# Is this a load bearing wall next to stairs?



## projectpete19 (Mar 6, 2014)

Is the wall highlighted in the plan a load bearing wall? I have a pic of the wall in person but apologize for not having the floor joists above in the pic 











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## Olcrazy1 (May 28, 2013)

Can't tell without knowing what above the wall which neither your drawing or the pictures show.


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## Daniel Holzman (Mar 10, 2009)

This particular topic comes up frequently on this forum, you can check the threads. The answer is always the same. A wall is load bearing if it carries more than its own weight. The ONLY way to tell is to examine the framing above. If any framing bears on the wall, including joists, beams, another wall, or diagonal elements, then the wall is load bearing. If your are not 100% confident in your ability to make this determination, you need to bring in a professional to do the determination and design the replacement header, assuming you want to modify the wall.


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## mikegp (Jul 17, 2011)

Yes it is.


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## crecore (Nov 2, 2005)

A wall next to stairs should be assumed to be load bearing of the floor above at minimum. The stairs interrupt floor joists in the middle from two directions. The load of those joists must be transferred to the neighboring full joists and/or transferred through that wall. It is possible to Engineer it out but it would likely require double LVLs on both sides and the ends of the stairs. It could also still require a post or two, which in turn could require, at minimum, blocking on the lower floor joists if not further changes there as well.


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## carpdad (Oct 11, 2010)

I suggest you get a permit for it so your town inspector can see it. Permit process is not expensive, nor intimidating as people seem to think. A house owner is a king of his kingdom.:smile:
Your focus on the wall makes me think you don't know enough about house building. You knew enough to ask, but thousand pictures here may not be enough. 6x6 post suggests your staircase frame is supported by a beam, but such things are difficult from a photo. Isolated photo helps but finished framing and finish materials make it confusing.
Stairs stringers are usually self supporting. 
Call a carpenter for consultation.


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## crecore (Nov 2, 2005)

The last part may not apply as it looks like a slab there... But then again columns, if required, need footings.


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

Nothing on the drawing shows a bean on top of the wall or any support on one end of wall only a ground girder under the slab to support the wall. According to the drawing without knowing the spec, I would say it is weight bearing.


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## projectpete19 (Mar 6, 2014)

Got a better pic of a neighbouring house with same layout (new build so I can't get into the actual house yet)

Attached pics make it seem it's not load bearing 











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## carpdad (Oct 11, 2010)

That triple beam helps but not yet. The stair well box joist from which those floor joists hang, is it single or double? If double, what's the span and what is above it? It is a famous last line to say my neighbors house looks like mine. If yours is covered over, only the last carpenter who nailed it would know.
For now, it looks like a load bearing wall.


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## projectpete19 (Mar 6, 2014)

It is doubled up and the span is 10'


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## crecore (Nov 2, 2005)

The photo is mirror image of the plan. The triple joist indicates double in the plan, and the the one parallel to the stringers with all of the hangers that you indicate is a double, is indicated as triple in the plan. Where they meet is indicated a 6x6.


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## crecore (Nov 2, 2005)

On second glance the triple is only a double. There's a gap and its not on the wall (or 6x6 post per print). The third is just a normal joist to maintain spacing. Kind of silly really... Could have made the stair opening about 1-3/4" longer and saved a joist.


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## Mingledtrash (Nov 27, 2015)

From what you have provided it seems it could be a non-bearing wall but, the neighbors house is not your house. many houses in a tracked development have the same base plan but then little changes are made here and there. 

You can also have several editions or updates to a plan as you go. 

Is the plan you have the city approved set or a preliminary set. If it is a city approved set with engineers stamps and building department stamps its probably safe to say that most of the wall is non-bearing with the exception of the point load at the end.


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## projectpete19 (Mar 6, 2014)

These are the best i could get if the actual house that someone was able to send me











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## mikegp (Jul 17, 2011)

You move the wall, all of those joists fall. Unless the perpendicular joist is being supported somewhere else and is at least doubled up, which is unlikely.


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## Mingledtrash (Nov 27, 2015)

it looks like you have a point load at each end of the beam. your house is a bit different than your neighbors you will need to keep the post at each end of the beam but you should be able to remove the studs in the middle as long as an engineer or architect signs off on it. they may require some extra straps or post base/caps. 

edit: post at one end beam and beam hangered into the triple beam at the other end. you will need to confirm this. If you have the full set of plans there should be a floor framing page that will show all the beams and posts, sometimes posts and beams are on there own page as well.
the plan page you posted was the foundation plan which is mostly for pouring concrete.


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## crecore (Nov 2, 2005)

As I pointed out, the TJ and DJ on your print are triple and double joists. The main joist, perpendicular to your stair stringers is DJ per print. The one parallel to your stringers should be a triple and where they meet is a point load which should be a 6x6 column. You have no column but have a wall currently. Your TJ is a DJ. Not sure if you can go to the original PE or another but as stated above you will need a sign off on the changes or your building inspector should not allow it. I suspect if you add the third joist, and the 6x6 in the proper place and have the proper brackets they would sign off on removing that wall.


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