# Painting Over Cigarette Smoke



## PaintedSurface (Mar 27, 2009)

I need to repaint interior of the whole house in which people have been smoking for about 3 years. How do i go about it?
Do i wash everything first then prime it? Or can i just prime it without washing it, and which primer?


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## housepaintingny (Jul 25, 2009)

Clean the walls first, tsp works well for cleaning nicotine off of walls, then prime with a stain blocking primer, such as Sherwin Williams Problock, after cleaning and priming paint with a paint of your choice


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## tpolk (Nov 7, 2009)

yeah i smoke and i'm not happy about my next painting excursion. nasty habit (hackhack)


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

IMO, Bin is a requirement for going over nicotine stains,I do not think pro block or much of anything else is labeled for or will work as well as Bin.


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## ccarlisle (Jul 2, 2008)

Look, many of the opinions you'll get here - including mine - are kinda 'idealisitic' because - in some cases, but not mine -they come from years and years of trial and error or represent thoretical answers given from _our_ vantage point. Thus they may not be the best solution _for your situation, your tastes and/or your budget._ 

So accept this as being from my personal preference: nicotine and all the hundreds of other organic compounds that are releaed into the air when a cigarette is burned are all carbonised oils and chemicals that may end up on your wall. Many are acidic. Some may head for the curtains, some too heavy to float around and end up in the carpet, some are water-soluble so they stick to moist surfaces - but all may or may not be on the walls you wish to paint. 

Now, any foreign compound may interfere with the coalescing of individual paint monomers in a coat of fresh paint and therefore will give you a less-than-ideal paint job. Now is the amount noticeable? probably not...but some of us can't afford to take the chance that they are and end up giving us a botched job.

Ideally, you'd wash it off with TSP or something, (maybe) prime it and paint it. But maybe there's not enough to interfere with a good-enough-to-you paint job, so a good sealer application would be fine. Maybe even, a reallly good paint would give you acceptable results. We can't tell from here...

I have had jobs where I had to wash the walls twice, prime it with 'Fresh Start', then apply two coats of BM's best to get the results I felt were OK. But then again, I was paid for that result. Yet on others, BIN was needed and on others nothing was needed. The difference between these jobs? I went there did a bit of testing and came up with a recommendation that validated the expectations and the budget. 

Just don't holler when wash+prime+paint is too much, nor when BIN isn't enough or when just paint does fine. It all depends...


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## Clutchcargo (Mar 31, 2007)

Many years ago, I moved into an apartment that was freshly painted. I thought I was in the movie Amityville horror because about 2 or 3 weeks into my lease, the walls started bleeding. Not just here and there, it was everywhere. Come to find out that the walls were not cleaned and the owner simply painted over the heavily nicotined walls. 
Moral of the story, lack of proper preparation will kill a paint job every time.


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## <*(((>< (Mar 6, 2009)

First hand experience here. About a year ago my wife and I purchased a foreclosure that had been smoked in for 5-6 years. The smell was horrendous, I purchased the home sight unseen (my dad looked at it, as I was then in another state) he told me it had been smoked in and that the smell was pretty bad, boy was I surprised when I actually smelt the place. It was bad.

Nevertheless, it was a nice newly built home which we bought for a good price. 

What we did was wash EVERYTHING (walls, ceilings, fixtures, molding, etc), with TSP, which worked great as you could see the orange nicotine streaming down the walls with the TSP. Then after letting the TSP sit for 15 minutes or so we went back and rinsed the walls with water. We used several cheap sponge mops and some buckets, which worked well.

Another thing we did is have the window shades up as much as possible as the UV will break down oders, and left windows open as well.

After all of this the, entire house, minus the molding, got painted with BIN, which is really caustic smelling, and just from the smell it seemed like I picked the right product. The stuff is GREAT, I wouldn't recommend anything else, because there is no reason to, as BIN took care of the smell.

Now in our house there is not even a hint of smoke smell, I even ask new people to my house if they can smell anything, just because I know people can get used to smells pretty quick. And everyone always answers no.

Good luck with your painting and do your own research, I'm sure you will find out the same things I did.



chrisn said:


> IMO, Bin is a requirement for going over nicotine stains,I do not think pro block or much of anything else is labeled for or will work as well as Bin.


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## housepaintingny (Jul 25, 2009)

SW Problock will effectively block solvent based stains, tar, grease and ink. It dries quickly, low odor and low voc and is a Stain Blocking Primer.


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

housepaintingny said:


> SW Problock will effectively block solvent based stains, tar, grease and ink. It dries quickly, low odor and low voc and is a Stain Blocking Primer.


 
Yes, but is it labeled for nicotine? I don't think so,I could be wrong. I have never come across ANY oil based or latex primer that will cover nicotine satin . Bin is labeled for just that and most anything else.


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## slickshift (Aug 25, 2005)

PaintedSurface said:


> I need to repaint interior of the whole house in which people have been smoking for about 3 years. How do i go about it?
> Do i wash everything first then prime it? Or can i just prime it without washing it, and which primer?


Wash everything as best you can
The TSP mix is good for this

Then you'll need to seal what's left (and there will be stuff left), seal out the odor (that has permeated the surfaces), and give your future paint coats something to hold onto
The best product for this is Zinsser's BIN
It is a pigmented shellac
It is tricky to work with, and you'll need a VOC/odor respirator (<do not go cheap on this)
But it's the only thing that _will_ work _every_ time

If it was a very light contamination, and it cleaned up great, I might..._might_ consider an oil-based sealer like Zinsser's Cover-Stain
But not really...it'd have to be a real reason I couldn't use BIN, like the H/O is bed-ridden and can't handle the smell or something

There's not one water-based sealer I can recommend for this
Yes, if it's not too bad, some might work
But that's "if" and "might"
And that's too much of a chance of an Amityville Horror re-make for me


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

slickshift said:


> Wash everything as best you can
> The TSP mix is good for this
> 
> Then you'll need to seal what's left (and there will be stuff left), seal out the odor (that has permeated the surfaces), and give your future paint coats something to hold onto
> ...


 
Now, that is what I was trying to say!:thumbup:


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## mazzonetv (Feb 25, 2009)

I know Zinsser's cover stain and I believe their odorless oil primer both list nicotine - usually we use the odorless if someone can't handle the smell - the odorless actually has a picture of painting over nicotine stains right on the front of the can. The bin, however, is the best for not only blocking the stain but blocking the odor. If you can deal with the smell of the bin - it's the best!


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## cain8858 (Jun 11, 2009)

One more vote for BIN. I picked it based on slickshifts advice and it did not fail. I purchased a house that must have been smoked in for decades. Sellers painted the walls with a yellow tinged white to try to hide the bleed through. This meant that cleaning it off was not possible since it was already under a layer of latex paint. 

We went through something like 50 gallons of BIN and applied two coats on every single surface (ceiling, wall, trim, doors, etc etc). Still have the pyramid of buckets. The house doesn't smell. The BIN did an astounding job at blocking and sealing in odors. 

I would just echo the advice above that is DON'T skimp on the respirator. I used a 3m half face with an organic vapor cartridge. The other note, is that these cartridges will not last forever and you should replace them periodically.


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

That is a LOT of Bin!


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## cain8858 (Jun 11, 2009)

No Kidding, it was pretty crazy. I should go get an accurate count of the number of five gallon buckets I've got sitten around the house. Perhaps 50 was high, but I have something like 6-10 empty five gallon buckets sitting about, and an assortment of empty 1 gallon cans.

Has anyone ever sprayed BIN? I imagine it would be fantastic in that it would go on really fast. But I can't imagine the mess and how nasty it would be to do.

B


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## slickshift (Aug 25, 2005)

b_corwin said:


> Has anyone ever sprayed BIN? I imagine it would be fantastic in that it would go on really fast. But I can't imagine the mess and how nasty it would be to do.


You would be imagining it correctly

We get a lot of...well I'm not how to describe them unless you are familiar with them
A lot of old cottage, porch, barn "conversions" where it was just a summer cottage or barn, and is now to be used as living space
Well, often the ceiling, and often the walls too, are just old wood planks
Sometimes from the '30s, sometimes from the 1800s or older, so we're not talking smoothly planed stuff here
And they are very old and dark and light stained (time, moisture, salt) and black from long term water leaks that weren't in an actual bedroom (and the inevitable NorthEasters out here can push moisture into any crevice), so were "lived" with for decades on end

The stuff is so rough hewn, taking a brush and roller to them is almost madness
So yeah, we buck up, suit up...and spray the BIN


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

slickshift said:


> You would be imagining it correctly
> 
> We get a lot of...well I'm not how to describe them unless you are familiar with them
> A lot of old cottage, porch, barn "conversions" where it was just a summer cottage or barn, and is now to be used as living space
> ...


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## cain8858 (Jun 11, 2009)

*wow*

wow i bet thats messy as all get out. 

walked around the house, found 8 five gallon buckets and another five one gallon cans of bin.

yikes.


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

Thats still a lot of Bin:laughing:


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## slickshift (Aug 25, 2005)

b_corwin said:


> ... found 8 five gallon buckets and another five one gallon cans of bin.
> 
> yikes.





chrisn said:


> Thats still a lot of Bin


 Yikes yeah!
That is _a lot_ of BIN!!!


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

vrvs said:


> *I found a simple permanent answer for smoking odor control one simple application removes odor from carpets, curtains and furniture. While researching in China I came across a product that you mix with paint that eliminates odors by releasing negative ions in the air, works by convection currents, warm air rises cool air falls creating a natural flow of air across the painted walls. I have had this in my home for over a year, works like a charm. No odor, no electrify and no problems.*


 
That's it?


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## Brushjockey (Mar 8, 2011)

BTW- I am working on a home with a heavy smoker- lots of nic residue on everything. Washed walls and ww with krud Kutter( just a fairly quick one, not going for really clean) and primed once with Smart Prime. 
Stopped the stain in it's tracks! Let dry over night as a precaution- finished WW in 1 coat Aura White dove. From NICOTINE brown
I was impressed.


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

Brushjockey said:


> BTW- I am working on a home with a heavy smoker- lots of nic residue on everything. Washed walls and ww with krud Kutter( just a fairly quick one, not going for really clean) and primed once with Smart Prime.
> Stopped the stain in it's tracks! Let dry over night as a precaution- finished WW in 1 coat Aura White dove. From NICOTINE brown
> I was impressed.


I am going to try it next time I need a primer.


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## Ironlight (Apr 13, 2011)

I sprayed BIN on the unfinished wood joist and subfloor ceiling of a 85 year old basement. Took about 6 gallons and worked well but the fumes were deadly. I had to stop and get every box fan I had going in the exterior doorway. It was a bit scary till I got the air moving through there. The result is great though. Nice bright basement ceiling.


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## Andy306 (Oct 31, 2011)

I agree with chrisn - BIn is the best. It's alcohol based it will cut through and adhere to most problem areas. The shellac forms a barrier that will not let anything through. It dries in 30 mins and redcoat time is one hour. I worked. for a restoration company for a few years and we bought this stuff in bulk.


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## dpieracci (Dec 23, 2011)

*Painting of newly painted walls with BIN?*

We bought a short sale and found out that only one room was smoked in by the mother in law. I knew from the smell and the carpet. I've never been in a home where someone smoked not have I had to clean/paint after one. My Mom cleaned the walls with TSP and left to dry. She's the painter in the family so I took her advise. This being my 9 year old sons room, he wanted a SF Giants theme so we painted the walls and closet. Never got to the ceiling. After 2 weeks, I just noticed the smell of stale smoke in the room. Thought it was the wooden closet doors and took them out to paint, too but I researched smoking and painting and realized we should have done more to "seal" in the smoke. My Mom (who laughed at my lack of painting skills) seems miffed when I told her we should have used a primer or shellac. My question is...can I purchase BIN or another primer and paint right over the newly painted room? The walls are clean but do I need to wash them again? My Mom seems to think it "power of suggestion" but it's not...I can smell the stale smoke. Can I use a transparent shellac to seal in the already painted walls? Does BIN do that?


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

dpieracci said:


> We bought a short sale and found out that only one room was smoked in by the mother in law. I knew from the smell and the carpet. I've never been in a home where someone smoked not have I had to clean/paint after one. My Mom cleaned the walls with TSP and left to dry. She's the painter in the family so I took her advise. This being my 9 year old sons room, he wanted a SF Giants theme so we painted the walls and closet. Never got to the ceiling. After 2 weeks, I just noticed the smell of stale smoke in the room. Thought it was the wooden closet doors and took them out to paint, too but I researched smoking and painting and realized we should have done more to "seal" in the smoke. My Mom (who laughed at my lack of painting skills) seems miffed when I told her we should have used a primer or shellac. My question is...can I purchase BIN or another primer and paint right over the newly painted room? The walls are clean but do I need to wash them again? My Mom seems to think it "power of suggestion" but it's not...I can smell the stale smoke. Can I use a transparent shellac to seal in the already painted walls? Does BIN do that?


Before I would do anything to what you already painted, prime and paint the ceiling:yes: Use Bin for the primer


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## dpieracci (Dec 23, 2011)

chrisn said:


> Before I would do anything to what you already painted, prime and paint the ceiling:yes: Use Bin for the primer


I will do that. How much ventilation is needed? Could I open the windows and use the ceiling fan?


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