# How long after soldering copper fitting do you need to wait B4 you can run water thru



## joed

Long enough for the solder to cool which is about 30 seconds after you take away the heat.


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## Arsinek

joed said:


> Long enough for the solder to cool which is about 30 seconds after you take away the heat.



Wow, so after like 1 minute I can run water through the connection I just made?

What about pressure on the fitting? Like how long until I can treat it like a fitting thats been there for a year?


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## TheEplumber

Arsinek said:


> Wow, so after like 1 minute I can run water through the connection I just made?
> 
> What about pressure on the fitting? Like how long until I can treat it like a fitting thats been there for a year?


As soon as you put water in it.


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## Arsinek

Well Im done. One connection was squirting water and the other had a stream running down it. I did a bunch of researching before trying and I still couldnt get it so Im just going to pay someone to put some copper to pvc fittings on and go with pvc.


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## shakey0818

Not related but still funny anyway.Yesterday i was doing some pluming for a new toilet nile and just finished soldering the cap on the end of the toilet line and forgot to wait till it to cool and turned the supply on while on my knees and the cap shot right off like a bullet and hit me square in the balls.Hurt like hell but i learned from that one.I usually use a wet rag to wipe every joint i make right after i solder it.It cools it down and helps the pipes from turning green in time.


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## TheEplumber

Arsinek said:


> Well Im done. One connection was squirting water and the other had a stream running down it. I did a bunch of researching before trying and I still couldnt get it so Im just going to pay someone to put some copper to pvc fittings on and go with pvc.


The choice is yours if you want to pay someone, but PVC is not to be used inside a house on domestic water. Use CPVC or PEX, or copper and push fit fittings


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## Larryh86GT

shakey0818 said:


> Not related but still funny anyway.Yesterday i was doing some pluming for a new toilet nile and just finished soldering the cap on the end of the toilet line and forgot to wait till it to cool and turned the supply on while on my knees and the cap shot right off like a bullet and hit me square in the balls.Hurt like hell but i learned from that one.I usually use a wet rag to wipe every joint i make right after i solder it.It cools it down and helps the pipes from turning green in time.


I had to laugh. This is a lot funnier when it happens to someone else. :laughing:


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## Arsinek

TheEplumber said:


> The choice is yours if you want to pay someone, but PVC is not to be used inside a house on domestic water. Use CPVC or PEX, or copper and push fit fittings


CPVC, is what I meant.


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## jsbuilders

Buy a few shark bites.


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## Arsinek

jsbuilders said:


> Buy a few shark bites.



I had that thought. But whats the lifespan on those things?


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## gregzoll

Arsinek said:


> Wow, so after like 1 minute I can run water through the connection I just made?
> 
> What about pressure on the fitting? Like how long until I can treat it like a fitting thats been there for a year?


Umm yes, it is within a minute, that you can turn back on the water. It will be as good as any soldered connection, that is a year, two, five, twenty, etc., as long as the person that does it properly knows how to sweat a joint properly.


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## gregzoll

shakey0818 said:


> It cools it down and helps the pipes from turning green in time.


Copper turns green, which is called Patna, which is a natural process. Has nothing to do with cooling it down after soldering a joint.


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## shakey0818

gregzoll said:


> Copper turns green, which is called Patna, which is a natural process. Has nothing to do with cooling it down after soldering a joint.


Ty for clearing this up for me i allways thought the flux helped it turn green faster when not wiped.


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## jsbuilders

Arsinek said:


> I had that thought. But whats the lifespan on those things?


25 years, I believe.


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## Fix'n it

shakey0818 said:


> and the cap shot right off like a bullet and hit me square in the balls.


:laughing:


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## ddawg16

Ya know, for some reason I don't feel so dumb now..............


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## RWolff

Arsinek said:


> Well Im done. One connection was squirting water and the other had a stream running down it. I did a bunch of researching before trying and I still couldnt get it so Im just going to pay someone to put some copper to pvc fittings on and go with pvc.


With copper soldering, the metal has to be good and CLEAN inside and out where the solder goes, and enough flux used to coat it. If you got leaks like that either there were spots that didn't get clean enough, were not coated with flux, or you could have just gotten it too hot and started boiling the solder, or not hot enough.
It's an art and takes practice, but if you do the above properly, and use good solder not cheap stuff, you heat the joint not the stick of solder, and then let the heat of the pipe melt the solder when it contacts it, not the flame of the torch, and let the solder flow in the join till it stops, and then take the torch away and don't disturb the pipe for a couple of minutes while it cools.

Maybe a youtube video will help you, it is difficult to tell someone how via text.
Oh, and if this is a water pipe, you can't use lead solder any more, you need to use the lead-free solder which is mostly tin $$


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## RWolff

shakey0818 said:


> Ty for clearing this up for me i allways thought the flux helped it turn green faster when not wiped.


The flux like "No Korrode" is an acid, you really want to completely wipe it OFF and get rid of any residue, you don't really want the pipe to turn green- it will if you leave a residue on it or the pipe gets wet on the outside or is exposed to the weather it turns green the same as copper gutters and roofs do. If it happens it happens, but you dont want to force it to happen by leaving flux residue all over.


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## md2lgyk

shakey0818 said:


> Ty for clearing this up for me i allways thought the flux helped it turn green faster when not wiped.


I've also heard it's better to wipe off the flux. I always do. And the green stuff isn't called patina, it called verdigris (at least that's what we called it in the Navy).


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## gregzoll

md2lgyk said:


> I've also heard it's better to wipe off the flux. I always do. And the green stuff isn't called patina, it called verdigris (at least that's what we called it in the Navy).


Verdigris is what happens when you apply Acetic acid, or Vinegar to Copper, Brass or Bronze. Also it is the proper name of the reaction that happens, when Copper, Bronze, Brass are exposed to the elements. The common name is Patina.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verdigris


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## jagans

You should wait till the solder thoroughly cools to room temperature which can take about 20 minutes. Hitting hot solder with a wet cloth can cause it to crack. Washing the joint after it has cooled with soap and water is the way to remove remaining flux. 

Leaking solder joints are usually the result of improper cleaning.


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## TheBobmanNH

From my own experience, with someone who is new to soldering, a "leak" is more often caused by heating the solder rather than the joint. When you're new you don't know what to look for and think you're doing something wrong when it takes FOREVER (if you're using propane) to get the thing hot enough.


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## jagans

TheBobmanNH said:


> From my own experience, with someone who is new to soldering, a "leak" is more often caused by heating the solder rather than the joint. When you're new you don't know what to look for and think you're doing something wrong when it takes FOREVER (if you're using propane) to get the thing hot enough.


It is a given that you heat the fitting not the actual joint. I have used a simple benrz-o-matic torch with propane to solder copper up to 3/4 inch for years and I have NEVER had a bad joint or a leak. I always use tinning flux, so I can see when the flux "Tins Off" I then follow up with wire solder and watch the capillary action suck the solder right into the joint. A small drip under the fitting is the telltale sign of a good joint. I like propane because it is not too hot. High Heat= Oxidation= flux burnoff= bad joint.


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## TheBobmanNH

jagans said:


> It is a given that you heat the fitting not the actual joint. I have used a simple benrz-o-matic torch with propane to solder copper up to 3/4 inch for years and I have NEVER had a bad joint or a leak. I always use tinning flux, so I can see when the flux "Tins Off" I then follow up with wire solder and watch the capillary action suck the solder right into the joint. A small drip under the fitting is the telltale sign of a good joint. I like propane because it is not too hot. High Heat= Oxidation= flux burnoff= bad joint.


I understand that "it's a given." Doesn't mean it's not a common rookie mistake.


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## TheEplumber

TheBobmanNH said:


> I understand that "it's a given." Doesn't mean it's not a common rookie mistake.


IMO- lack of properly located heat or simply lack of heat is the #1 reason solder joints fail.
For over 2 decades I have soldered pipe ranging from 1/2"- 4". 
I have been involved in unscientific "what if" tests and have decided that some steps people say are needed to solder don't always apply.
But 4 things are required- Clean material, flux, solder and heat.
The rest is a matter of opinion, preferences and jobsite conditions

http://www.diychatroom.com/f98/how-solder-copper-pipes-39020/


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## biggles

didn't have to call in somebody..should of just drained the line grab the soldered area with some steel wool..flux it and hit it again keeping the torch 1" away without moving it and when the exsisting flux gets wet go around the connect with the solder.as said you have to be super clean with soft solder..the fittings,connection ends even pull on a length of solder with steel wool and dip it in flux before applying it...always have a damp rag near by after the pipe/solder cools and then run it around the joints.


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## fetzer85

...reminds me of the first time I tried sweating a copper pipe. Didn't have a propane torch at the time, just a little butane torch. I read that you needed propane b/c butane didn't get hot enough. I thought what the heck and tried it anyways. Well after about 5min of heating I agreed with what everyone said. The solder wasn't even thinking about melting. Drove up the road to tractor supply, bought a benzomatic propane torch and haven't had any problems since. I've only sweat 1/2" pipe but I find that counting to 12 and then applying the solder is usually pretty good timing.


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## Amateuralex

Arsinek said:


> I had that thought. But whats the lifespan on those things?


I've talked to plumbers who hate them and are positive that they are satanic, and some plumbers who think they are great and work fine.

I've used a few and they were unbelievably easy and are still working 2 years later.

Still not sure what to think. But my god the ease....


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## VIPlumber

Don't give up yet. Instead of bringing in someone you could try a compression fitting like this,


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## jsbuilders

Amateuralex said:


> I've talked to plumbers who hate them and are positive that they are satanic.


Have you thought about why they think they are satanic, ask him how many service call he averaged before and after they came out, I use the a lot in tight spaces if I can't sweat it


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## ddawg16

TheEplumber said:


> IMO- lack of properly located heat or simply lack of heat is the #1 reason solder joints fail.
> For over 2 decades I have soldered pipe ranging from 1/2"- 4".
> I have been involved in unscientific "what if" tests and have decided that some steps people say are needed to solder don't always apply.
> But 4 things are required- *Clean material*, flux, solder and heat.
> The rest is a matter of opinion, preferences and jobsite conditions
> 
> http://www.diychatroom.com/f98/how-solder-copper-pipes-39020/


Allow me to stress....clean.....

I've pulled apart of a couple of my solder joints that failed, from what I can tell, the failure was 'clean'...second was heat...caused by water being in the line (white bread is your friend)


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## Amateuralex

jsbuilders said:


> Have you thought about why they think they are satanic, ask him how many service call he averaged before and after they came out, I use the a lot in tight spaces if I can't sweat it


Yeah it's a plausible motivation. I've hired a few plumbers who were positively experts at making money.

The plumber I use now has sweated copper on every job I've hired him for, but he's one of the guys who says sharkbites work just fine.


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## Stan the Man 25

Yes do clean the fitting after soldering, flux is an acid. 
BUT first let the solder cool, wait a few minutes, do not clean right away, especially with a wet rag, cools the solder too quickly and it can crack!!

Yes we prefer a clean solder joint, but functionality over looks!


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