# Attaching deck ledger to cantilever



## ram80ran (Apr 4, 2007)

We’re planning to build a deck on the back of my daughter’s house. It will be about 30 feet long, and 20 feet will attach to a 2ft cantilever off the house. Is it normal/ok to attach the deck ledger to the cantilever? We’ve also considered a free standing deck, but are concerned the fill dirt around the house may settle. Any advice is appreciated!


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## handy man88 (Jan 23, 2007)

It's definitely a bad idea to install a ledger board against a house section that is cantilevered, especially if you don't plan to support this cantilevered edge by shoring it up. I would recommend a free standing deck. 

For new construction, it is generally recommended not to install a deck until 1 year after construction to allow settlement from the dirt used to backfill the foundation. Some jurisdictions even require both a ledger board to be added to the free standing deck. 

Are you going to get a permit for this deck? Depth for posts is at least past the frost line, and sometimes deeper (3 ft.) if the county inspector can drive a length of rebar below the frost line.


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## AtlanticWBConst. (May 12, 2006)

ram80ran said:


> We’re planning to build a deck on the back of my daughter’s house. It will be about 30 feet long, and 20 feet will attach to a 2ft cantilever off the house. Is it normal/ok to attach the deck ledger to the cantilever? We’ve also considered a free standing deck, but are concerned the fill dirt around the house may settle. Any advice is appreciated!


That's a large deck. Do all your homework on how to properly support it. As mentioned already, don't attach to the cantilevered portion of your home.

Tip: when using all PT material, I usually encourage the home owner to consider 2x8's on the flat as a railing cap. This allows a large surface area to place food and drinks on when you are entertaining.

Example:


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## beer_geek (Feb 19, 2007)

Thanks for that tip. I'm going to rip out the current 2 x4's this weekend.


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## Brik (Jan 16, 2007)

To the guys that say NO to attaching to the cantilever. Doesn't it depend on how it was built?

If the 2' cant. is scabbed on then I can see why not. If the cant. is a projection of the floor joists and is continuous across the top of the foundation wall, under the house, then it should be fine, no?


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## AtlanticWBConst. (May 12, 2006)

Brik said:


> To the guys that say NO to attaching to the cantilever. Doesn't it depend on how it was built?
> 
> If the 2' cant. is scabbed on then I can see why not. If the cant. is a projection of the floor joists and is continuous across the top of the foundation wall, under the house, then it should be fine, no?


Good Question Brick. 

Here is a comment off this website regarding the same deck attachment question:

http://www.vadeck.com/page9.htm

*Question: *_"Any problem attaching my deck to a cantilevered (overhang) portion of my house?"_ 
*Answer: Don't do it. Most local building codes prevent this practice. The reason is because many folks will attach the deck band to the house band which has only been NAILED into the house joists. Therefore half of the weight of their deck is supported by the shear strength of a few nails! Be safe and run an extra beam under the deck at the area where it attaches to the house. Or, you can remove the existing house band, and run your deck floor joists back until they rest on the house foundation wall. (Always be sure to flash your deck to prevent water from gaining access to your house.) Or, step your deck down and attach the deck band to the house wall (normally concrete). *

Same question asked on the ICC bulletin board:

http://www.iccsafe.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=10;t=001678


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## robertcdf (Nov 12, 2005)

You can attach to the cantilever ONLY if it is engineered. In other words if they attached INVERTED hangers to the rimboard so that the weight of the rim (and new deck) are supported by the joists no just the shear of the nails.

BTW MOST cantilevers are NOT engineered because it would cost the builder a few more bucks in hangers.


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## mike6x7 (Mar 28, 2009)

I'm doing pretty much the same project, but smaller deck. When you say a free standing deck, should it be completly unattached from the house, or Can I have the deck completely self -supported and still nailed to base of cantilever on house? My plan is to install french doors in the place of the master bedroom window and would rather not jump to the deck


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## 12penny (Nov 21, 2008)

AtlanticWBConst. said:


> That's a large deck. Do all your homework on how to properly support it. As mentioned already, don't attach to the cantilevered portion of your home.
> 
> Tip: when using all PT material, I usually encourage the home owner to consider 2x8's on the flat as a railing cap. This allows a large surface area to place food and drinks on when you are entertaining.
> 
> Example:


 Atlantic...I built them like that for a while also. Last year, at final inspection time, one of my decks didnt pass because the handrail on the stairs needs to be "gripable". Idea is that older people and small kids cant grip such a big rail if they begin to fall. I added a seperate rail along side for people to grab onto. Any experience along that line.


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## Ron6519 (Mar 28, 2007)

mike6x7 said:


> I'm doing pretty much the same project, but smaller deck. When you say a free standing deck, should it be completly unattached from the house, or Can I have the deck completely self -supported and still nailed to base of cantilever on house? My plan is to install french doors in the place of the master bedroom window and would rather not jump to the deck


Just because it's not attached to the house doesn't mean it's far away from the house. You leave a 1/2" gap between the deck and house and you overhang the decking material so the gap by the house matches the gap in the deck boards.
Ron


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## rtoni (Jul 18, 2007)

robertcdf said:


> You can attach to the cantilever ONLY if it is engineered. In other words if they attached INVERTED hangers to the rimboard so that the weight of the rim (and new deck) are supported by the joists no just the shear of the nails.
> 
> BTW MOST cantilevers are NOT engineered because it would cost the builder a few more bucks in hangers.


Arrggh - didn't consider this when I built my addition (I really overbuilt the cantilever section of floor, but didn't even consider using inverted hangers before attaching rim board -- going to really feel stupid next time I trip over the bucket full of extra hangers I have from other projects ). Is there a way to address this after the fact (not hangers, but maybe some other metal corner brackets or fasteners inside the joist bays - using the usual hanger nails - to strengthen the connection between the rim plate and the joists)? Wouldn't be the same, but maybe good enough to alleviate the shear stress on the rim plate nails?


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## Dan V. (Oct 29, 2008)

> Atlantic...I built them like that for a while also. Last year, at final inspection time, one of my decks didnt pass because the handrail on the stairs needs to be "gripable". Idea is that older people and small kids cant grip such a big rail if they begin to fall. I added a seperate rail along side for people to grab onto. Any experience along that line.


I ran into that same issue here. I had used 2x4s for the railing tops on the stairs of a deck I built and the inspector wouldn't issue a CO until I added a handrail on at least one side.


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## Gary in WA (Mar 11, 2009)

I'm sure Atlantic's *other* handrail had a grip-able one. This code has been in effect since at least since '73, when I started building decks. 

More: http://www.stairways.org/pdf/UnderstandingtheGraspability.pdf

And yet: http://www.ci.wausau.wi.us/is/win/pdf/rdc_info.pdf

Finally: http://www.stairways.org/codes_standards.htm Be safe, GBAR


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## Ron6519 (Mar 28, 2007)

rtoni said:


> Arrggh - didn't consider this when I built my addition (I really overbuilt the cantilever section of floor, but didn't even consider using inverted hangers before attaching rim board -- going to really feel stupid next time I trip over the bucket full of extra hangers I have from other projects ). Is there a way to address this after the fact (not hangers, but maybe some other metal corner brackets or fasteners inside the joist bays - using the usual hanger nails - to strengthen the connection between the rim plate and the joists)? Wouldn't be the same, but maybe good enough to alleviate the shear stress on the rim plate nails?


 Support the cantilever from below using sonotubes and support framing.
Ron


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