# Hardiplank and Roofing Nailer questions?



## jfharper (Oct 28, 2012)

I've read ppl use a roofing nailer to install hardiplank using 2" nails, but I've run into some questions:
1. I went to buy a nailer at the local home depot/lowes, and all they carry are roofing nailers that go up to 1 3/4"...would this be OK?
2. I will be blind nailing into/over existing T1-11...the longest roofing nail (coil for nailer) HD carries is 1 1/2"...since the hardi is 1/4" and my T1-11 is 5/8", do I really need anything longer than 1"? Unless I should be looking for the studs for better anchoring.
3. Also, HD only carries electrogalvanized nails (for the nailer) and hardi says that is OK but may corrode early...I live in central california near the coast, but not right next to it...I'm about 40 minutes inland from the coast so I won't get the marine layer and moisture that the coast gets. Do you think EG nails will be OK, or should I search somewhere else for hot dipped?

Can someone please instruct me as I am new to this.


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

Using a 1" nail would be a big mistake. The panels would be able to just be pulled right off.

Buy one of these and you would be a whole lot happyer.
http://www.amazon.com/Stanley-Bostitch-N66C-1-Aluminum-Housing/dp/B0006FKI5G

And yes you should be nailing into the studs.

I tryed using a roofing nailer and hated it.

I use my siding nailer for lots of other jobs it not just for siding.


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## jfharper (Oct 28, 2012)

Thanks. What nail would you recommend, electro or hot dipped gal?


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

jfharper said:


> Thanks. What nail would you recommend, electro or hot dipped gal?


1 ¾” 11 gauge ring shank "stainless steel" roofing nail is what I’d recommend for blind nailing Hardie. 

The siding nails don’t have a large enough head imo. Save the siding nails for any exposed nailing.

This is the Hardie zone hz5 install guide, give it a read.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

why arent you stripping the old siding and installing a proper rain screen detail.. not doing so will void the harti warrenty. and by doing so you can nail to the furring strips. 

ive sided over a dozen homes with harti using a siding nailer with absolutely no issue with hte siding afterwords. where your on the coast definitely invest in stainless steel they last 20x longer than galvys. im on the opposite coast and have seen countless homes that guys have used the wrong materials for the environment and it caused issues.. if the nails dont corrode right away the salt water can cause them to rust and you may have nails that bleed leaving rust streaks down the siding


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## hand drive (Apr 21, 2012)

I recommend an exterior 2 1/2" nail gun nail that fits a framing nail gun. the nail head is bigger than siding nail gun heads too but not as big as a roofing nail head. As Woodworkbykirk mentions, I've installed miles of hardie with siding nail guns and never a problem but for the diyer, I recommend the framing nail gun because of the versatility with it after the siding project is over- need a deck built? etc...


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

Since I already owned several framing nailers and 2, roofing nail guns I tryed them first.
Not sure why but the framing nails would bend or the gun would just jam up time and time agin with the nail stuck in the gun and the gun stuck to the wall.
I tryed differant gun, differant pressures.
The roofing nailer would only dive them in about 1/2 way and shattered some of the pieces.
The siding nailer drove them almost flush and never once bent a nail or jamed up, It also can be used on the top pieces to face nail.
The nails are never going to back out, there near impossible to pull back out.


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

woodworkbykirk said:


> why arent you stripping the old siding and installing a proper rain screen detail.. not doing so will void the harti warrenty.


Why would you strip T111 if it was in sound shape?

Where does it say "no rain, screen no warranty"?


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

What's the differance if you side over OSB or CDX plywood or T111?
Wrap with house wrap and side it.
Nialing directly over the studs with no sheathing of some kind would leave air gaps everywhere, and give the siding no support behind it.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

for the entire east coast.. if your in a wet environment you have to have a rain screen if you want the siding to last and for the house to not rot out.

in a 10 year time frame of working with hardi product, the only issue weve ever had was getting the color match caulking at the same time as the siding for caulking around windows. on one house we used the most popular color , we had to wait 8 months after the siding was on to get our color match. luckily we back caulk the siding where it meets trim with clear. the reps have seen our installs and say we go above and beyond their very strict install procedure for the zone.. i worked for another guy hanging it on a house and he wanted to cut corners left right and center, had to tell him dont even think about sending me to fix things when the callback happens.. its your method so its your problem

as for rainscreen , one of our competitors underbid us on a job last year for my neighbor,, they didnt do a rain screen, didnt properly flash things. sure enough the deficiency list was a mile long and they were told not to come back. i finished the job and had to mend things as best possible without stripping the entire house.


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## jfharper (Oct 28, 2012)

Yes, I will be adding a new moist seal (tyvek) and the T-111 has the old organic tar paper seal under it, but I didn't know how it was since the house was built in the 80s. I thought adding tyvek would be a good call and some friends recommend that. The t-111 is in sound shape and will serve as a good sheathing.

I will also be using Quad chalking as I heard that is the way to go.

Regarding painting, a friend mentioned rolling it first before install. Question, so I prime it with a good primer, then roll it, then install, then brush edges and finish roll? Also should I primer and paint all sides before install if that is the way to go or just the surfaces that will be exposed?

Another questions is on nail depth, should it be flush to the hardiplank, which means it would dent the surface just enough for the head top to be flush? And how do you get this accuracy, do you adjust your compressor output to a max top pressure then finish with the dial on the gun? What happens when the pressure drops on the compressor, with the nail change it's depth? What compressor setting do you work with for this type of application, or does it depend on my wood...how think/old/hard it is etc. that will make me to adjust when I start and as I go?

Thanks for all your replies


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## hand drive (Apr 21, 2012)

the backside of the nail should rest against the siding and not puncture the face of the siding, the thickness of the nail head will be like a relief off of the siding. A compressor that is 120 psi capable works well for regulating pressure on a framing gun. Leave the compressor pressure turned up and adjust the nose piece on the nail gun for more accuracy. some nail guns have rubber bumper nose pieces that attach onto the nose of the gun.


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## Dewitt501 (Oct 29, 2012)

What's the differance if you side over OSB or CDX plywood or T111?


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## jfharper (Oct 28, 2012)

OK...great. So in my original question, I was curious about the length of the nail. I received 2 different answers, one 1 3/4" and the other 2 1/2"...which confuses me a bit. Perhaps, if I understand the reasoning I could take my situation and make a judgement call.

I understand expansion and contraction over time will push a nail out which I assume varies according to outside temp ranges. My outside termp range from 110 F max to 17 F max. Mostly the range is 95F-30F, those other temps were extremes. So would a longer nail help hold longer because of the extra friction overcoming push out? Does smooth shank or ring shank matter in this case?


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

I gave you the link to the install guide in my first post...it's all in there.


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## hand drive (Apr 21, 2012)

jfharper said:


> OK...great. So in my original question, I was curious about the length of the nail. I received 2 different answers, one 1 3/4" and the other 2 1/2"...which confuses me a bit. Perhaps, if I understand the reasoning I could take my situation and make a judgement call.
> 
> I understand expansion and contraction over time will push a nail out which I assume varies according to outside temp ranges. My outside termp range from 110 F max to 17 F max. Mostly the range is 95F-30F, those other temps were extremes. So would a longer nail help hold longer because of the extra friction overcoming push out? Does smooth shank or ring shank matter in this case?



the nail needs to penetrate the framing so the longer the better, 2 1/2" is an average size "one for all" siding nail for most applications


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## jfharper (Oct 28, 2012)

kwikfishron said:


> I gave you the link to the install guide in my first post...it's all in there.


Thanks...I know, I read that...but I'd still like to understand the reasoning behind the recommendation.


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## jfharper (Oct 28, 2012)

joecaption said:


> Using a 1" nail would be a big mistake. The panels would be able to just be pulled right off.
> 
> Buy one of these and you would be a whole lot happyer.
> http://www.amazon.com/Stanley-Bostitch-N66C-1-Aluminum-Housing/dp/B0006FKI5G
> ...


Joe,
I'm leaning towards your suggestion. Could you tell me what length nail you use? Since my T111 is 5/8" and the hardi would be 5/16", that would be 15/16" just for the matieral, so I'm thinking of 2 1/2 nail would be good...would the bostich nail that is a thickcoat galvanized be OK? The SS are so expensive.


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## jfharper (Oct 28, 2012)

Got one more question, since I'm installing over existing t111, should I first remove some of the nails holding the t111? That way I have less a chance of hitting a nail when installing the siding. How is this done when sheathing is applied first...do they use a limited number of nails to hold the sheathing on? Thanks.


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## hand drive (Apr 21, 2012)

jfharper said:


> Got one more question, since I'm installing over existing t111, should I first remove some of the nails holding the t111? That way I have less a chance of hitting a nail when installing the siding. How is this done when sheathing is applied first...do they use a limited number of nails to hold the sheathing on? Thanks.



if anything you want to add nails to the sheathing to tighten it up, it has probably worked loose some over the years while hanging on the wall. test it with the hammer to determine how tight it is to the wall and use the 2 1/2" sheathing/siding nails to nail it up if loose. After you have nailed at all of the studs in the wall if needed, line the little red dots on the tyvek up with the studs when you put the tyvek up and this helps to find the studs when putting your siding up :wink:

do not worry to much about hitting the nails in the sheathing, as the nail patterns of the siding when compared to the sheathing would be different


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

To each their own I guess but I can see no reason why you would need a 2 ½” nail to hang 5/16” of anything to a wall. I guess we should be using 2 ½”+ fasteners to hang sheetrock then.

Hardie specs say, either a 2” siding nail or a “1 ¼” roofing nail. Why would they spec an "1 ¼” nail if they thought the siding would fall off the wall???

Using a 2 ½” nail as your “go to, the longer the better fastener” will at some point get you into trouble, especially on older homes with 2x4 exterior walls. If you do this for a living at some point you “will” end up hitting some plumbing or electrical. 

Nothing like hearing the hiss of water spraying in the wall to take the wind out of what was a good productive day. Not to mention hitting electrical where the problem may not show up for days, months or even years down the road. Ask me how I know this.

Nail a coarse of Hardie (not to be confused with harti) with siding nails… you can easily pull the siding off the wall, the siding will pop through those small siding nail heads effortlessly. At least the roofing nail has a little more head surface to help keep that wet noodle on the wall.


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## Joe Carola (Apr 14, 2006)

jfharper said:


> Thanks...I know, I read that...but I'd still like to understand the reasoning behind the recommendation.


Is it going to matter? You're going to follow the installation guide....right?


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## jfharper (Oct 28, 2012)

Joe Carola said:


> Is it going to matter? You're going to follow the installation guide....right?


I might add to it...seems like manufactures change there minds often...so if I understand the physics of it, I can make a modification if needed.:thumbsup:


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## Big Stud (Jul 3, 2011)

My own rule for fastening most types of siding is to penetrate at LEAST 1" into the studs with the fastener. So if you have 15/16" to go through, I would use a 2" nail or longer and try to find the studs. Also, being that it is outside I agree that stainless steel fasteners should be used. JMHO,


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## jfharper (Oct 28, 2012)

Alright, I'm going to go with a 2 3/16" siding nail using that bostich siding nailer...thanks for all the help. How far in do I sink them, snug or flush...here is an image I drew up:










I was wondering about the painting question I asked above...here it is again.

Should I roll beforehand…would this be before cutting or after, and do you roll all sides or just the exposed sides?

Also, I read that some guys put a primer coat on first even though there is a primer from the factory…they say the factory primer is not that good and they’ve had paint not stick that well thus the reason for the second primer…should I add a primer?

Also, if roll beforehand, after install, do you brush the edges (next to trim) then roll a second final coat?


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## lawrence.crush (Apr 8, 2014)

Have you consulted both the Hardi warranty info and your local building code? Without following the guides specifically, you will void the warranty coverage. Generally we use 2" nails because of wind issues.


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