# Service wire thru attic



## 220/221 (Oct 9, 2007)

1 1/2" or 2" conduit with three #2 thwn copper and a #6 ground.

Thru the attic is fine. It's not really _service wire_, they are feeders.


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## joed (Mar 13, 2005)

Unfused service wires must be as short as possible inside the house. Usually less than 5 feet. However these are not service wires. These are feeder wires protected by a breaker in the main panel.


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## Poot (Feb 7, 2009)

*#2 and #6*



220/221 said:


> 1 1/2" or 2" conduit with three #2 thwn copper and a #6 ground.
> 
> Thru the attic is fine. It's not really _service wire_, they are feeders.


*Thanks for your reply and I do appreciate it. *
*So #2 wire is what, two seperate wires with the #6 ground being the 3rd? Or do you mean #2 as in 2/0? The one electrician who'd run it through the attic was using 2/0 romex. **No good??? *
*I'd rather use a romex type to make one pass through the attic and be done. *
*Like I said, I'm no electrician by trade so I'm not up on the "terms" so being more specific would be very helpful. *
*In other words break it down for this dummy please sir. *
*I know the THWN represents the environment a wire should be used in but to me #2 could mean a single #2 thwn wire x's 2 + the #6. And are you saying I should run conduit all the way through the attic? If so, not a big deal, just want to be clear and get it right and safe the first time. Thanks.....and sorry for being a little thick about this. *


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## jamiedolan (Sep 2, 2008)

Poot said:


> *Thanks for your reply and I do appreciate it. *
> *So #2 wire is what, two seperate wires with the #6 ground being the 3rd? Or do you mean #2 as in 2/0? The one electrician who'd run it through the attic was using 2/0 romex. **No good??? *
> *I'd rather use a romex type to make one pass through the attic and be done. *
> *Like I said, I'm no electrician by trade so I'm not up on the "terms" so being more specific would be very helpful. *
> ...


I thought you said you were running conduit? You don't put romex in conduit. You use thhn/thwn, single strands of wire, normally 4 wires to feed a sub.

Jamie


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## Poot (Feb 7, 2009)

jamiedolan said:


> I thought you said you were running conduit? You don't put romex in conduit. You use thhn/thwn, single strands of wire, normally 4 wires to feed a sub.
> 
> Jamie


I know you don't typically run romex in conduit. What I wasn't clear about was the reply to use #2 wire + a #6 ground. Does #2 mean as in 2/0 romex or two seperate #2 thwn wires plus a ground? I'm guessing two #2 thwn + the one #6 but I'm not going to assume anything about this. Earlier when I mentioned conduit I said INTO the attic and OUT of the attic but none in-between. They would be short runs just to get in/out. If it needs to run the entire length using two #2 wires plus the #6, not a problem. Or use 2/0 romex with NO conduit, can do that too. Look, I don't fear electricity but I HIGHLY respect it. And I'm not dumb (no, no one said I was!), I just want to do this correctly/safely because it involves my family/house which is why I want a clear understanding with no guessing on my part. Thanks


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## jamiedolan (Sep 2, 2008)

Poot said:


> I know you don't typically run romex in conduit. What I wasn't clear about was the reply to use #2 wire + a #6 ground. Does #2 mean as in 2/0 romex or two seperate #2 thwn wires plus a ground? I'm guessing two #2 thwn + the one #6 but I'm not going to assume anything about this. Earlier when I mentioned conduit I said INTO the attic and OUT of the attic but none in-between. They would be short runs just to get in/out. If it needs to run the entire length using two #2 wires plus the #6, not a problem. Or use 2/0 romex with NO conduit, can do that too. Look, I don't fear electricity but I HIGHLY respect it. And I'm not dumb (no, no one said I was!), I just want to do this correctly/safely because it involves my family/house which is why I want a clear understanding with no guessing on my part. Thanks


You can't use romex for this feed unless you plan to junction it over to thhn when it leaves the house, which seems kind of silly, this gage of wire isn't as easy to junction as some 12 gage branch circuits. This should be a solid conduit from the house panel to the shop. You need a 4 wire feed, 2 hot, 1 neutral, and 1 #6 ground if it is 100a.
#2 is 2awg wire. Are you planing on supplying a full 100a of service to the detached building?
I don't know of any 2/0 romex. I suspect your speaking of SEU cable, I would not use that, again it can't run outside in conduit.
Jamie


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## Poot (Feb 7, 2009)

*Reply*

*Thanks Jamie and I realized I've left a part out. Via a double carport I've an attached garage on one end fed by an outside 100 amp disconnect @ the meter base. The idea is to replace that disconnect with a 200 amp feeding 100 amp's to each building. I wanted to come out of that and conduit up roughly 6' then turn into the attic running the wire without conduit at that point to the opposite end then conduit out/down roughly 10' to another box to terminate it but from that point on I hadn't planned to use romex. *
*Unfortunately I'm handicapped so when it comes to trenching I have to do it a little at a time hence the reason for a termination point. Yes I could get the trench dug then do all the wiring at one time but there again I can't physically last that long in one stretch so I need to do this in stages. Replace the disconnect one day, another day running conduit/wire and so forth. I know it's backwards but you do what you hafta do sometimes. *
*So romex is out since it can't be in conduit and I suppose it can't be used unprotected outdoors between the disconnect to the attic's entrance point? And in using #2awg it must be in conduit all the way, correct? *
*Thanks again :thumbsup:*


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## 220/221 (Oct 9, 2007)

I am confused, but.....

#2 refers to the size of a single wire. The smaller the number, the larger the wire up to 0, (ott). Then it's 1/0 (one ott), 2/0 thru 4/0. The bigger the wire, the more current it can carry. #2 will generally carry 100+ amps.

You can use cable (multiple wires enclosed in a sheath) thru your attic and change to conduit and individual wire outside/underground. You could also use UF (underground feeder) cable (if you could find it) the entire distance with no junctions/splices.

I think you should call a real electrician :thumbup:


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## Poot (Feb 7, 2009)

I think you should call a real electrician :thumbup:[/quote]
*I did but I don't see the price they wanted. *
*One wouldn't run it through the atttic because "That's **illegal" but *
*would run it overhead for **$1400. However, be**cause of my wife's above pool there was no way to get the required clearance to do that. Then he wanted $2400 to run it underground, about 70', but flat out refused to do it if I dug the trench. *

*The second guy would install a new 200 amp disconnect then run it up/thru/out of the attic. This was **a less direct route to the building, about 7' up from the disconnect to the attic, 60' across, **then down *
*about 10' and stop**, for $2000. Material wa**s about $1000 and while I don't expect someone to work for nothing, **I don't **see $1000 labor for **r**oughly a **4 hour job which **is why **I'm not **using a **REAL electrician. I understand paying for experience but experience doesn't mean THAT much on a straight forwa**rd job like this. The attic is tall and wide open so he wouldn't be in it but MAYBE 30 minutes, 45 tops. I think it's unreasonable....or m**aybe I'm cheap?! *


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## rgsgww (Jul 5, 2008)

Why not run flex conduit where you need to and run conduit in the more accessible parts of your attic. Junction to pvc conduit outside.

No way your going to find 2 awg romex.

AL is cheaper, though, you would need big conduit for room.


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## 220/221 (Oct 9, 2007)

> *while I don't expect someone to work for nothing, I don't see $1000 labor for roughly a 4 hour job which is why I'm not using a REAL electrician. *




But you expect *us* to work for free and tell you how to do it?:jester:

I only help people who really need help. I do not help people like you that are just trying to save a buck.


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## Plumbvoltage (Dec 2, 2008)

rgsgww said:


> No way your going to find 2 awg romex.


http://www.wesbellwireandcable.com/ROMEXNMB.html


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## rgsgww (Jul 5, 2008)

Plumbvoltage said:


> http://www.wesbellwireandcable.com/ROMEXNMB.html



Never mind...


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## Poot (Feb 7, 2009)

220/221 said:


> But you expect *us* to work for free and tell you how to do it?:jester:
> 
> I only help people who really need help. I do not help people like you that are just trying to save a buck.


*No I DON'T expect you to work for free and I so stated. YOU on the other hand act like I should accept your royal screwing @ $250 an hour THEN shake your hand and thank you greatly. If your a REAL electrician, sorry to pop your bubble but your well beneath a God. Don't know you, don't care to, but I guarantee your NOT worth $250 an hour, at least not to me. As for me, yeah I'm trying to save a buck just like YOU and everyone else right now. And so?! I'm also trying to save because last year I became disabled after working 40 years because of degenerative disc disease. I went from $4200 a month to under 2k monthly but still have a mortgage, a 12 year old in private school, etc, so yeah, I'm trying to cut corners. **And who knows, maybe one day you'll have the pleasure of developing this and I bet you'll start cutting corners yourself. *

*I've helped a LOT of people in my life fixing their cars, mowers, roofing, whatever, for FREE if they were needy and a LOT of times they were. Apparently you and I come from completely differently backgrounds. I was taught to help AND what goes around comes around. It does, I've seen it, and so will you. What is the big deal for you to type a few lines telling me what I need to know? You've no problem typing what you did after CLEARLY stating I did not expect this to be done for free, I just don't see how you think your worth $250 an hour. *
*I understand paying for experience, your licensed (?) which takes time/work/years to obtain and blaa blaa blaa but still, you AIN'T all that. I've worked with industrial electricians a lot in my career and yes it IS work just as what I did was, but at that rate? C'mom. *
*And yes I WILL get this done without your wealth of knowledge. :furious: Oh, thanks for nothing and you oughta learn to REALLY read before replying. And no offense/disrespect meant towards the trade or anyone else. *


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## 220/221 (Oct 9, 2007)

Cry me a river. I've had DDD for the past 27 years. It hurts. Sometimes it hurts like hell. I don't whine about it and use it as an excuse. Life sucks sometimes, deal with it.



> I just don't see how you think your worth $250 an hour.


I don't allow you to set the value of my work. If I did, a lot of people would be in a bad situation. You have *no idea* what material cost and you have *no idea* what it cost to operate a buisness. Your hillbilly economics have no basis in reality.:jester:


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## Poot (Feb 7, 2009)

220/221 said:


> Cry me a river. I've had DDD for the past 27 years. It hurts. Sometimes it hurts like hell. I don't whine about it and use it as an excuse. Life sucks sometimes, deal with it.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't allow you to set the value of my work. If I did, a lot of people would be in a bad situation. You have *no idea* what material cost and you have *no idea* what it cost to operate a buisness. Your hillbilly economics have no basis in reality.:jester:


*You've whinned more then me about how much you THINK your worth, reading between the lines. Never heard of DDD unless it's dead d___ disease. You said "Cry me a river" then turn right around and contradict yourself by telling me you've DDD as if someone would care. Well my behind bleeds for ya, NOT. *

*You won't allow me to set the value of your work? Apparently your not working anyway since your able to post replies all day. *
*Maybe your OVERPRICED?! LOL!!! :thumbup:*

*And once again your clueless because I HAVE had my own business and I DO know the cost of material. T**he cost of healthcare shut mine down. *
*The price I keep telling you DID NOT include material. *
*Dang it man, READ will ya?! *
*I personally know FedEx aircraft mechanics and they've a HECK of a lot more responsibility then you safety wise and they don't make but $39 hr. Yeah, plus benefits but we're talking straight out $ per hour, right? Right. And if you don't like the cost of running a business, stop whinning and GET OUT. *
*And what does the price of material have to do with this? *

*Your waaaaay out in left field on this because you (well...maybe), as a smart business owner, PASS THAT COST ON TO THE CUSTOMER so quit whinning about material cost because it's not even relevant. *

*Was "hillbilly economics" (whatever that means. apparently you know.) your lame attempt at humor??? With that comment you've decided to take this to another level and tried to make it personal so...... bite me, then go change a light bulb you overpriced hick IF you can find someone stupid enough to pay what you THINK your worth. *
*I'm done, I'm through, 'cause your not worth MY time, and I'm REASONABLY PRICED. :yes:*
*Have a nice evening Gomer*


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## 220/221 (Oct 9, 2007)

> *And once again your clueless because I HAVE had my own business and I DO know the cost of material. The cost of healthcare shut mine down*




Again with the victim role. "I am disabled due to *D*egenerative *D*isk *D*isease" and "the cost of healthcare shut me down". 


Whatever pal. Don't get your blood pressure up though because I actually enjoy this part :laughing:


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## chris75 (Aug 25, 2007)

220/221 said:


> Whatever pal. Don't get your blood pressure up though because I actually enjoy this part :laughing:


 
I see your making new friends again...


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## 220/221 (Oct 9, 2007)

It's my hobby :laughing:


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## Bocolo (Jan 24, 2009)

220 is going to kill someone with a heart attack one of these days


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## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

Bocolo said:


> 220 is going to kill someone with a heart attack one of these days


Don't you mean 240v :laughing:


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## theatretch85 (May 17, 2008)

I find this rather amusing to read threads like this where the OP gets upset after a professional tells them to hire a real pro to do the work. After having been a member of these forums for the past several months and reading countless threads, I have found its pretty easy to tell (for the most part) when someone can handle the job themselves or when they should call in a real electrician to do the job.

To the OP (if he is even around anymore) it doesn't help to badmouth the very people that can actually provide you with some help here. The only thing its likely to do is make them not want to help you even more. Yeah the economy sucks, we are ALL dealing with it the best we can. But there is a difference between doing it cheap and doing it right. If you can't do it right, then there is no sense in doing it at all. You not only risk your life but you put your families life at stake as well. There is a time when calling in a pro is the ONLY answer.


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## Bocolo (Jan 24, 2009)

Agree theatretch, this is one of the most helpful sights I have found on the internet. The way I see it if you are asking a question in this forum it is because you do not know it all. Why even ask a question and waste people's time when you have already made up your mind on what you are going to do anyway. I ask questions, try to digest what I read and when I still "don't get it" I ask more questions. Am always happy to get a response (wether is what I want to read or not) and always thank people for their time. I think time is valuable and when someone takes some of their time to read and respond to your questions you should be grateful. We can always disagree without being disagreeable. On the other hand, Scuba always makes me laugh. He is a funny guy. Where else can I get knowledge while having fun?


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