# Trane vs Bryant



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

Trane XL15i vs Bryant 165A. Which one is better?


----------



## kenmac (Feb 26, 2009)

ignote said:


> Trane XL15i vs Bryant 165A. Which one is better?


 
If the install is done correctly... I would choose either....If you can't deside....Flip coin


----------



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

This would replace my current Trane and need to work with the current Trane XE90 gas furnace. So I guess it comes down to price all other things being equal?



ignote said:


> Trane XL15i vs Bryant 165A. Which one is better?


----------



## kenmac (Feb 26, 2009)

ignote said:


> This would replace my current Trane and need to work with the current Trane XE90 gas furnace. So I guess it comes down to price all other things being equal?


 

I didn't say all installers are equal.... You night check refrences of the 2 installers.... Are they installing R410 or R22


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

Guess the OP didn't like the idea of the install being more important than brand and started a new thread


----------



## kenmac (Feb 26, 2009)

Guess not.. I've seen installers around here change out a R22 system with R410 system & not even do a line flush......I just don't understand why they do this:no:.......doesn't take that long to do a flush


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

You catch that article in the HVAC NEWS that said getting the last drop of mineral oil out of a system is not a critical as it was first thought to be?


----------



## kenmac (Feb 26, 2009)

No I didn't... For some reason I haven't recieved that news letter in a while. I'am going to see if I can find an old letter with a ph # on it & call... Do you happen to have a news letter handy so I can contact them ??? While I know it's impossible ( in some) cases to get it all out & you will never know if you did ( unless you replace the line set) . I will do a flush on the system & give it my best shot if I intend to use the old line set


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

It's a trade publication, not a new letter. Can't remember when it was published. Your post just sparked the memory of it.

That isn't to say you don't have to flush a line set, but if there is just a smidgen of mineral oil left it won't kill the system.

I can PM you the number if you want to subscribe to the paper. it comes several times a month with a lot of good stuff.

I gotta dig up the number in my phone book. I'll get it to you later today.


----------



## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

I think the new standard is less then 4% MO now.


OP.

You might want to see what the SEER rating of each unit is with a standard furnace.

Why buy a high SEER unit, that needs a VS blower to get that SEER, if you don't have a VS blower.


----------



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

These will be 410 systems and the quotes state that there will be a line flush.


----------



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

So what system would you recommend if I have a don't have a VS blower?





beenthere said:


> I think the new standard is less then 4% MO now.
> 
> 
> OP.
> ...


----------



## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Something in the 14 SEER range.

You'll be able to get 14 SEER with a non VS blower.

I think the only non VS blower set up, that gets 15 SEER from Trane.
Requires the X13 blower motor.

Which you don't have either.

Are you looking at the TAX credits.


----------



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

Yes. I am interested in getting the tax credits.

Also. Is it possible to retrofit the Trane XE90 with a VS fan?




beenthere said:


> Something in the 14 SEER range.
> 
> You'll be able to get 14 SEER with a non VS blower.
> 
> ...


----------



## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Yes it is.

But you may not get the tax credit.

Must meet min SEER and EER requirements. That you probaly won't reach.

Did you tell these contractors, that you wat a system that will get you the tax credit?


----------



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

The Bryant guy was the only one to mention the tax credit. How do the determine whether or not you qualify for the credit? Isn't it just based on the SEER rating of the unit purchased?




beenthere said:


> Yes it is.
> 
> But you may not get the tax credit.
> 
> ...


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

yeah it is. But you can't retro the old furnace with a VS and get the credit. IRS tax forms are required that must state the model of the furnace and it must be installed in 2009 to qualify.

You follow ? I can expand if you prefer. IRS rules can be hard to get sometimes.


----------



## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

Make sure you are aware of the physical size and footprint of both units. The higher the SEER the larger they are and don't always fit where the old one was. Each co. has different ways of sizing them (vertical and horz). As a rule of thumb an ECM VS motor adds 1 SEER to any unit.


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

I say the OP should buy A Goodman.

Then a bad install won't matter:laughing: J/K


----------



## kenmac (Feb 26, 2009)

hvaclover said:


> I say the OP should buy A Goodman.
> 
> Then a bad install won't matter:laughing: J/K


 


Come on now,,,,,,,, That's what I have in my home..22 yrs & 1 consensor fan motor..


----------



## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

No, it is not.

A/C needs to meet SEER and EER requirements.(heat pump must also meet HSPF requirements)
And it must have an AHRI/manufacturer certificate that it meets those ratings in the match that you have.


Miss one, and you can kiss the tax credit good bye.


----------



## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

I meant as a rule of thumb so everyone can appreciate why a ECM is worth paying more for. A lot of the Lennox units when matched with a G61V will go up 1 SEER but not all of them. Converting an existing unit may not be worth the cost of the motor etc IMO. Probably close to $1000 which will take a LONG time to pay off.


----------



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

They don't make this simple do they. Sheesh.

But which brand do you guys think is the better brand. I feel that both installers are very good and come recommended.




hvaclover said:


> yeah it is. But you can't retro the old furnace with a VS and get the credit. IRS tax forms are required that must state the model of the furnace and it must be installed in 2009 to qualify.
> 
> You follow ? I can expand if you prefer. IRS rules can be hard to get sometimes.


----------



## kenmac (Feb 26, 2009)

I told you ...flip a coin..Difference..... Trane has their own compressors Bryant uses a copeland comp.


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

kenmac said:


> Come on now,,,,,,,, That's what I have in my home..22 yrs & 1 consensor fan motor..


Just funin'


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

ignote said:


> They don't make this simple do they. Sheesh.
> 
> But which brand do you guys think is the better brand. I feel that both installers are very good and come recommended.



It is simple. Both are equal. It's how well it's installed that counts.

Beenther gave a whole list of stuff that is important. 

Do a side by side comparison: write out what is the most important to you
and see which has the most of them.


----------



## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

yuri said:


> I meant as a rule of thumb so everyone can appreciate why a ECM is worth paying more for. A lot of the Lennox units when matched with a G61V will go up 1 SEER but not all of them. Converting an existing unit may not be worth the cost of the motor etc IMO. Probably close to $1000 which will take a LONG time to pay off.


Check into the conversion kit, its not as bad as you think.


----------



## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

Check the sound db decibel rating of them. One may be quieter and if near a deck may be of some value to you.


----------



## Ruuduser (Mar 22, 2009)

The sole Bryant guy where I live got totally consumed by the Bryant superhero image. Its all over his single truck. I think he has his own Bryant superhero costume too - big guy, probably will bust his superhero pants if he has to bend down.

Enough to scare me to Trane.


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

Ruuduser said:


> The sole Bryant guy where I live got totally consumed by the Bryant superhero image. Its all over his single truck. I think he has his own Bryant superhero costume too - big guy, probably will bust his superhero pants if he has to bend down.
> 
> Enough to scare me to Trane.



Hey watch it ! I'm Superhero too:laughing:


----------



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

I got back the following quotes for the new AC and coil. All quotes include new pad, flushing of the old line, installation, same warranty and prog. thermostat.

Trane
XL15i - $3980
XL15i - $4680

Bryant
165A - $3690
123A - $3120

My inside unit is a 9year old Trane XE90.







ignote said:


> Trane XL15i vs Bryant 165A. Which one is better?


----------



## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

You have (2) XL15i should one be XL16i?? The other point I would highly recommend is that they replace the freon lines if possible. Most of the new R410 units require a larger size suction line and a lot of corners are being cut by reusing the old smaller lines. For ex: a older 2 ton R22 uses 5/8" and then new ones should have 3/4". Do you have a Lennox dealer in your area? the XC15 is a incredibly quiet unit and has an onboard computer to monitor the compressor and a full set of safety controls.http://www.lennox.com/products/overview.asp?model=XC15. Trane and Bryant are good units.


----------



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

Both are quotes for XL15i.



yuri said:


> You have (2) XL15i should one be XL16i?? The other point I would highly recommend is that they replace the freon lines if possible. Most of the new R410 units require a larger size suction line and a lot of corners are being cut by reusing the old smaller lines. For ex: a older 2 ton R22 uses 5/8" and then new ones should have 3/4". Do you have a Lennox dealer in your area? the XC15 is a incredibly quiet unit and has an onboard computer to monitor the compressor and a full set of safety controls.http://www.lennox.com/products/overview.asp?model=XC15. Trane and Bryant are good units.


----------



## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

What kind of warranty with each company.

What kind of quality work do they do.


----------



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

beenthere said:


> What kind of warranty with each company.
> 
> What kind of quality work do they do.



All are quality companies.
All the warranties are comparable. 10year compressor and 5 on the coil.
2 of the 3 have 2 year labor warranty as well.


----------



## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

Personally the Trane looks like a heavier, quieter unit but I could be wrong. $700 is a lot of difference between the 2 companies. In my area $4000 for a Lennox XC15 would be reasonable. Try get some more quotes. I would go with a company who replaces the freon lines. Flushing is NO guarantee to get all the old mineral oil out etc and you don't want contamination in your new unit.


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

Flusing will get all the stuff out Yuri.


----------



## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

As long as it is done PROPERLY. Without knowing who is doing the work I would not trust anybody. I use RX11 flush and it is expensive:
http://www.nucalgon.com/products/refrig_systemFlushing_rx11flush.htm
Have not found too many techs who want to spend the time or really care about doing a job properly. Maybe I'm cynical but I would not take chances with my new purchase. My company always replaces the lines except if they are hidden/impossible to get at. We charge more but people trust us and we don't cut corners.


----------



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

One of my quotes states "flushed with R-11". I will check with the others as well.



yuri said:


> As long as it is done PROPERLY. Without knowing who is doing the work I would not trust anybody. I use RX11 flush and it is expensive:
> http://www.nucalgon.com/products/refrig_systemFlushing_rx11flush.htm
> Have not found too many techs who want to spend the time or really care about doing a job properly. Maybe I'm cynical but I would not take chances with my new purchase. My company always replaces the lines except if they are hidden/impossible to get at. We charge more but people trust us and we don't cut corners.


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

ignote said:


> One of my quotes states _*"flushed with R-11". *_I will check with the others as well.



Lol Ignote, I hope they aren't flushing with R 11. EPA would be down on them like stink on sh!t.:no:


(let's see how badly this confuses things)


----------



## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

x makes all the difference. :wink:


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

beenthere said:


> x makes all the difference. :wink:


Sure does.


----------



## ignote (Mar 25, 2009)

The answer.

"Will flush the lines with RX11 and nitrogen.It comes in a kit together.Then we install a filter drier which comes with the A/C unit,this is brazed to the liquid line(the smaller,bare copper line).The filter drier will keep the new refrigerant pure.After all the copper lines are brazed and sealed we will draw a vacuum to ensure there is no moisture,oil or air in the lines."






hvaclover said:


> Lol Ignote, I hope they aren't flushing with R 11. EPA would be down on them like stink on sh!t.:no:
> 
> 
> (let's see how badly this confuses things)


----------



## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

Good for you! Educated consumers are least likely to hire less than adequate contractor.


----------



## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

Amen brothers.:yes:


----------

