# Cement Block Wall Footing



## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

This is my understanding:

For a cement block garden wall, even at only 2 feet tall, if it is to be covered with anything that relies on stability and no cracks (i.e. stucco or stone veneer), the footing must be applied down to the frost line.

The concrete footer should have be as deep as the blocks are front to back, so standard block will dictate a 8" depth of footer, and front to back of footer double that for standard block with blocks set centered on the 16".

My question is this: If the footer must be dug down to frost line (in my area of NY that's about 3' down), and the concrete footer must only be 8" deep, does this mean below the initial 8" of concrete the remaining 28" of depth can be filled with compacted rock/gravel, or the concrete itself needs to be down to the full 36"?

I would like to build this planting bed surrounding my porch, only 2' high, but if it involves a full 36" of concrete at 16" wide for the full 30', that's a bit much and I'll have to switch to a segmented retaining wall (Cambridge Olde English Wall). If I could fill the depth to the frost line with gravel/rock until 8" below grade, and properly lay the 8" concrete above that to grade, then that's more doable.

Thoughts?


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

Anyone?


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

You really need to go down the full 36" with the excavation, and then follow with:

- Pour min. 8" by 16" (here, 16" is the ABSOLUTE min., and only applies if you're perfect. Code calls for 4" min. beyond foundation wall in each direction.)

- Build 3-3.5 course frost wall in your situation, wall likely being 12" wide to allow for brick/stone ledge.

- Build above grade 8" wall to receive brick/stone cladding.


If it sounds like a lot of work, it is, which is why many free-standing walls are SRW's now-a-days.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

*Thanks*

Thanks for the reply and advice!

So to clarify. 

One would want to start the concrete at the bottom of the 36" with a 8 x 16 footer, then do 3 courses 12" (and not 8") til about grade, and THEN a coarse/2 to accept veneer?

WOW, you're right, that is HARDCORE. But you sound like you know your stuff, and doing things the right way is not always easy!

I had wanted to stucco/culture stone the above grade part, but this seems like a bit too much for me, and may go with the segmented Cambridge. 

So the idea to excavate to that 3' but fill the bottom 2' of that space with compacted stone, then the 8" rebarred, etc. concrete is not an acceptable way to build footer for wall going <2' above grade? That's probably the only way to make it work for me, otherwise I'll need to go with the srw. 

Thanks again for the reply and advice!


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

99altrade said:


> Thanks for the reply and advice!
> 
> So to clarify.
> 
> ...


No Problem........


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

So I've decided to go with (unless some crazy change) a cement block wall, with concrete footer. The blocks will be veneered with 6"x24" MSI Ledger Panels. 

Couple questions: 

On the concrete footer: 

1) Of the space where I intend on pouring the footer: I know with a concrete slab I compact soil, then some odd inches of rock, then pour the concrete. For a block wall should the footer be similar in terms of makeup, or should the poured concrete go straight to soil with no base of compacted rock in between (will the rock base add or hurt the longevity of footer+wall?)? Is the wall more stable with the poured concrete straight to frost area or some inches of compacted rock beneath good for drainage?

2) I have a couple wheelbarrows of crushed/broken porcelain/ceramic tile in my garage, that I'd love to recycle as base. Can I throw this in as part of the compacted 3/4" rock base that I will lay beneath the poured concrete footer (assuming the answer above is yes add rock beneath concrete pour)?

3) Drainage. This wall is only 1-2' high from grade, on level surface. The rear will be 2' away at same height (essentially planting bed). I will back-fill with rock then top 1/3rd with planting soil (right?). What measures should be taken for proper drainage. Just drill some holes near bottom of the wall every few feet? Use perforated pvc pipe laid at slight downward grade behind wall and have it exit through drilled hole at other end?

Thanks so much!


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## AGWhitehouse (Jul 1, 2011)

If you insistent on a veneered wall, you could do a poured concrete wall on grade. Put in some horizontal and strapping re-bar and it won't crack from frost. Essentially a "grade beam". Then you can apply whatever finish you desire.

Building a frost wall for 2'-0" of exposure seems excessive. There are aton of options for landscaping walls now that may give you the look you're after. Check with your local landscaping supply (not the box stores). Even try a stone warehouse...you'll be surprised at your options.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

Thanks for the reply!

Can you explain what you mean a bit further? At this point I have a ditch dug nicely level to 22" down, 22' long, and about 22" front to back. So what exactly are you suggesting to do at this point. To do poured concrete wall (with some sort of vertical wall forms) instead of block wall? Not sure if that sounds more or less complicated than pouring in concrete, leveling, and then block wall couple courses to desired height and veneer it?

I would love nothing more than to make this project easier (without going for seg ret wall) or cheaper, but want to make sure it's done properly.

Thank you again!


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## AGWhitehouse (Jul 1, 2011)

If the trench is dug then carry on...the grade beam concept doesn't require a trench.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

Thanks again!

Do you have any input on the 3 questions I posted (posted again below for convenience):

Couple questions: 

On the concrete footer: 

1) Of the space where I intend on pouring the footer: I know with a concrete slab I compact soil, then some odd inches of rock, then pour the concrete. For a block wall should the footer be similar in terms of makeup, or should the poured concrete go straight to soil with no base of compacted rock in between (will the rock base add or hurt the longevity of footer+wall?)? Is the wall more stable with the poured concrete straight to frost area or some inches of compacted rock beneath good for drainage?

2) I have a couple wheelbarrows of crushed/broken porcelain/ceramic tile in my garage, that I'd love to recycle as base. Can I throw this in as part of the compacted 3/4" rock base that I will lay beneath the poured concrete footer (assuming the answer above is yes add rock beneath concrete pour)?

3) Drainage. This wall is only 1-2' high from grade, on level surface. The rear will be 2' away at same height (essentially planting bed). I will back-fill with rock then top 1/3rd with planting soil (right?). What measures should be taken for proper drainage. Just drill some holes near bottom of the wall every few feet? Use perforated pvc pipe laid at slight downward grade behind wall and have it exit through drilled hole at other end?

Thanks so much!


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## AGWhitehouse (Jul 1, 2011)

99altrade said:


> Thanks again!
> 
> Do you have any input on the 3 questions I posted above regarding footing?
> 
> Thanks!


 
The footing width is 2x the wall width and the footing height is equal to the wall width. Put either a keyway along the top of the footing (either set a piece of wood in the wet concrete after pouring or rake out when it slightly stiffens) or place rebar dowels so that the wall can be "locked" into the footing and avoid lateral movement from frost pressures.

Just Dowels: http://www.building-a-home-info.com/images/Concrete_strip_footings_with_reinforcement.jpg

Just Keyway: http://www.teamlorenz.com/images/Garage 24.JPG


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## AGWhitehouse (Jul 1, 2011)

1) Of the space where I intend on pouring the footer: I know with a concrete slab I compact soil, then some odd inches of rock, then pour the concrete. For a block wall should the footer be similar in terms of makeup, or should the poured concrete go straight to soil with no base of compacted rock in between (will the rock base add or hurt the longevity of footer+wall?)? Is the wall more stable with the poured concrete straight to frost area or some inches of compacted rock beneath good for drainage? Put the footing on virgin soil only. For your purposes, structural fill and compactiong is not requried.

2) I have a couple wheelbarrows of crushed/broken porcelain/ceramic tile in my garage, that I'd love to recycle as base. Can I throw this in as part of the compacted 3/4" rock base that I will lay beneath the poured concrete footer (assuming the answer above is yes add rock beneath concrete pour)? Use this a drainage fill behind the above grade wall. mix it in with the drainage stone when dumping.

3) Drainage. This wall is only 1-2' high from grade, on level surface. The rear will be 2' away at same height (essentially planting bed). I will back-fill with rock then top 1/3rd with planting soil (right?). What measures should be taken for proper drainage. Just drill some holes near bottom of the wall every few feet? Use perforated pvc pipe laid at slight downward grade behind wall and have it exit through drilled hole at other end? If this is a raised planting bed that will have a wall all the way around, I would lay a bed of stone within the hole planting area (6" deep). lay perforated pipe in and slope 1/8" per foot min. to discharge point. cover stone base with filter fabric and then backfill with soil. If it isn't a perimeter wall then apply the stone and pipe at the backside of the wall. make it about 12" deep and 12" wide and slope and discharge the pipe the same.


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## concretemasonry (Oct 10, 2006)

99Altrade -

You are just beginning to find the reasons why segmental retaining walls are most commonly used in the world, whether 2' or 40' high. Excavation depths, drainage, soil movement, frost heaves, weather, etc.

You could always fill your excess excavation with good compactable base material go SRW, which does not require a concrete footing (if the site is accessible). - It is good you did not want a curved landscape wall.

A rigid wall only 2' of high gets far too complicated since most everything is hidden and really not needed if there are other options.

Dick


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

Thanks for the replies guys!!! Ahhhh, I'm torn! To continue on with the already excavated for cmu+veneer or do as Dick suggests and backfill excavation to install SRW. I've calculated the total costs to be similar in the end (obviously lot more labor with cmu option).

My goal is to maximize return on investment with maximal curb appeal, and if that is definitely with the ledger panel veneer, I don't mind the extra work. I've calculated total cost going either direction to be about $1000 in materials. Labor: me, free.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

Per my last reply, notwithstanding other variables/factors (I'm trying to gauge what is better for resale at same cost to me) do you guys think a planter bed around an L-shaped front porch (22' long side, 10' short side) appears *higher-end* and adds more value with the SRW or Ledger Stone (quartzite) panels?

1) This is the panel I'd be using: http://www.pdtravertinepavers.com/natural_stone_ledgers_images/sierra blue.jpg

2) This is the SRW I'd be using: http://www.decorprecast.com/wallDetails.php?page=oldeManor

Thanks again guys for the input!


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## AGWhitehouse (Jul 1, 2011)

I personally prefer the SRW as it is a common product that isn't a mystery. I know before I even step over the curb what the system is, how it might fail, what it cost to replace, etc.

The Ledger stone can be done is a multitude of ways and not all are correct. You can't always tell the incorrect methods until it falls apart. Just had that problem on my office building. The contractor is a cheap skate and didn't prep the concrete wall at all. he just slapped the stone up. 2 years later a stone falls off, so he calls the repair man. The repair man finds out that the entire wall (10' high, 50' long) has delaminated and is holding together only by the exposed grout between the stone. With one shovel pry, and entire 20' section fell to the ground. Another pry, and another 20'. They spent more time talking about how ****ty the prep job was than they did taking it down. So what looked like a minor repair is actually going to be a complete redo.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

*OK Guys! PICS*

Here are some pics of where I'm at. I've decided to go ahead with CMU wall (I guess I like to make my life more difficult! - and wife likes the panels).

Here is where I'm at. Building L-shaped CMU wall, total height to be flush with porch. Porch and new CMU wall will be capped with bluestone tread. Short end of L wall will host 3 steps up to porch. I have no clue how to frame out the steps with the CMU's and if I should just throw the concrete down into entire digging (with forms at top, topping til 4" below grade to start wall), or form out narrower forms in various places.

Any suggestions, advice, ideas, etc., four letter words about my skill level, all welcome...... . Ground is all firm at this point, and tamped. Have not finished setting up rebar as you can see. I also intend on putting in some vertical rebar through footer to go through grouted CMU's, and perhaps bond-beam along top of wall under footer. Total wall is 1.5' or so over grade.

1st pic below (with firepit in middle) - the wall in this pic in appearance is exactly like what I'm trying to achieve (though in just L-shape) - and end posts in this is what I want to achieve in the 90 degree turn in L at corner which is why I dug out a bit extra in corner.

2nd pic below - i would like to put some lights similar to these on wall/steps/post. How to achieve this. Drill and wire after wall or setup wires (where/how) into mortar, or under bluestone caps before adhering to top?)

3rd pic below with steps - i would construct steps similar to this style, but top of steps will be flush up to porch. No idea how to deal with footer and block layout / setup for steps here?


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

*Pics*

Here are pics - read above post - this is what I WANT it to look like. See next post for where I'm up to...


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

*Pics...*

Now these are where I'm at...have at me guys! Up to setting up rebar. Ready for insults and advice!

No idea why there is a romex run down there (and why it's not protected with some sort of pipe). The only electrical item I have down after porch there are A/C units and those have electrical coming from elsewhere I think), and no landscape lighting down there. Also, should I just pull out that sprinkler head/flex pipe out of the whole pour and area (seen in long run of L), and deal with after wall is done?


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

*?*

Any input update based on my above pics?

Thanks guys!


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

Sorry, just too much to comment on all at one time. So, let's start at the beginning: Are you going to form one or both sides of the footing to save a little concrete? Or do you at least plan on using rebar for height stakes?


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

Thanks for replying!



jomama45 said:


> Sorry, just too much to comment on all at one time. So, let's start at the beginning: Are you going to form one or both sides of the footing to save a little concrete? Or do you at least plan on using rebar for height stakes?


1 - Not sure I'm clear on the question: I was planning to use 2x4 or 2x6 to form front and back of top of footing all along the L so I can screed/level and have a continuous even footing (with consistent block toe and heel) to lay the block. Should I bother with this or just pour and level?

2 - I was planning on using stakes attached to outer edges of my 2x's to hold forms level and at 4" at top below grade for 1/2 block below grade start.

Thanks again for input!


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

99altrade said:


> Thanks for replying!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The second point has me confused...........


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

I think you were just asking if that I did not use wood forms, if I were then going to use some sort of stakes to keep proper height of pour?

I was just saying that I was going to stake my forms to hold them to proper height, that's all. 


jomama45 said:


> The second point has me confused...........


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## AGWhitehouse (Jul 1, 2011)

Looks like you're off to a good start. I would look into fixing that random romex. Should be in conduit.

As for running power in the wall for lighting, run conduit in the wall as you build it and then you can pull wiring once the wall is complete and fixtures are ready for an install.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

AGWhitehouse said:


> Looks like you're off to a good start. I would look into fixing that random romex. Should be in conduit.
> 
> As for running power in the wall for lighting, run conduit in the wall as you build it and then you can pull wiring once the wall is complete and fixtures are ready for an install.


Thanks for replying again and staying with me! Need all the help I can get!

1 - I didn't know what to do with the romex so I was going to pull it back so it's accessible behind the pour (between the cmu wall and porch), so can work with it after the footing pour. 

2 - Can you detail a bit more about how to run conduit through the wall as I build? Where do I locate within wall? What sort of wire/conduit is best for this purpose? Should they already be setup as you lay block coming straight out of drilled exact spot for light similar to when putting up drywall outlet/switch/light? Not clear on this area. Thank you so much again!


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

jomama45 said:


> too much to comment on all at one time.


Anything else on your mind following the forms issue you brought up first? 

Thanks again!


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## AGWhitehouse (Jul 1, 2011)

99altrade said:


> Can you detail a bit more about how to run conduit through the wall as I build? Where do I locate within wall? What sort of wire/conduit is best for this purpose? Should they already be setup as you lay block coming straight out of drilled exact spot for light similar to when putting up drywall outlet/switch/light? Not clear on this area. Thank you so much again!


Yes, you need to layout the electrical conduit and boxes as you go. You don't need to run the conductors (wiring) at this point, but the conduit needs to be installed. You can route it at the center of the wall. Chip out the block as necessary to allow the conduit to route through. I'm not an electrician, but I think the grey plastic conduit (verify this though) is sufficient for this application.


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

99altrade said:


> I think you were just asking if that I did not use wood forms, if I were then going to use some sort of stakes to keep proper height of pour?
> 
> I was just saying that I was going to stake my forms to hold them to proper height, that's all.


OK, that makes more sense.

As for the lighting, we did something similar on a sitting wall and a bunch of deck posts last year. The HO's supplied the lights, and they were quite a bit smaller than the ones in your pic. Small enough to hide under the overhang of the cap. They were also low voltage, and the electricion just used some kind of Romex IIRC. He drilled a whole in the base of the wall and let the wires lay in the cavity. The lights were wired before we set the caps, and we just laid them in place in the mortar.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

I like this idea, as I think it would be nice to put a couple lights in right beneath the cap such that the light is visible but the lights are not (or barely). I think that would give a nice effect, and probably easiest to install as I can just wait until I lay the wall, then run wires from behind right over top just b/4 putting on the bluestone cap.

Thanks again. 

I had the roughest time last night working on, of all things, the wood forms, and so made little progress on the forms. I bought (what now seems like a mistake) a 20 pack of 1x2 wood stakes on the cheap, instead of the steel stakes, and trying to bang them down (in already tamped/tight ground) to proper level with the 2x4's attached with nails that were too thin was a disaster. Kept coming apart from the 2x4's, nails were bending out, the wood stakes were cracking. And the 2x4's were 8' length, trying to connect and level all along a 20' length... pain. Just seems like I'm approaching the forms install all wrong. 



jomama45 said:


> OK, that makes more sense.
> 
> As for the lighting, we did something similar on a sitting wall and a bunch of deck posts last year. The HO's supplied the lights, and they were quite a bit smaller than the ones in your pic. Small enough to hide under the overhang of the cap. They were also low voltage, and the electricion just used some kind of Romex IIRC. He drilled a whole in the base of the wall and let the wires lay in the cavity. The lights were wired before we set the caps, and we just laid them in place in the mortar.


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

99altrade said:


> and trying to bang them down (in already tamped/tight ground) to proper level with the 2x4's attached with nails that were too thin was a disaster. Kept coming apart from the 2x4's, nails were bending out, the wood stakes were cracking. And the 2x4's were 8' length, trying to connect and level all along a 20' length... pain. Just seems like I'm approaching the forms install all wrong.


Pounds the stakes in first, on the interior side of the footing (what seems like the wrong side) and nail through the stakes first, and into the 2x4's. Trying to pound stakes in with lumber attached is a PITA, especially with skimpy wood stakes. And remember, this is only extremely temporary forming it doesn't have to be pretty or tight, it just needs to give you a level platform to work off of, while saving a little concrete at the same time.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

Thanks for the reply!

Unless I'm reading you wrong, you're saying to pound in stakes first, and then (standing in center of footing) put the 2x4 OUTSIDE of the stake? Will than not interfere with a consistent straight footer (with stake cutouts every so often?), or does this not matter? Sorry if I'm not catching your point about interior, etc.

Also, I was going to pour the full footer all around and then create steps up a couple feet to concrete porch. It was suggested to me to instead form steps while forming footer and pour the steps at same time with footer, then just face it with my treads/riser veneer, instead of building the steps with blocks. Any input on which way to go on this? 

Thanks again!



jomama45 said:


> Pounds the stakes in first, on the interior side of the footing (what seems like the wrong side) and nail through the stakes first, and into the 2x4's. Trying to pound stakes in with lumber attached is a PITA, especially with skimpy wood stakes. And remember, this is only extremely temporary forming it doesn't have to be pretty or tight, it just needs to give you a level platform to work off of, while saving a little concrete at the same time.


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

99altrade said:


> Thanks for the reply!
> 
> Unless I'm reading you wrong, you're saying to pound in stakes first, and then (standing in center of footing) put the 2x4 OUTSIDE of the stake? Will than not interfere with a consistent straight footer (with stake cutouts every so often?), or does this not matter? Sorry if I'm not catching your point about interior, etc.
> 
> ...


I take it you're going to be pouring a patch between the existing stoop & the new wall with concrete after you build the wall? If yes, I'd form & pour the steps at that time. You can also build the steps with the block and veneer & cap them as well.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

Thanks again.

I have no existing stoop. Just a ditch prepped for footer, by the porch? See attached photos. One is my ditch, and the bottom 3 steps in the front of the other picture is what I'm trying to achieve (where the top of those steps is the porch - which will ultimately have pavers and bluestone caps). The wall I want to build will close around the steps like in that picture. I haven't created steps with block of concrete before so I'm not sure which way will be easier to go with.

Steps/wall will be built on footer which will be poured to slightly below grade.

p.s. more pics for perspective can be found on page 2 of this thread.

Thanks!



jomama45 said:


> I take it you're going to be pouring a patch between the existing stoop & the new wall with concrete after you build the wall? If yes, I'd form & pour the steps at that time. You can also build the steps with the block and veneer & cap them as well.


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

I'll admit, I'm really confused now. I think it may be best, for your own benefit, to make a sketch of this with some dimensions so you have a little more direction as you build this. You say you don't have a stoop, yet there appears to be a concrete stoop in all of your pictures, which you've excavated around. Regardless, if you're having troubles forming the simple trench footing, you're going to be in for some serious frustration when you get to forming the steps to receive concrete.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

The misunderstanding might have to do with how we're defining a stoop? Or...you mention it looks like I've excavated around a concrete stoop there on the short end of proposed wall. If you're referring to that exposed old concrete beneath the top few inches of porch - that's not an old stoop, but rather the old porch that I expanded and poured over with new concrete. Does that clear it up? In any case, I've decided to build the steps out of cmu's/blocks after I pour the footer all around. I am thinking it would be easier for me and provide a bit more flexibility as I lay the block wall. I'm figuring 6" blocks, and not standard 8" are the proper ones to use for building steps as risers would be too tall.



jomama45 said:


> I'll admit, I'm really confused now. I think it may be best, for your own benefit, to make a sketch of this with some dimensions so you have a little more direction as you build this. You say you don't have a stoop, yet there appears to be a concrete stoop in all of your pictures, which you've excavated around. Regardless, if you're having troubles forming the simple trench footing, you're going to be in for some serious frustration when you get to forming the steps to receive concrete.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

*Ok, footing forms completed (so I hope!)*

Ok, footing forms completed. Pics in next post.

Question: I can figure how to generally lay the rebar around the floor of the footing. However I've seen a lot in photos setting up some vertical rebar coming out of the footer going through the block, and I've also seen a 2x4 used across center of footer length as a key for mortar to lock into. Is this something you do one OR the other or somehow both key footer AND insert vertical exposed rebar. Wall will be about 2' high on footer. If vertical rebar through footer: Do they set this up with precise calculations as to where blocks will be laid so rebar will fit blocks and not hit solid block instead of cavity, or do they just drill and epoxy in later, or not tied into footer and just dropped into wall and grouted? Thanks!

Next steps: 

1) Setup and seat rebar/remesh (though I was going to have ready-mix add couple bags of fiber mesh to mix - still do remesh?). Once poured, allow to cure for a couple days.

2) Lay block.

3) Veneer wall.

Any opinions, insults , plow away....


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

*Pics.*

Pics. The form pushout at the turn in wall was to give bigger footer to lay pillaster/column-like corner on wall for better visual/architectual interest. I thought maybe I'd adhere 4" block flat against wall on both sides of corner as a pushout, make it several inches taller than rest of wall and give it an independent square cap, maybe with a light, etc.


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## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

You can set the rebar on broken brick, or just pull them up as you pour. 2-4" from the bottom. No need, or real benefit from either steel mesh or fibermesh. Save your money.

As for the vertical rod, yes you need to lay out ahead a little bit. This is going to be far easier to actually grab a block or two and take it in the trench with you to locate the rods. Trying to explain the process on the web won't be very efficient. If you have a decent hammer drill/rotary hammer, you can also lay one course through and then drill and pound the rods in. Don't bother with epoxy, you really have no concerns with uplift with a stoop like this.

Skip the keyway as well, as it works far better with a poured wall, and your dowels will be more than enough for this. As a matter of fact, 99% of block foundations for porches don't have any pilasters (grouted cells with rebar) here.

As for adding the additional 4" wythe for your column, you're on the right track. The the easiest way to do it. Just add a few galvanized wall ties between the two.

Good luck.


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

*Drainage*

Drainage

Based on the pics above (which show the area that will be behind the footing and wall:

1) Should I be doing anything in advance of the footing pour to create drainage through the wall? I wasn't sure if I was going to, and then yesterday it rained and the trench filled 1/3rd or so with water, which drained fully within about 12 hours (then day of hot weather to dry the dirt). Made me concerned generally about drainage for the space behind. Some sort of through or below footing french drains? Or something else, or weep holes through cmu's at grade after build, etc.?

Thanks again!


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

Bump on last question (see below, thanks).


99altrade said:


> Drainage
> 
> Based on the pics above (which show the area that will be behind the footing and wall:
> 
> ...


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## 99altrade (Nov 18, 2010)

Besides the drainage question above, if you have any knowledge about that, is it a good idea (and is there potential trouble with the strength of the footing running pipe through the footer like at 0:45 in this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGYJD11zaA8

Can use it to later run electrical or sprinkler flex tube through and behind wall.

Thanks.


jomama45 said:


> You can set the rebar on broken brick, or just pull them up as you pour. 2-4" from the bottom. No need, or real benefit from either steel mesh or fibermesh. Save your money.
> 
> As for the vertical rod, yes you need to lay out ahead a little bit. This is going to be far easier to actually grab a block or two and take it in the trench with you to locate the rods. Trying to explain the process on the web won't be very efficient. If you have a decent hammer drill/rotary hammer, you can also lay one course through and then drill and pound the rods in. Don't bother with epoxy, you really have no concerns with uplift with a stoop like this.
> 
> ...


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