# Pungent Wall (Paint?) Smell



## Gymschu (Dec 12, 2010)

I've used SW paint for 35 years now and have never heard of such a thing. Of course I don't put on a lot of flat paint. Anyone have any ideas on this one? This is unusual because most paints today have very low VOC's or NO VOC's so the paints don't gas off a lot of harmful chemicals or smells. The SW Emerald paint has a strong odor for about a day or two but it quickly dissipates. 

The only other thing I can come up with is that whoever painted the walls may have just painted over something that was on the wall like a spill or something and it is trapped in the paint film.


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## atlgator (Mar 6, 2014)

Gymschu, what type of paint do you use? Eggshell? I thought about a spill but it seems to be the whole wall in some cases. 

I did notice a lot of paint overspray in the electrical/switch boxes. Maybe the original coat was some kind of oil based paint? Would that change anything?

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## ToolSeeker (Sep 19, 2012)

The only thing I can think of is someone painted with some old paint that had sat for so long it had soured for lack of a better term. Personally I don't like flat on walls, I like satin or egg, egg being a little easier to touch up.


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## Gymschu (Dec 12, 2010)

I usually use satin or eggshell finish.


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

Happen to be outside walls?
There's is no location in your profile so where going to have to guess if it could possible have been a moisture issue behind the wall from an ice dam.


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## atlgator (Mar 6, 2014)

These are interior walls. Several inspections found no signs of moisture, water intrusion, or mold. Air samples are clean for mold with respect to the outdoors but, not surprisingly, elevated for VOCs in the paints, coatings, and primers category. It could just be sour paint. Many paint cans were found in the unconditioned attic and likely went bad. Question is how do I fix it?

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## ric knows paint (Oct 26, 2011)

atlgator said:


> These are interior walls. Several inspections found no signs of moisture, water intrusion, or mold. Air samples are clean for mold with respect to the outdoors but, not surprisingly, elevated for VOCs in the paints, coatings, and primers category. It could just be sour paint. Many paint cans were found in the unconditioned attic and likely went bad. Question is how do I fix it?
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


Hiya Atigator...

Even if a paint were still "off-gassing" (I hate that word) VOCs, I don't think that'd translate to what one would describe as a sour smell. Most often, when a paint odor is described as "sour" - VOCs aren't as likely a culprit as is bacteria or fungus that may have found it's way into the bucket. That can come from a can that hasn't been stored or sealed properly - or even could've been introduced at the point of manufacture or packaging. 

There are plenty of other areas where bacteria/spores could be introduced to a coat of paint including contaminated rollers and/or other painting tools, spores or bacteria already existing on walls, airborne contaminants within the environment where material is applied - then attracted to the coating as a fresh food source, etc. 

If the odor is related to bacteria or a fungus, you should consider scrubbing your walls with a solution consisting of 1/3 cup Tri-Sodium Phosphate + 1/3 cup household bleach to 1 gallon of warm water - then rinse thoroughly with clean water...After drying, I would recommend priming the surface with 1 coat of BIN Pigmented Shellac* or BIN Advanced (synthetic shellac) followed by 1 or 2 coats of a high quality acrylic finish. 

* If you're sensitive to strong odors, you may want to consider only the BIN Advanced instead of the BIN Pigmented Shellac. Although the solvent smell of BIN dissipates relatively quickly, it's pretty potent during application.

I hope this info is somewhat helpful - good luck.


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

ric knows paint said:


> Hiya Atigator...
> 
> Even if a paint were still "off-gassing" (I hate that word) VOCs, I don't think that'd translate to what one would describe as a sour smell. Most often, when a paint odor is described as "sour" - VOCs aren't as likely a culprit as is bacteria or fungus that may have found it's way into the bucket. That can come from a can that hasn't been stored or sealed properly - or even could've been introduced at the point of manufacture or packaging.
> 
> ...


 
and that's putting it mildly at best


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## Teresa22 (May 5, 2015)

Figured this situation would blend into this thread ..

Painted a closet today with paint that I used as recently as 3 weeks ago and was just fine- It didn't smell when I opened it today to paint- But after about 15 minutes or so of painting there was a very strong sour / rotten / chemical smell in the closet- Not only did it smell bad but think its emitting gases / fumes or something because its bothering my sinuses and stuff- Now hours later the paint itself has begun to smell bad- Not as bad as the closet but it doesnt smell the same as the paint I purchased a week ago- (All are Glidden) I'm thinking maybe there's some sort of chemical reaction going on with the paint and what was already on the wall or it's due to the older brush I used? I don't know- The brushes I used to paint the room were previously used but there was no issue- There was barely any scent whatsoever. Any idea what might be happening in the closet and what I could do to remedy it? I'm super sensitive to chemicals and fumes- Any suggestion would be appreciated.


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## Teresa22 (May 5, 2015)

ps - the paint I used to paint the room isnt the same paint i used to paint the closet ..


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## Gymschu (Dec 12, 2010)

Closets consist of very tight quarters so any fumes given off tend to stay in or very near the closet space. I would run a fan in there to speed up the drying process and help alleviate the smell.

**All paints have some sort of smell. There's just no getting around it. Even the "odorless" paints have fumes, you just don't smell them as strongly.


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## klaatu (Mar 9, 2015)

Teresa22 said:


> Figured this situation would blend into this thread ..
> 
> Painted a closet today with paint that I used as recently as 3 weeks ago and was just fine- It didn't smell when I opened it today to paint- But after about 15 minutes or so of painting there was a very strong sour / rotten / chemical smell in the closet- Not only did it smell bad but think its emitting gases / fumes or something because its bothering my sinuses and stuff- Now hours later the paint itself has begun to smell bad- Not as bad as the closet but it doesnt smell the same as the paint I purchased a week ago- (All are Glidden) I'm thinking maybe there's some sort of chemical reaction going on with the paint and what was already on the wall or it's due to the older brush I used? I don't know- The brushes I used to paint the room were previously used but there was no issue- There was barely any scent whatsoever. Any idea what might be happening in the closet and what I could do to remedy it? I'm super sensitive to chemicals and fumes- Any suggestion would be appreciated.


 Does it have an ammonia type smell to it? Kinda like cat urine?


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## Teresa22 (May 5, 2015)

Hi, I'm in Geauga County Ohio- It smells like cat urine, sour, rotten egg / dirty diaper- (The paint ..) I ran the fan in the closet for hours- The house is over 100- How much over nobody seems to know- 2 sides of the wall in the closet are plaster but the ceiling and other wall sound like some kind of hard board, wood or something else- No matter tho, the who thing smells the same .. it's nauseating ..


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## Nestor_Kelebay (Jun 17, 2008)

I can't help thinking that the smell in the paint after rubbing is Sherwin Williams "Mildex" or "M-1". I've never used the stuff, but that might be one explanation of why the paint smells if you rub it.

With utmost respect for the knowledge and experience Ric Knows Paint brings to this forum, I can't understand the purpose of the TSP in his proposed cleaning solution.

TSP was recommended as a cleaner years ago when people still used linseed oil based paints. That's cuz TSP would dull the gloss of linseed oil based paints so that the next coat of paint would stick better. So, even though TSP was a mediocre (at best) cleaner, the advantage in it's use was that it would prep the existing paint for the new paint to stick well. BUT, TSP does absolutely nothing at all to latex paints. And, the OP says this is a SW FLAT latex, so even though the TSP wouldn't do anything at all to the paint, there's nothing that needs to be done cuz the paint is already flat.

Since we don't know what's causing the smell, I would agree with the OP cleaning a specified area of paint with bleach diluted with water. 1/3 cup bleach per gallon of water seems a bit light to me; I would use bleach diluted with 4 parts water. Clean a predetermined area with the bleach solution, rinse with water and dry or allow time to dry. NOW do the rub test on the test area and see if that area still smells after rubbing. That way, we have proof of the effectiveness in the cleaning game plan before the OP goes and cleans the whole wall, ..... and then checks to see if it did any good.

Teresa:
Latex paints form films by coalescence. The latex paint consists of gazillions of blobs of hard clear plastic suspended in a solution of water and a water soluble solvent called a "coalescing agent". When you spread the paint on the wall, the first thing that happens is that the water evaporates. The hard plastic blobs then find themselves surrounded by the coalescing solvent at an ever increasing concentration. The coalescing solvent then is absorbed into those plastic blobs and makes then soft and sticky. The forces of surface tension and capillay pressure then causes each soft sticky blob to pull on each of it's neighbors so that the resins form a continuous films of soft sticky plastic. The coalescing solvent then evaporates from the soft sticky plastic film, causing it to harden up again.

I expect that what you smelled was the coalescing solvent evaporating from your paint.

I'd go to your Glidden paint dealer and ask if he has any paints recommended for interior painting in hospitals or nursing homes. That's because lots of the Low-VOC or No-VOC paints you buy aren't low or no VOC at all. They simply use coalescing solvents that hadn't yet been produced when the EPA came out with it's list of VOC's. So, if a company uses a coalescing solvent that's not on the EPA's list, it's not officially a VOC, and so the paint they make with it is a No-VOC paint, no matter how much it stinks as it dries.

Some latex paints actually use softer plastic resins that require less coalescing solvent to form a film properly. These paints then harden up by the formation of chemical crosslinks within the paint acrylic resins, or between acrylic resins. If you are sensitive to chemicals, these kinds of paint (recommended for painting in hospitals) is what you should try in your own home.


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## Will22 (Feb 1, 2011)

Generally, if paint is spoiled from age or exposure to air, it will smell bad when the can is opened for use. Obviously, it should not be applied, because the smell will no go away. Another possibility is that exterior paint was used on an interior surface. As noted , there is no way to determine what is causing this condition.


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## klaatu (Mar 9, 2015)

Nestor_Kelebay said:


> I can't help thinking that the smell in the paint after rubbing is Sherwin Williams "Mildex" or "M-1". I've never used the stuff, but that might be one explanation of why the paint smells if you rub it.
> 
> With utmost respect for the knowledge and experience Ric Knows Paint brings to this forum, I can't understand the purpose of the TSP in his proposed cleaning solution.
> 
> ...


 I would like to add that many low or 0-voc paints have a small amount of ammonia in them, that is why I asked about the ammonia/pee smell. I would recommend putting a coat of a shellac based primer (BIN) or the synthetic shellac primer (BIN Advanced) and then re-painting with a true 0-voc paint. I have a store in Mansfield if you can't get what you are looking for in your area. I have a product that is recommended for hospitals which is a true 0-voc,0-odor which would work fine.


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## klaatu (Mar 9, 2015)

It could be compounded by something that is leaching out of the walls when you paint them. I recently paint the bathroom walls at my store, which had been "primed" before I moved in, and the paint application caused a strong urine smell for several days.


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