# $600 brake job



## turbomangt (Sep 17, 2009)

If gas prices won't kill you maintainence costs will, I'm on my 3rd set of brakes on my cruiser with 140,000 miles, the first one according to my records cost me $350 second $475 now last week $600.......I did shop around and it seems every one is in the same ball park, I guess they way they make rotors now you can't grind em down as much.....I think mechanics are in the same salary bracket as doctors now. LOL...


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## fabrk8r (Feb 12, 2010)

Since this is a DIY forum I'll throw this out there...on modern cars it's very easy to do a very thorough and safe brake job for most people who are somewhat mechanically inclined and have the correct tools. This is especially true of vehicles with disc brakes on both the front and rear wheels.
It's within most people's ability to change drums and shoes as well, but it is somewhat more time consuming than disk pads and rotors and requires a few more specialized tools and it helps to have some experience.
On some vehicles it is cost prohibitive to have the rotors turned because a new set of rotors usually costs anywhere from $20.00 to $40.00 each, whereas to have the rotors turned and trued the cost is usually in the range of $13.00 to $20.00 each. It's also very important for the life of the new pads that the rotors are turned correctly (which isn't a job for someone inexperienced).


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## 95025 (Nov 14, 2010)

turbomangt said:


> If gas prices won't kill you maintainence costs will, I'm on my 3rd set of brakes on my cruiser with 140,000 miles, the first one according to my records cost me $350 second $475 now last week $600.......I did shop around and it seems every one is in the same ball park, I guess they way they make rotors now you can't grind em down as much.....I think mechanics are in the same salary bracket as doctors now. LOL...


$600? What they heck did they do? Did they replace everything, both front and back? Did they replace all the rotors/drums?

Brake Repair Shops are notorious for screwing people over. Most likely, these guys charged you exorbitant fees for unnecessary work.

I'm not sure what your vehicle is, but I've changed out hundreds of sets of brakes for people over the years. Any more, most "middle of the road" brake pad sets cost around $30. Most new rotors cost $30 - $50 each. 

Also, as *fabrk8r* said, it's relatively easy to change out front brake pads. And rear brake pads/drums rarely wear out. In fact, at 140,000 miles you should still be on your original set.


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## turbomangt (Sep 17, 2009)

it was both front and back, rotors and pads, I called 4 shops all were within the same range..........are you saying that your original brakes should last 140,000 miles? your kidding right


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## 95025 (Nov 14, 2010)

turbomangt said:


> it was both front and back, rotors and pads, I called 4 shops all were within the same range..........are you saying that your original brakes should last 140,000 miles? your kidding right


REAR brakes. And no, I'm not kidding. Many cars run their entire lives without needing the rear brake pads/shoes replaced. Granted, there are a lot of variables - not the least of which is what kind of driving you're doing.

And I suppose the $600 is "within reason" considering that the parts were probably a total of $350 (Your price, not their price. Their price would be half that.). Also, the cost of labor varies widely, depending on where you live.


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## turbomangt (Sep 17, 2009)

is this drum brakes you are talking about? mine are disc on all four


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## fabrk8r (Feb 12, 2010)

In most cases approximately 75% of the braking (and therefore the wear) is accomplished with the front brakes. On cars with front discs and rear drums your could sometimes change the front pads twice, maybe three times, before the rear shoes would have to be replaced. 

With newer 4 wheel disc brake vehicles the rear pads are much smaller and thinner which makes them wear at about the same rate as the front pads.


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## 95025 (Nov 14, 2010)

fabrk8r said:


> In most cases approximately 75% of the braking (and therefore the wear) is accomplished with the front brakes. On cars with front discs and rear drums your could sometimes change the front pads twice, maybe three times, before the rear shoes would have to be replaced.
> 
> With newer 4 wheel disc brake vehicles the rear pads are much smaller and thinner which makes them wear at about the same rate as the front pads.


Right. But even with rear disc brakes, the majority of the braking is done by the front brakes. Probably more of a 60/40 thing, I suppose.

Also, the quality of pads & shoes varies widely - as do the prices. Don't expect much life out of the $14.99 set of brake pads.


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## CoconutPete (Jan 22, 2010)

It's gotten much harder to DIY your car repair jobs over the years. Hell, my 3-Series doesn't even have a dipstick anymore, it has a submenu on the computer that tells you the oil level.

Throughout all of this, brakes have remained remarkably unchanged. ABS sensors, pad wear sensors all that good stuff - it just unplugs and the brake job consists of what it has always consisted of. I have always done brakes myself because it's one of those things that just seems to be priced so high for what it really is.


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## fireguy (May 3, 2007)

My Sprinter brake parts cost $575, plus $380 for labor, total $955.00 But, I got 40,000 on the Mercedes parts and 80,000 on the after market parts. Dodge would have charged more and the quality would have been less. You got off cheap. 

Mechanics like brake jobs, they can beat flat rate by lots. We loved brake jobs.


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## rusty baker (Feb 13, 2009)

I was a Toyota Certified mechanic at one time. At $600 for a complete brake job which will take maybe an hour, parts cost about $100, profit is $500. Nice racket. If you had 8 sets a day to do, $4000 labor. Mechanic makes $500-$600 a day, shop makes $3400-$3500 a day.


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## ukrkoz (Dec 31, 2010)

even top tier mechanics "for hire" are salaried at maybe $45 an hr. maybe some incentives. that's 8 x $45=$340. 
maybe a private mech can make $500 a day, but he'll be up his eyeballs in lease, insurance, parts, taxes, etc, etc... i am yet to see a rich mech. 

anyhow..

very good quality front rotors are $70 each, pads front end good quality $40, rear rotors will be slightly more as they may house parking brakes. plus, another $40 for set of pads. looking at around close to $500 in quality parts only, plus about 1.5 hr labor. 

yes, i can buy cheap-o rotors front for $20 each, they will warp in about 1000 miles.

i guess, i was waaaaay too optimistic about what mechs make. median gross salary is $51000; best are in only $71 000 range; that's $35 an hr folks

http://swz.salary.com/SalaryWizard/...Repairer-Salary-Details-98181-Seattle-WA.aspx

automotive mechanic I median average salary slightly above $30 000 year.


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## concretemasonry (Oct 10, 2006)

I like to be a DIYer. but there is a practical limit.

For cars, find a knowledgeable local mechanic with tools and an adequate shop. I was able to find one.

My wife and I have very similar cars (1999 Jimmy -150,000 miles and 2000 Blazer - 95,00 miles - both with 4WD). She is very independent and went to a "chain" shop for a major tune up (the typical 100,00 mile procedure). -It was $900 and a month or two later I had the same job for $600 from a local mechanic (4 bays, 1 or 2 helpers). After that comparison, there was no question. He did not say when it would be done (no hurry) and delivered my Jimmy at 9:00 PM and asked if I could give him a ride back to the shop, which was 4 blocks away. - After that. the was no choice where to go.

I go in and and tell him what I want done and he will tell me if it is not really necessary, but he remembers. He is not always on time (same day) or will be prompt if he is told it is important. Often he will say something is not necessary, but he will do it later it it happens to fit into what needs to be done. His mark-up on good parts is reasonable and not a big profit center. I use Mobil 1 oil because my Jimmy is bullet prof and was previously owned by GM and maintained at GM strictly according to the records I got with 25,000 miles on the odometer. When I said I wanted to continue using Mobil 1. He said "Just to to Walmart and buy a jug of it, since that is what I do for my 1962 Corvette". Since I supplied the oil, it was $8 or $10 for a change and lube. - He does not wan to bother with stocking the unique products, but he does "adopt" a car.

I would gladly pay more, but he may be insulted, so we always give him a few fruit cakes for the holidays and my wife refers to him as Dr. Eddie and he is reliable and trustworthy. - I don't know what to do if I moved.

Dick


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## rusty baker (Feb 13, 2009)

ukrkoz said:


> even top tier mechanics "for hire" are salaried at maybe $45 an hr. maybe some incentives. that's 8 x $45=$340.
> maybe a private mech can make $500 a day, but he'll be up his eyeballs in lease, insurance, parts, taxes, etc, etc... i am yet to see a rich mech.
> 
> anyhow..
> ...


Mechanics don't get paid by the hour, it's by the book hour. Dealer mechanics here make $65 AN HOUR. When I was still doing it, for example, it took 2 hours to change a head, but I got paid 6.2 book hours.


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## Clutchcargo (Mar 31, 2007)

I paid about $440 in parts and shipping for my wife's Suby Forester. That was for 4 rotors and the pads. $600 including labor is in line these days. 
OEM parts are expensive. I tried aftermarket parts (about $250 in parts) and that was a mistake because of poor braking performance. Subarus are picky with parts. I imagine that for $600, your mechanic is using OEM parts for your Cruiser. 
Also another thought, ABS is hard on rear brakes and a lot of times the rear wear out first.


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## fireguy (May 3, 2007)

rusty baker said:


> Mechanics don't get paid by the hour, it's by the book hour. Dealer mechanics here make $65 AN HOUR. When I was still doing it, for example, it took 2 hours to change a head, but I got paid 6.2 book hours.


When I worked in GM dealership, the repair time, as published by Motor and Mitchell included bringing the car to the stall, diagnostic time, getting parts from the part department, settingup the work station for the repair, doing the job, moving the car out of the shop, cleanin up the stall, and turning in the repair order. 

Chevy warrenty time was only working on the car time. If the mechanic stopped working to get a tool, the stop watch stopped and did not start until the mechanic started to work. Diagnostic time was at a minimum. The warrenty rep always acted amazed when we told him that Chevy declined all time except for what was listed in hte warrenty book. Chevrolet claimed there were dealers who made money on warrenty. Chevrolet lied.


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## Double (Feb 15, 2012)

I've worked at dealerships for years. Standard Toyota set's run about $260-$280 per axle installed, from the dealer, Subaru tends to be a little more expensive, $300 per axle in my experience. Those prices are including pads and TURNING rotors.

Rotors at both dealers run about $100-$120 EACH.


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## 95025 (Nov 14, 2010)

Double said:


> I've worked at dealerships for years. Standard Toyota set's run about $260-$280 per axle installed, from the dealer, Subaru tends to be a little more expensive, $300 per axle in my experience. Those prices are including pads and TURNING rotors.
> 
> Rotors at both dealers run about $100-$120 EACH.


$100 - $120 each, for rotors, is pretty darned high. Most parts stores sell the same rotors for anywhere from $28 - $48 each.


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## Double (Feb 15, 2012)

You are totally right, Im just giving dealer prices...


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## rusty baker (Feb 13, 2009)

fireguy said:


> When I worked in GM dealership, the repair time, as published by Motor and Mitchell included bringing the car to the stall, diagnostic time, getting parts from the part department, settingup the work station for the repair, doing the job, moving the car out of the shop, cleanin up the stall, and turning in the repair order.
> 
> Chevy warrenty time was only working on the car time. If the mechanic stopped working to get a tool, the stop watch stopped and did not start until the mechanic started to work. Diagnostic time was at a minimum. The warrenty rep always acted amazed when we told him that Chevy declined all time except for what was listed in hte warrenty book. Chevrolet claimed there were dealers who made money on warrenty. Chevrolet lied.


 No wonder then that Chevy has a bad rep in their shops. I worked for a Toyota dealer and several indy shops and have a friend who has worked for several dealers. They all paid book hours to the mechanics. Not actual worked hours. And all the jobs could be done faster than book hours. Still, brake jobs are a rip off. They are one of the highest profit jobs in a shop.


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## 95025 (Nov 14, 2010)

rusty baker said:


> No wonder then that Chevy has a bad rep in their shops. I worked for a Toyota dealer and several indy shops and have a friend who has worked for several dealers. They all paid book hours to the mechanics. Not actual worked hours. And all the jobs could be done faster than book hours. Still, brake jobs are a rip off. They are one of the highest profit jobs in a shop.


Right. I can't begin to tell you how many front brake jobs I've done in my garage. Unless it's an unusual vehicle, it takes me about 20 minutes. And I don't even have any special tools. Just a 3-ton floor jack, 2 jackstands, and a toolbox.

I can put on 2 brand new rotors, and ceramic brake pads, for under $100. That same job would cost over $300 to have done "professionally." Customers get charged about $100 for a "brake job" that consists of nothing more than throwing a set of $12 brake pads on a car.


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## Carkid0007 (Jan 24, 2012)

I work for a Nissan dealership and I give my customers a choice on what kind of rotor they want to use. Nissan rotors are priced so high I let them make the choice and explain the benefits of course of oem parts. I only sell oem brake pads though. Our warranty claims are made by a flat rate manual designated by Nissan.


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## 95025 (Nov 14, 2010)

Carkid0007 said:


> I work for a Nissan dealership and I give my customers a choice on what kind of rotor they want to use. Nissan rotors are priced so high I let them make the choice and explain the benefits of course of oem parts. I only sell oem brake pads though. Our warranty claims are made by a flat rate manual designated by Nissan.


Yeah... without question, not all brake pads are in the same league. There are the extreme low-end pads that people throw on if they're going to sell th car, only for the purpose of saying it has new brakes. Then there are usually two grades more, before getting up into ceramic pads.

I've started using more ceramic brake pads. They're a bit more expensive, but they sure do seem to work better - and they don't give you that wretched black brake dust.


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## Hardway (Dec 28, 2011)

Takes longer to jack veh up then It takes to do a 4 wheel brake job.


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## 95025 (Nov 14, 2010)

Hardway said:


> Takes longer to jack veh up then It takes to do a 4 wheel brake job.


I did the rear disc brakes on an older Volvo 240 this afternoon. Hahaha - THAT was different!


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## rusty baker (Feb 13, 2009)

The quality of brake pads that I use depends on the vehicle. Any Ford made in the 80's, I use cheap ones. The caliper pistons freeze up so often, no sense in buying quality pads. That whole brake system was junk. I used 80's model Ford vans for work for years because there is 12' inside. I could haul carpet and shut the back doors. Chevy and Dodge cargo vans are too short on the inside.


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## MecGen (Mar 26, 2011)

"Hey I have a crack in my foundation that leaks water, had a couple foundation pros come out have a look. The average estimate was 10K, but i did some research and fixed it in 10 minutes with some caulking. What a bunch of thieves those foundation guys are, I'll go on the interweb and tell everybody."

^^^sound familiar? Happens in all the trades.


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## 95025 (Nov 14, 2010)

MecGen said:


> "Hey I have a crack in my foundation that leaks water, had a couple foundation pros come out have a look. The average estimate was 10K, but i did some research and fixed it in 10 minutes with some caulking. What a bunch of thieves those foundation guys are, I'll go on the interweb and tell everybody."
> 
> ^^^sound familiar? Happens in all the trades.


Some foundation guys ARE thieves. Some mechanics ARE thieves. Not all, but some.

Also, if us "non-professionals" can do the work ourselves, using the same materials, and for far less money, why not?


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## bbo (Feb 28, 2010)

MecGen said:


> "Hey I have a crack in my foundation that leaks water, had a couple foundation pros come out have a look. The average estimate was 10K, but i did some research and fixed it in 10 minutes with some caulking. What a bunch of thieves those foundation guys are, I'll go on the interweb and tell everybody."
> 
> ^^^sound familiar? Happens in all the trades.


exactly.

trades exist because its a service people would rather pay than do it themselves.

I love DIY for most anything, but time is my major constraint. I'll do anything unless the time factor ( and tool availibility ) is is more than what I have available.


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## noquacks (Jun 5, 2010)

$600? The answer is too obvious. And the difference between a cheap pad and a good one is just a few dollars, like many things. Common, classic, well made semi metallics have lifetime warranties these days- I have them on most my cars. Yes, they also do wear eventually. They , IMO, are still the gold standard in brakes. 

Some people just feel klike they have little choice but to pay high fees for work/products. Its not "their fault"- its kindalike, its the system we live in.


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## WillK (Aug 29, 2010)

$600 for brake pads and rotors on all 4 wheels doesn't sound out of line for having it done at a shop, the question is whether it was really necessary.

We recently traded in a Toyota Yaris at 125,000 miles that I bought new, I don't know how much pad was left, but it went that full distance on the original brakes.

Just this weekend I did the same job on my 2006 Chrysler Pacifica with 75,000 miles. One pad (front right inner pad) had started grinding the rivet against the rotor. I had known for a couple weeks I had been waiting too long because on hard stops and turns I'd get a low brake fluid light (because the fluid was in the caliper pistons since they were extended due to pad wear)

At any rate, I received 4 rotors and 8 ceramic pads for $218 from Ebay. Aside from the 1 rotor that had been subjected to pad rivets, I probably could've reused rotors.

The work was simple enough even though I haven't had time to organize my tools in the garage, my hydraulic floor jack is kind of buried for example. Working non-continuously I got it done starting 1 PM finishing 6 PM with kids and dinner interruptions.

I'm also going to note... Don't take the wear of the rear pads for granted, they do provide less of the braking, but they are also smaller in proportion. The pad condition on my Pacifica was pretty similar front vs. rear.


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