# Can i clean out my septic tank myself?



## tireshark (Aug 17, 2014)

Tank has 3.5 feet of material in it... looks like roughly a 4x3 square structure.


The top scum layer is like a foot thick, and it's almost physically impossible to break through it in some spots (its like a big heavy quilt). In the spots i was able to break through, i go down to the bottom of the tank and never feel a sludge layer.


It seems to me that the scum layer is blocking the inlet and pretty much preventing anything from getting to the bottom. The bottom 'feels' pretty much liquid under the scum layer. 



I'm not afraid of sticking my arms down into the tank and pulling the scum layer out, if it would save me $400.


A. Is it feasible to just pull the scum layer out by hand?


B. If so, is there somewhere i can dispose of it? Like put it in big contractor trash bags or something and take it to the city dump or somewhere that would accept it?


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## joed (Mar 13, 2005)

The material is hazardous waste and needs to go to sanitary treatment plant. There is no way you can clean it yourself. Around here it is about $150 to pump a tank. Money well spent.


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## tireshark (Aug 17, 2014)

Thanks for the input.

I was hoping i could just pull the scum layer out (which i wouldnt think would be terribly difficult), and take it to the sanitation disposal place myself. 

Is this unheard of? 

Cheapest that im getting quoted around here is $350-400. That's a lot of cash for only needing about a foot of material removed from the top of the tank.


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## gregzoll (Dec 25, 2006)

There is a reason why it costs so much to have a tank pumped. You are paying for Labor, the wear and tear on the truck and equipment to pump, the license that they have to carry as Plumbers, EPA, state Sanitary license, tags and title, insurance on the vehicle, in case they damage a person's property, able to still get paid through their workman's comp if injured, such as what AFLAC does, payroll if they are paying someone as their employee or paying theirself to help pay their bills, the list goes on.

You will not be getting a foot of material removed from the tank, you are going to be getting the whole tank emptied. What you see is the first chamber, there should be one or two more lids for each section. As for that sludge, they actually will use a steel bar that has an flat rectangular section that is like a knife to break through, or they will use a spade or shovel.

Unless you are daring and do not have any open sores, which actually the bed under your nails can absorb the bacteria inside the tank, which is human waste. You would quickly realize that there is a reason why people get sick and get Flesh eating bacteria.

As for that sludge. That comes from people pouring grease down the drain, soaps, body oils, wrong products for toilet paper, etc, too much detergent and fabric softener in the washing machine.

If there is an issue of too much house waste like grease, etc getting poured down the drain, you really need to get a grease trap installed. Also using Gray Water, which is from the washing machine that would go through a filter and be reused for other items, that can help cut down on how much water is going into the tank.

The biggest issue that you will encounter is that most likely your drain field has failed, because of the system not being properly maintained, your costs are going to get even more.


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## jimn (Nov 13, 2010)

You likely have a hardened sludge layer as well. Sounds like this tank has been neglected for years and you may have more issues. I am not sure where you live, but in our neck of the woods septic tank up pumping has to to be taken to a sewage treatment facility. Pretty sure they won't accept material from a homeowner. It costs me 220 every four years to have my tank pumped out and inspected. For that I get a properly functioning tank that should go for years. Money well spent . Beats the 20 grand to replace a neglected system.


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## SHEPLMBR (Mar 4, 2016)

You are kidding right? Your tank cleaners pay a fee for proper disposal. Not to mention doing it the way you want to is like a major health hazard and you could potentially DIE. 
__________________


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## SeniorSitizen (Sep 10, 2012)

So how is a pump going to pump a big heavy scum layer like a quilt that could hardly be broken through?


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## ZTMAN (Feb 19, 2015)

And, in our neck of the woods,we have to provide proof, once every three years, that the tank was pumped and the pumping co has to certify the tank, and that it was pumped.


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## ben's plumbing (Oct 6, 2011)

while I encourage diy projects to help owners save money and gain knowledge....what your asking .cannot and should not be done....why... well 1 st its a law to have proper disposal...where would you get rid of the waste...2nd. you already said your not afraid to stick your hand in human waste to save money,,so will let that one go...3rd .its a small price to pay for having a septic system....people on city sewage pay 75-150 per month

4th.. well I must say ...its just plain wrong..." A MAN GOT TO KNOW HIS LIMITATIONS"


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## Bud9051 (Nov 11, 2015)

I'm certainly one to save a buck when I can, even at an advanced age I will be replacing my entire roof. But no way would I touch that job and no way would my town want me to do so. There are plenty of other way to save the required money.

You could explain you have the cleanout open and will take care of filling and covering it to try and get a slightly better price. If your access is easy where they can get in and out without a hassle, explain that, time is money for any business.

But getting it done right is more than removing what you are looking at. If not right it could hasten a complete failure where solids and grease enter your leach field and THEN you don't want to see the quotes.

Bud


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## goobertime (Mar 19, 2016)

once cleaned out properly, you can save money in the future on proper maintenance of the tank..methane gas is poisonous to breath in, if your gona be face to face with the sludge...


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## joed (Mar 13, 2005)

SeniorSitizen said:


> So how is a pump going to pump a big heavy scum layer like a quilt that could hardly be broken through?


It is not actually a pump. It is a giant vacuum that sucks it out.


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## SeniorSitizen (Sep 10, 2012)

I'd like to invite the OP to keep us posted on the process and final cost of removing the foot thick layer with a vacuum pump.

I predict what will happen is the pumper will penetrate the thick layer, pump the liquid out and say that's pumped and the bill will be 3-4 hundred $.


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## gregzoll (Dec 25, 2006)

ben's plumbing said:


> 3rd .its a small price to pay for having a septic system....people on city sewage pay 75-150 per month
> 
> 4th.. well I must say ...its just plain wrong..." A MAN GOT TO KNOW HIS LIMITATIONS"


You are telling me that I have been underpaying. My sewer is the same as water use. It is really nice when you are empty nesters and your kids are gone. The bill goes way down. We actually pay around $21 for the city to take crap to the plant.


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## Tom738 (Jun 1, 2010)

ZTMAN said:


> And, in our neck of the woods,we have to provide proof, once every three years, that the tank was pumped and the pumping co has to certify the tank, and that it was pumped.


OK, that is just overregulation and possibly lobbying from septic companies. I could see five years, maybe, but every three years is just a tax on little old ladies who live alone.


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## SHEPLMBR (Mar 4, 2016)

Tom738 said:


> OK, that is just overregulation and possibly lobbying from septic companies. I could see five years, maybe, but every three years is just a tax on little old ladies who live alone.


 depends on size of tank.


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## tireshark (Aug 17, 2014)

Thanks for the input everyone. Well, after reading some of you talk about multiple sections in a septic system, i went out to dig some more to see if i had it all... and you were right, what i was looking at was just one small section. Here is a photo of the entire thing (at least i think it's pretty much the whole thing) exposed... i had only uncovered the section where the hole is, and thought that was all of it.











Now that i realize how much is there, i will probably just call the septic company. I still feel like i could physically remove all of it, but that much material is way too much to deal with. I might could deal with it if it was just that small section, but i'm not going to tackle the whole thing.

I replaced the entire drain field myself last year, and i've replace 99% of the piping under the house leading into it... so after i get it pumped, im hoping it will be good to go for many years.

BTW, here is a short video of me poking the scum layer so you can get an idea of how thick it is. In the spot where the shadow is, i couldn't even break through... and where it broke through in the rest of it is because of me probing it yesterday. 

This is a rental house and it hasn't been pumped out in 'i think' 10 years (it's my parents, and i started helping my mom with the maintenance on it about 3 years ago when my dad passed)... so lots of baby wipes im sure, and possibly even roots as well.

I was expecting to see more than one lid, and separation between the sides... but sticking my stick in there and probing around it feels like its just a big box with an inlet and outlet in it. I imagine the mass is interfering with the outlet, because it looks like its actually blocking it from this angle. I'll find out more about the internal structure when it's empty.








I'm like seniorcitizen... going to be interesting to see how they deal with this. Hopefully they can break it up enough to suck out without having to tack on more fees.

Thanks again for all the good input.


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## tireshark (Aug 17, 2014)

Oh and just to add to the discussion about sewer fees, they are only $12 a month where i'm at. :biggrin2:


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## Tom738 (Jun 1, 2010)

SHEPLMBR said:


> depends on size of tank.


Absolutely. Still, 3 years would be good practice for three people on a 900 gallon tank, which is a pretty small tank and a home with slightly over the median number of people (2.49 for PA) in it. (Or I suppose two people with a garbage disposal they use a lot, etc...). It's insane to require it for someone living alone with a reasonably sized system--insane enough, btw, that I would never trust a pumping company to be telling the truth if that's where I heard it from. Of course, sometimes crazy laws get passed. 

There is no harm in pumping a tank every three years, but anyone who passes a law mandating it has never lived on a tight budget. I'd much rather a senior take an extra few years between pumps and spend that money on things that could save someone's life, like assist bars in their bathrooms or junk removal to get tripping hazards out of their home.

http://inspectapedia.com/septic/Septic_Tank_Pumping_Schedule.php


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## gregzoll (Dec 25, 2006)

Tom738 said:


> OK, that is just overregulation and possibly lobbying from septic companies. I could see five years, maybe, but every three years is just a tax on little old ladies who live alone.


It depends on if you live in a Flood zone or have Wetlands where you live. Public Health departments are getting stringent on Septic tanks more now then before, dur to a lot of people are not getting them emptied or maintained.


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## gregzoll (Dec 25, 2006)

Use the shovel to break through. I am sure with all of that grease and junk has not helped. Wipes, Tampons, Paper towels are not supposed to get flushed for a reason. They turn into concrete after a while.

Also Rid-X needs to be used or Robic Foaming root killer.

I would not put it past that the field is screwed up from deferring the maintenance on the tank.


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## gregzoll (Dec 25, 2006)

Tom738 homes and businesses with Septic tanks are not supposed to have garbage disposals. Also a sewage grinder helps in breaking down stuff, before it gets pumped out to the tank. Systems with the newer tank setups, use multiple tank stages, so that the field only ends up with water.


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## Tom738 (Jun 1, 2010)

gregzoll said:


> Tom738 homes and businesses with Septic tanks are not supposed to have garbage disposals. Also a sewage grinder helps in breaking down stuff, before it gets pumped out to the tank. Systems with the newer tank setups, use multiple tank stages, so that the field only ends up with water.


Newer? Systems that are forty years old have multiple chambers, and on any good system the fields basically only wind up with effluent unless you don't pump them.

RidX is NOT the answer to septic problems. 99% of the time it is just flushing money down the drain. Chemicals and septic systems are generally unmixing things.

Plenty of homes and businesses with septic tanks have garbage disposals; you have to pump more frequently if you use them much. I don't know where the "supposed to" comes from, although obviously you're better off composting most organic matter.

A grinder (for household use) just sounds like extra moving parts to fail.


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## ben's plumbing (Oct 6, 2011)

well iam not good at paying the bills ..thats why i have a wife...she informed me /..that number i quoted is per quarter.....so now its more like 20-40 per month...ok iam not perfect...but i still won't not touch that septic:biggrin2::biggrin2:...sorry for the miss quote


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## SeniorSitizen (Sep 10, 2012)

Possibly never considered but I'd say the worst thing that could be put in a septic system and even a municipal sewer for that matter is synthetic materials from the laundry. Think about it, what does it take to break those non organics down.


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## Yodaman (Mar 9, 2015)

Are you sure about that $400 fee? Around here that would include locate, dig to uncover and the pumping. If you are already uncovered the fee is about half.

Municipal sewer fees are annual about $125 to $150 directly proportional to water usage. I am about 2 blocks out side the sewer district. So the only thing that gets flushed into this tank is poo, pee and paper. No chemicals.


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## gregzoll (Dec 25, 2006)

Tom738 i am talking about the newer units now required in a lot of areas, that you have three separate tanks that the waste has to go through, before it goes out to the leach field.

You can no longer replace a Concrete tank with another, in those areas that requires the newer systems.

Those homes and businesses that have garbage disposals, also have a tank with a screen, that catches that junk, so that it does not go into the main tanks.


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## SHEPLMBR (Mar 4, 2016)

gregzoll said:


> Tom738 homes and businesses with Septic tanks are not supposed to have garbage disposals. Also a sewage grinder helps in breaking down stuff, before it gets pumped out to the tank. Systems with the newer tank setups, use multiple tank stages, so that the field only ends up with water.


Sewage grinders are not recommended for septic systems because the solids that settle at the bottom would turn into a slurry and make your septic field fail. Seen that before.


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## tireshark (Aug 17, 2014)

Had someone come out and pump it. Before they got there i took a shovel and broke up the mass and pulled a few basketball sized clumps of thin roots/debris out. $350 for about 10 minutes of work, good day for him i guess. 

Oh and for the people who cautioned me about it being hazardous to your health... not only did these guys not have any goggles or face masks or anything, but they weren't even wearing gloves haha. One guy wasn't even wearing boots... just what looked like his regular sneakers.

Anyway, they were in and out real quick and didn't really check things out very well i thought (in fact, i dont think they even bent down to look into the tank). After they left, i looked in the tank and there was about 3-4 inches of sludge left... is that normal? I didnt know if they were supposed to suck every last drop out, or leave a few inches behind. Anyway, i leaned down in there with a light and could see big sections of sludge that were piled up along the walls in several spots. I have a 20 ft. homemade hoe that i use to clean culverts out with, and i used it to break all the clumps up. Called them about 5 minutes after they left and had them come back and pump some more out. Of course he told me that they are supposed to leave 5 or 6 inches of sludge for bacteria growth (and maybe they are, i dont know), but i still asked him to come back to suck out all the clumps i broke up. 

To his credit, he didnt really give me a hard time... after all, i did all of the hard work on the job... uncovering the access, breaking up and removing roots, and scraping down the walls... even with the trip back it was an easy $350 for him and his partner. He did ham it up a little, going 'see im hittin rocks' 'see that i got a big rock blocking the pipe' and i was thinking 'geez man just move your pipe back where its deeper' but i didnt say anything cause i didnt want to get too picky haha. I had my hoe down there scraping stuff towards the middle while he was pumping it though. Anyway, he didn't suck all of it out, but got it down to about 2 inches and if nothing else, it made me feel better about dropping the cash on it.

Now that it's empty i can see the interior of the tank. There are no chambers, it's just a big box. The inlet has no baffle, it's just a straight pipe into the tank... although, there is a very large 90 degree fitting laying on the bottom of the tank... i thought maybe that was the inlet baffle that broke off or something... otherwise i dont know where it came from. The outlet has about a 1 foot baffle on it... looks like its just a cast iron 90 degree bend that extends down a little bit. If the inlet is supposed to have a baffle, i guess it's too bad because it looks like there is no way to access it unless you are down in the tank.

Anyway, that's the conclusion of my septic tank ordeal.


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## Tom738 (Jun 1, 2010)

tireshark said:


> Had someone come out and pump it. Before they got there i took a shovel and broke up the mass and pulled a few basketball sized clumps of thin roots/debris out. $350 for about 10 minutes of work, good day for him i guess.
> 
> Oh and for the people who cautioned me about it being hazardous to your health... not only did these guys not have any goggles or face masks or anything, but they weren't even wearing gloves haha. One guy wasn't even wearing boots... just what looked like his regular sneakers.
> 
> ...


Yes, the inlet needs a baffle, and that is the inlet baffle that's fallen off. The guy who pumped it should probably have noticed that and told you.

I'm not an expert, but it seems like without it the inlet pipe is more likely to get blocked and have the septic back up into the house.

http://inspectapedia.com/septic/Septic_Tank_Tees.php

Note: do not fall into the Septic Tank. People get trapped. Seriously.


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## Nik333 (Mar 1, 2015)

tireshark said:


> Oh and for the people who cautioned me about it being hazardous to your health... not only did these guys not have any goggles or face masks or anything, but they weren't even wearing gloves haha. One guy wasn't even wearing boots... just what looked like his regular sneakers.


Doesn't mean they are right! I've seen plumbers do the same thing. If you want Hepatitis B & C plus all kinds of nasty enteric ( gut) infections, go ahead. That's the wonderful thing about America & it keeps hospitals going:devil3:


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## tireshark (Aug 17, 2014)

Nik333 said:


> Doesn't mean they are right!



Yeah i didn't mean to imply that they were, i was just passing it along for entertainment. 

They definitely should have had some protection... i mean, i'm pretty relaxed about it, and even i thought they were a bit crazy, especially since they are probably doing this stuff every day.


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## joed (Mar 13, 2005)

If he is diligent he has had Hep vaccines.


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## SeniorSitizen (Sep 10, 2012)

tireshark said:


> Anyway, they were in and out real quick and didn't really check things out very well i thought (in fact, i dont think they even bent down to look into the tank). After they left, i looked in the tank and there was about 3-4 inches of sludge left... is that normal?.


 You've just experienced doing business with contractors. No matter if they didn't have a job for the next month it has to be done fast. Hopefully you keep good records and put them on your Sh!t List not to be called again.


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## Rango (Dec 13, 2013)

My tank hasn't been pumped in 15 years. The sludge is supposed to break down and then gets pumped out into the drain field. I checked it last year and there were no solids in the tank. I do have a garbage disposal but use it very lightly, no big stuff.


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## Tom738 (Jun 1, 2010)

Rango said:


> My tank hasn't been pumped in 15 years. The sludge is supposed to break down and then gets pumped out into the drain field. I checked it last year and there were no solids in the tank. I do have a garbage disposal but use it very lightly, no big stuff.


Relative had a tank that hadn't been pumped for forty years, seemed fine. It is possible but depends on light use, no fats, really good field, system designed to overcapacity relative to usage, lots of things going right, etc...

But at the end of the day, $300 every three or four years to avoid a $40K replacement job is really cheap.


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## jlhaslip (Dec 31, 2009)

Throw a dead cat in there once in a while to renew the enzymes and bacteria.


*just kidding folks*


Actually, there is a product you buy and flush into the toilet once a month to do exactly the same thing.


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## Nik333 (Mar 1, 2015)

joed said:


> If he is diligent he has had Hep vaccines.


Yes, it certainly helps but some people lose any evidence of their immunity. I'm one. I've had two full sets of three Hep B vaccines and the antibody has disappeared. So am I Immune? They don't know. I have to have repeated tests to make sure I don't have the virus. ( Will get a reference)

That's why I have new blood tests waiting for me to have drawn.lain:

It's better to be safe to the best of your ability. Sorry to be a downer, but you risk not only yourself but your wife/girlfriend/partner, babies, etc.

An older Occupatioal Health nurse told me she would rather have HIV than Hep B or C. Based on the resultant illnesses.

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/hepb.html -under Vaccine Nonresponder


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## TheEplumber (Jul 20, 2010)

tireshark said:


> Had someone come out and pump it. Before they got there i took a shovel and broke up the mass and pulled a few basketball sized clumps of thin roots/debris out. $350 for about 10 minutes of work, good day for him i guess.


A company I worked for charged 31.5 cents a gal to pump a tank. We then paid 21.5 cents a gal. to offload it at some reclaim place. We would take the small pumper to the yard and transfer the load to a tanker trailer, when it was full we'd haul it 50 miles to the dump site.

That means on a 1000 gal tank we grossed $100. Subtract fuel, wages(commission), overhead and the tanker trip- we made squat....
But that was just one service we offered. We banked on call backs for other services too.


Rango said:


> My tank hasn't been pumped in 15 years. The sludge is supposed to break down and then gets pumped out into the drain field. I checked it last year and there were no solids in the tank. I do have a garbage disposal but use it very lightly, no big stuff.


I got ya beat- it's been 20+ for me, but it's on my list :wink2:


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## Yodaman (Mar 9, 2015)

TheEplumber said:


> I got ya beat- it's been 20+ for me, but it's on my list :wink2:



An old pro told me that if a septic tank is working then leave it alone because once you pump it out, it will require more frequent clean-outs. Don't know if there is any truth to it but I do like the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" line.


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## Tom738 (Jun 1, 2010)

jlhaslip said:


> Throw a dead cat in there once in a while to renew the enzymes and bacteria.
> 
> 
> *just kidding folks*
> ...


Waste of money. At worst it can even plug up your drain field.


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## Tom738 (Jun 1, 2010)

Yodaman said:


> An old pro told me that if a septic tank is working then leave it alone because once you pump it out, it will require more frequent clean-outs. Don't know if there is any truth to it but I do like the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" line.


Has to do with quantity of sludge and scum in the tank. If you want to see if you need to have it pumped, you can check the scum and sludge levels relative to the baffles. If the bottom of the scum layer or the top of the sludge layer are too close to the bottom of the baffles--i.e. if there is a risk the scum will get into them or there isn't enough room for the sludge to settle and get broken down--get it pumped. If you are unsure, pumps are cheap preventive maintenance. 

The "If it ain't broke" philosophy doesn't quite work, because if you don't pump it and it needs pumping, it will destroy your field and give you a $30-40K bill instead of a $200-400 bill.


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## Rango (Dec 13, 2013)

Tom738 said:


> Relative had a tank that hadn't been pumped for forty years, seemed fine. It is possible but depends on light use, no fats, really good field, system designed to overcapacity relative to usage, lots of things going right, etc...
> 
> But at the end of the day, $300 every three or four years to avoid a $40K replacement job is really cheap.


 Why would it need to be replaced? There are no solids, the thing is doing it's job as designed but even if I had to replace the drain field I could do that myself. And for a whole bunch less than $40k.


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## Rango (Dec 13, 2013)

Tom738 said:


> Has to do with quantity of sludge and scum in the tank. If you want to see if you need to have it pumped, you can check the scum and sludge levels relative to the baffles. If the bottom of the scum layer or the top of the sludge layer are too close to the bottom of the baffles--i.e. if there is a risk the scum will get into them or there isn't enough room for the sludge to settle and get broken down--get it pumped. If you are unsure, pumps are cheap preventive maintenance.
> 
> The "If it ain't broke" philosophy doesn't quite work, because if you don't pump it and it needs pumping, it will destroy your field and give you a $30-40K bill instead of a $200-400 bill.


Can you elaborate on this? I'm no expert and read various opinions and I'm sure not all tanks are the same. Mine is just a big box with a pump on the bottom. I swirled a long stick around and can't feel any solids. The pump sends it out to the drain field so I'm lost on what a truck pump is going to do differently or how my field would be damaged or why it would cost so much.


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## Tom738 (Jun 1, 2010)

Rango said:


> Why would it need to be replaced? There are no solids, the thing is doing it's job as designed but even if I had to replace the drain field I could do that myself. And for a whole bunch less than $40k.


Ordinarily a septic tank is a holding tank designed to let sludge settle, scum come up to the top, and ordinary effluent to go through the output baffle and drain in the drainfield. Some of the sludge breaks down over time through the action of aerobic bacteria, but not everything in the sludge is going to break down. The sludge and scum layers get thicker over time until one of them threatens to hit the bottom of the baffle or until the sludge layer is so close to the bottom that new deposits into the tank are more likely to throw up a lot of particulate matter. 

Particulate matter from sludge (or scum) can then start going out into the field with the effluent. This can clog up the field, and it is MUCH more expensive to replace a field than to get a tank pumped. In your particular situation, you may be able to do the work to replace your field yourself--you'd have to check the law in your jurisdiction--but most places and on most properties, it can run you tens of thousands of dollars to put in a new field.

There are a very few people who I've heard your position from--that it never needs to be pumped if functioning correctly. But I've heard from almost everyone--including water engineers and *all* of the literature I've seen written about them--that they need to be pumped eventually even under ideal conditions. If you look up "septic myths" on Google, you'll find one of the first ones is the idea that they never need to be pumped.


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## Tom738 (Jun 1, 2010)

Rango said:


> Can you elaborate on this? I'm no expert and read various opinions and I'm sure not all tanks are the same. Mine is just a big box with a pump on the bottom. I swirled a long stick around and can't feel any solids. The pump sends it out to the drain field so I'm lost on what a truck pump is going to do differently or how my field would be damaged or why it would cost so much.


That is not an ordinary septic tank; most of them are designed in one particular way, as a gravity-fed settling tank that holds slum and sludge and allows effluent runoff into a drain field. Possibly yours is designed to drain to an uphill field or has some other unusual design that necessitates having a pump. If you feel no sludge on the bottom, where is the sludge going?

You should find the designs to your septic (perhaps on file with the county) and ask an expert what maintenance your system needs.


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## Rango (Dec 13, 2013)

Tom738 said:


> Ordinarily a septic tank is a holding tank designed to let sludge settle, scum come up to the top, and ordinary effluent to go through the output baffle and drain in the drainfield. Some of the sludge breaks down over time through the action of aerobic bacteria, but not everything in the sludge is going to break down. The sludge and scum layers get thicker over time until one of them threatens to hit the bottom of the baffle or until the sludge layer is so close to the bottom that new deposits into the tank are more likely to throw up a lot of particulate matter.
> 
> Particulate matter from sludge (or scum) can then start going out into the field with the effluent. This can clog up the field, and it is MUCH more expensive to replace a field than to get a tank pumped. In your particular situation, you may be able to do the work to replace your field yourself--you'd have to check the law in your jurisdiction--but most places and on most properties, it can run you tens of thousands of dollars to put in a new field.
> 
> There are a very few people who I've heard your position from--that it never needs to be pumped if functioning correctly. But I've heard from almost everyone--including water engineers and *all* of the literature I've seen written about them--that they need to be pumped eventually even under ideal conditions. If you look up "septic myths" on Google, you'll find one of the first ones is the idea that they never need to be pumped.


I don't read to research it since I have personal experience with mine. I'm not selling a do not pump your tank service. I didn't make the claim none of them ever needed it. I don't see why it would cost tens of thousands of dollars to put in a new field, gravel and pipe can't be that much. I can see why some could depending on the situation but mine is small and I can do the work myself. But it's been working fine for nearly 20 years.


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## Rango (Dec 13, 2013)

Tom738 said:


> That is not an ordinary septic tank; most of them are designed in one particular way, as a gravity-fed settling tank that holds slum and sludge and allows effluent runoff into a drain field. Possibly yours is designed to drain to an uphill field or has some other unusual design that necessitates having a pump. If you feel no sludge on the bottom, where is the sludge going?
> 
> You should find the designs to your septic (perhaps on file with the county) and ask an expert what maintenance your system needs.


No thanks. I learned many many years ago to not get the government involved in anything it doesn't need to be involved in. I explained it gets pumped out. The sludge is biodegradable because I don't eat anything that potent.


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## Tom738 (Jun 1, 2010)

Rango said:


> I don't read to research it since I have personal experience with mine. I'm not selling a do not pump your tank service. I didn't make the claim none of them ever needed it.


It's your house; it's your risk to take. Normally I prefer to know more about things I'm maintaining than what I've learned from when they fail. Learn more or wait for it to fail; your choice.



> I don't see why it would cost tens of thousands of dollars to put in a new field, gravel and pipe can't be that much. I can see why some could depending on the situation but mine is small and I can do the work myself. But it's been working fine for nearly 20 years.


Depends on your community and labor costs, etc..., but it certainly can cost that much if you're hiring someone to do it. For you, the question is whether it's worth spending the pumping costs to limit risk or not.

https://www.angieslist.com/articles/what-does-it-cost-install-septic-system.htm



> No thanks. I learned many many years ago to not get the government involved in anything it doesn't need to be involved in. I explained it gets pumped out. The sludge is biodegradable because I don't eat anything that potent.


Unpermitted work can raise a lot of problems, some at sale, also some when you are dealing with something that needs to be done right for health reasons, also some when you don't learn enough about the right way to do it. 

You said it gets pumped out through the bottom--I read that as during normal operation, not as regular pumping, but if you meant regular pumping out of the tank, it is probably not a conventional septic tank, just a holding tank. If it is getting pumped out through the bottom, this may pump it out into your real septic tank, which may be overfull.


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## Rango (Dec 13, 2013)

Tom738 said:


> It's your house; it's your risk to take. Normally I prefer to know more about things I'm maintaining than what I've learned from when they fail. Learn more or wait for it to fail; your choice.
> 
> Depends on your community and labor costs, etc..., but it certainly can cost that much if you're hiring someone to do it. For you, the question is whether it's worth spending the pumping costs to limit risk or not.
> 
> ...


Dude. Give it up. You can't bully me into agreement with you. You are some random guy on the internet getting hysterical over something he has no control over. What I have heard has panned out in my reality. You've made a lot of grandiose statements and can't back them up. 40k for a small septic field? That's not happening here. There's only one tank, it works fine. Like I was told it would. I'm not doing anything more about it and you need to find a way to live with it.


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## Tom738 (Jun 1, 2010)

Rango said:


> Dude. Give it up. You can't bully me into agreement with you. You are some random guy on the internet getting hysterical over something he has no control over. What I have heard has panned out in my reality. You've made a lot of grandiose statements and can't back them up. 40k for a small septic field? That's not happening here. There's only one tank, it works fine. Like I was told it would. I'm not doing anything more about it and you need to find a way to live with it.


"Bully?" :smile: Really? No worries; next time I will try not to help you. Have a great day!


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## Ghostmaker (Mar 2, 2013)

Pumping of a septic tank is the least of your worries. Problems arise once the septic field fails and all will fail. Then your looking at a huge expense since what worked in the 1950's no longer will be approved today.


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## tireshark (Aug 17, 2014)

Rango said:


> bully, hysterical, grandiose


None of these words are an accurate description of Tom's discourse.



> 40k for a small septic field?


Yes that is a high figure, but you yourself literally said that you could see some fields costing 'tens of thousands' to replace.



> I'm not doing anything more about it and you need to find a way to live with it.


I'm pretty sure Tom, nor anyone else here, is going to lose any sleep over what you do with your septic system.


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## Rango (Dec 13, 2013)

tireshark said:


> None of these words are an accurate description of Tom's discourse.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm pretty sure your opinion doesn't mean much to me either. Why would you imagine it does? I was talking about my system, he said it would cost 40k, so either you didn't follow the conversation or you're deflecting for whatever reason. And it isn't just me, I've lived here 16 years and never saw a pump truck on the street so whatever the design is it's obviously working for a lot of people. And yes, telling people if they don't pump out tanks every three years or pay 40k is a bullying tactic where I come from. Not all systems/circumstances are the same so a blanket statement like that is a bunch of hot air.


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## Oso954 (Jun 23, 2012)

You might not be looking at your septic tank, but at a pump tank which is sometimes used down stream of the actual septic tank. The lack of sludge in the tank makes it a fairly good possibility.

I would check the city/county records to see if they have records on what is installed at your home.


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## tireshark (Aug 17, 2014)

Rango said:


> I'm pretty sure your opinion doesn't mean much to me either. Why would you imagine it does?


Quote where i said, or implied, that i thought my opinion meant something to you.

You said that Tom would have to 'find a way to live with' how you deal with your septic tank, implying that your opinion was bothering him. I merely pointed out that no one will have to 'find a way to live with' your opinion, as at the end of the day, we couldn't care less what you do with your septic tank.



> I was talking about my system, he said it would cost 40k, so either you didn't follow the conversation or you're deflecting for whatever reason.


You're acting like what he said was a specific quote for your specific system (or anyones specific system for that matter), even though he didn't have knowledge of your setup. It was obviously just a comment made in passing, not intended to apply to every single system out there... at least obvious to everyone but you, it seems.

I get the feeling you are one of those guys that likes to argue about petty semantics, and is never wrong. In that case, i would like to save you the trouble of writing up a scathing reply, and go ahead and say that you are right and im wrong. I apologize for rustling your jimmies, i'll try not to be such a bonehead in the future. Good day.


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## SHEPLMBR (Mar 4, 2016)

Wow that escalated quickly


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## dougp23 (Sep 20, 2011)

SHEPLMBR said:


> Wow that escalated quickly


Yeah and it's too bad. 

As just a regular homeowner, there are a few things I would never attempt on my own. Cleaning my septic tank is definitely one of them. 

As for the OP, if you want to attempt it, and you have made it apparent that you do want to, then go ahead, but be realistic: you will likely vomit very strongly, the smell, especially up close is pretty incredible. Your neighbors will rapidly get the smell, so if you are going to clean it and do something with the sludge or "gray water", you will need to move quickly before someone calls and complains. And God help you if the health department shows up because of a complaint and they see what you are trying to do.

Sounds like you may just want it pumped. About $250 in my part of the world.


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## seephor (Mar 9, 2014)

Here's my take on it. If you sit around and reply to forum posts, you will never get anywhere. If you ask how to screw in a light bulb, you still get someone who tells you to have a professional do it. The solution is to get on your hands and knees and work. Forget the waste hazard stuff. If you can bag up dog sh*t and throw it in the trash, human sh*t is not more or less hazardous. We buy manure and spread it over our lawns and brag how good it smells for a week. Get're done!


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## Yodaman (Mar 9, 2015)

seephor said:


> Here's my take on it. If you sit around and reply to forum posts, you will never get anywhere. If you ask how to screw in a light bulb, you still get someone who tells you to have a professional do it. The solution is to get on your hands and knees and work. Forget the waste hazard stuff. If you can bag up dog sh*t and throw it in the trash, human sh*t is not more or less hazardous. We buy manure and spread it over our lawns and brag how good it smells for a week. Get're done!


:vs_worry:

A typical tank might be 750 gallons or even larger. Water weighs about 8 lbs/gal. I would guess you'll get 5 gallons in a heavy duty garbage bag weighing approx 40 lbs each.
So 750 gallons / 5 gal. per bag = 150 bags of waste.
Maybe you can put out 5 bags a week with your regular trash pick up, for the next 30 weeks!


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## Nik333 (Mar 1, 2015)

seephor said:


> Here's my take on it. If you sit around and reply to forum posts, you will never get anywhere. If you ask how to screw in a light bulb, you still get someone who tells you to have a professional do it. The solution is to get on your hands and knees and work. Forget the waste hazard stuff. If you can bag up dog sh*t and throw it in the trash, human sh*t is not more or less hazardous. We buy manure and spread it over our lawns and brag how good it smells for a week. Get're done!


Actually, human waste is much more dangerous to you than dog poop or cattle manure, because the bacteria, viruses, fungus & parasites are often specific to humans. Just as a human bite is more dangerous than a dog bite, usually. And I'm someone who has 'worked' with human waste over 30 yrs. Delightful :} I've gotten as close as one can be, on an hourly or more frequent basis.

Also, posters keep trying to emphasize how dangerous the gases are.

Reference for diseases: http://www.gchd.org/ech/health.html 
Los Angeles County is very strict compared to the rest of the world. Even unincorporated areas.
http://www.gchd.org/ech/health.html


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## SHEPLMBR (Mar 4, 2016)

I just love how people who think they know everything try to buck the powers that be...i.e. mandates on sewage disposal. If they weren't in place we would all be living inside a cesspool.


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## woodchopper65 (Mar 28, 2016)

there are 3 basic septic systems.. below grade gravity, above grade gravity, and above grade pump system( usually called a turkey mound) this is the big$$ system that can cost 30k to 40 k...and im sure some home made systems that do alittle of everything..depending on where you live the local codes will dictate what type of system you need to put in..


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## SHEPLMBR (Mar 4, 2016)

woodchopper65 said:


> there are 3 basic septic systems.. below grade gravity, above grade gravity, and above grade pump system( usually called a turkey mound) this is the big$$ system that can cost 30k to 40 k...and im sure some home made systems that do alittle of everything..depending on where you live the local codes will dictate what type of system you need to put in..


 Not to mention all of the alternative systems there are ...not to mention drip...too many to name really. I used to sell these systems. Blew my mind


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## lenaitch (Feb 10, 2014)

seephor said:


> Here's my take on it. If you sit around and reply to forum posts, you will never get anywhere. If you ask how to screw in a light bulb, you still get someone who tells you to have a professional do it. The solution is to get on your hands and knees and work. Forget the waste hazard stuff. If you can bag up dog sh*t and throw it in the trash, human sh*t is not more or less hazardous. We buy manure and spread it over our lawns and brag how good it smells for a week. Get're done!


Yes, silly public health and hazardous waste rules. Reminds me of the house we bought a number of years ago and found that the previous owners had dumped their waste oil - or something - in the sump. Although many people do put pet waste in the garbage many municipalities prohibit it. Fecal waste needs to be properly composted, not landfilled. Manure sold for garden use is composted, and all come from plant-eating animals (grazers), not meat eaters or omnivores (i.e. - us). As a service to we users of this forum, I propose a test. Spread the contents of your toilet or septic on your lawn and keep us posted on how it goes.


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## sarahcruz (Jan 27, 2021)

tireshark said:


> Tank has 3.5 feet of material in it... looks like roughly a 4x3 square structure.
> 
> 
> The top scum layer is like a foot thick, and it's almost physically impossible to break through it in some spots (its like a big heavy quilt). In the spots i was able to break through, i go down to the bottom of the tank and never feel a sludge layer.
> ...


Homeowners can clean out their septic tanks, but you will need to store the sludge for transport and safely dispose of it. Professional septic tank cleaners come with a tank truck that hooks up to your septic system and removes its contents, then transports it all safely off your property.


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## joed (Mar 13, 2005)

7 year old thread.


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