# Install slim IC Rated LED Recessed light Directly against vapor barrier?



## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

What's your plan for running the cable?


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## Boogityman (Oct 17, 2017)

Long story but we had to open up the adjacent 'interior' side of this ceiling due to a water infiltration issue. (it's all original construction but the family room is kind of built like an extension...ensuite bathroom is over half the room, and rest is like an attic, but really not accessible from anywhere.)

Now that there is a hole in the other side of the ceiling, I can fish a wire from the 'interior side' to the 'attic side' as I can see the vapor barrier is just tuck taped up to a floor joist where the transition is made. 

edit: so the wire will be fished between the existing vapor barrier and the drywall beneath it. 

Don't know if that is clear enough...always easier when you're standing here looking at it! haha.


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

If the attic is more than 100 sq. ft, code would have you do a door 28 x 21 1/2.
I don't know what heat you will get from those lights.


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## Boogityman (Oct 17, 2017)

I'm not sure I follow you--a door to make the attic accessible? Because I am adding lights or just in general to bring it to code?

Note that there are already two pot lights in place in the corner of the room, but they are orignal and so are in those big galvanized boxes...not really an option here where I'm trying to not tear apart the ceiling more than I absolutely have to.


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## CodeMatters (Aug 16, 2017)

They disturb the vapour barrier same as any other 4" pot-light. 4" hole 
is a 4" hole. None the less I install them in insulated ceilings and don't 
worry about it. 
If your insulation is loose fill then you really want to shovel the whole 
area clear to keep it from falling through the hole and making a mess. 
While your installation may be the rare exception, I'd expect to make 
a couple trips into the attic. 
If you think you'll be able to install the light and driver between the 
vapour barrier and drywall, I seriously doubt that will work out.


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

Not for anything in particular, just because. The big boxed lights are rated for insulation.

The transformer inside the box is where the heat is so I doubt you will get away with this.
Heat that cannot escape above will also shorten the life of the bulb.


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## Boogityman (Oct 17, 2017)

Thanks to you both for your input, much appreciated! 

Regarding space--I do think there is enough 'slack' in the vapor barrier as I already installed some in-ceiling speakers elsewhere in the same room and was able to just push them up against the barrier with no trouble really. I cut the holes in the drywall with a Dremel with a taped bit so I didn't plunge too deep...only punctured the barrier in a couple spots and patched that up with Tuck tape, so I thought I would be able to do the same here. 

Regarding the heat--I think those vapor barriers are polyethylene, which melts at 120C+, I don't think that I am really in danger of melting it, particlarly because if the fixture is IC rated it means the whole fixture--driver and light, right? I don't know just thinking out loud...

So what I understand is that IF I can fit in the fixture without breaking the vapor barrier, it would still be OK code-wise? Because those vapor boots are just to make space for the fixture when they don't fit in under the vapor barrier?

edit: I guess another option would be to put in a piece of insulation, so that it would go light/driver --> sheet of insulation --> vapor barrier --> blown insulation already in attic

Thanks again for all your input

B


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## CodeMatters (Aug 16, 2017)

As you likely know Quebec is different than the rest of Canada. My impression
is that the CEC applies, with some variations to every province and territory 
EXCEPT Quebec. So my knowledge applies to the CEC/OESC. 

If you have the slack in the vapour barrier and the ability to get wires in and 
out at the end of the sheet then you're golden. I've never seen this scenario 
and have a hard time imagining but if that's what you have, great! 
I routinely install these buried in insulation and occasionally add a plastic sheet 
directly overtop before burying with insulation. They are designed for this location. 
No need whatsoever to worry about heat dissipation.


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## Boogityman (Oct 17, 2017)

haha do I ever know that, yeah. Alright I will do some digging to make sure. 

Assuming it's OK, I'll give it a shot. Worst case if I don't have the slack I just have a hole (or a few...) to repair... ceiling need to be painted anyways so no big deal... What's life without a little risk taking, haha...at least as it comes to patching and painting, not electrical codes...!

Thanks again


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## CodeMatters (Aug 16, 2017)

Here's something I've never tried but seems like it would help:
-Cut through the drywall & vapour with hole saw or tool that leaves 
a clean hole in both. 
-Squeeze caulk or other sealant between the VB and the drywall all 
the way around the circumference & press the 2 together as best you 
can.
Seems to me this would help significantly in retaining the continuity 
of the VB. 
Note that the lights also come with a gasket that is supposed to help 
in this regard as well. I don't see it as being particularly useful as it 
I think it's in the wrong place. In fact I usually toss it cuz the light sits 
flatter/tighter without it. And, if the ceiling is textured, it's definitely 
not going to do anything. 

As a side note, due to all the advantages including direct insulation burial,
these lights have taken over here. My supplier says they sell about 30% 
as many traditional pots as they did 5 yrs ago.


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

CodeMatters said:


> -Cut through the drywall & vapour with hole saw or tool that leaves
> a clean hole in both.
> -Squeeze caulk or other sealant between the VB and the drywall all
> the way around the circumference & press the 2 together as best you
> can.


You have left a direct hole to the insulation.

They should make one of these round to fit the hole that he could work in and stick it to the poly.
https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/p.vapour-barrier-boot.1000182142.html

Out here the electricians put this kind of stuff over ever box on exterior wall and attic and caulk the hole the wire goes thru. Then the insulators tape to it.


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## CodeMatters (Aug 16, 2017)

If one chooses to install the light with gasket, as recommended by the
manufacturer, the leakage will be near zero (on a flat ceiling). 
No way I'd put a microwave size VB over a 1" thick light and wallet sized
driver but others can do as they wish; at least they can in reno's.


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