# Build 10 foot wall with 5 foot 2x4's



## rjniles (Feb 5, 2007)

You can't, save yourself the aggravation and buy the studs you need. Use this scrap for blocking and fillers.


----------



## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

Have to agree, not a strong wall with 2x's that are not full length
With a 10' high wall you need full length studs

Where are you located?


----------



## COLDIRON (Mar 15, 2009)

Buy new studs not that many, I know moneys tight.

Many somebody else knows keep looking there may be a magical carpenter out there.


----------



## Gandalf (Dec 4, 2009)

rjniles said:


> You can't, save yourself the aggravation and buy the studs you need. Use this scrap for blocking and fillers.


I disagree. What about making hexagons like a beehive wall. Students at the University of Calgary built a bridge out of popsicle sticks that held 5030 pounds of load before it collapsed. I guess what I'm looking for here is ideas. Three people have already posted that it can't be done. More postings like that are really not helpful. 


BTW I'm not looking for a "magical carpenter" just one that can consider alternative construction methods.


----------



## bob22 (May 28, 2008)

You want to build an exterior wall. Exterior to what? If it is a place where people live, you'd have to get it inspected. If it is for a shed for storage, just cobble them together as you like (two 5' tall stud wall sections placed one on top of the other?). But, the strength will not be there without bracing and my guess is you could spend more on metal plates and what not to get to where it is strong enough IMO.
Good luck.


----------



## Daniel Holzman (Mar 10, 2009)

The OPS stated this was a garden shed, not a habitable structure. The OPS did not ask about permits or construction to code. The question simply was could you build a strong exterior wall using 4 and 5 foot long lumber.

You certainly can build an adequately strong exterior wall. The key is to get the strength from exterior grade sheathing rather than from the framing lumber. By using 3/4 inch plywood attached at frequent intervals (say every 6 inches with screws or nails) to the framing lumber, you can build a perfectly satisfactory wall without having continuous studs. To connect the studs, you can either use an inexpensive metal splice plate, or overlap the joint using a 2 or 3 foot piece of 2x4. Run the plywood all the way down to the bottom of the sill plate, as this will give you extra strength. Make use you use full size sheets of plywood, and overlap the framing joint.

Will this be as strong as a continuous stud wall? No, but remember, this is a garden shed, not a house.


----------



## Gandalf (Dec 4, 2009)

Daniel Holzman said:


> The OPS stated this was a garden shed, not a habitable structure. The OPS did not ask about permits or construction to code. The question simply was could you build a strong exterior wall using 4 and 5 foot long lumber.
> 
> You certainly can build an adequately strong exterior wall. The key is to get the strength from exterior grade sheathing rather than from the framing lumber. By using 3/4 inch plywood attached at frequent intervals (say every 6 inches with screws or nails) to the framing lumber, you can build a perfectly satisfactory wall without having continuous studs. To connect the studs, you can either use an inexpensive metal splice plate, or overlap the joint using a 2 or 3 foot piece of 2x4. Run the plywood all the way down to the bottom of the sill plate, as this will give you extra strength. Make use you use full size sheets of plywood, and overlap the framing joint.
> 
> Will this be as strong as a continuous stud wall? No, but remember, this is a garden shed, not a house.



Thank you for your post. That's what I was looking for. But instead of 3/4" plywood what would you think of using 1"x4" boards continuously butted against eachother horizontally from the bottom plate to the top plate. I can get those free by just taking more pallets apart.


----------



## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

Gandalf said:


> Three people have already posted that it can't be done


I count 1 person that said it can't, 2 that said you should buy full length studs

Are you building a hexagon shed out of popsicle sticks?

Splice plates are $1 each from the ones I have bought
The extra cost on 3/4" plywood VS 1/2"....well you could buy the studs with what you would save by being able to use 1/2" plywood on full length studs
Can you do it......Yes
Will you save $$ using the 1/2 studs & 3/4" plywood & metal splices...No

6x8 garden shed - no permit required around here under 100 sq ft

How long will the 1x4's be?
Most pallets I see are 4' long
I can't see them giving as much strength as a 4x8 sheet of 3/4 plywood


----------



## jaros bros. (Jan 16, 2009)

You could also build a garden shed out of Popsicle sticks, but I wouldn't recommend it. I can't imagine why you would take pallets apart to build a garden shed. Surely your time is worth more. The end product will not be the same as if you purchased the proper material.


----------



## bob22 (May 28, 2008)

Sorry I missed the original post about it being a garden shed. Mea culpa. It's Friday.


----------



## vsheetz (Sep 28, 2008)

Consider to use the 1x4s on the diagnal - triangles are strong.


----------



## Megabuilder (Dec 7, 2009)

Since you have all that free lumber why don't you just sister the joints like Daniel Holzman suggested but use 12" centers. Then you can use 1/2" plywood or better yet T1-11 and Scuba Dave's cost concerns are moot.

I like the way you are using recycled wood that would otherwise end up in a landfill. The cost of disposing of the pallets is a cost Scuba Dave didn't figure into his cost analysis. It's a real financial cost now - hauling it to the dump and a hidden cost that future generations must pay.


----------



## pyper (Jul 1, 2009)

Take two 5' boards and put them end to end, flat. Now take a third 5' board, put it right on top of the other two. Nail together. :thumbsup:

Now will this be as strong as new lumber? No. Do you care? 

Since you have an unlimited supply of wood, you can use additional 2x4 pieces as corner bracing. So when you have the stud wall up, and the ceiling joists in place, put a board at a 45 degree angle to conect a stud to a joist. This will add a lot of strength. Since you have 10' ceilings you have plenty of room to put the bracing in without giving up headroom. Is a wall like this (with bracing) as strong as a new-lumber wall? I don't think the calculations that would be requried to determine an informed answer are within the scope of this forum!

But here's another answer if you want to use the lumber and want to build something that you KNOW is strong -- build a pole structure. Use the proper size PT posts for the building size you're making, and then use the other lumber to fill in the voids.

Here's a third alternative. Take two 5' 2x4's and make one foot of the end of each one a 1x4. Glue and screw them together. You now have 8' studs. Even better would be to make a tennoned scarf joint, but that would take more time, and probably not be worth the effort for a garden shed.


----------



## rjniles (Feb 5, 2007)

All these suggestions are fine if you consider your own labor as free. Personally my time is worth more than cobbling together a $4.00 stud.


----------



## pyper (Jul 1, 2009)

rjniles said:


> All these suggestions are fine if you consider your own labor as free. Personally my time is worth more than cobbling together a $4.00 stud.


If I can do ten of them in an hour it's worth it to me.

If it takes me one hour but saves me a one hour trip to town to buy the studs, then it's worth twice as much. :thumbsup:

If it prevents me from needing to tell the wife I need to buy more wood then it's priceless :laughing:


----------



## rjniles (Feb 5, 2007)

pyper said:


> If it prevents me from needing to tell the wife I need to buy more wood then it's priceless :laughing:



touche


----------



## Klawman (Nov 10, 2009)

I am no framer or carpenter, but I have a question. I think someone suggested building two 5' walls; one atop the other. Others have talked about joining two shorter piesces together by different methods. I don't know which is better, but I would think that if you build 10' studs from two shorter pieces, it may be best to offet the joints. (Ex. Stud1 is a 6' on top of a 4', nest to it in the wall is stud 2. this time a 4' is on top of a 6". If you have plenty of wood, not only mortise the two peices together (if I am using the correct term) with glue and nails, but place a couple of 3" boards on each side of the joint.)


----------



## Evil Scotsman (Nov 4, 2009)

pyper said:


> If it prevents me from needing to tell the wife I need to buy more wood then it's priceless :laughing:


TRUER WORDS HAVE _*NEVER*_ BEEN SPOKEN!!! :thumbup:


----------



## 295yards (Oct 29, 2009)

It's a shed man, of course it can be done!

Build 2 5' walls and overlap them at the corners with a double top plate like you would a full length wall and just make sure you when you build your top wall directly over your lower wall studs to support the load ( this is really not even that important either assuming you'll use 16" centers) and the sheathing will add extra locking power from sway. 1/2" is fine, no need to get crazy with 3/4!

Just try not to use overly warped studs for your bottom and top plates and frame as tight as you can.

It's a shed without any rediculous code compliance.

_"build it and you can store"_


----------



## md2lgyk (Jan 6, 2009)

Are you sure this free lumber is 2x4s? We have literally hundreds of pallets where I work, for heavy stuff like pumps, large motors, etc. None of them have any 2x4s in them.


----------



## 295yards (Oct 29, 2009)

md2lgyk said:


> Are you sure this free lumber is 2x4s? We have literally hundreds of pallets where I work, for heavy stuff like pumps, large motors, etc. None of them have any 2x4s in them.


I have seen most pallets as you described but I have also seen pallets made with PT 4 X 4's.

I have not measured the studs myself, but can only assume if the OP posted he had access to 2 X 4's in 5 - 6ft. lengths that's what he meant.

It's kinda like someone getting detailed drawings from a structural engineer with a certain number of 2 X 12's that they would need to carry a load over a certain length than going out and trying to scab it together with that number of 2 X 6's.

*"What do you mean you're not going to pass it"?*


----------



## pyper (Jul 1, 2009)

Klawman said:


> I don't know which is better, but I would think that if you build 10' studs from two shorter pieces, it may be best to offet the joints.


Maybe a little.

If you scarf the joints so that the joint is across the 4" dimension (joint two 1x4s, and not two 2x2s), then the joint will be pretty strong. A 2x4 has two dimensions, width (2 inches) and depth (4 inches). A scarf joint as described will have essentially as much strength in the depth dimension as uncut lumber -- the wood itself will always fail before the glue. In the other dimension it will only be as strong as a 1x4. But that's OK, because building's don't rely on that strength. They either have sheer panels (plywood in the corners) or they have diagonal bracing in the studs.

Then all you're left with is the remote possibility that you're going to get wind gust so strong that they're going to be able to sheer your building at the joints in the 2x4s. From a practical standpoint, you're probably going to have the roof blow off long before the studs sheer.

If I was going to do it I'd just make a simple jig for my circular saw and finish the cuts with the sawzall. Either that or put the stacked dado's on the table saw. Either way it would probably take less than five minutes each to splice two ends into a full length board.

If the building is sheathed in T-111, then all this discussion is probably silly. My pole barn is sheathed in T-111 and my framing consists of 2x4s on the perimeters of the sheets. But they're glued and screwed. The roof will blow off long before there's any issue with the sheathing.


----------

