# Love my Home Automation



## ktkelly (Apr 7, 2007)

Does your stuff work.sync with Amazon Alexa?

For the DIY market, this system appears by far one of the better routes to go.

Google is playing catch up at the moment.


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

ktkelly said:


> Does your stuff work.sync with Amazon Alexa?
> 
> For the DIY market, this system appears by far one of the better routes to go.
> 
> Google is playing catch up at the moment.


Havent tried that yet, but have been told it does, especially the Nest Thermostat. Alexa is next on my purchase list...


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

KPDMinc said:


> So far, I have the following:
> 1. Nest Thermostat
> 2. WIFI Garage door operner
> 3. Camera system
> ...


Just curious...
I could understand a smart thermostat and even a camera system, but why would you need a wifi garage door?


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

toys for rich people.


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## ktkelly (Apr 7, 2007)

Bob Sanders said:


> Just curious...
> I could understand a smart thermostat and even a camera system, but why would you need a wifi garage door?



Actually Bob, we don't need most any of this stuff, but we WANT it, We're LAZY. After all, it's damn difficult walking across the room to turn the lights off, or out to te garage to hit the button and close the door.


How many people do you know that have cable TV, an Iphone (latest version of course) and lord knows what all else, but they can never seem to have enough money for food, rent, etc, etc.

Screwed up value systems is what we have.


That said, I see all of it as a great thing, as it's paid my bills for years. :smile:


Then too, if you have a garage that you actually park your car in, don't you use the garage door opener in your car? Same thing....


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

Bob Sanders said:


> Just curious...
> I could understand a smart thermostat and even a camera system, but why would you need a wifi garage door?



1. because I can
2. have you ever been gone and wonder if you closed your garage door? I can check to see if its open or closed.
3. I get notifications when my door opens or closes
4. I can open the door anywhere in the world to let someone in. ie: UPS, FedEx deliveries
5. I can contact a Friend to enter in the event of an emergency when I am away.
6. This model comes with a battery backup.
7. I needed a new opener, so why not?!?


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

ktkelly said:


> Actually Bob, we don't need most any of this stuff, but we WANT it, We're LAZY. After all, it's damn difficult walking across the room to turn the lights off, or out to te garage to hit the button and close the door.
> 
> 
> How many people do you know that have cable TV, an Iphone (latest version of course) and lord knows what all else, but they can never seem to have enough money for food, rent, etc, etc.
> ...


But but, the economy...

Bankers, politicians, and corporations need people to go into ever increasing amounts of debt to buy ever increasing amounts of environmentally destructive crap from china they don't need, to keep the GDP and amount of loaned into existance currency growing to service the existing debt so that you can take out your hard earned money from the bank, 90%+ of which the bank to loans out at a higher interest rate than they pay you (so other people can use your money to buy crap they don't need) all *while promising* all your money to you at the same time.

Without the people with screwed up value systems to keep on racking up consumer debt, this system would collapse and the bankers and politicians wouldn't be able to make money off of other people's money any more.


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

user_12345a said:


> But but, the economy...
> 
> Bankers, politicians, and corporations need people to go into ever increasing amounts of debt to buy ever increasing amounts of environmentally destructive crap from china they don't need, to keep the GDP and amount of loaned into existance currency growing to service the existing debt so that you can take out your hard earned money from the bank, 90%+ of which the bank to loans out at a higher interest rate than they pay you (so other people can use your money to buy crap they don't need) all *while promising* all your money to you at the same time.
> 
> Without the people with screwed up value systems to keep on racking up consumer debt, this system would collapse and the bankers and politicians wouldn't be able to make money off of other people's money any more.


Chamberlain garage doors is an American company,I an supporting Americans! and I highly doubt a $200 purchase is "racking" up my debt. I see people bung more frivolous things that have NOTHING to show for it... Besides, new things are an investment in your house, which bring value to MY nestegg.


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## ddawg16 (Aug 15, 2011)

Just like Bob to take a technical discussion and turn it political.

It's not up to us to challenge why the OP wants the stuff.....

Has hard as it might be for Bob to understand, some of us like Geek stuff.

Lets take that WiFi garage opener. I wish I had one. It's a long walk from upstairs of my house down to the detached garage. More than once I've out out my balcony and noticed the garage door still open and said "Crap...."

I have the Lorex NVR system...it lets me monitor all my cameras from anywhere...and I can get notifications when there is movement in certain areas. It came in handy when we had the house tented. I would have known if anyone tried to enter the house.

Right now I'm looking for a WiFi outdoor light. What I really want is WiFi with Motion sensing and remote on/off. That way we can turn it on/off without having to walk past it. I don't have a switch on the light. I wired it with the assumption of it being WiFi.


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

ddawg16 said:


> Just like Bob to take a technical discussion and turn it political.
> 
> It's not up to us to challenge why the OP wants the stuff.....
> 
> ...



https://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&k...o=&hvqmt=b&hvdev=c&ref=pd_sl_35njpqbca2_b_p14


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## ddawg16 (Aug 15, 2011)

KPDMinc said:


> https://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&k...o=&hvqmt=b&hvdev=c&ref=pd_sl_35njpqbca2_b_p14


The selection has broadened since I last looked.

Protocols are still all over the place.

Who do you think is going to win out?


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

ddawg16 said:


> The selection has broadened since I last looked.
> 
> Protocols are still all over the place.
> 
> Who do you think is going to win out?


Im still shopping myself...


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## user_12345a (Nov 23, 2014)

KPDMinc said:


> Chamberlain garage doors is an American company,I an supporting Americans! and I highly doubt a $200 purchase is "racking" up my debt. I see people bung more frivolous things that have NOTHING to show for it... Besides, new things are an investment in your house, which bring value to MY nestegg.


my post wasn't directed to you. i don't know anything about you or your purchase. 

i couldn't resist.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

KPDMinc said:


> 2. have you ever been gone and wonder if you closed your garage door? I can check to see if its open or closed.


The other ones I dismiss, but this one makes sense. If you're going to close electronically then you need some way of checking if it actually closed. The question is... how does it do that though.

I have a "two way" car remote which sends feedback and confirmations. One day I locked the van and the remote confirmed it. The next day I found it had been rifled through. Upon inspection I found that the passenger door lock wasn't working and by the looks of it, it hadn't been working for a while. In other words the remote was sending me confirmations that it did lock the door, but it was only confirmations that it sent the door a 'lock signal'... not that the door was actually locked.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

ddawg16 said:


> Just like Bob to take a technical discussion and turn it political.
> 
> It's not up to us to challenge why the OP wants the stuff.....
> 
> ...


This isn't the controversial board room. Please don't turn it into one.

I'd be willing to bet I'm probably more of a 'geek stuff' owner that you are, but the one thing I have not gotten into is home automation and main reason for that is that sometimes this stuff makes things less safe rather than more safe. Since my little incident from the van (post above) I now find myself second guessing that very technology I find so 'neat' and no longer have too much faith in it.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

ddawg16 said:


> I have the Lorex NVR system...it lets me monitor all my cameras from anywhere...and I can get notifications when there is movement in certain areas. It came in handy when we had the house tented. I would have known if anyone tried to enter the house.


What kind of confirmations do you get that the motion sensors are actually working?


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

Bob Sanders said:


> The other ones I dismiss, but this one makes sense. If you're going to close electronically then you need some way of checking if it actually closed. The question is... how does it do that though.
> 
> I have a "two way" car remote which sends feedback and confirmations. One day I locked the van and the remote confirmed it. The next day I found it had been rifled through. Upon inspection I found that the passenger door lock wasn't working and by the looks of it, it hadn't been working for a while. In other words the remote was sending me confirmations that it did lock the door, but it was only confirmations that it sent the door a 'lock signal'... not that the door was actually locked.


The app on my phone shows a picture of the door either in the up position, or the down position. I also have the alert system set up so I get an instant email the minute the door is either opened or closed.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

KPDMinc said:


> The app on my phone shows a picture of the door either in the up position, or the down position. I also have the alert system set up so I get an instant email the minute the door is either opened or closed.


So you need the cameras to absolutely confirm whether the door is opened or closed

That's my problem with a lot of this home automation stuff. There is very little out there which ACTUALLY confirms if a door is locked or not. More often than not the confirmation that you get is simply a confirmation that a lock or close signal was sent to the door, not an actual confirmation that the door *IS *closed/locked. You must rely on other technology to actually confirm.


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

Bob Sanders said:


> So you need the cameras to absolutely confirm whether the door is opened or closed
> 
> That's my problem with a lot of this home automation stuff. There is very little out there which ACTUALLY confirms if a door is locked or not. More often than not the confirmation that you get is simply a confirmation that a lock or close signal was sent to the door, not an actual confirmation that the door *IS *closed/locked. You must rely on other technology to actually confirm.


no. the app actually has a garage door that shows it open or closed. also, shows it in the present time while its opening and closing. For example. if i have my app open, and the image shows an open garage door, I can tap the garage door and it will close (after all the safety beeping and such) same goes for when it shows it closed. Like after a walk, I can tap the closed garage door picture, and it will open - and the app shows it opening. no cameras are needed.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

KPDMinc said:


> no. the app actually has a garage door that shows it open or closed. also, shows it in the present time while its opening and closing. For example. if i have my app open, and the image shows an open garage door, I can tap the garage door and it will close (after all the safety beeping and such) same goes for when it shows it closed. Like after a walk, I can tap the closed garage door picture, and it will open - and the app shows it opening. no cameras are needed.


The picture on your app is irrelevant. You need to know whether the app is TRULY sensing the door in a closed position or its just ASSUMING the door is closed because it sent a "close signal"

Send your door a "close signal" from your app and when the door is 1/2 way closed, unplug the garage door opener. See what your app says then. If it says door closed, then you have a security problem... one that most of these apps have. If it says "door jammed" or "door still open" then you will know it is truly sensing the door.


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## ktkelly (Apr 7, 2007)

ddawg16 said:


> The selection has broadened since I last looked.
> 
> Protocols are still all over the place.
> 
> Who do you think is going to win out?



No one company....


Amazon has a pretty good head start, but Google has a ton of money and could well catch up in a hurry.

All those little stand alone light bulbs, and outlets are not going to do everything that most people want, and will ultimately find there way into junk drawer.

The major integration companies (Crestron & C4) will still be the go to for the serious money and those that want a no fail solution.


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## Nobr8ks (Sep 30, 2015)

ddawg16 said:


> Right now I'm looking for a WiFi outdoor light. What I really want is WiFi with Motion sensing and remote on/off. That way we can turn it on/off without having to walk past it. I don't have a switch on the light. I wired it with the assumption of it being WiFi.


Enjoy!... Am doing sum pre wiring myself.

https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=43625


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

Bob Sanders said:


> The picture on your app is irrelevant. You need to know whether the app is TRULY sensing the door in a closed position or its just ASSUMING the door is closed because it sent a "close signal"
> 
> Send your door a "close signal" from your app and when the door is 1/2 way closed, unplug the garage door opener. See what your app says then. If it says door closed, then you have a security problem... one that most of these apps have. If it says "door jammed" or "door still open" then you will know it is truly sensing the door.


The 'picture' in my app is actually a live door opening and closing. i did your little test, but had to disable the battery backup. I hit the 'close' and while the door was actually closing in time with the app door, I turned the switch (I have my opener on a switch by my door also) to kill the power, and the app also stopped mid-stream. Upon applying power back to the door, the app also started back up, both in perfect harmony. I trust my opener and its components.


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## raylo32 (Nov 25, 2006)

I have BlueIris with webserver for cams. Great setup for video surveillance. Although one problem with most all of these video surveillance systems is video motion sensing and alerts. Video detection is not great for cams pointing outdoors since clouds, sun and trees make far too many false alarms. And it is also problematic indoors in occupied space. You need to run different profiles when home and away and that makes it a PITA.

ermostat and Honeywell total co


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## ddawg16 (Aug 15, 2011)

raylo32 said:


> I have BlueIris with webserver for cams. Great setup for video surveillance. Although one problem with most all of these video surveillance systems is video motion sensing and alerts. Video detection is not great for cams pointing outdoors since clouds, sun and trees make far too many false alarms. And it is also problematic indoors in occupied space. You need to run different profiles when home and away and that makes it a PITA.
> 
> ermostat and Honeywell total co


I don't have that issue with the Lorex. Each camera has a 'grid' where you can specify the 'motion detect' zone. On my driveway camera, this lets me exclude any movement on the sidewalk.

The front camera just records 24/7


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## raylo32 (Nov 25, 2006)

I can also setup a detect grid and mask out other areas but there is no way to make it work. Waving shadows during the day from trees progress into the area I need detect in the back, and spillage from passing and turning cars' headlights gets me in the front at night. Video detect is next to worthless outside unless you have a VERY stable environment. I just record all cams 24/7 and save for 3 weeks.



ddawg16 said:


> I don't have that issue with the Lorex. Each camera has a 'grid' where you can specify the 'motion detect' zone. On my driveway camera, this lets me exclude any movement on the sidewalk.
> 
> The front camera just records 24/7


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

raylo32 said:


> I can also setup a detect grid and mask out other areas but there is no way to make it work. Waving shadows during the day from trees progress into the area I need detect in the back, and spillage from passing and turning cars' headlights gets me in the front at night. Video detect is next to worthless outside unless you have a VERY stable environment. I just record all cams 24/7 and save for 3 weeks.


I also set up my grids. have to be pretty strategic, like instead of the top of a fence for instance, do the actual fence itself, this way, it catches motion coming over the fence, sidewalks, i choose a couple different grid areas, not the whole sidewalk itself. like do the beginning grid square, or where there is no chance of any other entrance area. The driveway, i just do an area that will catch movement crossing a given area. No need to cover ALL the grid areas.


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## Nobr8ks (Sep 30, 2015)

Swann NVR-7250 (with tamper/motion rear connections tied into Honeywell Vista alarm-Envisalink EVL-3 internet module)

Front door cam (mounted above door) points into small courtyard with an 8 foot wall & 7 foot gate separating it from driveway (Gates always locked)

Plus two other cameras in front, each side of house & two in back (Our house has back ally access. 

I've all but given up using cam grids. Between light winds, birds, dog/cat, other animals, wild peacocks, raccoons, skunks, the occasional bear, I just record 24/7... 

I've added motion sensed red lights for better night vision.


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## BayouRunner (Feb 5, 2016)

I have the same door opener. It was just a few dollars more than the standard. We've used the garage to enter the house for the last 25 years. A couple of times we had power failures in the past and the women have been been locked out. Why they won't carry a key beats me. But the battery backup takes care of that. I've used the feature to open the garage door a few times and I don't have to give out the the keypad info anymore. I like it. It does tell you whether the door is open or closed. Doesn't give any false readings.


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## raylo32 (Nov 25, 2006)

This is a good little cam. It has good resolution, great IR night vision and POE in a compact and attractive form factor. Also outdoor rated. I have one outside out back and one inside in my workshop. The outside unit replaced a much higher priced cam and this one is better in all respects. Integrates seamlessly with BlueIris.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01E7QI91E/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


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## jdeatsch (Jun 1, 2017)

For those of you still investigating switches...


I've been playing with H/A since X10 first came out and have evolved from there.

I started, much to my chagrin, with Belkin's Wemo switches. I struggled, I cussed, I fought, I even resorted to contacting Belkin's 'support' email and phone line. Suffice it to say their products, in my humble opinion, are crap. Absolute crap. The hardware is unreliable (6 wall plugin modules and 2 wall switches). They jump on and off my network periodically. 

It used to be that rebooting my router would re-establish communication. No longer.

The good folks at Belkin suggested that my 'outdated' router was to blame. Shrug, I finally went along and bought a new router, though not Belkin's. 

Same problem. Nothing changed. I scanned for interference. I changed channels. I ran the gamut of suggestions, bright ideas, and absurd guesses.

Location made not a whit of difference.

SO, I bagged the Wemo product and went with TP-Link.

What a WORLD of difference. The hardware is reliable. The software is PERFECT. Everything works as advertised and the clowns at Belkin 'support' (using the term loosely) are telling me that I should have stuck with it cause they 'could have fixed the problem' AFTER TWO YEARS OF FRUSTRATION.

Take it from one who's been down the road: TP-Link makes a quality product that's cheaper than wemo's junk and all you do is plug it in and run the smart phone app. 

My Amazon Echo LOVES the TPs.

I do hope this saves someone the frustration I suffered.

Jim


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## Windows on Wash (Aug 30, 2011)

What are folks using to control the AC these days? 

I need one that can be controlled remotely as well as be set to shut off if a window or door switch is showing as open.


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

Windows on Wash said:


> What are folks using to control the AC these days?
> 
> I need one that can be controlled remotely as well as be set to shut off if a window or door switch is showing as open.


I use a Nest for my AC, but as far as your window or door issue, there are systems that hotels use. Can even detect if someone is in the room that triggers the unit to turn on / off... they are typically hardwired units to sensors and switches


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## Mitaela Drayne (Aug 31, 2017)

These are nothing but the toys for the rich people to pass their time on. And also to money.


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

Mitaela Drayne said:


> These are nothing but the toys for the rich people to pass their time on. And also to money.


...and your point is? isnt society based on things people 'want'? Im sure there are things YOU have that most wouldnt agree with, but dont voice their opinions upon you...


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## KHouse75 (May 14, 2008)

Mitaela Drayne said:


> These are nothing but the toys for the rich people to pass their time on. And also to money.


I'm not sure what year you are living in but all the technology discussed here is affordable for anyone, not just the rich.

With a $3 ESP8266 WiFi module, you can control anything wirelessly. Inexpensive Arduino microcontrollers and Raspberry PI PCs have opened up everything to the IOT (Internet of Things).

I monitor my energy consumption using a Raspberry PI, some wire and an inexpensive IR sensor. I've cut my energy consumption in half with the aid of those "rich people toys" you speak of.

You can buy a $50 esp8266 based WiFi garage door door/closer and car monitor from OpenGarage.io. Since it's open hardware and open source code, you can build your own for a fraction of the already assembled and ready to go price.

I run my sprinkler system and LED landscape lighting using an OpenSprinkler controller from opensprinkler.com. Again, it's open source and hardware so you can build your own for a fraction of the assembled price.

I have a Samsung SmartThings hub that I got for $50 that integrates with anything internet connected that I have. If there isn't already a device created in their API, I write my own code.

You can get PTZ WiFi cameras for $30 and monitor your entire house and yard over the internet.

I have a 16 channel Camera DVR system installed in my house that was $600. Not super cheap but not "Rich People" expensive.

GE switches and outlets readily available from Lowe's for $30 to $40 can turn your lighting into internet enabled smart lighting when paired with a Z-Wave hub like the Samsung SmartThings Hub.

Do I need all this stuff? Nobody needs anything they have except for food and water but I have a much higher sense of security with them. I've come home after work to find my garage door open on several occasions. I know I shut it as I watched the door start to close but sunlight or debris over the sensors caused it to open when almost fully closed. I now get alerts when it's closed, when it's been closed for 5 minutes and I get a camera image with those alerts for verification. I also get an alert every 5 minutes with an image if it's open. If I don't get those alerts, I know something is up and can go back and check.


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## KPDMinc (Nov 7, 2016)

KHouse75 said:


> I'm not sure what year you are living in but all the technology discussed here is affordable for anyone, not just the rich.
> 
> With a $3 ESP8266 WiFi module, you can control anything wirelessly. Inexpensive Arduino microcontrollers and Raspberry PI PCs have opened up everything to the IOT (Internet of Things).
> 
> ...



Hey, KHouse - can you go into further detail on your consumption monitoring? I would also like to achieve this... Thanks!


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## KHouse75 (May 14, 2008)

KPDMinc said:


> Hey, KHouse - can you go into further detail on your consumption monitoring? I would also like to achieve this... Thanks!


There are several free and paid solutions on the market that monitor consumption in various ways.

Good links to check out are:

https://sense.com/
https://github.com/boblemaire/IoTaWatt
https://openenergymonitor.org/
https://community.openenergymonitor.org/
https://github.com/bemasher/rtlamr
https://osmocom.org/projects/sdr/wiki/Rtl-sdr
https://emoncms.org/
https://www.smappee.com


The first that I tried just monitors usage by listening for over the air broadcasts that some power meters send out every few seconds. To achieve this, I was using a program called rtlamr. rtlamr uses another program called rtl_tcp which is part of rtlsdr. Software Defined Radio (SDR) utilizes inexpensive DVB-T dongles based on the Realtek RTL2832U demodulator. You can purchase the dongles with antennas on Amazon for under $25. Basically, some really smart people figured out that you could tune these DVB-T dongles to a wide range of frequencies. You can listen to FM radio and air traffic. You can pull down weather satellite images. Capture and decode rf wireless remote controls and weather stations, etc. Back to rtlamr. rtl_tcp interfaces with the DVB-T dongle and you can tell it what frequency to tune. rtlamr connects to tcl_tcp via tcp/ip and tunes it to the frequency power meter broadcasts. It then unscrambles the data into a usable format that displays your meter ID and overall power consumption. You can then put this data into a database and create graphs of utilization. I upload everything to emoncms and to a copy of emoncms that I run on a raspberry pi which is running raspbian.

rtlamr worked great for about 9 months when I got mail from my power company letting me know they were moving to AMR power meters and would be installing mine in a few days. AMR meters don't broadcast OTA. They send the data over the power lines to the power company so I had to come up with a new solution.

IR Pulse monitoring is what I tried next and what I still use. Some power meters emit an infrared pulse per a certain usage of watts. You can monitor these pulses and keep track of your energy consumption. I purchased an inexpensive IR receiver from mouser. I think it was a TSL261R-LF (856-TSL261R-LF). I then have it hooked up to a raspberry pi running raspbian and I monitor for the voltage changes produced by the IR receiver. These pulses are loaded into emoncms where I manipulate the data and can create various graphs. Usage monitored via pulses is identical to to usage reported by my power company so it works perfectly.

I wanted more granularity so I started testing my own emontx via the open source data provided by openenergymontor.org. This would allow me to monitor several individual circuits but I never got around to fully implementing it. Openenergymonitor.org is 240v, European based so you have to know circuit design to be able to make it compatible with 120v.

I came across another project similar but much more advanced than emontx called Internet of Things appliance Electric Power monitor (itoawatt) which currently can monitor 14 individual circuits. He released it open source/hardware so you can build your own.

Sense Energy Monitor. I wanted the ability to know how much energy each individual electronic devices were using but couldn't anything available at the time. I was watching The This Old House Hour one day and they had a device called Sense which can pick out energy consumption of individual electronic devices. It looked promising so I purchase one even though I know it wasn't perfect and was relatively new and I would probably be a guinea pig. I was skeptical but it started finding devices. After a few weeks it had discovered different elements in my oven, curling iron, lights, two refrigerators, freezer, 3 A/C condensers, 1 Air handler, 2 furnaces, miter saw, disposal and others. Again, It's not perfect but it does work very well. Even if you it hasn't picked out a device, you can still see real time when things are turning on and off. This can then be used to track down what's using electricity.

I also picked up a smappee just to compare against sense. Smappee has found dozens of devices but it's really just a garbled mess. Nothing really corresponds to one particular device. It's almost as if it's only monitoring watts used instead of signature of a device. Sense if far superior.

I'm currently using IR monitoring, Sense and Smappee. Sense is what I use the most.


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