# Rain coming into door



## dcentuori (May 21, 2011)

Thought I'd cross post this, since this could be more about my door than my gutters. I have the same post on the roofing forum.
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Not sure if this is a gutter issue, since they seem to be hung OK and not clogged. But when we get heavy rain, the water seems to flow over the side of the gutter and directly onto our screen door which then pours on our wooden exterior door and it is getting water damage over the years.

Could just be a problem with the layout, since driving rain will directly hit the screen and do the same.

Any thing I can do to check to see if it is a gutter problem before I do anything else? I don't want to treat the symptoms, I want to find what really is going on.

Right now, I just put my storm windows back up to keep the water outside, but that is a temp. solution.

Thanks,

Dante


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

Are you sure there not clogged?

I can think of a handful of things that could be going on. 

Posting a few pictures here would help, including a shot showing the whole side of the house including the roof.


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## dcentuori (May 21, 2011)

I'll try to get pictures later this weekend. Scattered thunderstorms, so I may get action video too.

I'm pretty sure they aren't clogged enough to cause big problems. I just went up there this morning after the rain and there was some standing water, no more than 1/2 inch and some gunk on the strainer I have in the downspout top. When I cleared it there was a trickle of water freed up. I suppose I could just take the strainer out of that downspout opening nearest the trouble area.

I guess even if they were to be seriously clogged, there may be something odd or unusual about the way the water just hugs the outer edge of the gutter and separates from the surface at just the right spot so it is directed right at my screen and at a nice angle to just drive downward.

I also wonder if the momentum of the water going down the roof just takes it past the gutter in heavy rain. This is where I have a steeper angle.

Thanks,
Dante


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

dcentuori said:


> I'll
> 
> I also wonder if the momentum of the water going down the roof just takes it past the gutter in heavy rain. This is where I have a steeper angle.


That could be one issue for sure and pretty easy to check if you don’t mind getting a little wet.


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## dcentuori (May 21, 2011)

Nice downpour late this afternoon...unfortunately I wasn't home....

Anyway, if it helps, I took some photos of the roof and gutter. I tried to get at least part of the door in the photos so you had some perspective. Any gutter close ups are in the area directly above the door.

Hopefully I get some good rain again in the daytime for action shots!

Thanks,
Dante


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

The first thing that catches my eye is that the gutter apron is behind the gutter and not over and into it so we know that water can get behind the gutters.

Second, (and you can’t see this in the pictures) if the gutters were not removed when the fascia was wrapped then the wrap isn’t underneath the gutter apron so any water that’s getting behind the gutter is also getting behind the fascia wrap. 

If that is happening the water that’s getting behind the gutter and then the fascia wrap ends up behind the vinyl siding and likely behind the flange of the storm door. 

You started talking about a leaking door and finished with putting the storms back on the windows to keep the water out, do you have window leaks too?
Also in the second picture it looks like the gutter is split at the bend.

The best way to troubleshoot this is to get out there with a hose and try to recreate the leak. I’d start by spraying water behind the gutter.


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## dcentuori (May 21, 2011)

That sounds not good. Siding was done by previous owner, and I never noticed that detail, as it the gutter was not sagging and tight against it's attachment along the house. But I guess water could still get in there. I would suppose it was done that way everywhere!

Is this a big deal to rehang the gutters under the apron?

What can I look for to determine if the vinyl was wrapped around the fascia? I think the gutters were removed, based on evidence of new screw locations, but I know that is only a guess.

Water is not getting behind the storm door flange--storm window keeps wood door dry. It is the water dripping off (and behind I guess) the gutter and flying directly into the screen. Same problem when I have driving rain going directly into the door. But exacerbated when gutters also contribute.

No window leaks so far as I can tell, but we have storms there.

Gutter is not split, that gap you see is some metal mesh? that is sandwiched between the gutter and fascia and is bowed out more away from attachments. I"m guessing that has something to do with the roof venting.

Let me know if certain photos would help. Still expecting scattered thunderstorms. Hope I can get true in-situ observation today and not hose-simulations!

Also, I started two posts like this, with the other in Roofing, but now it's gone. I was hoping to get door and roof opinions. Anyone know what happened? 

Thanks,
Dante


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

R&R of the gutters is not a big deal if you know what your doing. A helper is a must in most cases.

I’ve been chasing leaks such as this for a very long time and if the problem isn’t obvious the hose test is the way to do it since you can control the water and systematicly rule things out.


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## dcentuori (May 21, 2011)

No pictures, but I looked more closely. I'm not sure if that is a gutter apron the gutter is installed over. I was able to feel around and look into the areas that had some play and it seems to be 4" long--if the gutter was reinstalled with that piece on the outside I would guess it could cover the gutter or extend to the bottom--diagrams and photos I googled don't show aprons that long. This "flange" does come down from under the shingles and the underside appears to have a metal mesh/screen along the length. So I"m not sure how that would fit over the gutter.

Does this help?

Dante


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

Like this.


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## dcentuori (May 21, 2011)

OK, this helps. To use your diagram as a reference, if I rehung my gutters like this, what would be the gutter flashing is long enough to touch the bottom of the gutter. In this scale, it would be at least twice as long as what is depicted here. And there is that wire mesh under the gutter flashing that appears to connect it to the fascia or roof that would prohibit the gutter from fitting underneath.

I'll try to get photos, but real hard since this is all inferred from feeling and looking in cracks.

Thanks,
Dante


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## Blondesense (Sep 23, 2008)

I admit I'm a total newbie in this area but I have two questions.
Where are the downspouts in this run? 
And are the gutters on the dormer serving any real purpose?


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## dcentuori (May 21, 2011)

Haven't had any updates due to vacation and bad timing with rain. Haven't been able to witness downpour while at home.

But to answer most recent question, the dormer gutters just spill out onto the roof. So I think I know what you're thinking--is there an extra flow coming from that lefthand gutter? I'll note that next time.

Only one downspout feeds this run, as the gutter wraps the sunroom to the left and terminates. That part of the gutter is only for a small overhang on the sunroom, not a full roof. The downspout is on the right, about 8-10 feet away from the sunroom. And of course, it also needs to handle the gutters halfway to the next downspout.

All my directions are from the perspective of standing on the deck and looking directly at my problem door.

If anyone suspects my downspout is overloaded, other than the linear feet of the gutters, what other measurements could be useful for you to determine this?

Thanks,
Dante


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