# 30 amp GFCI wall outlet?



## CZ DIY (Oct 4, 2009)

The enclosed shower unit I'm installing in my bathroom has a built-in steamer. The steamer motor is rated as follows:

Steam Generator: 3000W/110V/60Hz/27.3A 

I ran 12 awg romex from my subpanel to the bathroom for this. The outlet for this will be behind the enclosed shower, on the wall. And I'll be looking for a 30 amp single pole breaker.

1) Do you guys recommend GFCI for both breaker and outlet?

2) I'm having trouble locating a 30 amp outlet that will fit in my existing, normal sized wall outlet. Any suggestions?

3) Is one outlet as good as the next, if all specs are identical?


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## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

30a requires #10 wire


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## huck (Mar 21, 2010)

Yeah, what Scuba Dave said.


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

A 3000 watt unit rated for 120v is absolutely dumb. 

- You need #10 wire. DO NOT use the #12 you ran.
- You need a 30A single pole GFI breaker. GOOD LUCK finding that. :whistling2: (a 30A GFI receptacle does not exist)
- You must either use a 30A receptacle and cord, or better yet hard wire it with a disconnect at the unit.

If it were me I would return this junk and get a better unit. :thumbsup:


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## CZ DIY (Oct 4, 2009)

Frack. This website said it was okay to use 12 awg.

http://activerain.com/blogsview/67758/12-awg-on-a-30-amp-breaker-

It's already ran up to the 2nd story bathroom and the drywalling is done & painted.


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## TimPa (Aug 15, 2010)

"The outlet for this will be behind the enclosed shower, on the wall." 

does this mean no access to it? if so, how will it be reset should it trip? or be tested? hardwire it from a gfci cb.


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## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

CZ DIY said:


> Frack. This website said it was okay to use 12 awg.
> 
> http://activerain.com/blogsview/67758/12-awg-on-a-30-amp-breaker-
> 
> It's already ran up to the 2nd story bathroom and the drywalling is done & painted.


For certain MOTOR connections a higher breaker can be used depending upon the name plate

But not for your use

That info is from a BLOG
And it looks like the author DELETED other peoples posts
There was enough left to cast serious doubt on using 12g for a 30a load


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## frenchelectrican (Apr 12, 2006)

CZ DIY said:


> Frack. This website said it was okay to use 12 awg.
> 
> http://activerain.com/blogsview/67758/12-awg-on-a-30-amp-breaker-
> 
> It's already ran up to the 2nd story bathroom and the drywalling is done & painted.


First thing first I am sorry what you did is complety wrong on this set up the conductor size you did install is way too light for this load to handle due you mention 27 amp load you DEFENTLY need 6.0mm² { #10 AWG } conductors 

And Bon Chance to find a single pole 30 A RCD { GFCI } breaker there are around but you will not find them in big box store unless you order them or go to electrical supply centre that will cost a bit of Euros { Dollars for North Americian } 

I will NEVER follow what the bloggers say it is ok to use 4.0mm² { #12 AWG } with that much a load on it That is asking for trouble right there.

The other thing you will need access panel to get into the steam generator which I know you will do it from time to time to clean out gunk etc.

Dave., Most steam generator which I ran into most are just like souped up water heater but very little water in the tank.

Only way I can verify if it have motor in there or not if the OP mention what brand name the unit itself.

Merci.
Marc


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## Scuba_Dave (Jan 16, 2009)

frenchelectrican said:


> Dave., Most steam generator which I ran into most are just like souped up water heater but very little water in the tank.
> 
> Only way I can verify if it have motor in there or not if the OP mention what brand name the unit itself.
> 
> ...


Yup, my steam generator I ran #8 wire for a 30a load - 240v
No motor....I have a Kohler


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## zpm (Jan 6, 2009)

Based on the OP's description, this might be a Rainforest steam shower unit. Appears to be targeted for European market. It looks really good, but the instructions I found leave much to be desired. I'd be sure this thing is UL listed. You're mixing water and electricity ... better safe than sorry.

Tech specs, matches the OP's info about the steamer unit:
http://www.mybath.biz/stores/6/617602/catalog/MB160_2.pdf
Note: Option for MP3/MP4 compatibility!

Installation instructions.
http://www.mybath.biz/stores/6/617602/catalog/MB160.pdf


The electrical preparation instructions consist of


> Also, fit two number IP56 rated electrical sockets. Figure 1: (1 for the two water pumps 1460W, 1 for the heater pump 1500W). 110V/60Hz/54.2A (220V/50Hz/27.1A).


IP56 is an IEC code for (5) "dust protected" and (6) "powerful jetting water, any direction". Yeah, I had to look that up.

My favorite:


> Step 18: Connect the electromagnetism value, audio & radio, and TV power.





Speedy Petey said:


> You need a 30A single pole GFI breaker. GOOD LUCK finding that.


QO130GFI. THQL1130GFP. Should I google it for you?:jester:


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## frenchelectrican (Apr 12, 2006)

ZPM.,

Let me speak of my behaf and Speedy's as well due we are electrician by trade and we know what is common and what not.

All it depending on what brand name in OP's panel if he have SqD or CH[ CulterHammer ] Or GE or Seamens they are not too bad but if very old or out of production items like FPE or other oddball then it will be very long shot to ever find one like that.

And 30 amp single pole RCD { GFCI } is not super common item just walk in any big box store and look at the shelf I know 15 and 20 amp single pole RCD is common but very rare to see single pole 30 amp RCD but two pole verison yeah it somehow common but you will not like the cost of 30 amp SP verison even DP verison.

And with that steam generator what ZPM gave the link if that the case the OP will have serious issue allready there due it will reqired MWBC for it that will get very tricky to meet the code requirement and it will denfity need two pole breaker to work on this one.

Merci.
Marc


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

zpm said:


> QO130GFI. THQL1130GFP. Should I google it for you?:jester:


Gee thanks. :icon_rolleyes:

I never said it didn't exist. I said good luck finding it. :whistling2:


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## CZ DIY (Oct 4, 2009)

Thanks, everyone. Yes, it is the same unit you posted directions to. 
The Rainforest model in the user manual posted.

I got a reply from the customer care people from one of the retailers. 



> Hello,
> 
> We would suggest using the same size wire as the cables coming from the shower. We believe these should be 10 or 12 AWG for your unit.


The unit can be pulled away from the wall, for access to the back panel. 

I took some pictures of the "steam generator"

The cable is labeled:




> 4400/200321276 SHUN DE DA DU CABLE RVV 3X4MM (cubed) 300/500V HUANG DU


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## frenchelectrican (Apr 12, 2006)

Ok That is not a North Americain verison at all due I do not see the UL label.

Second thing it say 110 Volts *50* HZ 

The reason why I am supecting something is not right due the manufacter just put a second sticker over the oringal one { the oringal one is rated for 220 ~ 240 volts 50/60 HZ }

The cord size you mention 4mm² that is the same size as # 12 AWG and IMO that is too small for this useage.

I do not know why the manufacter suggest both gauge size and it will NOT work with 30 amp load like that fashion!

and The Brown is hot conductor while Bleu is netural and green with yellow stripe is ground { Earth }

Call back and get the athorization to change the cord to use the 6.0mm² { 10 AWG } 

Merci.
Marc


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## codeone (Dec 31, 2009)

Just a thought. 

This unit looks like an untested unit for the US and would not be allowed to be used in most jurisdictions here. Are you having the work permitted and inspected? With the labeling doubled like it is I dont think I would personally use it. 

Just my opinion though.


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## frenchelectrican (Apr 12, 2006)

I just look at the PDF link and almost fall off the chair if this is correct.,,


Install the inbound hot & cold waterlines and drainpipe to the location
where you’re installing this unit. Also, fit two number IP56 rated electrical
sockets. Figure 1: (1 for the two water pumps 1460W, 1 for the heater
pump 1500W). *110V/60Hz/54.2A (220V/50Hz/27.1A).*

54 amp on 120 volt circuit? and IMO look like it will required 3 receptales for it.

Merci.
Marc


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## CZ DIY (Oct 4, 2009)

I'm sure it's cheaper for them to simply modify existing 220v units for use stateside in the USA. 
So they just mod it, slap on a new sticker and away it goes.


Yes, there are three outlets needed for this. A pair of 20a and a 30a. When I installed the wiring, I set up three 20a each with their own 12awg cabling and 20a GFCI breaker.

I don't know how I missed that the third was 30a rated. 

I'm so pissed. I have no idea how I'm going to fix this. 

Btw, I don't think you're supposed to use both motors & the steam at the same time? The motors are for the jacuzzi while the steam generator is just for steam baths.


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## codeone (Dec 31, 2009)

CZ DIY said:


> I'm sure it's cheaper for them to simply modify existing 220v units for use stateside in the USA.
> So they just mod it, slap on a new sticker and away it goes.
> 
> .


This is not legal for them to do. For it to be sold in the US it has to be properly tested and labeled with a UL listing or other approved listing. This unit does not have one we recognize to be allowed.

This type of thing happens all the time and is not safe from the aspect of the NEC.


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## frenchelectrican (Apr 12, 2006)

The biggest drawage will be steam generator that will be a issue.

Ya I know what you mean with 30 amp circuit but you have no choice but redo one circuit to order to meet the codes.

and Of course all of them have to be on RCD {GFCI}.

Merci.
Marc


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## frenchelectrican (Apr 12, 2006)

codeone said:


> This is not legal for them to do. For it to be sold in the US it has to be properly tested and labeled with a UL listing or other approved listing. This unit does not have one we recognize to be allowed.
> 
> This type of thing happens all the time and is not safe from the aspect of the NEC.


Codeone.,

It took me few seconds to figure it out where it came from and it located in Eastern European area due one of oddball marking that something most of European items do not have oddball marking { in the middle one }

Merci.
Marc


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## CZ DIY (Oct 4, 2009)

Well I don't intend to take the slightest chance with this house. I don't like cutting corners and I will fix this. I'm just incredibly dissapointed.

My plan then, is to run 10 awg from the subpanel downstairs, up through the inside wall, across the attic floor and then have the terminal in the bathroom ceiling about 2" from either wall (corner of room). Because the shower unit is the corner of the room and both walls face outside, the only way for me to mount the terminal inside the wall is to.... actually I have no idea. I ran all the cabling when the ceiling & walls were all torn out.

Any problem with me mounting this new terminal in the ceiling, in the corner?


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## Bob1946 (Aug 6, 2010)

*Might be time to cut your losses*

I've read through the entire thread and all I suggest is to think of three things.
1. This thing has been rewired for the US and is a questionable unit to use at best.
2. Nothing seems to make any sense when it comes to installing it.
3. How much life insurance do you carry on yourself and your family? I think that it is somewhere around 20 milliamps at 120 volts through the heart that can stop it. Do you really want to chance it?


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## codeone (Dec 31, 2009)

This picture appears it was modified to go to Europe instead of the US also.

Since the label on top says 50 hz. Id suspect this may have came from China. There have been quite a few products coming into the US from there that are not actually UL approved and even sometimes have a counterfit UL label on them. Buyer beware.


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## CZ DIY (Oct 4, 2009)

Guys, I ripped apart the drywall and ran 10awg. :furious:


Having some trouble finding the 30a gfci breaker & receptacle. What is recommended? 
Here is my panel:


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## Techy (Mar 16, 2011)

http://www.amazon.com/Industrial-Dept-THQL1130GFP-Circuit-Breaker/dp/B001737PES

http://www.google.com/products/cata...-tgfggvjoDg&ved=0CH0Q8wIwBA&biw=1920&bih=981#


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## CZ DIY (Oct 4, 2009)

Will that breaker fit my panel?

The receptacle doesn't look like it's GFCI?

Thanks!


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## Techy (Mar 16, 2011)

breaker will fit yes, the receptacle doesnt have to be GFI if the breaker is


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## CZ DIY (Oct 4, 2009)

Techy said:


> the receptacle doesnt have to be GFI if the breaker is


Huh, I had thought it had to be GFI at both ends. This is good news. Thank you for the help! 
I'll order the breaker tonight and get the receptacle from HD tonight so I can install it this week.

Glad I went back and re-did things. I'm feeling safer already!!!!


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## XxHaimBondxX (May 22, 2012)

Wonder how OP made out. I've ordered the same unit instead of doing an entire bathroom and facing similar electrical dillemas. 

The electrical specs are 

2 Water pumps:1460W/110V/60Hz/13.3A
Steam Generator: 3000W/110V/60Hz/27A

I am not planning to use the steam generator often, however, will use the jets.

Currently, there is an outlet for a former wall air conditioner that's rated 20 AMP. There is also an electrical baseboard heater that's rated 2 x 20 AMP (40 AMP?), which I plan to remove and retrofit the wiring into a outlet for the steam generator. Can I just use the regular outlets and change the breakers to GFI for 20 and 30 amp?


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## Techy (Mar 16, 2011)

the baseboard heater is likely a 20A 240V circuit, if wired with #10 it could be converted into a 30A 120V circuit 

yes you can use breakers in lieu of gfi receptacles.


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## Missouri Bound (Apr 9, 2011)

CZ DIY;65262. Thank you for the help! :)
Glad I went back and re-did things. I'm feeling safer already!!!![/quote said:


> *Glad you re-did the wiring. It's the smart thing to do*.:thumbup:


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## rrolleston (Oct 17, 2011)

Was getting nervouse thinking you were going to leave it the way you originally had it. So relieved that you decided to do the right thing to help keep your family safe.


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