# Help! Stain EVERYWHERE and turpentine on asphalt!



## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

our strata needs help.
we had contractors come in to stain all our new fences. horrible sloppy work the stain is on our vinyl siding, patios, asphalt, paving stones etc.
all their efforts so far to clean up the mess have resulted in more damage.
1. suggestions on how to remove from siding and paving stones
2. they poured turpentine on ashpalt. asphalt + turpentine = melted asphalt + black mess.

we have tried
laundry detergent
Pinesol
varsol
magic eraser
wire brushes
power washer

prayer.


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## ddawg16 (Aug 15, 2011)

First off....welcome to DIY

Second....why are you trying to clean it up?

Get the contractor back out there to clean it up. Take plenty of pics first. If he doesn't, small claims court.


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

every time the.contractor.comes.back They make it.worse

I think we have to file an insurance claim


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

Agreed should not be your problem.
You checked to see if he had insurance before having him do the job, right?
Stains not going to come off, main reason it's called stain.
Sure hope you have not paid them.


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## Jmayspaint (May 4, 2013)

Yeah, if its oil stain (assume it is from the turpentine use) your pretty much screwed. Lacquer thinner Might take it off the vinyl, but it would also dull it. Nothing much to be done about the melted asphalt now. 

Geeze what a mess. Let me guess, they applied the stain with a pump up sprayer?


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

Siding will need to be replaced.
Driveway degreased and resealed.


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## ToolSeeker (Sep 19, 2012)

Should not be your insurance, should be his.


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## Canarywood1 (May 5, 2012)

And i'll bet the "contractor" doesn't have insurance.


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

The contractor does have some form of insurance up to$5million. It is in the contract we signed.

I cannot get it off my stone paving stones. 

They came back this morning and also have it all over the rear entrance to our complex on the asphalt. So incredibly sloppy. Unbelievable how awful. 

My neighbour said maybe the stain on the roadways will eventually wear off?

Anyone know?

p.s. it is, of course, red stain... red being the worst colour to get rid of


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

I have also managed to kind of get it off the vinyl siding with some Norwex cleaning paste but there it is.... pinkish/red patches.

So angry. And they are demanding our strata pay the rest of the bill.

I dont think so.


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

Also - I'm assuming the asphalt melted with the turpentine is probably a permanent problem now.

See attached picture of how they poured turpentine on our asphalt - this is after we tried scrubbing it with wire brushes and laundry detergent and fantastic and various other cleaners. It actually isn't jet black like it was originally but its pretty obviously "melted" by the turpentine.


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

Some other photos of stain damage from the contractors - and this is only a small part of the stain spilled throughout our complex... any suggestions for clean up greatly appreciated.

what we are probably going to do is having to hire some form of professional to remove or repair the damage. Maybe graffitti removal people? For the asphalt I don't think there is anything much we can do other than cut it out and re-pave which we don't want to have to do.


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

joecaption said:


> Siding will need to be replaced.
> Driveway degreased and resealed.


Not sure it was ever sealed.... maybe when the complex was built back in 1992!!!


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

They have in the contract that they have up to $5million of some type of insurance. What it actually is and how we go about stopping them from causing more damage via "cleanup" I don't know.


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## taylorjm (Apr 11, 2013)

If they are trying so hard I would guess they don't have insurance. In michigan when we bid on a job our insurance company mails them a copy so that they know it's valid and up to date. Otherwise it's easy to show someone your policy but they don't know if it's paid up and valid.


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

Never thought about actually asking for proof of insurance, I will get our strata manager to see if it is.actually valid.
they have such good reviews online, except one review 2 years ago that echoes ours a little.

my slate paving stones are wrecked. I'm so upset about them.


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## Jmayspaint (May 4, 2013)

helpinpitt said:


> Never thought about actually asking for proof of insurance, I will get our strata manager to see if it is.actually valid.
> they have such good reviews online, except one review 2 years ago that echoes ours a little.
> 
> my slate paving stones are wrecked. I'm so upset about them.


 I've diminished stuff like that with lacquer thinner and a wire brush. As bad as that is, it would take a lot of thinner and scrubbing. Maybe not worth the effort.


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

just tried lacquer thinner and used the wire brush again

no effect.


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## taylorjm (Apr 11, 2013)

This is exactly what the contractors' liability insurance is for. I had one claim in my career when I was installing a new kitchen cabinet and there was a staple left on the bottom of the cabinet, and when I moved it into place, I gouged the wood floors. The insurance paid to completely refinish all the wood floors in the house so they would match. It was a very easy process, took some pictures, send them to the agent, got a couple estimates, they sent a check. I'm sure it depends on your insurance company.


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

how did you go through contractors insurance? like did you have to get the contractor to go through or contact their insurance directly?


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## taylorjm (Apr 11, 2013)

I was the contractor, so it was my insurance, so I called my agent and they told me what to do.


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

oh I see. now your post makes sense.

so we would have to get them to stop trying to "clean" up and let us have their insurance Do it.


the other problem is we paid and signed for 2 coats. they only did 1 coat and it is so obvious but they are lying to us insisting it was two coats.

will their insurance.cover things if we haven't paid the full bill? we are withholding because of the damage and also because they only did one coat.


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## taylorjm (Apr 11, 2013)

Their insurance covers any damage they do to a clients property, it doesn't cover their workmanship though. So, if they did a crappy job on the fence, that's their responsibility to fix. If they damaged property, just like your situation, during the coarse of their work, that will be covered. I'm surprised at the 5 million figure though, which is why I questioned if they had insurance. 1 million liability is the most common and reasonable around here. Of course, if you were building a skyscraper, then you would have a larger policy, but 1 million will pay for a lot of damages for a normal contractor. To my knowledge, the insurance doesn't care if they got fully paid or not. You have an agreement, and they were obviously on site performing work, and they were paid for for some of the work, so there's no question they did the damages. I really hope for your sake they have current insurance. Keep taking lots of pictures and document what has been done on what day, and the result. It's going to get to a point where they have to give in and say it can't be cleaned and will have to be replaced, but as to when that happens, I don't know. Keep a log showing when they came, what they tried, and that should show that they acknowledge to making the mess, since they were trying to clean it up, and should be proof enough for any insurance company or lawsuit.


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## Gymschu (Dec 12, 2010)

That's one contractor who will soon be out of business. Wow, what a freaking mess. I guess the sale on drop cloths ended last week.


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## helpinpitt (Aug 8, 2014)

They have excellent reviews online. been around for a long time. great reputation.

I'm guessing 5 million since we have a.strata complex of duplexes. if it was a.single house.maybe 1 million but in Vancouver it can be tough to find a decent house for less than a million


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## Jmayspaint (May 4, 2013)

Probably a new employee who just didn't know how to handle stain. Its not like handling paint. As is evident from this thread, it's easy for an inexperienced or careless person to make a real mess with oil stain. A few drops on siding or masonry can be cleaned up, but only if its done immediately with the correct solvents. Once it's dry, its not coming off. 

Another concern for the OP might be the time frame on re coating the fence. Many semi-trans oil stains must have the second coat applied within a certain time frame. Some stain systems have to have the second coat applied on the same day as the first, others can be second coated within a period of a few days or weeks. 
Check the specifications for the specific stain your using.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

I would imagine insurance only covers damage from accidents not incompetent workmanship which is what you have. Small claims court but the judge will give them the opportunity to fix it first. Have to wait until they give up trying and then threaten to sue them. At that point i would want whatever is damaged replaced with new material.


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## Gymschu (Dec 12, 2010)

Is there a way you could flip the paving stones over, clean the dirt off, and have them looking like they're supposed to look? Just a thought.


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## r0ckstarr (Jan 8, 2013)

helpinpitt said:


> They have excellent reviews online.


Did you find them on Angies List?


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## mnp13 (Jan 16, 2007)

*Stop.* 

We are currently in the middle of the _SAME_ issue - contractor screwed up and did _thousands_ of dollars to our home. 

If you keep trying different stuff, they may start blaming _you_ for additional damage.

Call YOUR insurance company and make a claim. They will come in and assess the damage. Then they will take care of paying for the repairs, minus your deductible. Then they will go after the contractor's insurance company and you will get the deductible back. Don't go through their insurance, their insurance will not be on "your side." They have not called their insurance yet, so I'd guess they don't plan to. Just skip a step and further headache.


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## cdaniels (Dec 27, 2012)

Hard to believe anyone would be that sloppy. Good luck to you!!


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## taylorjm (Apr 11, 2013)

Your insurance isn't going to pay for damage done by a contractor you hired to come on site. That's exactly what the contractors insurance is for. As far as them paying for all your damages then going back to the contractors insurance company for reimbursement, not gonna happen. Why would your insurance company do that? Why would they put their butt on the line for everything and just give you money to repair it, on the chance they can get reimbursed? They will simply tell you to go after the contractors insurance or sue them. Your insurance isn't liable, nor will they pay for anything. If your insurance covered it, then why would contractors even get insurance?


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## mnp13 (Jan 16, 2007)

taylorjm said:


> Your insurance isn't going to pay for damage done by a contractor you hired to come on site. That's exactly what the contractors insurance is for. As far as them paying for all your damages then going back to the contractors insurance company for reimbursement, not gonna happen. Why would your insurance company do that? Why would they put their butt on the line for everything and just give you money to repair it, on the chance they can get reimbursed? They will simply tell you to go after the contractors insurance or sue them. Your insurance isn't liable, nor will they pay for anything. If your insurance covered it, then why would contractors even get insurance?


You are incorrect - _or at least incorrect in my state_ (New York.) As I said in my post, we are in the middle of the exact same thing - roofing contractors caused many thousands of dollars of damage to our house. OUR insurance (State Farm) is covering the claim. Then our insurance company will sue their insurance company for the full amount of the damages. 

As of right now, we have had an adjuster in the house (sent by State Farm), Service Master in to asses the clean up (sent by State Farm), an asbestos company in for testing (sent by State Farm), next week the asbestos abatement team comes in to clean out the attic (sent by, you guessed it, State Farm.) After the abatement, then we have dry out, mold testing, repair estimates, and contractors in to do the work... again, all paid through _my_ insurance company. 

This is why I pay for insurance, so that I don't have to deal with stuff like this. State Farm will take care of getting the money from the contractor's insurance company and, if necessary, suing the contractor directly if their insurance isn't adequate.

I suppose I could have contacted the roofer's company directly and gone through them. But what reason do they have to be fair to me? I'm not their customer, they have never received a dime from me. It is in their best interest to lowball everything and make our lives miserable while they contest everything. However, my insurance company has been taking my money for 12 years (this house and my last house) and they have a pack of lawyers who will be sure that they get every penny spent. They lose nothing by making sure that the repairs are done correctly because in the long run, if the other insurance company does a half assed job and there are other issues, that causes a string of other problems.


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## taylorjm (Apr 11, 2013)

Actually, your situation is totally different. Your roofing company did a shoddy or incorrect job, and I'm guessing that water came in the house and caused the damage. That's covered under your insurance. Just like if there's a wind storm that blew shingles off and allowed water into the house. I can understand now why they would cover you, then go back to the roofing contractor. Now if the roofer would have fell through the roof, through your ceiling, damaging your new hardwood floors and your priceless chandelier, then that's the roofer's insurance and not yours. The contractor's insurance is for when they directly cause damage. In your situation, the roofer didn't really "cause" the damage, the water caused the damage.

In your instance, the contractors insurance probably won't cover the claim either, because the cause of all the damage is because of shoddy workmanship. To my knowledge, insurance won't cover someone that does a bad job. There are certain types like error's and omissions insurance that may cover certain mistakes, but I doubt bad workmanship is one of them. Your insurance company will probably take a loss since they would have to sue the roofer for the money.


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## mnp13 (Jan 16, 2007)

My roofer did a full tear off, then covered the boards with tarps... that had holes in them. The next morning, there was a very heavy thunderstorm. The roofer's negligence directly caused the damage to the home. 

I agree that a bad job wouldn't be covered - bad paint, poor prep work, etc. However, actual, physical damage is a different story. There is physical damage to the siding and the driveway. The damage to the tile is cosmetic.

I'm not sure why my insurance would take the loss, unless they want to take the loss _and_ pay me the deductible as well. After over a week of going back and forth with the roofer, I called my insurance company and said "let me give you a scenario and you tell me what the next step is." Then at the two week mark, I called them back and said that I was ready to file a claim.

I guess the only person who can answer this is the original poster, after he calls his insurance company and asks. :thumbsup:


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## taylorjm (Apr 11, 2013)

I understand what you are saying, I'm just telling you what an insurance company would say. You said the roofers negligence directly caused the damage. Which is true. But the roofer himself didn't cause the damage. There was a step between what the roofer did, and the damage, which was the rain. Which is an act of god and covered by your insurance. In the op, the contractor himself spilled stain all over, which makes his insurance responsible. I doubt the op's insurance will cover that. Now, if the contractor was carrying the bucket of stain, tripped on a broken sidewalk and spilled stain all over, then I think the op insurance would cover it because the broken sidewalk caused the spill.

I'm not trying to be a dink or anything, or tell you I'm right and your wrong, I'm just having a conversation, not trying to cause trouble so please don't take it the wrong way.


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## mnp13 (Jan 16, 2007)

I didn't take it that way at all!  We have different opinions with different reasons for those opinions. I don't take stuff like that personal. (but I do appreciate you saying so)

I was actually just thinking about it and was coming on here to say that I see your point in the different shades of detail between the two issues and how they were caused. I still don't agree, but I _do_ see your point. lol

So, let's agree to disagree and let the original poster find out who is right. :laughing:


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## ben's plumbing (Oct 6, 2011)

DEMAND ..they file a claim against their own insurance for the damage done to your property.... guess what ,,,some insurance carriers will not cover claims if it was done from neglect by the company...he the owner will have to eat it...


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