# Used pickup price too good to be true?



## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

I'm looking at a 2015 Nissan Titan Pro-4X that my son wants to buy. It's from a small dealer in Denver. The price is about $6000 less than what KBB and NADA show as fair market value, though, so I'm wondering why. 

The dealer offers a free Carfax report, so I'll take a look at that when we get there. I got one of the free history reports online. It showed it having a salvage title early on, but a couple what look to be fairly thorough inspections afterwards. 

I know my way around the mechanical areas of vehicles fairly well, but some of the more sophisticated computer stuff is over my head.

I'd like some advice on what to look for, to hopefully not find out the hard way why it's so cheap.


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## 3onthetree (Dec 7, 2018)

Salvage title would crash the price.
Could have been in a flood. Inspections don't remove carpet, don't check any electronic connections.
Would never buy a salvaged newer vehicle for a DD, reliability is key, you might be chasing problems far into it's usable life.


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## MTN REMODEL LLC (Sep 11, 2010)

HotRod....That salvage title would worry me also....maybe with the carfax you can guess from what it came.

Especially on later model vehicles that still have some value, the dealers will transport flooded vehicals to a completely different location so as to disguise that it may have been flooded.....flooded is a specially detrimental problems because of hidden electrical issues that are likely to become problems.

The car fax will indicate from where the car has been....and in Houston or Loisiana be carefull.


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## u2slow (Feb 9, 2012)

In my jurisdiction, salvage is parts-only. It has to be converted to 'rebuilt' to go on the road again. YMMV.

IME, there's really good deals to be had on 'rebuilt' status vehicles. Insurance can be (too) quick to write things off. It helps immensely if the seller (hopefully also the rebuilder) will share with you the real history instead of playing stupid.


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

Thanks, everyone. It being in a flood would seem to fit with the timelime - 2017 had the costly flooding ever. 

I'm listening to your warnings about the problems we may encounter, and I'm not dismissing them at all. I also can't ignore that it's $6000-$8000 below what would normally be a good deal on that vehicle. If it is the case that it was flooded, and that's why it's so cheap, I'll feel better about that than if there was no apparent reason, because dealerships don't knock 8 grand off for no reason.

My credit union told me if it's still under a salvage title, they can't finance on it, so we'd have to come up with the full purchase price some other way. We can do that, but there's probably alot of people who can't, so that may be another reason why it's not sold yet.

Just you're not concerned about what happens if it breaks down, I'm never more than a phone call and an hour's drive away, so he won't be stranded anywhere.


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

Yep, it was most likely flooded during Hurricane Harvey. I found a vehicle history report that shows a total loss declaration January 17th and a sale to Copart, Inc. in Dallas, on January 19th.

The good news is it's been driven 50,000 miles since then.


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## Oso954 (Jun 23, 2012)

Talk to a claims expert from your insurance company about flood cars. My insurance will total a brand new car once flood water hits the lowest portion of the dash. The assumption is that water has gotten into the wiring harness and many of the plug connectors. In time, corrosion causes electrical problems.

Short of a complete rewire, you can end up chasing one problem after another when the problems start appearing,


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## Old Thomas (Nov 28, 2019)

I would stay away from it. If it had a salvage designation early in its life, it had substantial damage to cost more than it’s value. It could be a money pit that you have no alternative but to junk it.
On the other hand, if you want your son to stay home more, buy it. When it dies and costs a fortune to fix, he will be on the shoe leather express and he will be home more.


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## lenaitch (Feb 10, 2014)

It's encouraging that it has gone that far since Harvey (assuming that's why it was branded as salvage), but perhaps price out the ECM or BCM and balance that against the apparent savings. Chasing electrical faults can be extremely aggravating.


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## Half-fast eddie (Sep 19, 2020)

Contact your state vehicle licensing department. Ask if they have any special requirements for salvage vehicles. I have heard that some states require an extensive inspection process.
This is the process in virginia. Note that they want to see pictures before it was rebuilt ...


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## ZTMAN (Feb 19, 2015)

Good advice above. One more suggestion. Call your insurance agent to see if your insurer has limitations on insuring a a vehicle with a salvaged title.


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## Drachenfire (Jun 6, 2017)

I would sooner buy an older vehicle with a clean title than buy a newer one with a salvage title. In this (expensive) electronic age, you are taking a serious gamble on a salvage. 

If you are still considering this vehicle, I would at least take it to your own mechanic and have them do an end to end, top to bottom inspection. They may find faults not readily apparent in a cursory inspection.


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

Drachenfire said:


> I would sooner buy an older vehicle with a clean title than buy a newer one with a salvage title. In this (expensive) electronic age, you are taking a serious gamble on a salvage.
> 
> If you are still considering this vehicle, I would at least take it to your own mechanic and have them do an end to end, top to bottom inspection. They may find faults not readily apparent in a cursory inspection.


The Nissan Titan is the vehicle he wants, and I'm the only mechanic I trust. Believe me, I will be going through it thoroughly.


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## raylo32 (Nov 25, 2006)

I wouldn't touch a vehicle with a salvage title. You will never know everything about it and when (not if) some new problem is going to pop up. But if you are game for that I guess it might work out.


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## Mordekyle (Dec 3, 2020)

Oso954 said:


> Talk to a claims expert from your insurance company about flood cars. My insurance will total a brand new car once flood water hits the lowest portion of the dash. The assumption is that water has gotten into the wiring harness and many of the plug connectors. In time, corrosion causes electrical problems.
> 
> Short of a complete rewire, you can end up chasing one problem after another when the problems start appearing,


.... and if you do purchase the truck and get in an accident, you won’t get much of a payout.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

Thank you all for your help. I think we're going to go look at it tomorrow. I don't think we'll worry too much about the full-coverage insurance. My son who would be getting it is a very cautious driver (wish my other kids were as careful). We don't have to have the full coverage, since our credit union won't do a loan against it, anyway, so the loan would be unsecured (primarily for him to build a credit history).


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## Old Thomas (Nov 28, 2019)

HotRodx10 said:


> The Nissan Titan is the vehicle he wants, and I'm the only mechanic I trust. Believe me, I will be going through it thoroughly.


Will you check inside the ECM and inside every module and electrical connection in the vehicle? Do you have a frame machine to make sure it is square? Can you see inside every enclosed cavity? Can you make sure the driveline is aligned in the chassis? Will you drain the differential(s) to look for moisture?


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

Old Thomas said:


> Will you check inside the ECM and inside every module and electrical connection in the vehicle?


If necessary. After 4 years and nearly 50,000 miles, it's likely dried out by now.


Old Thomas said:


> Do you have a frame machine to make sure it is square?


No, but being flooded is unlikely to have bent the frame.


Old Thomas said:


> Can you see inside every enclosed cavity?


No, but again, it's been 4 years.


Old Thomas said:


> Can you make sure the driveline is aligned in the chassis?


Yes, but being under water, doesn't change the alignment of the drive line.


Old Thomas said:


> Will you drain the differential(s) to look for moisture?


Probably. but generally, if oil can't get out, water can't get in. Again, it's been driven 50,000 miles since it was flooded.


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## Half-fast eddie (Sep 19, 2020)

HotRodx10 said:


> Probably. but generally, if oil can't get out, water can't get in.


I don’t know the answer, asking out of ignorance. Are there vents above the fluid level in the transmission or driveline where water could get in if it was under water?


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

Half-fast eddie said:


> I don’t know the answer, asking out of ignorance. Are there vents above the fluid level in the transmission or driveline where water could get in if it was under water?


Differentials are typically sealed. Transmissions are typically vented through the fill/check dipstick tube, unless they're one of the new sealed 'lifetime' transmissions that are not supposed to require fluid changes. If the water level got high enough, it could get into the engine and transmission, but changing the fluids in those is fairly easy and has most assuredly been done, or it would not be on the road after 50,000 miles. Drivelines are either solid shafts or sealed pipes.


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## DexterII (Jul 14, 2010)

I believe that all differentials are vented, not much larger than an 1/8" nipple with a cap and a light spring under it, sometimes in the housing and sometimes on a hose to get them a bit higher, but always there as fas as I have seen.


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## Old Thomas (Nov 28, 2019)

HotRodx10 said:


> If necessary. After 4 years and nearly 50,000 miles, it's likely dried out by now.
> 
> No, but being flooded is unlikely to have bent the frame.
> 
> ...


In your initial message you said it was a salvage vehicle, not that it was a flood vehicle. Then the posts went on to assume that it was in a flood. I haven’t seen you claim that it is fact. Do you know that it wasn’t driven off a bridge, totaled and rebuilt? It could be twisted, sprung, go down the road dog tracking, have leaks, etc. Maybe it was swept up in a flood and severely bent, too.


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

Old Thomas said:


> In your initial message you said it was a salvage vehicle, not that it was a flood vehicle. Then the posts went on to assume that it was in a flood. I haven’t seen you claim that it is fact. Do you know that it wasn’t driven off a bridge, totaled and rebuilt? It could be twisted, sprung, go down the road dog tracking, have leaks, etc. Maybe it was swept up in a flood and severely bent, too.


Looking at the vehicle history, it was declared a total loss on January 17th, 2017, in Houston, Texas; obviously, one of the many victims of the Hurricane Harvey flooding. No mention of body or chassis damage, which I understand would be in the vehicle history report, if it needed those repairs.


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## Joeywhat (Apr 18, 2020)

Many differentials do have a breather port on them. I know the one on my mustang is not a 1 way valve, so water can definitely get in. Flood damage is a tough sell for most people...


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

Ah well, some of you will be relieved to know that it appears the truck has been sold to someone else. I called this morning and they told me it was out on a test drive and they'd call me back. That was about 2 hours ago, and I haven't heard from them. Interestingly, the guy who returned my call tried to tell me the reason it was so cheap is that it had hail damage, after I mentioned that I noticed it had been in a flood. If they didn't disclose the actual history to whoever they sold it to, the dealer could be in alot of trouble.


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## Half-fast eddie (Sep 19, 2020)

I don’t think it was damaged in Hurricane Harvey ... that was in august 2017. But houston did have major storms the middle of january.


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## Old Thomas (Nov 28, 2019)

I don’t understand why you asked for opinions and advice, but you defended the vehicle to those who criticized it. If you had your mind made up to buy it, you should have bought it.


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

Half-fast eddie said:


> I don’t think it was damaged in Hurricane Harvey ... that was in august 2017. But houston did have major storms the middle of january.


Yep, you're right. Harvey flooded Houston in August. I saw Harvey and the 17th, got it mixed up. Houston did have storms that caused major flooding the 17th of January, too. Looks Like the big hail didn't hit until the 20th. Anyway, it seems odd for hail damage to result in a salvage title. The truck appears to not have any hail damage now, so hail damage that's been completely repaired is no reason for the truck to be 6 or 8 grand below market value.


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## HotRodx10 (Aug 24, 2017)

Old Thomas said:


> I don’t understand why you asked for opinions and advice, but you defended the vehicle to those who criticized it. If you had your mind made up to buy it, you should have bought it.


I didn't have my "mind made up to buy it". I considered the cautions and warnings, but ultimately decided the savings justified the risks. I appreciate everyone's input, including yours. I did find it valuable, and I would have looked for the things you mentioned. I'm sorry if you feel I wasted your time; it was not my intention. I would have liked to inspect it in person, but it was sold before we had the chance to get down to Denver to look at it.


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## Old Thomas (Nov 28, 2019)

No problem, HotRod.


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