# How to Fix Crooked Control Cuts on Driveway



## Peconga (Jul 26, 2019)

In August 2016, our new home builder poured a large concrete driveway for us that is about 4400 sf. The driveway looks terrible and I am trying to figure out the most cost-effective way to improve the appearance without having to totally tear it out and start over with a fresh expensive pour. To our dismay the control cuts installed by the builder meander and are generally crooked. Some cuts have double entry points or double cut with two separate cut lines. The width of the control cuts generally varies from 1/8th inch to 1/3rd inch. Edges on some of the wider cuts have now chipped and are jagged. Unfortunately, the builder also mechanically overworked the surface and the concrete surface started to scale away within 60-days of installation. Patches of concrete have scaled off in about 25 locations, but never any deeper than 1/16th inch. The surface finish on the driveway is nearly as smooth and slick as what is in our garage. The slick driveway is a guanine safety concern that I need to address ASAP. I have explored the notion of applying a resurfacer product like SureBroom or NewCrete, but I don’t know how to deal with the crooked control cuts given how terribly crooked the lines are. I have spent hundreds of hours researching and trying to find a way to address both the scaling and crooked control cuts, but I’m at my wits end and I can’t find a concrete professional in Central Kentucky willing to help me with these two problems. Any help is appreciated.


----------



## lug-nuts (Jun 17, 2019)

Widen all the joints so they are uniform, and if possible straighten while widening. If the joints are too crooked to straighten with a wider cut, then cut new joint's in a different spot. 

If you decide to cut new control joints, the new joints will need to be at least 3" deep, then "patch the old joints with a epoxy for concrete crack repair. Use the epoxy to "patch" over any ugly overcut's or joints you want to disappear. 

The new position "deep 3 inch" cut doesnt need to be super wide. You are just moving the control joint to a new spot. If you go this rout. 

Just make sure all the joints are clean, and dry before you epoxy or caulk. If not you will have issues later

I would use a concrete saw, and spray paint a line so you have a guide to follow while cutting. Plus it wont wash off.

After everything is dry and cleaned, place backer rod in the joints not more than 1/2" deep and caulk the joint. You can use a urethane or silicone here, they come in colors so choose what looks best.

once the caulk cures a day or so mask it off and apply the concrete overlay "broom finish" remove the tape before the overlay cures. follow the instructions for prepping.


----------



## lug-nuts (Jun 17, 2019)

You can cut the new joints with anything from a grinder, skilsaw, to walk behind concrete saw. I would use the concrete saw. You can rent the saw just about anywhere.

Always check the guide on the concrete saw to make sure it follow's the painted line. The guides or pointers are adjustable. Get it right before you even start the saw up. Also use water when cutting, makes it so much better. No dust, or wearing out the blade prematurely


----------



## lug-nuts (Jun 17, 2019)

You could even apply the overlay before the caulk goes in. Not sure what your caulking skill's are, but there are a ton of videos on utoob how to tool it. If your driveway isnt sloped too much you could even use self leveling caulk.


----------



## Msradell (Sep 1, 2011)

If it was that bad from the start why didn't you pursue having the contractor fix it?


----------



## 3onthetree (Dec 7, 2018)

Must have come back after a Friday lunch and done the cutting, he should have got a ticket for CUI - Cutting Under the Influence.

After 3 years, cutting new control joints will do no good. The top spalling is usually a sign of overworking and having too much cream. I usually don't see long-term success with resurfacing in freeze/thaw climates, but maybe others have. I also don't know if 3 years is too long to go after the builder, but maybe looking into it is better than spending $20K-25K.


----------



## Canarywood1 (May 5, 2012)

You should have gone to the builder while your 1 year warranty was in force , unfortunately it's on you now, and if i were you unless you have experience doing overlays , i wouldn't attempt doing a 4400 sq. ft. driveway.

There's a good reason you can't find a contractor to patch things together, if it were mine i would probably have it torn out and a new driveway put in, as a patch job would probably cost almost as much as a new driveway.


----------



## Peconga (Jul 26, 2019)

Thank you all for your comments, especially “lug nuts”. I will give your ideas considerable thought. 

Yes, as 3ontheTree observed, the cost to tear out and replace the driveway alone exceeds $30K. While another $30K in of itself would have been manageable for us, but we have many other defects that the homebuilder failed to address that push the repair costs to nearly $175,000. 

However, rest assure that the pursuit of a legal redress began in a timely fashion and we have engaged one of the top construction law attorneys in Kentucky. Unfortunately, just because a homeowner has been wronged by a scallywag doesn’t mean legal redress is an easy or cheap path for a homeowner to take, especially in one of the nearly 30 States that have a Notice and Opportunity to Repair Act and mandatory arbitration. First, we had to wait out the warranty period while using best efforts (a legal term of art) to establish a mutually agreeable timetable to fix issues covered under the warranty. For us, this was the one-year period the homebuilder simply ignored all communication (e.g., text, email, phone, certified letters) and tried to run out the clock. Second, we had to petition the local Homebuilders Association and request informal dispute resolution since the we used a registered builder (our builder was the President of the local Homebuilders Association). This was a 60-day period were the other tobacco chewing good ol’ boys colluded and decided spalling concrete with grossly crooked control cuts is well within acceptable construction practices in Central Kentucky. Third, we had to follow the Kentucky Notice and Opportunity to Repair Act and give the builder notice that we believed the concrete flatwork was defective and give the builder an opportunity to repair. Now, the logic of the Notice and Opportunity to Repair Act assumes the builder is honest, responsive, and will use professional due care to fix issues identified by the homeowner. The Act doesn’t envision that a builder will simply ignore a Notice sent by certified mail. On the other hand, the Act protects a builder from civil lawsuits and forces the homeowner into mandatory arbitration as the sole avenue of redress. The Act is built on the false promise that arbitration is cheap, easy, and quick. The opposite is the case for the homeowners in Kentucky were there are less that a dozen attorneys that practice in the area of construction law arbitration and they are too busy handling multi-million-dollar commercial litigation. It took us over a year to find a skilled attorney willing to take on a residential construction arbitration case (gulp, at $400 per hour). Preparing for arbitration is no different than preparing for a civil suit. The homeowner must find experts (not just any handyman that pours a couple labs of concrete per year) that are willing to be “your expert”. That is not easy to do since most concrete installers with enough expertise to be called “expert” are too busy to be bothered. However, once you find an expert, you must pay for the investigation report and the legal documentation (i.e., declarations; depositions) in addition to the attorney’s time too. The deck is stacked against the homeowner in Kentucky.


----------



## lug-nuts (Jun 17, 2019)

You can "move" the control joints, even years later. That is why I specified using crack repair epoxy on the old joint's. The mechanical bond from the epoxy to the concrete is stronger than the concrete. 

Also that's why I said to cut the new joint "deep" at 3 inches. The driveway is likely 3-1/2 to 4 inches thick. That cut would almost go completely through. Allowing the concrete move in a new location. I have done this before, and have been in the concrete restoration/masonry trade since 1996.

The concrete resurfacing can be achieved with a overlay that will last for years. I like Westcoat systems products. I live in a Utah we have freeze thaw here and westcoat works great in this climate. They have material specific for outdoor/driveway applications.

Another option would be to use a clear epoxy like a Sika (lo mod 22) bulk product. Apply with a flat squeegee and flood with a colored sand. 2 coat minimum, first coat fills the low spalled area's, second coat levels it out. Second coat same application, flat squeegee roll out heavy areas then flood with sand until everything looks dry.

The epoxy overlay will cost about a 2 dollar's a square foot to install yourself. Quite a bit more expensive than a cementitious overlay. The epoxy wears like steel, and you'll never have to do anything to it again. I have installed the epoxy with sand to refusal in parking garages, and it has lasted more than 10 years in that environment, so a driveway would last a last a lifetime.


----------



## lug-nuts (Jun 17, 2019)

There is some prep involved with any overlay you choose. Prep can be anything from acid etching, power washing with a rotating 0* head, grinding, or shot blasting. With the epoxy you can power wash it and let it dry. I did a driveway Oct. of 2012 that way and it still looks new.


----------



## lug-nuts (Jun 17, 2019)

google sika lo mod 22, and you can find the product guide with instructions.


----------



## 3onthetree (Dec 7, 2018)

lug-nuts said:


> have been in the concrete restoration/masonry trade since 1996.


Then you would know cracks would usually occur in the beginning of it's lifecycle. Any after would probably be structural, sign of other problems. 

From the OP description, if you just epoxy the old joints or resurface spalled areas, it will look like a network of veins or patches here and there. Too much spalling (around here) leads to replacement, but as I said, others elsewhere may have more success if you do an entire topcoat. Also, cutting through new deep joints, I assume wire mesh at the bottom, may allow some vertical movement at those joints.


----------



## 3onthetree (Dec 7, 2018)

Peconga, you've done well on your follow-thru, too bad you have to throw a lot of money to even get a say. Another thread here with the same finisher issues had the builder still in the subdivision. That put more pressure on him to fix it still trying to sell houses, even after a prolonged period of time.

Diregarding the spalling for a moment, since I don't see how you can ever hide the joints with epoxy or surfacers, maybe . . . . . thinking . . . . maybe . . . .
if the cuts are multiple lines and that out of whack, cut out a depth of paver brick along that line and install a ribbon of bricks. Usually when this is done from the get-go along the edge or a grid pattern in the slab, you would thicken the slab along that ribbon. If your slab is 5"+ it might work, but if it's hanging at 3 1/2"-4" that's probably too thin. Throwing it out there for more thought, but this idea or even cutting all the way through, pouring a thickened, doweled slab for bricks (or just a grid of new 8" wide concrete making an ad-hoc "California" finish) seems more work than replacing it all.


----------



## lug-nuts (Jun 17, 2019)

Its slab on grade, and these are control joints. The joints were cut crooked, concrete needs a place to expand to or it will make its own joint (a crack). A 100 foot slab on grade will expand about 2/3 of a inch in a 100 degree temperature change. So we are talking about 1/16" movement at the joint, the joints were probably cut 12 feet apart. The concrete doesn't care where the expansion is, as long as it has one. If you didn't cut new joints, the old one's would surely crack right next to the epoxied joint you filled.

As far as the network of cracks, it sounds like there isn't any. The original control joints weren't cut straight, and there is spalling on the slab. 

Peconga wants a remedy that address the crooked joints, and spalled concrete. If there were spider cracking the epoxy overlay would fill and seal and the sand broadcast into it would hide it all. Once the overlay is complete you caulk the new control joints to keep water and debris out. The water can freeze in winter and cause problems. 

There is also a product made specifically for spider cracks (healer sealer), again I've used it in parking garages with success.

To address the vertical movement, if there is vertical movement then you have a compaction issued with the grade below the concrete. You would see that by now. The driveway would be broken and have heaving in the concrete. Plus a 3" deep cut shouldn't cut through any mesh that would have been laid on the ground before they poured. Im fairly confident they didn't use chairs to get the mesh above grade. If they did, they wouldn't have overworked or sprayed water on it to finish it.

There are ways to make this driveway look new and nice once more without completely replacing it. Some products will last a few years, and other's a lot longer. Just depends on what your budget is. Me, I would cut new joints, address old joints, then epoxy overlay with sand to refusal, then top coat (same process) The next day sweep off excess, then blow down with leaf blower, and calk the new joints. Done.


----------



## lug-nuts (Jun 17, 2019)

Oh, in case there is confusion about the overlay you would cover the entire concrete driveway in the new overlay. Not just spalled areas.


----------



## Peconga (Jul 26, 2019)

Thanks folks for your assistance. The slab does appear to be solid one on rebar (don't know about mesh) and is at least 4 inches think along the edges. I gave the ribbon of paver concept some thought last year and check it out some more. So, thanks for jogging my memory. Money is both a short and long term consideration, especially since we have must put $30k into the house this past month to get closer to level 5 drywall we paid for. My 64 year old wife fell on the slick wet driveway surface three weeks ago and now is in PT rehab, but may still need knee surgery. I'll add that PI issue to the defective construction claim against the builder, in the meantime I need come up with a quick fix to address the slick hazard. More later.


----------



## stadry (Jun 20, 2009)

*before i'd cut new control joints, i'd want to be sure the old joints hadn't yet cracked full depth as they're designed to perform,,, an alternative is sawing full-depth 2 parallel cuts, removing that portion of concrete, & installing new decorative concrete or brickwork,,, that's the path we chose when repairing another contractor's f/u*


----------

