# Garage door won't go down easily



## diggitydog (Aug 28, 2006)

I have an automatic garage door opener that continues to reverse itself when attempting to close the door. It'll go down a bit and then start to bring the door back up. 

It is a screw drive type from Genie probably from the 80's or early 90's - 1/2 hp. It began occurring about a month or so ago, and is happening more and more frequently..... I believe because it is colder outside.

Could this be that the springs are wound too tightly? The lube in the track is gelling in the cold MN air? Other ideas?

I tried to find some adjustments on the opener that would adjust the amount of resistance it needs to encounter before reversing, but couldn't find anything.

Anyway, it currently takes about 4 or 5 attempts of getting the door down before I get it closes completely. The door will close a couple feet and then begin reversing.....I'll press the button to stop the retreat......press it again and the door will go down a few more feet.... it begins to reverse again...... I repeat this process until closed.

The red light on the floor beam sensor never blinks so I don't think it is caused by the floor sensors.

Please help if you've ever experienced anything like this or have any ideas how to proceed.

Thanks,
Dave


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## joasis (May 28, 2006)

Step one: Pull the door release and operate the door manually...see if it is binding up...if it is easy to operate without the opener, then you have an operator problem. With the door released, cycle the opener up and down and watch the trolley on the track and see if it is smothly moving the full distance. Btween these steps, you will find the culprit....spring tension changes on the door would make it harder to lift, no go down, and do not adjust them,...torsion springs are not a DIY adjustment...if the operator (opener) jerks or the trolley catches and isn't smooth, then you have a sensor problem or the screw needs lubricated, etc.....check all of these and see what you find. Overhead doors do like maintenance from time to time...lube the rollers, make sure the tracks are secure (not allowing a catch point for the rollers, etc.)


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## concretemasonry (Oct 10, 2006)

Everything slows down when winter starts and the grease and dirt coagulate.

Your door carriages wear and get dirty and cause restraint that the door senses as hitting something. When you try it a few times you loosen it up and get everything working better, so it then works - sort of.

The easy, short term "fix" is to crack up the closing adjustment. BETTER YET - look at everything, clean it up, tighten all the bolts that have loosened and then lubricate with oil (not WD40). That should do it and you may even be able to re-adjust the operaying power a little looser so it will be safer.

************


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## diggitydog (Aug 28, 2006)

joasis said:


> Step one: Pull the door release and operate the door manually...see if it is binding up...if it is easy to operate without the opener, then you have an operator problem.


Thanks, I did this already and the door operates pretty smoothly by hand. However, it is a bit heavy and doesn't stay open without my holding it open at any position on the track.....perhaps the springs are out of adjustment. It is my understanding that the door should hang on its own about 3 to 4 feet off of the ground where the springs and the weight of the door are in equilibrium.


joasis said:


> With the door released, cycle the opener up and down and watch the trolley on the track and see if it is smothly moving the full distance.


When cycling the opener this way, the screw track and opener both shake/vibrate quite a bit....it seems there may be a kink or bend in the screw and this is causing additional friction/resistance, as well.


joasis said:


> ...if the operator (opener) jerks or the trolley catches and isn't smooth, then you have a sensor problem or the screw needs lubricated, etc.....check all of these and see what you find.


The sensors don't seem to be a problem because the opener does cycle fully when the door is unlatched.


concretemasonry said:


> The easy, short term "fix" is to crack up the closing adjustment.


Problem is that this is an older opener so the power adjusting screws are not on the unit. From what I can tell, you have to adjust it with a large plastic nut on the back of the opener. I've already got the thing cranked as tight as it will go.


concretemasonry said:


> BETTER YET - look at everything, clean it up, tighten all the bolts that have loosened and then lubricate with oil (not WD40). That should do it and you may even be able to re-adjust the operaying power a little looser so it will be safer.
> ************


I'll lube up the rollers, track, screw and continue to play around with it. Hopefully, I'll be able to get to it over the holiday weekend. With all the family and friends in town it may be hard to find some time.

Thanks much for your replies,
Dave


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## joasis (May 28, 2006)

*I cannot stress enough that spring tension, unless you have the old "extension springs" is not something to be jacked with under any condition.* Not 3 weeks ago, I went out to repair a door after a guy tried to tighten up the springs himself. He went to the *emergency room *and lost a few teeth when the screwdriver he was trying to hold the spring tension slipped out of the pocket in the spring collar. He had no idea of the force these springs are under, and he didn't know when we wind them, we use bars that fit exactly, and a method to insure that if one comes out, it won't kill us. 

*Another thing about torsion springs, and this is for all of you who happen upon this post: The springs will age....meaning as they get old, they can and will loose some tension. Call a garage door guy for a service call.....you can't imagine what a spring looks like after it has been over-tightened and explodes in pieces....it can kill people.*

I am not picking on the original poster, diggitydog, but this is a general statement about overhead garage doors. I will not ever tell anyone online how to set up and wind springs.....they show this stuff done on the DIY shows, and HGTV, but it is not a DIY project. The overhead doors purchased from Lowes and HD are usually extension spring doors will decent instructions, and those can hurt you. In my area, I charge a $100 and upto install a door, and takes me an hour or more a door to do it....but I have installed them for years, and I know exactly what I am doing...when you look at a door and think to yourself it isn't that hard, remember these words of wisdom here, and call a door guy!


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## KUIPORNG (Jan 11, 2006)

I have similar problem last week, and I thought it is because of lack of lubrication or non-sufficient resistant force, and then I do both adjustment and it is still not working...

I also felt the sensor is not the problem of the source as there is no blinking or anything... but after I do some adjustment on the sensors... it work no problem... here is what I suspect: the sensor has no problem if everything is steady... but once the door start to move and everything vibrate, the sensor eye may lose connection in a milli seconds and door reverese... so the conclusion is the sensor eye must be aligned to a way which is with good covering that can overcome minor vibration... I did find my sesor eye drop a little bit... so I put its head up and tightened up the screw... it's been working for a week not a single failurer since... may be you want to try that...


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## diggitydog (Aug 28, 2006)

joasis said:


> *I cannot stress enough that spring tension, unless you have the old "extension springs" is not something to be jacked with under any condition....*
> 
> ...when you look at a door and think to yourself it isn't that hard, remember these words of wisdom here, and call a door guy!


Thanks joasis, for the words of warning (I know that you weren't singling me out). Just to clarify, I had *no intention* of adjusting the springs myself. 

I'm hoping I can get the door to function well enough through the winter without calling a door guy because next year I plan on doing a major overhaul to the entire garage. I plan on adding a 3rd stall, upgrade the electrical service, insulate the walls, hang drywall, etc. At that time, I'll replace the double wide door with one that matches the new door on the 3rd stall. I'll upgrade openers at that time as well. Of course, I'll have a professional doing all of this work.

I only want to limp this opener/door along for about 4 to 6 more months until we start the garage upgrade next spring.

BTW, do you have any suggestions on openers? Good brands? Screw drive vs. chain, etc? I'd like to start thinking about which setup I'm going to use in the new garage.


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## joasis (May 28, 2006)

I like the Genie screw drives myself, I don't like cable or chain drives...but remember, if I need an operator, I buy a liftmaster from my supplier. I have installed several Genie screw drives, and they are fine...just set an hour aside to asssemble it. 

I don't run an overhead door company, I am a contractor who happens to install doors in new construction mostly, and have done a lot of service work in my own town, since the closest door service is 20 miles. Typical of the doors we install are up to 24 feet wide and 18 feet high. Not your everyday home garage door. Good luck with it, I think when you lube the screw...you will not have a problem.


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## HarryHarley (Nov 17, 2006)

I only want to limp this opener/door along for about 4 to 6 more months until we start the garage upgrade next spring.

All wise responces here. You'll definitly get as many months as you need with the old door. The last resort is ya just gotta raise and lower by had like we "used" to do. Good luck with your remodel and be carefull.


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## dougrus (Sep 16, 2006)

joasis said:


> *I cannot stress enough that spring tension, unless you have the old "extension springs" is not something to be jacked with under any condition.*


Sorry, just needed to share. A year ago I was sitting in my living room watching the tube and I hear this noise to end all noises...It sounded like someone had driven a car into the back wall of the house where it meets the garage. Went out and looked and saw a torsion spring laying on the ground and very significant gash in the plaster. Ahhhhh ya.....not a DIY project.:no:


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## redline (Mar 5, 2006)

diggitydog said:


> I have an automatic garage door opener that continues to reverse itself when attempting to 'CLOSE' the door. It'll go down a bit and then start to bring the door back up.
> 
> Thanks,
> Dave




If this is happening when it is trying to close the door then it sounds like the springs can be ruled out. If the springs were the major problem then it would happen when the door was being opened. Gravity helps the door to close.

I would look at rollers. Over time the ball bearings in the rollers become worn. They may be binding up as the door tries to close. Change the worn rollers and also look at the rails to see if they are out of alignment.


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## joasis (May 28, 2006)

There is a guy I met who had a huge scar on his arm....he missed the lecture on red is left, black is right (and if you don't know what I am talking about, you don't need to ask) and wound the cone out of the spring. I guess the end of the spring dug a path through his arm as it re-coiled. Ouch. 

I cannot believe in this day and age of product liability, Lowes and HD sell overhead doors...there is more potential for injury and damage with OHD's then just about anything else....but I have seen their new extension spring models, and they have a plastic winch that a cordless (or corded) drill will wind tension to adjust the door...just about idiot proof if they read the instructions. I have not personally seen one, but I understand that there is a drill operated mechanical winder that stays on the tension bar...supposed to eliminate the winding bars....of course, raise the prices of the doors...they won't give a rebate on the product liability insurance they now pay.


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## boman47k (Aug 25, 2006)

Just curious, does this door have a coupler for the screw? Something was said about it wobbling or making a noise or something.


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## diggitydog (Aug 28, 2006)

boman47k said:


> Just curious, does this door have a coupler for the screw? Something was said about it wobbling or making a noise or something.


I don't understand what you mean by the door having a "coupler for the screw". 

The opener shakes quite a bit during the open/close cycle because the track and screw are bent just a little bit. So when the screw rotates it does so "out of round". Kind of like a tire that has uneven wear or is unbalanced and begins to wobble at speed.

BTW, after messing with the old Genie and continually running into problems with door reversal, poor tension adjustment, old ground sensors, bent track, fixed remote codes, I bit the bullet and replaced the opener on Sunday after all of the family was gone from the holiday weekend. Sears had an after Thanksgiving special so I purchased the higher end 1/2 hp Craftsman chain drive for $129.99 after rebate. I thought it was a pretty good deal, so I went ahead with it.

Very happy with the new opener so far :thumbsup: even though it is chain drive.


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## boman47k (Aug 25, 2006)

Glad you got the problem solved.



> I don't understand what you mean by the door having a "coupler for the screw".


I was thinking the Genie had a sleeve like piece that slid over a part of the screw to keep it from making noise and to keep it in line. My son left it off one once , and it made a big racket when in use. This piece being left off made the screw wobble and the door was slow to open and close. Sounded like it was coming apart.


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## HarryHarley (Nov 17, 2006)

Sounds like you solved your problem. Guess it was best just getting the new one, huh?


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## redline (Mar 5, 2006)

Sounds like the bent shaft was causing too much resistance and activating the safety.


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## hozII (Aug 25, 2011)

Hey guys.....new here......similar problem but im in the south....n.al. I have a early 2000 model 1/2 hp craftsman. Door does same thing. Jerks when closing and gets about halfway and goes back up. I have replaced both sensors and lubed everything. Adjusted down force. Door and trolley operates smoothly with door disconnected. Now when it hits the ground it pushes too far and makes door go back up when you can actually get it to close without having to help it close by hand...im on a really tight budget and need some good advice...thanks in advance!! Side note last night I had adjusted the down force and it closed properly without help...this morn it closed without help but when it hit full close it pushed too far and made it come back up.


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## iamrfixit (Jan 30, 2011)

Adjusting the force limit adjusting knob can help the opener push the door past minor catching, anything major would need to be corrected or the door can be damaged and the repeated jamming can wipe out the plastic gears inside the opener. Remember the opener pushes from the center of the top panel, you are probably pulling the door from the bottom panel which can cause some problems to disappear when you operate the door by hand. If you don't see obvious signs of the door catching on the way down, next look at the sensors. It takes very little to affect these, cobwebs on the door, a leaf stuck in the cobwebs or sometimes even sunlight shining into one of the eyes can cause intermittent problems at a certain time of year.

There are travel limit screws on the side of the opener to adjust how far it closes or how far it opens. These have a door icon with an up and down arrow and you need a smaller flat screwdriver to make changes. If the door is closing too far you need to adjust the close limit, back it off about a half to one full turn then try closing the door. You may need to make a couple adjustments to get it just right.


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## hozII (Aug 25, 2011)

iamrfixit said:


> Adjusting the force limit adjusting knob can help the opener push the door past minor catching, anything major would need to be corrected or the door can be damaged and the repeated jamming can wipe out the plastic gears inside the opener. Remember the opener pushes from the center of the top panel, you are probably pulling the door from the bottom panel which can cause some problems to disappear when you operate the door by hand. If you don't see obvious signs of the door catching on the way down, next look at the sensors. It takes very little to affect these, cobwebs on the door, a leaf stuck in the cobwebs or sometimes even sunlight shining into one of the eyes can cause intermittent problems at a certain time of year.
> 
> There are travel limit screws on the side of the opener to adjust how far it closes or how far it opens. These have a door icon with an up and down arrow and you need a smaller flat screwdriver to make changes. If the door is closing too far you need to adjust the close limit, back it off about a half to one full turn then try closing the door. You may need to make a couple adjustments to get it just right.


Yeah im Goin to go back and back the down force off a lil, but yes sensors have been replaced all new and clean, everything lubed, both door and trolley operates smoothly disconnected, Just can't figure out why it jerks so bad on the way down to make it come back up. This is so frustrating and im sure its something so simple but complicated to figure out......lol


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## hozII (Aug 25, 2011)

Alright went out tonight and played with it.....everything was set back to original force settings.....now with door off trolly,the trolls goes all the way to the end and goes to far and come back on its own so idk what the heck is up with it!


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## iamrfixit (Jan 30, 2011)

Inside the opener unit you have a plastic gear set, a worm gear on the motor shaft which drives a larger plastic gear on main shaft that drives the chain sprocket. Normally it is only the larger gear that fails, when this happens it allows the door to become out of sync with the limit switches. 

If you are handy the repair is not difficult and the parts are about $8 for the gear at amazon. If the worm gear or the upper sprocket shaft and bearing is damaged the whole kit is around $20. This is the most common and really about the only problem with this style opener. I have seen these gears last 15-20 years or be completely stripped in a few weeks if the door is improperly adjusted or catching.

You can confirm this problem by disconnecting the power and removing the cover from the opener. If you see many white shavings then locate the large white gear, chances are the teeth are worn almost completely off.


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## hozII (Aug 25, 2011)

iamrfixit said:


> Inside the opener unit you have a plastic gear set, a worm gear on the motor shaft which drives a larger plastic gear on main shaft that drives the chain sprocket. Normally it is only the larger gear that fails, when this happens it allows the door to become out of sync with the limit switches.
> 
> If you are handy the repair is not difficult and the parts are about $8 for the gear at amazon. If the worm gear or the upper sprocket shaft and bearing is damaged the whole kit is around $20. This is the most common and really about the only problem with this style opener. I have seen these gears last 15-20 years or be completely stripped in a few weeks if the door is improperly adjusted or catching.
> 
> You can confirm this problem by disconnecting the power and removing the cover from the opener. If you see many white shavings then locate the large white gear, chances are the teeth are worn almost completely off.



Great info! That makes sense, since it is not at all working with the limit switches....played with it some more before I read this and not it stops, starts all over the place now.....lol gonna pull cover off and im sure that's the culprit, have a look see if its just the gear or shaft and all......thanks a ton! $10-$30 is a whole lot better than $200+ for a new opener!


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## hozII (Aug 25, 2011)

Alright, finally got it down took it apart everything looks good.....put everything back ,door worked fine up and down with no jerking now? On third fourth cycle it started messing up again....I adjusted down force worked great third or fourth cycle it messed up again.......almost like I turned the down force to 0....I can play with the force adjustment and it will work fine for a few cycles then mess up again......could this be the set limiter sensor in the opener going out?


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## iamrfixit (Jan 30, 2011)

Does the door start jerking again when the opener is messing up? 
Does the door work smoothly when disconnected and operated by hand?
Does the opener cycle up and down smoothly with the door disconnected?

Trying to figure out if the door is actually catching on the jamb or track to cause this jerking, which in turn causes the opener to exceed the force limit and reverse. Or if a problem in the opener is intermittently happening to cause the door to jerk enough to exceed the limit and send it open. Something like maybe a loose connection or broken wire causing the motor to start and stop suddenly. 
It's very hard to diagnose something like this without seeing it operate!

The force limit adjustment is actually a part of the main control board in the opener and a new board costs nearly as much as a basic opener. Rather than experiment with parts it could quickly become cheaper to just replace it.


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## hozII (Aug 25, 2011)

iamrfixit said:


> Does the door start jerking again when the opener is messing up?
> Does the door work smoothly when disconnected and operated by hand?
> Does the opener cycle up and down smoothly with the door disconnected?
> 
> ...


Yes door and trolley works smoothly disconn. Was jerking before when closing but now it doesn't. After I took motor unit down and put everything back together, worked fine for a few cycles but then it was stopping on opening and closing all over the place.....as in, it wouldn't open but half way or 3/4 or close too far then make itself come back up. Then it would work fine again after I would turn the down force all the way back down then back up again.....I can get a vid of it and post it...you guys support photobucket here?


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## iamrfixit (Jan 30, 2011)

I don't know much about photobucket, but if they support video you should be able to link it to here.

Opening and closing too far is very strange, because the travel limit switches are completely independent of the force knobs. Turning the force knob should not do anything to change how far the door travels.

If the stopping points are changing, then something is definitely wrong. The door position is directly linked to the limit switches, every time the motor runs the limit switch travels one way or the other the exact proportionate amount because it is gear driven. The only way the travel limits can change is if something is slipping, allowing the door position to advance without moving the limit switch. Usually the cause is the plastic gears. Other than that, the chain, chain drive sprocket, or something in the limit switch drive gears or drive screw.

I have been assuming this opener is chain drive is that correct? Not much chance of the chain slipping, it pretty much works or falls off.

If it is belt drive your belt could be missing some teeth and slipping over the drive sprocket, or the drive sprocket could be slipping on the shaft. I have not had much trouble with either but have heard of an occasional problem. 

Something has to be slipping and allowing the door position to get out of sync with the limit switch. Occasionally it may slip back close to correct position for a few cycles until it does it again.


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## hozII (Aug 25, 2011)

iamrfixit said:


> I don't know much about photobucket, but if they support video you should be able to link it to here.
> 
> Opening and closing too far is very strange, because the travel limit switches are completely independent of the force knobs. Turning the force knob should not do anything to change how far the door travels.
> 
> ...


Yeah its chain driven....its really weird.....sometimes it closes and opens fine....other its all over the place....I pulled it down and all the gears looked good and still lubed. Chain has a little slack in hangs about a 1/4" or less below tract....but has good tension on it...i'll get a vid posted of it tomm. While im off and get it posted...and side note sorry to OP for the thread jack.......lol


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## rockcrawler (Nov 11, 2011)

*more door problems - help please*

Hello - Read all the post and I am still have problems. Was hoping that someone could help me out. (sorry for the length of post, just trying to be detailed on problem and what I have done up to now)

Here's what I have:
2009 Genie Screw Shaft opener on a 11 yr old, two car albumin garage door.

Problems:
-Door was jerking/jumping real bad when it got about 10" from closing. 50% of the time, the door would go back up. Only have problems when closing. Is not the sensors and believe that the travel limit switches are set correctly.

What has been done up-to now:
-I have cleaned all tracks
-Replaced all rollers with new Nylon rollers
-Replaces all broken or loose door hinges. (there was one broken and 1 loose, both replaced)
-Have tested door by unlatching and seeing if the door will balance while halfway up. It does balance and seems to go up and down without issue except, when going down, there seems to be a slight hitch/stopping spot just about 10" off the ground. (while moving the door up and down by hand-unlatched) I have tried to see what causes the slight hitch/stopping point without any luck. The door will close, but requires more presser right before getting 100% down.

Other things that I have checked:
-Cable drum looks good on both sides.
-Cable spools properly on both sides and appears to be the same length and same tension when down. Both look in sync when down and up position. 
-Tension bar appears to be straight

Things that I don't know if they could cause this problem:
-Bearings in the faceplate on both sides? (I have sprayed WD-40 into the bearing area. Seen this on a different site that said it might help?)
-Torsion Spring? When the door is down, the spring looks like it has a little bow to it, meaning it looks like it has a slight sag in the middle. It is not broken and the door still goes up without an issue and is balanced when unlatched, so I don't think it is the Torsion Spring.

So there are the details. I watch the door up close from the inside and the outside and am still left scratching my head on whats going on. All is fine expect just before it get closed, when it wants to jerk around and sometimes goes back up because it thinks something is there or it requires too much force. 

Please send help before I buy all the wrong parts.

Thanks much,
Rick


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## Oh-Fudge (Sep 1, 2011)

iamrfixit said:


> Inside the opener unit you have a plastic gear set, a worm gear on the motor shaft which drives a larger plastic gear on main shaft that drives the chain sprocket. Normally it is only the larger gear that fails, when this happens it allows the door to become out of sync with the limit switches.
> ..........
> You can confirm this problem by disconnecting the power and removing the cover from the opener. If you see many white shavings then locate the large white gear, chances are the teeth are worn almost completely off.



Ditto iamrfixit, this is just what happened to my door opener. It was at least 15 yrs old (came with the house). I put in the repair kit about 4 yrs ago and it still works great.

Luckily, my door has the old coil springs. But, one of them gave out one day and shot across the garage at amazing speed. Not as dangerous as the torsion springs - but I still wouldn't want one coming my way :no:


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## mountainhome (Jul 16, 2012)

*Wd-40*



joasis said:


> Step one: Pull the door release and operate the door manually...see if it is binding up...if it is easy to operate without the opener, then you have an operator problem. With the door released, cycle the opener up and down and watch the trolley on the track and see if it is smothly moving the full distance. Btween these steps, you will find the culprit....spring tension changes on the door would make it harder to lift, no go down, and do not adjust them,...torsion springs are not a DIY adjustment...if the operator (opener) jerks or the trolley catches and isn't smooth, then you have a sensor problem or the screw needs lubricated, etc.....check all of these and see what you find. Overhead doors do like maintenance from time to time...lube the rollers, make sure the tracks are secure (not allowing a catch point for the rollers, etc.)


There's some great broad stroke suggestions in this tip. I have an old Master Mechanic chain-drive opener. I followed these steps and found that even with the garage door released the trolley would stop and return. It didn't look to be binding up though. I decided to do what my dad always did when mechanical things conjured up mysterious problems - I hit it with a few shots of WD-40 the length of the chain. Ran smooth as butter. Now, I know that WD-40 isn't a lubricant and all the reasons not to use it on chains, gears, bearings, and stuff but I can't help but wonder what magic lives inside a that wonderful can that has brought smiles to generations of DIYers.


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