# I need help laying concrete foundation for dog kennel.



## grimreaper1014 (May 18, 2013)

Hello,

I would like to lay a concrete foundation for a dog kennel a just purchased. I don't know a whole lot when it comes to concrete so I am looking for as much advice and help as I can get. The kennel is 10Lx10Wx6H. I would like to put it on a 11Lx11W slab 4 inches thick. I was given a quote for $230.55 for the concrete by the ready mix right down the street from me. I was going to buy 80lbs bags and do it that way but when I used an online concrete calculator it said I would need a heck of a lot of bags. The biggest problem is I don't know how I will get the concrete to the location of the kennel. My house is built into a hillside. I have a ranch style home. My driveway is cut into the hillside. The location of the kennel is above the driveway on the hillside about a good 100ft. I have a flat 15x15 spot prepared for the kennel that is surrounded by woods on three sides. I have a neighbor that lives on the back side of where the kennel is. I was going to see about maybe getting permission from to have the truck back in there. That will get me probably 15ft to 20ft away from where I need the concrete. If I can't get permission from him what other options do I have? Also, what all will I need to spread the concrete around etc? Can I build my form and pour the concrete right on the dirt, or should I lay gravel, sand, or something else? If someone could break down the steps on how to do this that would be great. If more information or even pictures is needed please let me know. I would really appreciate that. Thanks for reading.

Rocky


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

Whole lot less work and money if you just layed some patio blocks.
Might even be able to find some on Creigs list cheap.


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## RWolff (Jan 27, 2013)

grimreaper1014 said:


> Hello,
> 
> I would like to lay a concrete foundation for a dog kennel a just purchased. I don't know a whole lot when it comes to concrete so I am looking for as
> 
> The biggest problem is I don't know how I will get the concrete to the location of the kennel. My house is built into a hillside. I have a ranch style


Bare concrete is very hard on a dog's joints, it tends to cause large callouses on the elbows, hocks and other places. pea gravel is good but not easy to remove looser droppings from.
The concrete is ok, but I would put something on top made for kennels, they have an interlocking or sheet rubber material that works well that you put on top of the slab.

As far as the concrete, for my dogs I have about a 12x24 area in the back that I concreted over time by pouring roughly 3'x5' slabs. It works fine but I don't leave them out there, it's just for excersize and all that.

Trust me, you'll be better to pay the $230 for the ready mix, this is a lot of concrete to mix by hand in a wheelbarrow, you will spend almost that much in materials if not more.



> I was going to see about maybe getting permission from to have the truck back in there. That will get me probably 15ft to 20ft away from where I need the concrete. If I can't get permission from him what other options do I have?



They can get the concrete there with pumping it via a hose with the way these trucks are designed, or you can use a couple of wheelbarrows and a friend if you really had to.




> Also, what all will I need to spread the concrete around etc? Can I build my form and pour the concrete right on the dirt, or should I lay gravel, sand, or something else? If someone could break down the steps on how to do this that would be great. If more information or even pictures is needed please let me know. I would really appreciate that. Thanks for reading.


The way I did it was dug the area down 2-3" nice and flat to hard dirt, put in about an inch of sand, plastic sheet over the sand, built a wood form with some 2x4's staked into the ground and raised about an inch up to allow the slab to be roughly 4" thick.

Pour the concrete in, place and rough level it out with a flat shovel higher than the boards, work the concrete down and in, getting all the air pockets etc out, and then you take a 2x4 or similar and using the forms' top edge, run the board side to side while pulling it slowly towards you to level and smooth the concrete to the height of the form.
Once you do that, you let it sit for a while, till the wet water sheen goes away, then you can work the concrete smooth with tools, put an edge on it with a tool you run around the perimeter that makes that nice rounded edge, and put your control lines in.
I haven't needed to do the control lines as I always worked with small slabs 3'x5' or so, even when I concreted my whole basement I did it in sections roughly 5'x6' or so.


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## Daniel Holzman (Mar 10, 2009)

The ready mix price sounds too good to be true. Usually you cannot purchase less than a full load of concrete, and you are only talking about less than 2 cubic yards, much less than a full truck. Usually the price for a partial load is much higher per cubic yard than a full load.

Second, you are going to pay a lot more if the delivery includes a pumping truck. I totally agree with the idea of using concrete blocks, makes a lot of sense, you only need a bedding layer of sand to put down the block. And I agree that you should use matting on top of the block or concrete, heavy duty horse stall matting works very nicely, we used it in our dog kennel, our dog loves it.


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## stadry (Jun 20, 2009)

all of our mil police dogs were kenneled on conc unless they spent the nite in the bush w/us,,, easy to keep clean AND conc help'd keep their nails short :yes: imagine the kennels might now be coated rather'n regular bare conc for better germ control,,, i'd rather see a larger exercise area than just 1' perimeter but that's just me, i guess,,, @ dog school, the exterior run was 4'wide x 20' long & dogs slept inside by entering a door

in atl, min delivery's 5cy & mud's about $ 110cy,,, maybe they're giving you the tail end of a load which'll be ' HOT ' & more difficult to place,,, curious about the dimensions - are you building a dog hotel or condo ? some folks live inside houses w/those dimensions :laughing:


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## grimreaper1014 (May 18, 2013)

Thanks for the reply guys. I am going to use rubber squares designed for dog kennels overtop of the cement slab. I think the reason I got such a good deal and the reason they are willing to do it is I live a stone throws away. The dispatcher gave me a formula to figure out how much it would cost. He said 90 x 1.75 +$60 + sales tax 6.0% = $230.55. RWolff thanks a lot for typing out the steps. That was exactly what I needed. What are control lines and how do you place them etc? I read about the concrete pumps and heard that you can rent them reasonably. My understanding was they actually make smaller ones that don't require the truck being there to use. I guess what I could do is call back over to the plant. Then, see if they could send someone out to look at what I am doing, and see what the best option would be to get the cement up there.

@ itsreallyconc

I have seen German Shepard's on concrete before too. My mom use to breed them and a lot of the places we went looking for good bloodlines had kennels on concrete. Doggy hotel lol. Its probably going to look like one when I get done haha. I bought a 10x10 kennel because I have two AKC Rotts. I am going to be breeding them. I plan to get another male and female as soon as these two are housebroke etc. Figured I would get the 10x10 instead of buying a whole kennel again I can just buy a panel to divide them. Then, after that if I need even more room I can buy a set of three panels and add on another hotel room lol.


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## Nailbags (Feb 1, 2012)

grimreaper1014 said:


> Hello,
> 
> I would like to lay a concrete foundation for a dog kennel a just purchased. I don't know a whole lot when it comes to concrete so I am looking for as much advice and help as I can get. The kennel is 10Lx10Wx6H. I would like to put it on a 11Lx11W slab 4 inches thick. I was given a quote for $230.55 for the concrete by the ready mix right down the street from me. I was going to buy 80lbs bags and do it that way but when I used an online concrete calculator it said I would need a heck of a lot of bags. The biggest problem is I don't know how I will get the concrete to the location of the kennel. My house is built into a hillside. I have a ranch style home. My driveway is cut into the hillside. The location of the kennel is above the driveway on the hillside about a good 100ft. I have a flat 15x15 spot prepared for the kennel that is surrounded by woods on three sides. I have a neighbor that lives on the back side of where the kennel is. I was going to see about maybe getting permission from to have the truck back in there. That will get me probably 15ft to 20ft away from where I need the concrete. If I can't get permission from him what other options do I have? Also, what all will I need to spread the concrete around etc? Can I build my form and pour the concrete right on the dirt, or should I lay gravel, sand, or something else? If someone could break down the steps on how to do this that would be great. If more information or even pictures is needed please let me know. I would really appreciate that. Thanks for reading.
> 
> Rocky


Wheel barrel!! Or rent a mixer and do it your self, or one last option concrete pump rental. Those are your three options if your neighbors say nope.


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## stadry (Jun 20, 2009)

OR WHEELBARROW ! ! ! :thumbup:


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## RWolff (Jan 27, 2013)

grimreaper1014 said:


> I am going to use rubber squares designed for dog kennels overtop of the cement slab.


Excellent!



> RWolff thanks a lot for typing out the steps. That was exactly what I needed. What are control lines and how do you place them etc?


I haven't had to do it as all the concrete in my basement and the dog area is made from smaller slabs not one huge pour, but basically you just score a line in the concrete either when it has started setting and is firming up, or later with a circular saw and masonry cutting disk. In theory it's like a score on a piece of glass, if/when the concrete cracks it's supposed to want to crack along those lines- the weakest part, but I've rarely seen concrete slabs that ever JUST crack there.

I've never had concrete crack on me, and I've done the whole 900 sq ft basement in my house, as a 12x24 area for the dogs, and narrow sidewalks around the house- mainly to keep water away from the foundation along with grass and weeds.
Here's a part of that along the front, I just mowed yeasterday so the clippings are all over it, but this is about 30" x 5' per section, 4" thick, see that line between them? if this was done in one pour a control line would go right around there.













> I read about the concrete pumps and heard that you can rent them reasonably. My understanding was they actually make smaller ones that don't require the truck being there to use. I guess what I could do is call back over to the plant. Then, see if they could send someone out to look at what I am doing, and see what the best option would be to get the cement up there.


I assume the TRUCK comes with all that, after all, if they have to pour the slab for foundations or a basement floor and the truck can't get in far enough, they have to pump it using a large hose, it might cost extra but I believe all of that which you would need can be provided by the truck, 20 feet is nothing, it would be if it was 200 feet...
You def want to preplan the route and method in advance as to where the truck can back up to, and how the mix will get where you want it.




> I have seen German Shepard's on concrete before too. My mom use to breed them and a lot of the places we went looking for good bloodlines had kennels on concrete


As a former AKC show dog exhibitor and breeder myself, and having worked in an animal shelter I can tell you there are 500 different views on this, the bad ones are: constantly housed on bare concrete is hard on the dog's pasterns and paws, you get dogs with spread out paws, bad calouses on their hock joints and elbows.
If the concrete is not sloped well, urine tends to just pool on the surface and then the dog tracks it all over and lays in it, ditto for the droppings.

Nothing smells worse than a dog who has laid in urine repeatedly, other than one who tracked droppings all over and laid on that (seen commonly in dogs at animal shelters not used to being confined/not housebroken)

Bare concrete tends to absorb urine and over time it can get pretty sour, then you would be using clorox and water and the clorox isn't the best thing for concrete. A sealer (not Thompsons water seal) might be of good help for both issues.

Overlaid with the rubber tiles helps reduce the above issues, if you have a decent slope to the slab liquids should roll off readily.

Certain breeders prefer pea gravel, they say it tightens up the dog's feet, it's not harsh like bare concrete can be to lay on, it drains instantly, the down side is loose droppings are impossible to remove without shoveling out a shovel full of the gravel with it, thus you wind up having to replenish the gravel periodically.
Dogs who are active tend to run around and thus push the gravel to the sides in a bank much like the Daytona 500 speedway has, but mud in the center and a 2 feet deep gravel ring around the perimeter.

As you can see there's upsides and downsides to each!




> Figured I would get the 10x10 instead of buying a whole kennel again I can just buy a panel to divide them.


You do know that a dividing panel can still allow fence fighting, as well as breeding THROUGH the fence even if you don't want a breeding...
I worked for a private kennel back in 1990ish who raised German Shepherds and Rottweilers that they sold to the police dept and others, they also boarded dogs. I was hired on the spot because during the interview I was able to correctly answer what Schutzhund was, where probably none of the potential applicants had ever heard of let alone knew what it was.

They had 2 in-out kennel buildings with runs, they also had an old German Shepherd who escaped his chainlink run one night, went down to the other building, managed to either open the kennel run gate or climb over the fence where another male was boarded, the old dog HATED this other dog for some reason and killed him- don't underestimate how a dog can open gates or climb over them!
At the animal shelter, arrived for work one morning and found this dog in with a great dane who was in heat- he had climbed over the chainlink divider and squeezed thru a tiny gap at the top under the roof.

Another time 2 dogs had bred THROUGH the fence and were locked together, don't underestimate their ability to do that either!

A word about the chain link fencing- the larger size holes used for landscaping /security fences are dangerous, a smaller weave is much better, what can happen and I've seen happen, is the dog will typically jump up on the fence repeatedly, inevitably one of those times their paw will go right through the hole and become STUCK due to the angle when the rest of the dog drops back down on 3 legs.
Add a little panic and it becomes a serious injury issue.

lastly, on the normal style gate, most of those doors only have one very poor U shaped latch, not only are they easy to bump up and open, they don't keep the BOTTOM of the gate secure and the dog can push their way out the gap by forcing it.
I knew a woman whose puppy was put into a portable Vari kennel while she was at work, the latch failed on the top of the little gate door and the puppy got her head thru the gap at the top by pushing her way through, but she couldn't go further and she couldn't pull her head back in either, unfortunately she didn't make it.

You really have to select the right equipment for safety and consider the impossible is often a lot more possible than you think when it comes to dogs figuring out how to open, thwart, defeat, break thru or climb over something.


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## gregzoll (Dec 25, 2006)

I wouldn't, due to you have to be out there every week with a power washer and Tide detergent to clean the floor, from the feces & pee. Also, that base will be hot during the Summer, unless the whole kennel is covered with a roof. Your best bet is to use hay or straw across the pen in a small area, grass for the rest. Pick up feces every day, and you can treat the spots with lime or baking soda, to bring the ph down.


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