# Air conditioning slow leak...



## ashton (May 24, 2009)

Hey Guys,
I am the one who posted a few times regarding our HVAC being serviced and almost being taken to the cleaners for the parts they wanted to replace. Thanks to everyones help here it saved me a ton of money. 

Well, there is one additional item when the service manager came out to re-check the techs work he was using an air sensor unscrewed one side of the panel stuck in the the sensor and it detected a very small lead in both of my unit coils. I was standing with him on both of our units when he stuck it in the panel with coils. I have had to add freon, about a 1lb or so, every year to both units. He suggested using a stop leak addative but said they charge over $1,000. IS THIS TRUE? IS there any way I can get this whole sale and put it in myself?


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## kenmac (Feb 26, 2009)

The leak seal I've seen doesn't cost $1000.00... As far as does it work ??? I haven't used it . I've talked to many that have.. Some say it works on small leaks & have had good results.. Some say they have had bad results . Ie.. stopping up the metering device... Did the ones that had bad results not follow the install instructions for the leak seal ?? Who knows.... This is the product I've seen at the supply houses







Just google ac leak seal mabe you can check the install instructions to see if you need any special tools to install yourself


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## ashton (May 24, 2009)

I know I have learned my lesson with these guys...but he didn't even take the whole panel off to look at the coils or fittings. Is 1.lb a year a bad leak? I haven't heard anything good about stop leaks...he suggested it since its a small leak..he said he had remove all the coolant, than add the stop leak, and then recharge them...for both units he said just over $1000...I just feel like I am getting taken ....again...


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## dac122 (Sep 5, 2008)

I'm not sure what you mean by an air sensor, but if this was an electronic leak detector you would need to be very close (within a few inches depending) to the leak in order to detect a leak as small as 1 pound per year. I've not used an ultrasonic leak detector yet but it may be able to give you a rough reading like that.

I would get a second opinion on where or whether there is a leak.


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## PoodleHeadMikey (Jun 1, 2009)

*Do not let them use the stop leak!*

The stop-leak is unlikely to work in your application and risky to try.

The refrigerant stop-leak products work by setting up in the presence of moisture. Unless you have a low pressure control which has prevented your compressor from ever running in a vacuum, there is a chance that you have moisture in your system.

The system cannot be dehydrated with a vacuum pump - because you have the leak.

Technically the system could be made dry by repeatedly installing and changing filter-driers and then having the refrigerant analyzed to verify it, but this would be a stupid way to spend money on a residential system.

More likely than not the product will harden in your system and clog things up. This will be bad and require extensive repair or replacement.

There is no leak that can't be found. But for a pound per year - how much are you willing to spend?

And since we are being cynical - are you sure that they are actually adding the refrigerant? <g>

BTW: the grand they want is at least five times too much.

PHM
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ashton said:


> Hey Guys,
> I am the one who posted a few times regarding our HVAC being serviced and almost being taken to the cleaners for the parts they wanted to replace. Thanks to everyones help here it saved me a ton of money.
> 
> Well, there is one additional item when the service manager came out to re-check the techs work he was using an air sensor unscrewed one side of the panel stuck in the the sensor and it detected a very small lead in both of my unit coils. I was standing with him on both of our units when he stuck it in the panel with coils. I have had to add freon, about a 1lb or so, every year to both units. He suggested using a stop leak addative but said they charge over $1,000. IS THIS TRUE? IS there any way I can get this whole sale and put it in myself?


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## beenthere (Oct 11, 2008)

Get another company.

You can top off a pound of gas a year for a few years before you spend that kind of money on a product that could harm your system. And cause you to have to replace it anyway.


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## dac122 (Sep 5, 2008)

It didn't really come out in my reply, but what I was trying to say is if he was using an electronic leak detector then he found the leak as you have to be very close to that leak. But since it sounds like he was just waving the detector around and declared a leak he was either using an ultrasonic detector or getting a false readings on the detector (just blowing on an electronic leak detector can set if off). 

So what you are reporting sounds a bit questionable and worthy of a second opinion.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

An electronic leak detector can be set off by moisture, grease etc. I always verify the leak with a special leak detector soap. I abhor the thought of adding ANY kind of leak stopper solution just like the idea of using it in a car radiator. It can plug up a capillary line or do other serious damage. If it is not illegal to keep topping it up then do so. We cannot do that (legally) in Canada.


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## HvacWiz (Nov 24, 2006)

*We have been using hvac super seal for 3 years now, never had any problems whatsoever with metering devices plugging up or systems failing. And in most cases it works 90-95% of the time i would say based on my experience. And it sure beats the hell out of crawling around under someones house or in there attic looking for that special little pinhole leak somewhere.*



*www.cliplight.com*


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## biggles (Jan 1, 2008)

your being set up again what was that guy Zorro:whistling2: he was using a electronic freon leak detector and that he just did the routine you descrided.there is a sensitivity adjustment on all of them and as he reached in he can set the gain up and it would pick a fly farting:laughing:.like suggested get another company in if you need freon..he was stinging from his brain surgeons running there game on you and probably got it from his boss.keep a record of freon being added and take some temp readings as the summer moves on...you want 10F rise out at the condenser,and 18F thru the air handler.if the charge starts to leak out it will take longer for the unit to cool your will see it on your bill.so do the temp readings and log it along with the last time freon was added.you saying you have to add a pound every year? have somebody come in and doa SH/SC temperature check out on the unit to get the maximum charge in there so you get the true tonnage and keep those bills down.


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## ashton (May 24, 2009)

I will keep a log and see what it looks like...

You guys are the best!


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## jstjohnz (Jun 1, 2009)

ashton said:


> Hey Guys,
> I am the one who posted a few times regarding our HVAC being serviced and almost being taken to the cleaners for the parts they wanted to replace. Thanks to everyones help here it saved me a ton of money.
> 
> Well, there is one additional item when the service manager came out to re-check the techs work he was using an air sensor unscrewed one side of the panel stuck in the the sensor and it detected a very small lead in both of my unit coils. I was standing with him on both of our units when he stuck it in the panel with coils. I have had to add freon, about a 1lb or so, every year to both units. He suggested using a stop leak addative but said they charge over $1,000. IS THIS TRUE? IS there any way I can get this whole sale and put it in myself?


Seriously, stop using this company, they sound like a bunch of crooks.


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## ashton (May 24, 2009)

I absolutely agree....that is what I get for going with one of those "big fancy truck, tv commercial" companies....

live and learn...


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## COLDIRON (Mar 15, 2009)

*Big companys*

The big company's have a lot of overhead and a axe to grind.

Cost a lot of money to keep trucks on the road, etc, etc etc.

Do not let that company back on your property and don't put sealers of any kind in your system let them find the leak an repair the right way.

If the leak is as small as a 1/2 or 1 ounce a year maybe you want to overlook it for a year. It's up to you however I must make one statement.

" Pay me now or pay me later but it will cost you more later"


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## biggles (Jan 1, 2008)

get yourself a spray bottle with dish liquid and water in it during a hot day running the AC spray around the wrenched fittings going into the condenser,and if you touch any soldered fitting keep an eye out for oil residue at the fittings(cooling off or on position with that one).if you feel any oil on the black insulation that could be a pinhole leak.this is all free to yourself that a company in question wants to walk in and bang you for a quick fix.i would hesitate on adding a leak blocking agent a solid leak check is the beast way to go if you ever have a ZERO'd out system after a winter layover then that is a major leak


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

The big name companies sometimes provide better service as they pay better wages/attract more skilled techs and don't keep you waiting for 3 days to come out. I won't work for most of the small guys as they can't afford me or won't pay a decent wage.


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## hvaclover (Oct 2, 2008)

yuri said:


> The big name companies sometimes provide better service as they pay better wages/attract more skilled techs and don't keep you waiting for 3 days to come out. I won't work for most of the small guys as they can't afford me or won't pay a decent wage.



My customers (and a lot of local one man shops) won't call a big company because they like the personal touch and the confidence that comes from dealing with the owner, so if they have a continuing equipment problem they know they won't be jacked around by twenty different techs.


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## yuri (Nov 29, 2008)

The problem is there is less of us "old school guys" with the personal touch. The young pups are more concerned about their social life and living off credit than getting to be real good at their craft from my observations.:wheelchair:


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## texas115115 (May 3, 2009)

*Yes*

:thumbup:


yuri said:


> The problem is there is less of us "old school guys" with the personal touch. The young pups are more concerned about their social life and living off credit than getting to be real good at their craft from my observations.:wheelchair:


AMEN BROTHER:thumbup:


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## Bigfoot (May 10, 2009)

yuri said:


> The problem is there is less of us "old school guys" with the personal touch. The young pups are more concerned about their social life and living off credit than getting to be real good at their craft from my observations.:wheelchair:


 In the twenty some years I did refers, freezers and A/C. There was one leak I never did find. The evaporator was like 20-25 cubic feet, the leak was in there somewhere.
BSing the customer never was my thing, but to tell you the truth, they often swallow the lie quicker than the truth. I guess they have been conditioned to expect it. 
Turn off the AC so the low pressure comes up some, use soap (and a flashlight) to find the leak, they are sometimes tiny and you have to look close. In all likelihood it is at a joint someplace in the low pressure side, at the expansion valve or hopefully not in the evaporator.
If it was in the high side, it would likely leak out much quicker.
What kind of freon? If it's F-22, an old style propane sniffer works as well as anything else (they're cheap), to localize the leak.
Fixing it is a whole other can of worms.


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