# Can't remove Ceiling Electrical Box



## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

That style can not be removed and replaced with a fan box from below.
It has two adjustable arms attach that are nailed to the joist in the attic.
By removing the 4 screws the box would come out but the arms would still be in the way in the attic.
http://www-public.tnb.com/ps/fulltilt/index.cgi?part=309094


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## diyorpay (Sep 21, 2010)

Joe-

If the box is accessible in the attic, would it be ok to remove screws from below, and adjustable arms from above, and sister a new 2x4 piece on its side between joists directly over box, then attach 4 long screws and lock washers/nuts thru box holes and 2x4 ?


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

If you lay a 2 X 4 flat instead and screw the box to that there would be no reason to remove the screws or arms.
I like to predrill the angled holes and insert 3" long screws in the hole far enough so they do not stick out down below then go in the attic and attach it to the joist in the attic. That way your not trying to drill and screw while trying to not fall through the ceiling balancing on the joist.
Predrill the holes in the box so you do not break the box with the screws.


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

You can remove that box from below. Easiest is to breaker it up, then pry the "J" bracket off the side of the ceiling joist. 
Than you can use a fan Smart Box screwed into the side of the joist.


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## greentrees (Apr 28, 2012)

diyorpay said:


> Joe-
> 
> If the box is accessible in the attic, would it be ok to remove screws from below, and adjustable arms from above, and sister a new 2x4 piece on its side between joists directly over box, then attach 4 long screws and lock washers/nuts thru box holes and 2x4 ?


It look like it will be difficult to get to the box from above. There is a lot of foam up there. I would have to lay a panel up there to be able to walk across. I assume I could put a 4x8 plywood up there and keep it up there?

Does the box look like it is fan rated? It moves around a bit so I wouldn't think it would work with a fan, unless there is a way of stabilizing it more, but the pins don't look like they can be tightened.


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## brric (Mar 5, 2010)

You could also try drilling out those rivets from below to free the box from the bracket.


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## sirsparksalot (Oct 16, 2010)

These are a PITA. If this is a plastic box, just try to cut it out with diagonal cutters or some such tool.


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## J. V. (Jun 1, 2007)

Just go up there!


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## greentrees (Apr 28, 2012)

brric said:


> You could also try drilling out those rivets from below to free the box from the bracket.


Yes, drilling them out won't be a problem. But the original box used a metal bracket, rather than attaching directly to the joist, so if I drill out the box, I might not be able to put another one up there without taking out a large area of drywall, in order to attach to the joist. 

I am going to check the other rooms, and see if I can install the fan there instead.



sirsparksalot said:


> These are a PITA. If this is a plastic box, just try to cut it out with diagonal cutters or some such tool.


Yes, PITA.


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## k_buz (Mar 22, 2012)

Remove the screws holding the box to the bracket

Cut the bracket, or go up in the attic and remove the bracket

Install a remodel fan brace from below, or rough fan brace from above

Absolutely no need to remove drywall.


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## brric (Mar 5, 2010)

k_buz said:


> Remove the screws holding the box to the bracket
> 
> Cut the bracket, or go up in the attic and remove the bracket
> 
> ...


There are NO screws, there are rivets holding the box to an L bracket attached to the structure. Remove the box, remove the bracket, proceed with installing a fan rated bracket and/or box.


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## k_buz (Mar 22, 2012)

brric said:


> There are NO screws, there are rivets holding the box to an L bracket attached to the structure. Remove the box, remove the bracket, proceed with installing a fan rated bracket and/or box.


Looked like screws to me. 

Still no reason to remove any drywall tho


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## greentrees (Apr 28, 2012)

k_buz said:


> Remove the screws holding the box to the bracket
> 
> Cut the bracket, or go up in the attic and remove the bracket
> 
> ...


I don't think I will go up to the attic and wake through the insulation. If I remove the box from the bottom I think the old bracket will get in the way of the new bracket. I could try to remove the bracket from the bottom, but think it will be difficult thorough such a small hole (4 inches).


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## Code05 (May 24, 2009)

Screws or rivets, just get them out and remove the box and bracket.

Use a remodel fan brace kit with box, or a fan rated Smart box if you are up against the stud.

This can all be accomplished from below.


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## k_buz (Mar 22, 2012)

If you can't do it from below yourself without removing drywall, call and electrician to install the fan rated box. It will be worth the cost vs. repairing the drywall.


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## Code05 (May 24, 2009)

greentrees said:


> I don't think I will go up to the attic and wake through the insulation. If I remove the box from the bottom I think the old bracket will get in the way of the new bracket. I could try to remove the bracket from the bottom, but think it will be difficult thorough such a small hole (4 inches).


I will admit, I am an electrician and have done this dozens of times. 

Getting the bracket out is a pain, but is possible.

If it is an L bracket, a pry bar or large screw driver will pry it out. If it is a brace, cut it in half, stick your arm through with a hammer and get the pieces off the studs, just leave the garbage in the attic pushed out of the way.

If you are not comfortable, than just hire a sparky.


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

I have to say, this is getting blown WAY out of proportion.

JUST BREAK THE BOX out of there. Then pry off the bracket.


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