# Notching deck posts at 45� angles



## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

Are you asking what saw to use? Or are you asking how to figure the angles?

ED


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## Bud9051 (Nov 11, 2015)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

Not a deck pro, but notching can have limitations. Here is one reference that may help.
http://www.awc.org/pdf/codes-standards/publications/dca/AWC-DCA62012-DeckGuide-1405.pdf

Bud


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## esullrich (Jul 19, 2016)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

Ed, I am mostly asking about setting the angles. I am having trouble making a detail drawing of those particular posts. Considering setting the posts at a 22.5° angle, and making the necessary jig, etc to cut 22.5 notches. This drawing gave me hope there was a good way to use only 90° and 45° cuts. Was planning on using a circular saw, kerf cuts and a chisel to physically make the notches. 

Bud, I have a paper copy of this in front of me now. To my understanding, notching even a double 2x8 is ok with 6x6 posts, as long as the post is not also supporting a second level. On the sections where the post will continue up past the first level, I will only notch the depth of one 2x8 beam at the first level. The second level will sit on top of the posts, with a triple ply 2x10 beam, and double ply 2x10 rim joists. The complex notching is where I am having trouble. If my understanding doesnt agree with yours, let me know. I'm not an expert.


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

I usually set the posts relatively square with each other, then use a PULL SAW to do the starter cuts to get an outline of what needs to be removed.

Since it is impossible to notch something this complicated on a bench and expect to get them all lined up perfect when installing them, I prefer to install the posts then cut them by hand to fit right. 

After getting the edges marked and cut, you can use a circular saw to remove the bulk, just be careful to not cut too deep, then a chisel and mallet, to finesse it. 


ED


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## esullrich (Jul 19, 2016)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

Essentially trying to figure out how the diagonal beam is mounted to the post at the 30 second mark in this video.


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

It appears that the post is notched an inch on two sides, and the rim joist on the right was installed first, right on the right side notch.

Then the left rim joist was cut to sit in the left notch side, and cover the end of the right rim joist, Next (not shown), it is screwed into the post and end of the right rim joist. 

This continues around the perimeter until you get back to the structure(house) at the end of the rim joist run. 

It's a puzzle where you make each piece to fit.



ED


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

#1, That picture looks like 4 X 4 post that should not even be notched.
#2, Why not set the rim joist on top of the post?
Your making this deck far harder to build, going to be far more waste and making a lot of useless areas by making all those zigs and zags if you follow that first picture.


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## esullrich (Jul 19, 2016)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

Thanks, Ed. Hoping to set my last two footers tomorrow. 

Joe, I will be using 6x6 posts, this is just an example of similar angled beams I found. On the second level, and parts of first level without another above them, I will be setting the rim joist on top of the post. For the portions of the design that will be two story, it becomes more complicated, and I have cleared the notching of first level with my local inspection dept. Below is a hand drawing of my design.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

i try to never notch posts as it can weaken them but it also isnt accepted by inspectors in some regions.. as for the angles i generally shift the post so it can be square with the framing.. its easier to cut 2x on the angle to butt into it than it is to mess with angled notches


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## Bud9051 (Nov 11, 2015)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

I assume you are using pressure treated posts. If so, the treatment only penetrates so far and your notched area should be treated with an appropriated material.

Bud


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## SeniorSitizen (Sep 10, 2012)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

Set 2 post for each corner and forget the notching. After the lumber shrinks the notch is of 0 value even if you were good enough to get the joist to set on the notch in the beginning.


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## esullrich (Jul 19, 2016)

Mr Sitizen, I've already poured the concrete for most of my footers, with cast in place post bases. Not much flexibility at this point. 4 of the posts will be attached to two levels of decking, with the top ten feet above the bottom. Can't think of a safe way to connect the first level the post, other than notching. The second level will be on top of the post. If you've got any ideas, please help.


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## carpdad (Oct 11, 2010)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

You shouldn't go by that photo. Posts have 90 deg angles and 45 does not give you a flush joint. Also your drawing does not say which part will support the joists - beams vs box joist, eg. Best way I think would be not notching the posts and put the second floor on a different post. That is, post - floor - post. Are the footings thicker/wider for second floor?


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## 123pugsy (Oct 6, 2012)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

Strongtie hangers?


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## esullrich (Jul 19, 2016)

I've seen a picture of a hanger that would do that, but not found the part itself.

Carpdad, do you know where I can read up on that type of build? I haven't found a good drawing to look at, but is looking as I can get a constant load path, it should be solid.


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## hkstroud (Mar 17, 2011)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

My suggestion.

Cut the notches in all of your post first. You have indicated that there are to be two levels of decks. Measure the distance between the footers and the lower notches. Add 6 inches to that measurement. Cut your lower notches. Lay you post side by side with the notches aligned. Measure the distance to the upper notches and cut upper notches. Then set your post in place. Then get your level and straight edge out or pull your level line and mark on the post where level is. Measure between that mark and the notch. Cut off that much off the bottom of the post. That will accommodate any variances in height of the footers and keep your notches level. If you try to measure up form the footers to level for each post you are probably doing to miss. 

The two post by the steps are the only post where you have to bevel the notches to accommodate the band board coming in at 45 degree. Logic also says that these post only extend up to the lower deck and railing.

To bevel those notches, draw a line on the side of the post 3/4" below the notch which is shown as a green line in the drawings below. Hopefully the drawings come out large enough for you to see.
Also draw a line which is shown as a blue line in the notch. To measure where to draw the blue line use you the 45 degree side of your combination square.

To set up your combination square for measuring where to draw the line, put your square on the end of your band board as shown in the drawings below. Extend the tongue down until the corner of the tongue is flush with the bottom side of the band board.

Put the square on the post, in the notch, with the top edge of the tongue at the corner of the post. Mark where to draw the line, which is where the corner of the tongue touches the bottom of the notch. The distance between that line and the corner of the post should be the thickness of the band board.

Get out your hand saw and cut the ends of you notches between the two lines. Chisel between the two lines. Which will of course be at a 45 degree angle relative to the surfaces of the post. There really won't be that much material to remove so you should not have any difficulty doing that.

You will cut the band board coming into that notch at a 90 degree angle. That is the end of the band board that comes to the steps will be cut off square. That will give you the maximum support in the notch. You will cut the other end of the band board at a 45 degree angle. It will fit into the notch of the post supporting then main deck. You will cut the band board between the two sets of steps at 45 degrees on each end. That will mate up with the square end of the band boards coming in at 45 degrees. 

Cut the end of the deck band boards, meeting these 45 degree band boards at the inside corner, at 45 degrees to mate up.

All you can do to attach your 45 degree band boards is nail or screw them to the post. That will be at the very end. Drill pilot holes to prevent splitting. Especially the 45 degree end. Later you can add metal brackets on the back side to reinforce that attachment.

When cutting your notches set the depth of cut of you saw equal to the thickness of you band boards. Yes, your band board will shrink but so will your post. 

You band boards will shrink more in their width than in their thickness. Nothing you can do about that except cut the width of your notches as tight as possible. You can chisel off the back corners of the band board then use a C clamp to force the band board into a tight notch.

Suggest that you find a scrap piece of post and do a practice notch and beveling. 
Make your outside cuts for the notch, then make lots of saw cuts between the those two cuts to make chiseling easier and and for a smoother bottom.


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## jlhaslip (Dec 31, 2009)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

Another method would be to use a bolt-on piece so that it supports the rim board that is set at the 45 degree angle. You would need to use structural screws like GRK's (which are not cheap) and have a method to cut the bolt-on pieces at a suitable angle.


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## esullrich (Jul 19, 2016)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*



carpdad said:


> Best way I think would be not notching the posts and put the second floor on a different post. That is, post - floor - post. Are the footings thicker/wider for second floor?


Carpdad, I think the method quoted above would be the best way to do it, If I can get any level of confidence in the design. Would a triple ply beam set on top of a first level post provide a continuous load path between the first and second level post? If so, how would I securely mount the second post to the decking or beams/joists? 

If I can avoid notching, it would simplify the rim joist/beam assembly, and avoid notching the posts at an intermediate height. Win/win in my eyes.


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## de-nagorg (Feb 23, 2014)

*Re: Notching deck posts at 45° angles*

An iron worker can fabricate you hangers to put your second floor on, bolted to the posts without notching them. 

It won't be cheap, but will be safer than notching, and hoping that it holds. 

An ornamental iron works, in your community can easily engineer any hanger that you desire.


ED


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