I am sure glad the 63 Corvair wasn't unstable the day I almost met my water loo. In 63 I worked for a blue print company in Memphis. They sent me to Little Rock Arkansas to fix a blue line machine. Back then the interstate was a two lane highway. 

The traffic coming from Little Rock toward Memphis was bumper to bumper. In the lane I was in, headed to Little Rock, the traffic wasn't heavy at all. I was doing around 65 and looked up and a rig headed my way had just pulled out to pass. 

There was no way for the trucker to get back in the line of traffic. I swerved off the road onto the gravel shoulder, never let up, just kept going. The trucker waved at me as we passed. That was close but for some reason it didn't scare me at all. The little Corvair did just great for me, unstable or not. I loved driving that little thing, it was like driving an over grown go cart. lol

A couple years later I was working in a garage as a mechanic. There was this one guy who worked there was a real prankster. He would take a condenser out of a distributor, pull a plug wire loose, ground the main part of the condenser the hook the wire end to the plug wire, than crank the car. That would load the condenser. 

It was ok if you held the condenser by either the wire or the main part, just don't touch both at the same time or it will knock the stew out of you. I was under the hood of a 2 ton truck working on the carb. I was actually sitting on the motor. The dude came by and tossed a loaded condenser to me. I tried to slap it away but it got me. LOL

Later that afternoon he was up inside a Corvair van. The Corvairs had magnetos that supplied the fire to the plugs. He grabbed the wire as someone turned it over and it knocked him out the back of the van. I got the last laugh. lol


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## gthomson (Nov 13, 2016)

My parents had a blue one when I was young - we're talking when I was probably under 10, so no concept of cars as being important at the time. All I really remember about it is that the cat through up in it, and it smelled bad.
But in my mid teens I went to work at a gas station, and the owner had a Corvair, among others, that he loved to work on. Body work was amazing. He painted it a nice sandy brown color. He loved to drive it around town. And I got in a couple quick short trips as well. For me, I think, it brings back good memories of simpler times, and times when people had more pride in what they drove, and times when design of car lines and body styles was very different. I don't see the car designers of today being so creative. I get it, the aerodynamics are important to conserve natural resources. But I think much could be said about how much the Corvair did similar. And that little lever gear shifter on the dash - that was just so cool.


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## mark sr (Jun 13, 2017)

> typical of most cars back then, always broken, but not broken down.


 New cars are more reliable than the cars of old. Back when I started driving, a car that had 100k was an anomaly. But you could do various rigged up repairs to keep going. I remember having a truck where the coil was shorting out and I had no money. So I applied a coat of oil base interior enamel over the coil body, then 2" masking tape followed by another coat of oil paint. I only needed it to work until payday. I bought a new one when I got paid but if I remember correctly I didn't install it for a month or so. I doubt there is any electronic component on today's cars you could fix with paint and masking tape!


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## Arky217 (Aug 18, 2010)

Driving Corvair in late 60's.
Made left turn from stop sign.
Left rear axle came completely out; it rolled down the road.
Fun car to drive though.


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

mark sr said:


> New cars are more reliable than the cars of old. Back when I started driving, a car that had 100k was an anomaly. But you could do various rigged up repairs to keep going. I remember having a truck where the coil was shorting out and I had no money. So I applied a coat of oil base interior enamel over the coil body, then 2" masking tape followed by another coat of oil paint. I only needed it to work until payday. I bought a new one when I got paid but if I remember correctly I didn't install it for a month or so. I doubt there is any electronic component on today's cars you could fix with paint and masking tape!


Another fix for a dead battery was two aspirins and coco cola in each cell of the battery. It will last for a little while. I drove from Atlanta to Memphis with a battery like that.


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## Oso954 (Jun 23, 2012)

> Another fix for a dead battery was two aspirins and coco cola in each cell of the battery. It will last for a little while. I drove from Atlanta to Memphis with a battery like that.


It works to get you home. But it shortens whatever life is left in it.

It’s best to replace that battery as soon as possible. Otherwise, you have more battery trouble in your future.


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## DoomsDave (Dec 6, 2018)

Arky217 said:


> Driving Corvair in late 60's.
> Made left turn from stop sign.
> Left rear axle came completely out; it rolled down the road.
> Fun car to drive though.


Sounds like one knee-slappin' howl of laughter after another! :vs_laugh:


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## Timborooni (Apr 16, 2011)

ktkelly said:


> The only thing I don't like about the Corvair, is the same thing I don't like about the VW bug. A serious lack of heat.


My VW bug had great heat. I remember back in my college days I had a gig painting apartments each month vacancies. It was freezing out, so I had the heat cranked. A bucket of paint was sitting in the back floorboard right near the vent. I was tooling down the road when the air in the can expanded from the heat.....POW!...the lid blew off the bucket. Luckily the bucket was about empty, so no paint esploded out of the can and made a mess, though I dang near had to change my shorts.


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## lenaitch (Feb 10, 2014)

ZEW496 said:


> My VW bug had great heat. I remember back in my college days I had a gig painting apartments each month vacancies. It was freezing out, so I had the heat cranked. A bucket of paint was sitting in the back floorboard right near the vent. I was tooling down the road when the air in the can expanded from the heat.....POW!...the lid blew off the bucket. Luckily the bucket was about empty, so no paint esploded out of the can and made a mess, though I dang near had to change my shorts.



Ya, I recall their heat output was pretty good, but if I recall there was no electric fan, so I suppose if you were idling in winter traffic it might have gotten chilly. You did have to watch for the heat exchanger 'pot' rusting out and letting exhaust into the car. As a kid I drove delivery for a restaurant back in the day when they owned their own fleet. They took out the passenger seat and installed an insulated plywood box with a flex hose to a floor duct. In later models, they came out with a gas heater that had two settings; on and off, and it would drive you out of the car (but kept the food hot).


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

My Greenbriar van, had an aftermarket propane heater set-up in the back , made for camping.

If you ran it while driving, it kept you toasty.

ED


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