# Toilet Rim holes not working



## 7SistersRanchTX (Feb 28, 2012)

I have read 3 pages of threads talking about toilets that are not completely flushing and nothing is helping. Maybe I need to specifically ask my question for my specific issue.
I have a Kohler toilet with a siphon jet at the bottom. When I flush with a full tank, ( to the top of the overflow tube), the water flushes out the siphone jet and anything in the bowl at or below water level goes down the drain slick as a whistle. The Rim jets however have No water coming out of ANY of them, dry, barron, free of water. 
Anything above the water line, usually tissue, hangs out and never goes down.
I Inspected with a mirror and fingers and no rough surface. No calcium or lime build up. If there was something, I would have thought that I would have gotten at least some water out one of the holes.
About mid way from the water line and the rim, at the front of the bowl, above the siphone jet, is a hole that water does come out. But as I repeat, no water out of the rim jets.
I poured Lime-A-Way down the over flow valve so incase I missed, the tank would dilute the Lime-A-Way so it wouldn't damage the flapper and fill valve. All I got was a bowl full of Lime-A-Way. I let that sit for an hour and still nothing.
I removed the tank and inspected the inlet opening, with a mirror and hand I did not find any obstructions.
The only other thing is to remove the toilet completly and turn it on its nose so that the Lime-A-Way would stay in the ring and not fill into the bowl. Would that be the right next step?
If so if I remove the toilet I have to replace the wax ring correct, it can not be reused with the same toilet?
Anything else I can try before I pull/replace the toilet?


----------



## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

A simple test, dump some red food coloring in the tank and flush it, see if any is coming out the holes and running down the sides of the tank.
To clean out the holes use a metal coat hanger or a pipe cleaner.


----------



## 7SistersRanchTX (Feb 28, 2012)

joecaption said:


> A simple test, dump some red food coloring in the tank and flush it, see if any is coming out the holes and running down the sides of the tank.
> To clean out the holes use a metal coat hanger or a pipe cleaner.


Thanks, nice idea, but I already stated:
"..The Rim jets however have No water coming out of ANY of them, dry, barron, free of water."

So if I put red food coloring in the tank, all I will get is red water in the bowl, but the sides will still be white. Nothing runs out ANY of the rim holes.

After inspecting the holes with a mirror and didn't see anything blocking the holes, I used a wire, but that wasn't the issue, so a coat hanger or pipe cleaner wouldn't give me anything.

Tonight I poured yet again, more Lime-A-Way down the over flow tube and worked out an angle to squirt it under the rim to the holes, but don't know if I was able to get it in the holes. I will let it sit over night and maybe for two or three days and see.

Is there a drawing of the inner workings of this Kohler I can see so I can get an idea where the "blockage" may be. There is no telling when this started, this toilet are in an HOA clubhouse and I just got the handyman bid to look at why it wasn't working right. It may be an internal defect that was there when it was installed.


----------



## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q...22941E03386C7720F6716A0E4D91D90EB&FORM=IQFRBA


----------



## kreemoweet (Dec 22, 2012)

Try plugging that "extra" hole at the front of the bowl (duct tape?) to see if that does anything. My house has a Kohler toilet which formerly had almost all
of its rim holes plugged up. It was caused by a resident who used insane amounts of toilet tissue, resulting in almost daily toilet backups which exposed the
holes to dissolved toilet tissue pulp, and I suppose other stuff. The person moved away, the rim holes were repeatedly reamed out with wire, and the toilet
eventually returned to normal operation.


----------



## oh'mike (Sep 18, 2009)

Is the little feed tube from the flush valve installed into the overflow tube?

If so is there any water coming out of the tube when the toilet is flushed?

Pour some water down that tube----


----------



## 7SistersRanchTX (Feb 28, 2012)

oh'mike said:


> Is the little feed tube from the flush valve installed into the overflow tube?
> 
> If so is there any water coming out of the tube when the toilet is flushed?
> 
> Pour some water down that tube----


Yes, that is in there. I replaced the Flush mechanism as the original FlowMaster Pro took 1.5min to fill the tank. Now the Flowmaster eco fills in 30 seconds. That flush valve tube is in the overflow tube and puts water in the bottom of the bowl, fills from the bottom up.


----------



## 7SistersRanchTX (Feb 28, 2012)

kreemoweet said:


> Try plugging that "extra" hole at the front of the bowl (duct tape?) to see if that does anything.....


I'll give that a try, and maybe plug the siphon hole too. I might blow water every where, but it might blow what ever is there out.


----------



## 7SistersRanchTX (Feb 28, 2012)

joecaption said:


> http://www.bing.com/images/search?q...22941E03386C7720F6716A0E4D91D90EB&FORM=IQFRBA


Yes, I see these great cutaway photos. I have attached one of them with some markings. How does the wafer get to the siphon jet "X" location.
It looks like there is no connection from "Y" the rimm holes to the siphon jet. I'm trying to see a cut away that shows how water gets from the flush valve to the rim holes and siphone jet.


----------



## Lightfoot (Jan 16, 2011)

7SistersRanchTX said:


> After inspecting the holes with a mirror and didn't see anything blocking the holes


you cannot tell by looking at the holes with a mirror. If they are stopped up, it will likely be from the inside of the rim (which you cannot see). Run a coat hanger in each hole all the way through it, and remember the holes are slanted, at least the ones i have seen are.


----------



## oh'mike (Sep 18, 2009)

Did you pour water into the overflow tube like I suggested? In a Kohler toilet--that's where the rim holes get the water from


----------



## 7SistersRanchTX (Feb 28, 2012)

Ok, it seems like I'm getting requests to do things that I have already tried.
Issue: no water comes out ANY of the rim holes.
Here is the currently completed items and their results.
1. water goes into tank to the top of the overflow and stops.
2. water goes out the small tube of the fill valve into the overflow.
3. water sits in tank until flushed.
When flushed below are the actions.
1. Flapper in tank opens completly and water exits the tank.
2. water from tank shoots out the siphon jet and the bowl is emptied.
3. tank starts to refil and water from the small tube in the filler valve is pouring into the overflow. This causes the bowl to start to partially fill with water to the proper level.
4. NO water comes out any of the rim holes. Wire was used on many of the holes. Lime-A-Way was used in the tank and over flow for 2 days and still no water out the rim holes.
5. There is a smaller jet just above the siphon jet that water does come out. When this is plugged, it doesn't change anything, still no water out the rim holes.
6. The siphon jet hole was covered (made sure to wear gloves) and flushed. water came out the smaller jet that is just above the siphon jet, it just came out a little faster. The tank only partially emptied, about 1.5" Probably enough to fill the air gap between the water in the bowl to the flush valve. Bowl filled really slow since it was only getting water from the smaller jet. Still no water out the rim holes. 
7. With full tank, siphon jet covered, smaller jet covered. The only place for water to go was the rim holes. I flushed. The flapper stayed in the up position. The tank remained full, bowl did not empty. Still nothing out the rim holes.

My conclusion: This Kohler toilet was mfg incorrectly and there is no path for the water to get to the rim area and holes. Without a proper drawing that shows the actual water path to the rim, this is my only guess.
Looks like I will have to replace the toilet. 
Would Kohler replace this under some type of MFG service? No telling when or where it was purchased.


----------



## 7SistersRanchTX (Feb 28, 2012)

oh'mike said:


> Did you pour water into the overflow tube like I suggested? In a Kohler toilet--that's where the rim holes get the water from


When I put water in the overflow, it comes out the siphon jet and the small jet just about the siphon. Nothing comes out the rim holes no mater where you put water.


----------



## epson (Jul 28, 2010)

Try using muratic acid by running a steady stream down the overflow replicating a typical flush. This will eat the buildup out of the holes to the point like the day it was made. That way when you do this, you’re doing the same as if you were flushing the toilet. This will send the muratic acid through the bowl rim, cleansing all the buildup that you cannot even see, giving the effect of the way the toilet was when first installed. It might take 2 or 3 attempts, depending on how much buildup there is. You can find muratic acid Home Depot.


----------



## silence (Dec 23, 2014)

Apologies for bumping an old post. Was there any resolution to this issue? I'm experiencing the exact same problem as the original poster.


----------



## Bud Cline (Mar 12, 2006)

silence said:


> Apologies for bumping an old post. Was there any resolution to this issue? I'm experiencing the exact same problem as the original poster.


Why wouldn't you guys call Kohler first thing?


----------



## silence (Dec 23, 2014)

I'm communicating with them. So far they've told me to ream out the holes and check the tube in the tank. Just curious if OP happen to find the solution.


----------



## Ghostmaker (Mar 2, 2013)

Defective casting. Replace.


----------



## DIYBTRON (Sep 7, 2015)

silence said:


> I'm communicating with them. So far they've told me to ream out the holes and check the tube in the tank. Just curious if OP happen to find the solution.


I just used a KORKY replacement kit to replace the parts inside the tank. The rim jets did not work after this replacement. I found that the replacement gasket that the tank sits on was smaller than the previous, and was sitting lower inside the opening, blocking the two holes that lead to the rim jets. I took an exacto knife and cut holes at the base of the gasket to match up with the stream jet holes. Problem solved. Working great.


----------



## deltadon (Mar 21, 2016)

I was experiencing this same problem with my Kohler toilet. I read through all the posts and found the last one by DIYBTRON. I removed the tank and sure enough the plastic threaded tube and rubber gasket were blocking the fill holes for the rim jets. I cut through the rubber with a sharp knife and then drilled two 1\2 holes in the plastic down spout part and voila, water now flowing from jets.


----------



## IAMNOT (Dec 19, 2016)

Hey guys, so this is my first time ever posting to a blog but Ive just gotten so frustrated with my Kholer toilet and was having the hardest time even figuring out what to type in my google search to find the name to my problem so thank you all for posting. i now know the name of my problem and it is the issue with my toilet rim holes not flushing at all just a dry waterless attempt when i flush it. My siphon jet works just fine. I'm going to try and do all the suggestions mentioned in this post but if anyone has had any luck with Kholer or found a solution i would be greatly in your debt for it. Wish me luck! ill be checking back in by the end of the week for updates or to see if anyone has any solutions. Thanks!


----------



## gnarkilleptic (Jan 2, 2018)

I just made an account to answer this question. My Kohler has had extremely poor flow to the rim holes, and I have been scouring for answers to no avail. I have finally found the solution (for me at least) and it is annoyingly simple. I found out that my toilet flushed just fine without the tank lid on, but poorly with it on. This was driving me nuts until I found out that the lid has a hole in the back and in the bottom so that when the water flushes, air travels through the lid to fill the void. My lid was tight against my wall which was blocking air flow to the tank, so that when the toilet flushed, the water did not go up the hose and into the rim holes easily. I repositioned the tank lid so that the hole in the back was not obstructed and voila, toilet flushes perfectly. Crazy.

Hope this helps others that may be having the same issue.


----------



## tayeke (Mar 15, 2019)

I had to sign up just to thank DIYBTRON for the info! I had my suspicions this was an issue, but wasn't sure. Really surprised by the lack of Google results about this issue, considering a common home Depot replacement with a common Kohler toilet has this compatibility issue... Not looking forward to separating my tank and bowl again 😑


----------



## ront02769 (Nov 28, 2008)

The orig poster theorized a manufacturing error......in which case, unless he just installed it, it NEVER would have worked. I was having flushing problems also.....and just spent like two hundred bucks on a new American standard cadet 3 chair height extended bowl. Easy install, flushes fast and well, no worries. Ron


----------



## Al147 (Nov 28, 2020)

7SistersRanchTX said:


> Yes, I see these great cutaway photos. I have attached one of them with some markings. How does the wafer get to the siphon jet "X" location.
> It looks like there is no connection from "Y" the rimm holes to the siphon jet. I'm trying to see a cut away that shows how water gets from the flush valve to the rim holes and siphone jet.


This is an image of the back of the bowl that attaches to the tank. There are two holes that allow water to run out those little holes







around the rim once the toilet is flushed. A lot of the new toilet innards block the holes pictured. So either get Kohler toilet replacement parts or alter you replacement parts so these holes aren’t blocked.


----------



## orly (Jul 11, 2021)

7SistersRanchTX said:


> I have read 3 pages of threads talking about toilets that are not completely flushing and nothing is helping. Maybe I need to specifically ask my question for my specific issue.
> I have a Kohler toilet with a siphon jet at the bottom. When I flush with a full tank, ( to the top of the overflow tube), the water flushes out the siphone jet and anything in the bowl at or below water level goes down the drain slick as a whistle. The Rim jets however have No water coming out of ANY of them, dry, barron, free of water.
> Anything above the water line, usually tissue, hangs out and never goes down.
> I Inspected with a mirror and fingers and no rough surface. No calcium or lime build up. If there was something, I would have thought that I would have gotten at least some water out one of the holes.
> ...


I have a toto toilet with the same problem. Then , i replaced the flapper and trip lever with an original one 's for the model of my toilet and lo and behold water comes out of my rim jets and helped in the flushing.


----------



## argile_tile (Aug 1, 2020)

I have to read the previous posts more carefully.

But seeing the last photo: it looks like it's gravity fed. if there's no water in the bowl when the tank releases then "the falling water from the tank" will just go down (not to the sides). to get the sides you'd have to have standing water in the main hole which might require a certain level of water in the bowl (which is adjustable)

I'M SURE YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE REPLACED THE FLUSHING MECH WITH A NON-KHOLER PART, buy only the MFG OEM part. but no one on the forum blamed the part - so that may have been wasted money.

what i do know is OBAMA toilets are a scam that require 3 flushes which wastes water not saves it - and china is part of the scam (over-seas shipping weight is what they are after). and they are probably designed to stop working also.


----------

