# Do I need pressure treated wood for outdoor project?



## Ironlight

gijoe985 said:


> I am trying to make some outdoor 2x4 furniture and I was curious if I needed to use pressure treated lumber if the projects are going to have a finish on them? I don't want them painted, but I saw an arbor/bench at Lowes for $200 that looked like about $20 of pine with a darker stain on it.
> 
> Let me know your thoughts, thanks.


You should NOT use pressure treated lumber for anything that is going to come into routine contact with skin. So the answer is no, use pine and then finish/seal it with stain.


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## gijoe985

That's what I thought, but someone told me that I needed it so that it would handle the weather. I figured if anything I'd need pressure treated 4x4s for the uprights if I were to bury them underground. 

Any special instructions/requirements for the stain/finish? Something that would help it last longer?


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## Daniel Holzman

A lot of outdoor furniture is built using naturally rot resistant wood, for example redwood, some types of cedar, mahogany, and teak are all used. I don't think I understood the part about burying the furniture in the ground, perhaps you have someone in mind you plan to strap down to the chair while you bury them? Hard pine works as long as you paint it well with a quality outdoor paint, but if you don't want to paint, one of the types of wood I mentioned can be used without treatment.


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## gijoe985

I meant to bury the posts if I were building an arbor....

How much do those woods costs vs pine? Like a 2x4 of cedar or redwood?


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## Hardway

gijoe985 said:


> I meant to bury the posts if I were building an arbor....
> 
> How much do those woods costs vs pine? Like a 2x4 of cedar or redwood?


 
pine not much.
cedar lots more.
red wood way lots more.


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## kwikfishron

Hardway said:


> pine not much.
> cedar lots more.
> red wood way lots more.


True story but the cost of Red Cedar vs. Redwood depends on where you live, on the West Coast anyway.


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## Hardway

kwikfishron said:


> True story but the cost of Red Cedar vs. Redwood depends on where you live, on the West Coast anyway.


that make sense.


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## Daniel Holzman

My issue with pine, particularly low grade pine as you typically find at the big box stores, is that it rots quickly, it splinters easily, and it is often pitchy and hard to paint and impossible to stain effectively. I have a teak bench outdoors, I bought it from one of those garden stores about 20 years ago, it is still in excellent condition, just needs a little washing once in a blue moon to restore it to near new condition. It has never been stained, painted, or oiled. No splinters.

Now you may not like teak because of political concerns and sustainability issues, and I respect that. However, this bench did not cost a whole lot more than an equivalent bench out of cedar, or hard yellow pine, or any other wood for that matter, and it looks great, feels nice, and does not rot. I built my deck using ipe for the same reason, needs no treatment, does not rot, does not splinter. And as for cost, never assume that one material costs less than another until you check local availability and pricing. I was astonished at the fact that ipe, a Brazilian hardwood, is less expensive in my area than western red cedar, redwood, or top quality douglas fir. You gotta check first, then decide. Personally, I would never build outdoor furniture from pine, too many issues, but to each their own.


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## Gary in WA

Teak is very tough: http://www.google.com/search?client...f.,cf.osb&fp=12315a86656515db&biw=828&bih=466

Gary


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## gijoe985

Someone just suggested to use pine with a UV protective deck finish. Any thoughts?


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## gijoe985

Hey, I'm still curious about your thoughts on pine with UV deck finish... This is going to be for some high school students doing group projects. We're trying to keep costs down. Although I don't want things to cost a lot, I also don't want things looking like junk...


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## ddawg16

gijoe985 said:


> Hey, I'm still curious about your thoughts on pine with UV deck finish... This is going to be for some high school students doing group projects. We're trying to keep costs down. Although I don't want things to cost a lot, I also don't want things looking like junk...


If your trying to go cheap....pine will work...not something I would normally use...

But if you use pine....seal it with something like Thompsons. You can stain it first if you want....but you can also get Thomspons with stain in it....

With pine....just plan on having to refinish it every couple of years....


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## gijoe985

ddawg16 said:


> With pine....just plan on having to refinish it every couple of years....


That is what my friend(another shop teacher) told me...


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## Gymschu

DO NOT USE THOMPSON'S WATER SEAL. It is the cheapest, worst of the clear wood sealers. Its' effectiveness is for about 3 months. Get something like Flood Co's CWF-UV. It doesn't cost a lot, has uv protection built in and it looks good.


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## Willie T

One thing you can bank on is that PT is going to split, crack, warp, and twist... and turn a funky grey color. PT and weather just do not mix. It will stay there, but it will look awful.

And If not coated with something akin to tar (well, it looks like it, anyway) it will still rot out in an underground application...... It just might take a couple of years longer.


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