# Can I "Layover" a T-Lock roof??



## Fairwind (Sep 20, 2011)

We have a ranch house with a "T-Lock" shingle roof that was badly damaged by hail..I know stripping the roof is the best method, but today, where I live, disposing of the existing roof is difficult and expensive. Also, since this is a DIY project, stripping a roof is labor intensive..

I would like to overlay this otherwise sound roof with Tamco heritage laminated shingles..(or whatever) price being an important consideration as there is no insurance involved with this...My main concern is that the resulting roof be sound and last a reasonable length of time. Someone else will worry about the NEXT roof....

Someone recommended I first put down a layer of 15# felt to help "smooth out" the surface and "insulate" the new shingles...(?) Someone else said save your money and don't bother....A third "expert" said "I don't think you can overlay a T-Lock roof.. Has anyone done this? How did it turn out?


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## Windows on Wash (Aug 30, 2011)

Whether or not it can be done and be unwarrantable is a question for Tamco.

In terms of the underlayment question, underlayment is cheap insurance and I would always put down a slip layer if doing a second layer.


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## Slyfox (Jun 13, 2008)

If you go too the shingle manufacturers website you'll find instruction "Spec's" on how to do a lay-over.
The spec's will not include covering t-locs specifically but you'll get the general idea of what you need to do.

It's not common place to lay-over t-locs because you can't nest the new shingles because of the different design, but it still works.

The new felt is not needed, it won't hurt anything, it just won't help either tho.


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## MJW (Feb 7, 2006)

Don't you have insurance? Won't they pay to have it done the right way?

Or are you trying to "save" some money?


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## Fairwind (Sep 20, 2011)

MJW said:


> Don't you have insurance? Won't they pay to have it done the right way?
> 
> Or are you trying to "save" some money?


You are correct on both counts...I view "insurance" as just a lay-a-way plan for storm damage. The last policy I had had a $2000 deductible for storm damage which leads to all sorts of fraud as the roofers work the angles to "cover the deductible" for grateful homeowners by cutting every corner possible. 

Today, in Denver, if you shop around, you can find unwrapped shingles on pallets sold as "seconds" which are actually surplus overstock being liquidated by large home-builders and their suppliers who haven't built a new house here in over 3 years... $50 to $75 a square for say Tamko Heritage 30 laminate shingles...You pick them up, you hump them up to the roof, no warranty at all...

So the bottom line is I can do a re-roof overlay myself for around $2000, or I can have a pro "do it right" for $6700, a difference of $4700....The $2000 DIY cost represents less than 2 years homeowners insurance premiums..I'm retired, I've done 4 roofs in my life, 3 of them still in service with no problems....It's like I'm paying myself $4700 for a weeks hard labor..

With the heavily textured look of the dimensional Heritage shingles, I'm not too worried about the old roof pattern transferring through..!5 years from now, the new owner of this house will probably cuss me but that's all part of the joy of home ownership....

I'll check the Tamko and GAF websites and see what they say about re-roofing..I was just wondering if the T-Locks presented any unique problems..


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## MJW (Feb 7, 2006)

Have at it. Good luck. Sounds like you have the answers and knowledge to get er done.


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## Fairwind (Sep 20, 2011)

MJW said:


> Have at it. Good luck. Sounds like you have the answers and knowledge to get er done.


Thanks MJW.. I contacted a Tamko tech rep and he gave me the same answer, "Go for it!" Should be no problem..:thumbup:


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## MJW (Feb 7, 2006)

My guess, being you have T-locks now, is that you have quite a bit of depreciation taken out of your claim. This is money that you will not receive unless you hire a Contractor to do it correctly.

The insurance may also void your roof of any claim in the future. Depending on your location, you may have to disclose this in your purchase agreement if you sell. Just a FYI, and check it out for yourself to get the facts for your area and insurer.

The Tamko rep probably got the same vibe I did while reading your posts. You are going to do it anyway, so why argue....Make the sale.


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## Fairwind (Sep 20, 2011)

There is no insurance involved...In their printed application instructions, Tamko gives re-roofing instructions without any negative disclaimers...As Slyfox correctly pointed out, the new laminate shingles will not "nest" into the old T-Locks but they should lay down okay...


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## Slyfox (Jun 13, 2008)

MJW said:


> My guess, being you have T-locks now, is that you have quite a bit of depreciation taken out of your claim. This is money that you will not receive unless you hire a Contractor to do it correctly.
> 
> The insurance may also void your roof of any claim in the future. Depending on your location, you may have to disclose this in your purchase agreement if you sell. Just a FYI, and check it out for yourself to get the facts for your area and insurer.
> 
> The Tamko rep probably got the same vibe I did while reading your posts. You are going to do it anyway, so why argue....Make the sale.



Hope I'm not going to far off topic hear, not trying too.
I know Fairwind said there's no insurance claim here but still wanted to comment on MJW's post.
I have no idea how many States do or do not allow it but in my area it is legal for a home owner to act as their own contractor and still receive the insurance monies.
This includes them hiring others to do the work or doing it themselves.


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## MJW (Feb 7, 2006)

Slyfox said:


> Hope I'm not going to far off topic hear, not trying too.
> I know Fairwind said there's no insurance claim here but still wanted to comment on MJW's post.
> I have no idea how many States do or do not allow it but in my area it is legal for a home owner to act as their own contractor and still receive the insurance monies.
> This includes them hiring others to do the work or doing it themselves.


It's the same here, but you have to do it correctly to get all the money and to keep your insurance coverage.

Not sure why a Roofer would work as a sub contractor under a homeowner though. Most people have no idea if they were compensated correctly for the job from the insurance. How would they get accurate bids?


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## Fairwind (Sep 20, 2011)

This property is uninsured...Regardless how I replace it, it's on me, cash and carry...A simple, gable roof ranch house, 4-12 pitch, 25 squares..I'm 69 years old, this WILL be the last time I do a roof!!


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## kt82 (Jan 28, 2009)

we used remove the raised portion of the T -lock back in the 70's when layover's were accepted.
Why don't you use metal on 1x4 lathe?


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## Gymschu (Dec 12, 2010)

Fairwind said:


> This property is uninsured...Regardless how I replace it, it's on me, cash and carry...A simple, gable roof ranch house, 4-12 pitch, 25 squares..I'm 69 years old, this WILL be the last time I do a roof!!


I gotta admire you Fairwind...........just reroofed my house and I am 50.....I kept saying "what did I get myself into?" Best of luck, take your time, and be careful up there.


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## Slyfox (Jun 13, 2008)

MJW said:


> It's the same here, but you have to do it correctly to get all the money and to keep your insurance coverage.
> 
> Not sure why a Roofer would work as a sub contractor under a homeowner though. Most people have no idea if they were compensated correctly for the job from the insurance. How would they get accurate bids?


I have done it a few times just to get out of tearing off.
They supply materials, tear off existing and take care of clean up & waste removal, while I handle any wood work and install the new roof system.

I had a couple who wanted to take care of the wood work & underlayment as well but I wouldn't do that because mistakes in either of those areas could cause problems with my shingles.

They legally save a few bucks that can be spent elsewhere and I still make my money because all my mark up is attached to labor rather then to materials or waste removal, etc, like many other contractors I know do.

As far as them getting all they have coming, when the home owner is going to act as the general they need to get three estimates from contractors and the adjuster determines the pay out off of those.
It's legal unless you get caught asking contractors to boost their bids/estimates, had one home owner get turned in by a pee'd off contractor (pee'd off because he didn't get the job), not sure what happened tho because I ended up not getting the job either.


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## Fairwind (Sep 20, 2011)

I went over to the supplier this morning to finalize the deal and I mentioned I would have preferred IR (Impact Resistant) but they just cost (with Tamko or GAF) too much..The counterman played with his computer and said "we have some CertainTeed Landmark Lifetime IR for $XXx /square...Since the main reason I'm replacing the roof is hail damage, I felt the extra cost was reasonable, about 20% more..They will deliver the shingles tomorrow to the ridge of my roof and THEY will stack them up! That alone was worth the extra money! I'll see if I can figure out how to post a before and after picture!


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## MJW (Feb 7, 2006)

Slyfox said:


> I have done it a few times just to get out of tearing off.
> They supply materials, tear off existing and take care of clean up & waste removal, while I handle any wood work and install the new roof system.
> 
> I had a couple who wanted to take care of the wood work & underlayment as well but I wouldn't do that because mistakes in either of those areas could cause problems with my shingles.
> ...



Never seen that, but it would make sense. Around here the cheapo's get the first check and try to get the repairs done at Xactimate prices minus their deductible and depreciation. Usually these are done by fly by nights or weekend warriors. This just saves the multi billion dollar insurance company even more money on the claim being they don't pay depreciation. Also usually ends up that the homeowner gets a sub-par job.....in the end, roofers in general get a bad rap.


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## Slyfox (Jun 13, 2008)

MJW said:


> Never seen that, but it would make sense. Around here the cheapo's get the first check and try to get the repairs done at Xactimate prices minus their deductible and depreciation. Usually these are done by fly by nights or weekend warriors. This just saves the multi billion dollar insurance company even more money on the claim being they don't pay depreciation. Also usually ends up that the homeowner gets a sub-par job.....in the end, roofers in general get a bad rap.



We have the crappy subs in my area also and I do sometimes think they out number the legit.

Last year I did a repair for a 92 year old widow a couple towns north east of me, ends up a Siding, Windows and Insulation company "large operation" decided to take on some roofing during the slow period of work and hired a sub to handle it.
After it leaked the well known large company sent a repair tech out (not a roofing repair tech) who ended up smearing some roof cement around here and there at the bottom of a valley, with no luck on stopping the leak.
After several calls and hearing them say, we will be there asap, she called a different roofer (self employed) who came out and smeared some more roof cement over the existing roof cement but still did not stop the leak.
So she called the reputable company again and when she mentioned she had some one else look at it also because she was worried about her ceiling caving in, they told her the warranty was void and she's on her own.

She found me through a friend of a friend, turns out the valley shingles were never leaking, the chimney 2 feet away was...

You gotta watch your back no matter if it's a sub, contractor or a business you hire.


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## Slyfox (Jun 13, 2008)

Fairwind said:


> I went over to the supplier this morning to finalize the deal and I mentioned I would have preferred IR (Impact Resistant) but they just cost (with Tamko or GAF) too much..The counterman played with his computer and said "we have some CertainTeed Landmark Lifetime IR for $XXx /square...Since the main reason I'm replacing the roof is hail damage, I felt the extra cost was reasonable, about 20% more..They will deliver the shingles tomorrow to the ridge of my roof and THEY will stack them up! That alone was worth the extra money! I'll see if I can figure out how to post a before and after picture!


Good luck and be safe.


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## Fairwind (Sep 20, 2011)

Thanks guys...! Picture of old roof, 30 year old T-Locks, badly hail damaged..


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## Fairwind (Sep 20, 2011)

Picture of finished roof..


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