# Ceiling repair after Irma damages - plaster washer application?



## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

Your existing ceiling is what is called Rock Lath it is sheets of gypsum base lath 1/2 inches thick and size would be 16 inches by 48 inches with a gypsum brown coat of 3/8 inch and a finish coat of 1/8 inch than at some point the knock down texture was added so yes you should be abled to do the repair as stated. As for the plaster washers I would highly recommend you use them they work great. the plaster washer will be 3/32 inch in depth so if you apply it on top of the existing your repair area gets larger in order to feather out the repair. You can recess the washer by using a paddle bit if you select this method remove the gypsum material back to the face of the Rock Lath as the lath will be stronger than the gypsum brown coat.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

Thank you I have been wondering for years what it's called, now I know - "Rock lath". They also put wire meshes at all the inside corners between two walls and between walls to ceiling. Makes demo real difficult and dusty.

I was concerned about the plaster washer being bigger and proud of the finished surface would make the patch wider. If I use a paddle bit to remove some of the brown coat that would recess the washer...but will the paddle bit also weaken the existing ceiling or crack it?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

I have used the paddle bit many times, no problem just don't force it in take it slow if you have old bits use them the plaster will make the bits useless after used in plaster. The mesh in the corners is called Corner Rite's.
If you would like to go back with conventional plaster than install a glass faced gypsum board in place of the Rock Lath and apply a Gypso - Lite or Structo Lite Plaster over the glass faced board and apply a veneer gypsum plaster.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

I have been putting this on hold but finally got moving on it.

I have square cut the damaged ceiling to a rectangular opening, then put in some 1/4" plywood shims, then installed regular sheetrock across the three joist bays.










Since the old rock lath is over an inch thick, even after furring then the 1/2" sheetrock the old ceiling is still about 1/8" lower than the new sheetrock. Guess I will need to float an 1/8" coat.

Also, since I used an angle grinder to cut into the existing ceiling in the middle of a the joist, and in the process damaged some existing nails used to fasten the gypsum layer to the joist, I had to reinforce the ceiling. I tried using the 1" plaster washers along the edge, with mixed results, in some places I was able to drive up a washer, in another area I end up creating more cracks along the edge.

So I put up a few plaster washers along the edge, but went 16" over where I know the next joist is, and put up a series of washers along there. That worked much better.



















and I followed ClarenceBauer's recommendation to use a paddle bit to recess a hole for the plaster washers.

Now the next step is to figure out how would I finish the ceiling now? One side is the original painted textured rock lath, with some spots the finished coat has been scraped off, and the other side is new sheetrock, sitting about 1/8" higher.

Do I float an 1/8" joint compound or plaster until they are both level? Do I use paper tape? Mesh tape? Do I need to scrap all the texture say 2" from the edges so I can apply tape?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

To skim coat the new area to meet the existing plane i would recommend that you use a bonding agent on the new sheathing, than use a gypsum premix base coat like USG Structo-Lite or Gold Bond Gypso-lite plaster and being it is only 1/8 inch sift the product selected through a screen wire to remove the perlite. Than mix 1/2 pound of dry mix per SQ. FT. of area to be covered add water & mix now add about say two good double handful of masons lime to your full mix this will make it easy to trowel plus add to the surface bonding.
Don't worry about adding to much lime you could go double the above with no bad effects.
Next time you need to install the plaster washers along the edge fill the gap between the new and old with a gypsum base than install the washers. On the tape question i would use mesh tape for a gypsum product remove the existing texture back about 6 inches around the repair area than tape
OPTION 1 yes you could use a setting type skim coating but being you have an existing Gypsum ceiling system the compatibility will be affected by moisture changes and reaction between the two different materials and over time will crack and or separate. Also next time use a Fiberglass Mat Faced Gypsum and there would be no bonding problem on skim coating.
Bonding agent that can be used Primer 118 , Plaster Weld Blue or White , Throbond & most concrete bonding agents.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

Thanks Clarence a few more questions if I may.

(1) For bonding agent, I still have left over bonding agent by Lanco, in blue color, that I used previously for some stucco application. Can I use that? The bonding agent is to be applied on top of the sheetrock paper right?

(2) Using sifted USG Structo-Lite over the sheetrock - do I also pack the same material into the space between the edge of sheetrock and the existing ceiling?

(3) I thought about filling the gap before using the plaster washers. The problem is the existing ceiling came down a little after the big tree branch fell on the roof, plus when I used my angle grinder on the rock lath to cut a straight line for repair, I grinded off a few nails that was holding the ceiling to the joists. So the plaster washers were used to bring the ceiling back up a little, and if I squeeze in some new materials between the new and old ceiling gap, it may just squeeze in between the space and and up preventing the ceiling from coming back up. I hate these super thick ceiling.


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

(1 ) Yes the Blue bonding agent is fine.
( 2 ) Yes press the Struco-Lite in all the voids.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

Another question, I have seen a brand I believe it's called FibaTape, that carries mesh tape 6", 8", 12" even 36" wide. Is this product any good if I get that and apply that all over the new sheetrock, will that make the base coat easier if I do that instead of or in addition to the bonding agent?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

As a plasterer i would not use the mesh over the entire surface. I would use it over the seams & cracks.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

@ClarenceBauer since I haven't done any plastering before - I have worked with concrete, done exterior stucco on walls, and regular drywall finishes, but never ceiling plastering. So I was ready to hire out this job because I imagine 90% of the plaster ending up on the floor LOL.

However, I got estimates from three plasterers and none of them would agree to do it the way I wanted to which is to use the Structo-Lite base coat over a bonding agent. They instead wanted to use a 20 minute joint compound - I guess because they can make a quick job of it. 

So I think I am going to attempt to DIY this myself.

The ceiling area is 10'X4' rectangle.

I have all of the stucco tools, mixer, drill, buckets, trowels, hawk etc...I will be laying rosin paper on the tiled floors.

A few questions.

(1) The thickness of the base coat needs to be 1/8" to 1/4" because the original ceiling was hand floated and so it's not completely even. Should I be putting on the base coat in one application after the bonding agent? Or should I do a thin "skim coat", wait a day and do another skim coat until I get to the desired thickness?

(2) Once I mixed the Structo-lite, how much time do I have to apply it? Do I need to keep going at full speed until it is used up? At what point will the plaster be unusable if I can't go at a good pace?

(3) The ceiling is 8' tall, I have a 6' ladder, I also have a 20" tall aluminum work platform, which is more efficient for ceiling?

(4) With the bonding agent coated on the new drywall, there is nothing to absorb the moisture of the plaster except the air, so I assume it will set/cure slower? Like over 24 hours?

Any other DOs and DONTs would be greatly appreciated.


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

miamicuse said:


> @ClarenceBauer since I haven't done any plastering before - I have worked with concrete, done exterior stucco on walls, and regular drywall finishes, but never ceiling plastering. So I was ready to hire out this job because I imagine 90% of the plaster ending up on the floor LOL.
> 
> However, I got estimates from three plasterers and none of them would agree to do it the way I wanted to which is to use the Structo-Lite base coat over a bonding agent. They instead wanted to use a 20 minute joint compound - I guess because they can make a quick job of it.
> 
> ...


( 1 ) Apply the base coat in one application
( 2 ) You will have about 45 min. work time per pail mixed.
( 3 ) Best results is a work platform 6'4" from finished ceiling ladders do not work for plaster application
( 4 ) The set time will not be affected by the bonding agent you need the 24 hours regardless before applying the finish.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

Thanks so much ClarenceBauer. I will give it a go and see. Still not sure how I would put a coat of 1/4" on just by feel. I wonder if I should nail a 1/4" strip of wood along the area and do it in four sections of 12"X10'?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

miamicuse said:


> Thanks so much ClarenceBauer. I will give it a go and see. Still not sure how I would put a coat of 1/4" on just by feel. I wonder if I should nail a 1/4" strip of wood along the area and do it in four sections of 12"X10'?


No just use a straight edge to screed it off use the existing edge as a reference.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

Seems I can't get any break on moving this project further.

I tried to look for the two products ClarenceBauer recommended - USG StructoLite or Gold Bond Gypsolite. Googled the names and it showed up on the big box store web sites, but they do not carry it locally here in South Florida, not available for delivery or "pick up at store" either.

So I looked up the manufacturer's web sites and found a list of local suppliers. Called a few of them and no they don't have it. Then I contacted USG and National Gypsum to see if they can give me a local supplier that carries this. After two weeks USG gave me the name of ALL STEEL AND GYPSUM which is about 25 minutes away. So this morning I went there, ready to buy.

I asked them if they carry this product and they said "WHAT?". I repeated "either USG StructoLite or Gold Bond GypsoLite".

"What is it again?"

I stated the same thing again.

The guy yelled out loud to the whole warehouse "ANYONE HEARD OF STRUCTOLITE or GYPSOLITE"?

Everyone had a blank stare. One guy asked me "what is it for"?

I said "It's an extra light weight base coat plaster".

The guy said "We don't have that but we have MARBLE LITE and it's the same thing, you want it"?

Having no choice I said OK and bought two bags of this MARBLE LITE plaster.

After I paid and drove to the back where Receiving is they handed me two bags of this:

WONCOTE SMOOTH VENEER PMM PREMIX-MARBLETITE

As soon as I saw that MARBLE"TITE" I figured this is something else. This is the finish coat plaster right?

So the hunt for a "LITE" plaster continues.


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

Check with L&W Supply ( dba ) CK SUPPLY if they do not have it ask them to check with USG and find out who received the last shipment of Structo-Lite in your area.


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

If L&W cannot help contact the Florida Trust for Historic Preservation they should have info on the companys that repair / restore the plaster systems in Fla.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

@ClarenceBauer I will try that tomorrow. Thanks so much for your help and guidance!


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

Good news. I downloaded the supplier list for Gold Bond and USG in my area and called everyone of them asking for both products and finally found a place that has them. A little out of my way but finally I got it.

I company told me they used to have it but no more because no one uses it anymore.

I picked up two bags - not sure if I need more but I am sure I will find out. I figured about 50% of it will end on the floor or my face since this is my first try.

Clarence, if I don't want to mix the whole bag in a 5 gallon bucket, simply because I am really skeptical of my plastering skills on a ceiling, what is the minimum I can mix that will give me a warm up, I know once I mix it I have to use it in 45 minutes. Would be nice to do a bit of a dry run.

Bonding agent said to apply then wait two hours, so I will do that.

I assume I still need a finish coat of veneer plaster. I still have two bags of the WONCOTE that I have no need for, can I use that as a finish coat? I will be texturing since the rest of the ceiling is knock down - yes I know I hate texture anything.


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

You can mix any amount desired just add water to make a good paste like peanut butter. Yes you can use the woncote as a finish. Two bags is enough to complete the job.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

If I "overfill" a little then use a straight edge to screed from the existing edges, the base coat would be the same level as the existing.

The existing is textured rock lath. I have scraped the texture off around 4" to 6" off the edges.

after the base coat is cured, I will float a finish coat - really thin on top of the base coat, but also covering part of the 4" to 6" I scrapped off. Then I will texture everything right?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

miamicuse said:


> If I "overfill" a little then use a straight edge to screed from the existing edges, the base coat would be the same level as the existing.
> 
> The existing is textured rock lath. I have scraped the texture off around 4" to 6" off the edges.
> 
> after the base coat is cured, I will float a finish coat - really thin on top of the base coat, but also covering part of the 4" to 6" I scrapped off. Then I will texture everything right?


All of the above is CORRECT.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

OK I will be going for it tomorrow.

I did some practice on some scrap sheetrock pieces last weekend just to get a feel for it.

I was mixing about a gallon at a time, seems to be about what I can put up in about 45 minutes. I just can't go any faster.

I noticed when I used up about 90% of the mix, I added more and remix - this seems to be a bad idea, as I noticed the stuff seems have some lumps. I am guessing the left over mix of the first mixing when mixed with the second mixing is not a good idea? When I mix concrete I am able to get away with it by leaving a little in the bucket and add another batch, but for plaster this seems to create a problem. Does it mean I need to completely clean the bucket with each mixing?

Another question I have, is since I will be doing knock down texture at the end, is it really necessary to apply a finish coat after the base coat?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

DO not mix the two to gather as it will cause the first mixture to set very fast.
I would use a parge coat of finish before the texture is applied.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

ClarenceBauer said:


> DO not mix the two to gather as it will cause the first mixture to set very fast.
> I would use a parge coat of finish before the texture is applied.


OK that means I really need to clean and rinse out the bucket for each mixing. I thought I could get away with some residue but yes my second mix was not as smooth as the first batch. Good to know.


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

After 20 years you will find out what you can & cannot do with plaster.
If you know what the end results will be you can mix some things with plaster that will make it set very fast. It is like Epoxy when you mix A & B to gather Than add a fresh batch with the old mix will cause the new to set faster.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

I covered half the repaired area with the StructoLite base coat today.










First I applied the Lanco bonding agent.










I then waited two hours, then did the mixing of the mud. I took about 1/3 of the dry mix from the 50lb bag and added about 4-5 gallons of water. Turned out that's about what I needed to cover the area I covered with bonding agent which was about 20SF.

It was messy. I had a painter's coverall on, and I still end up with plaster on my nose, UNDER my armpits, and on the floor. I had a real hard time using the trowel to get an even clean coat. When I used a 48" edge to go across, more mud came down.










Is there any tricks to getting a smoother coat? I tried using a sponge to smooth things but that seems to make the surface more "gritty". I think I need a 48" long trowel.


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

You need to start by using a small trowel like a 8 inch X 3 inch get the feel using this size trowel. Than switch to a larger one like 10.5 inch X 41/2 inch trowel. Use the straight edge after the area is covered to level out. A large trowel for a beginner is very difficult. Also make the mix a little stiffer if you turn the over the mud should stay on the trowel.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

I was using a very long one I think may be 16" long. Today I used a 10" long one and it went much better. I had much less plaster coming down, probably because I started to put the hawk right underneath where I trowel to catch any drips. I also found it easier to do it in sort of a circular motion then to pull the plaster towards me in a straight line.

The plaster I applied yesterday between 3pm-5pm when I looked at it this morning I see some darker spots that felt damp. How long does it take for the Structolite to be dry enough for the finish coat (WONCOTE) to be applied? I think the Structolite base coat is on an average 1/8" thick, with some spots thinner and some spots thicker.

Today I also tried a sponge float, and a rubber float about 30 minutes after I applied the base coat. That didn't work too well either. I think may be I should have waited longer but being it's a base coat I don't really need it silky smooth. I used a wet sponge to smooth off the edges where it meets the existing plaster. I am assuming I don't need tape on the joints while I put up the finish coat, or do I?

However when I do the finish coat, can I rubber or foam float it smooth after the application? How long should I wait before doing so?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

In reguards to the mesh over the seams go back to post # 10.
As related to drying when the color is the same over the entire area you are ready for the finish coating material, do not sponge float the base coat you do not want it smooth. It needs keys to hold the finish to the base. pulling the material in a straight line covers the most Sq / Ft pre lift. Thickness has no effect the base it is used to keep the ceiling on the same plane. The finish coat should be troweled smooth, texture should be applied before the parge coats sets.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

South Florida has been raining for over a week, humidity is high. I have the air con on 74 degrees so hopefully that will help move things along.

In regarding the mesh tape, I have the "joint" between the new ceiling drywall and the old plaster which were at different elevations but now it's matched up. I will tape that and apply the finish coat over it as advised. However, there are also some spots where the old veneer plaster has delaminated and I have scrapped off everything loose, those area I see the old brown coat. Do I tape along the seams of the veneer plaster when the old brown coat is solid?

I should texture right after the finish coat? I thought I need to wait till it dries to give it time to cure?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

No more mesh tape is required.
DO not let the top coat of finish dry ( cure ) before you apply the texture you will have a better bond with a damp.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

ClarenceBauer said:


> No more mesh tape is required.


 @*ClarenceBauer* in post #10 you indicated mesh tape would be desirable along seams and cracks. So just to make sure I don't misunderstand this is a picture after I installed the ceiling sheet rock, along with existing ceiling showing the brown coat in some areas and the finish coat (with texture) in other areas.










Are you saying no more texture at all is needed everywhere after the Structolite brown coat has been troweled on, or you mean to use tape along the seams where the two ceilings meet (shown below in red), but no tape is needed along the edge of the veneer plaster (shown below in blue)?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

NO mesh tape in the blue area.
The structo-Lite is a brown coat to bring the new area out to the same plane as the existing area. YES a texture coat would be applied over the Structo-Lite.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

I am going to try and finish coat today or tomorrow depending on whether it's dry and ready. It's suppose to have a cold front coming and dryer air. We shall see.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

Ready to do the finish coat today but the brown coat is still damp in many spots.










I opened the windows all day to get some moving air. It's been in the 70s and 60s all day with no rain. At the end of the day there are still damp spots. I hope tomorrow will be all dry.

If texture is applied before finish coat is cured, it will bond better. However, does the texture also slow the curing drying time of the finish coat because it's masking/blocking the finish coat from releasing moisture into the air?

I read somewhere I may have to wait a month to paint after finishing coat? I hope not.


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

Wait and let cure until all the dark spots are gone.
The dark areas are caused from thickness & bonding agent.
Question what brand Bonding Agent was used?


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

I used the Lanco bonding agent blue color.










On Thursday afternoon I did half the ceiling - I used a brush to brush on the bonding agent, then waited two hours as in the instructions. On Friday I rolled on the bonding agent which was much easier and faster - also waited two hours and I did the other half of the brown coat. When I did it Friday there may be 8" to 10" of overlap since I feather out the coat from the day before.

I am going to the property this morning to see if it is dry out yet to accept the finish coat (WONCOTE).

If I give it a go, should I mist+sponge at the end? I know this is probably not what a real plasterer would do but I think it may give a first time user better results?

Another thing I forgot. Where the ceiling joins the existing walls (which is also rock lath plastered), I didn't worry about it during the brown coating, but I assume I should scrap off the texture for say 4 to 6" or the ceiling, and put in a mesh tape?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

The bonding agent used is re wettable which would indicate to me that high moisture would slow the drying of the bonding agent under the plaster.
As for the wall ceiling tie in if the walls are ok just neatly butt the ceiling texture to the wall. I would not recommend wetting the final finish.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

well, ceiling still not completely dry so the waiting continues.

what is strange is when I left yesterday afternoon I took a picture of the ceiling and I compared it to what it looks like this morning and it seems to be the same damp spots roughly the same size. It did not seem like there has been any progress in the drying. In fact I compared what it looked like tonight and this morning, the same.

I kind of expected the joints between new drywall and existing plaster to be slowest in drying because I packed as much of the base plaster into the seam so it's thicker there. As for the bonding agent I put that on but waited two hours, so it wasn't wet when I laid on the plaster but it was still somewhat tacky.

I am taking a floor fan there tomorrow and tilt the fan towards the ceiling and create more air movement, may be that would help, not sure.

So should I use a mesh tape at the ceiling wall joint, or just pack the finish coat at the ceiling seam and make a nice transition with a corner trowel?


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

OK it's been three days and it doesn't seem like the base coat is dry yet because the color is not uniform. However what is also puzzling is the first 18 hours I can tell it's drying because much of the ceiling turned a lighter color.

But after the first 18 hours, I have checked it every 12-28 hours and it's been over 48 hours and there has been virtually NO CHANGE in the color. I am wondering if it's ever going to have a uniform color.

Just to recap, I did half of the base coat (right side) last Thursday. Then on Friday I put up the other half (left side). This is a picture taken right after I finished on Friday. You can tell the left side was still wet and dark.










Now, the next morning, on Saturday, about 18 hours later it looked like this. Much of it has turned a lighter color and looked dry. I was ready to put on the finish coat but decided to wait.










Then forward to Sunday morning, that's 24 hours after the last picture. To my eyes it looks the same, I didn't see any more "drying".










Now forward to Monday evening, another 36 hours since the previous picture. Again, it looks the same to me. This is over 72 hours since the base coat was laid.










The last three pictures, taken a day apart from each other, look virtually the same. I don't know what that means. I felt the dark spots by hand and it felt dry.

Either it is not drying for some reason, or it is done drying but the color is not going to be uniform?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

It could be that the thicker areas dried slower causing the darker color.
If it feels dry go for it.
The only other way would be to use a moisture meter or IR camera to check the moisture level. From what i can see & understand you should be OK to apply the finish coat.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

OK I will proceed now to do the finish plaster.

Can I do it in two sections, because I work slow and I don't think I can cover the entire area within 45 minutes. Or do I have to somehow lay it on in one shot?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

It would work best if the entire area was completed at the same time plus you will not have a cold joint.
What kind of trowel are you using? You should be able to cover that area in 9 min. if using a 10 inch trowel.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

I am using a steel trowel 10" by marshaltown. I have a longer one but not using that.

9 minutes is impossible for me. It takes 9 minutes to pit up two strips of mesh tapes along the joints! For the base coat it took me 30 minutes to do the mixing and just over one hour to cover 25 SF that's why I did the basecoat in two sections. I am more worried about the finish coat and making the result even, straight and smooth.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

:sad: today was a total disaster.

Knowing that I may have about 40 minutes of work time, I decided to mix about half a bucket (5 gallon bucket) and see how far that goes.

According to the instructions on the bag of the WONCOTE, mix 3 gallons of water to the whole 50 lb bag. Since I don't need that much, I figured that means 1 gallon of water will be just right for 1/3 of the bag.

So I took out a 5 gallon bucket, put in 1 gallon of cold tap water. Then I add in the dry mix. I just kind of eye balled it then used a mud mixer to mix it thoroughly, took about 5 minutes to mix. Then I noticed it seems a bit too dry, so I used a garden hose and squirt in a little water and mixed again. When I got the right consistency, what I had was only about 1/3 of the 5 gallon bucket...not sure that would be enough, so I added more dry mix and a few more squirt of water, and mixed again. I am guessing when I did this I messed up?

I took the bucket inside and started to lay it on. I put some on my hawk and started on the end of one wall. About 5 minutes in I noticed the mix was starting to get lumpy so I stopped. I only put on about a strip of 18" wide 4' long. That's it. I noticed the mud on my hawk is getting hard and difficult to trowel. At the same time I was troweling, I might have troweled too hard due to the plaster setting quick, I must have scraped across a mesh tape hard and that piece came down, hit the window trim, baseboard and floor. I have rosin paper on the floor but had to quickly clean up the wall. When I went back to the 5 gallon bucket, the entire mix is now rock solid and can't even be emptied and cleaned. I spent the next 20 minutes scraping the hard plaster off my tools. :vs_mad:


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

I think I figured out what went wrong, it wasn't the mix, I was just slowwwwww.

The instructions on WONCOTE says work time is 40 minutes. I assume that's when I start to mix. It takes me a good 5-8 minutes to mix, and I am mixing outside the house where it's ventilated, and a garden hose right there, and I have some cardboard paper laying down. Once I did the mixing I have to remove the mixing bit from the drill, clean that so it won't be all clogged and set, then carry the bucket inside to the room. Then when I am laying it on, like the first time got up on the work platform I had too much on the trowel and as I lay it on the ceiling the angle was such that part of it came down, splattered on the baseboards so I went to clean that up...another time after I reloaded my hawk, I had to move the work platform, so I came down and lifted the platform while my other hand tilted unconsciously, and all the mud on the hawk fell on the platform. So I cleaned that up too because if I stepped on it I will be leaving mud everywhere. So with all that taken into account, I think I have may be at most 15-20 minutes to actually doing the laying.

The first two times I mixed half of a 5 gallon bucket and I didn't get to use half of that. I was just too slow and inefficient. I end up figuring I probably use about 1 gallon of mud each time before it sets. So yesterday I did five mixing, each time starting with 2QT of water and until I have a good consistency I was able to use all of it each time before it gets hard. Each time I also thoroughly clean all the tools and bucket before restarting. The entire process took about 8 hours. I know the pros probably have a team of people, one doing mixing, one doing laying, and this is my first time trying this, ten hours to put on a coat over 50SF, pathetic I know LOL.

Each time I lay it on when I got near the end I start to feather the edges, then on the next laying I feathered from the other end. I used a sponge to smooth the joints. For some reason the WONCOTE sets quickly. The Structo-Lite even 45 minutes after laying I can use a steel trowel to smooth things, the WONCOTE once it sets in like 20 minutes I can't trowel. If I try to use my steel trowel and trowel hard, it seems to pull loose the mud instead of leveling/flattening. I thought about misting with some water but you advised against it so I didn't. So the end result is not as smooth as I thought.

If I put a spot light on it I can see some blemishes in small spots I didn't get it smooth enough or some mild trowel lines. Can I touch it up by mixing and trowel on just a little more WONCOTE now? Since I am going to texture it it doesn't need to be perfect I guess.










I didn't get to do any texture yet as it was close to 11pm when I finish last night.

I don't know why the plaster end up in strange spots. I have most of the floor covered with two layers of rosin paper, two feet beyond the work area. Yet for some reason when I cleaned up I saw splatter of mud on the wall a good six feet from the ceiling I was laying. Don't know how it got there. One time I had mud coming down as I caught it with my hawk, it fell partly on the hawk then rebounded into my neck, and down inside my shirt. This is definitely a skilled trade.


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

Things that can cause fast set - Old Material Woncoat over 6 mounts old - Mixing too long with the paddle mixer - Adding more material after the chemical action has started - Using warm water from the garden hose that was in the sun. Pot life starts when you add the Gypsum to water.
Now you know why an Apprenticeship takes about 4 years. It would be best to mix close to the work area like in the same room.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

Oh I definitely know this is a different ball game and what I was getting myself into. I had planned on hiring this one out but couldn't find anyone. Everyone just wanted to skim with joint compound. Even had trouble finding structolite locally probably indicated its a lost art. The only plasterer I found who knew what I wanted, kind of, is from Hialeah, and he doesn't speak English only Spanish and we couldn't communicate on the phone.

So now I can see a few blemishes from yesterday, some trowel marks, joints from two separate layings, a couple of dimples. Should I lay mote woncote over those spots or move on with texturing?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

Move on to texture and do it while it is still green the longer between the parge coat and the texture the faster the texture will set.


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

OK finally the texture is finished too.

The woncote finish plaster was put up on Wednesday.

Knock down texture put up on Friday afternoon.

I am tempted to prime/paint today. Is it OK in terms of the plaster? Does it need more time to cure/set/dry? I have a fan blowing up at it for two days. But I read somewhere plaster may need a month before paint?


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## ClarenceBauer (Mar 4, 2005)

Check the spec. on the Woncote veneer plaster. USG & Gold Bond Veneer plaster can be painted the next day as per manufacture data. I have never used Woncote don't what the spec states. At the least check it for dark areas , dark would indicate moisture bright White dry. Last use a moisture meter to check moisture content.
I should have added " check the requirements on the paint to be used what PH reading do they require? "


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

The plaster was uniform in color before texture went on.

I checked the fine prints on the bag of Woncote and it says it's "ready for decoration the next day". Decoration means painting?


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## miamicuse (Nov 13, 2011)

Finally, the ceiling repair is done, texture applied, and primed and top coated with no issue.
@ClarenceBauer, I wanted to express my gratitude for your advice, patience and basically hand holding me through this repair and plastering process. This would have been impossible without your guidance. Seems traditional plastering is an lost art, almost impossible to find local plasterers nowadays. Thank you again for sharing your knowledge and experience.


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