# So... why does my car skid so?



## SeniorSitizen (Sep 10, 2012)

Toller said:


> I have a 2011 AWD Subaru Impreza with 25,000 miles. The tires still have good tread. On a slushy road I have to take turns very slowly as the car wants to fishtail. I don't remember it being so bad in prior years, but we haven't had this much snow since I got it.
> 
> My wife's 2014 AWD Mazda CX-9 is very steady on the same road; the difference in handling is dramatic. The tires are bigger and a bit newer, and the car is much heavier. Does any of that account for it?
> 
> Any ideas?


The reason for fishtail is that at the moment fishtailing occurs the rear tires have less traction than the front tires. The tires with the least traction always take the lead. What's causing this scenario with one vehicle and not so much with the other could be one or a combination of many things and would be extremely difficult to diagnose.


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## collegetry (Feb 7, 2012)

Its called too traveling too fast for the road conditions


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## Windows on Wash (Aug 30, 2011)

Toller said:


> My wife's 2014 AWD Mazda CX-9 is very steady on the same road; the difference in handling is dramatic. The tires are bigger and a bit newer, and the car is much heavier. Does any of that account for it?
> 
> Any ideas?


That can account for all of it. 

Heavier cars will push through the snow and make road contact more effectively as will a newer (i.e. deeper) tread groove.


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## 47_47 (Sep 11, 2007)

Slush is the worst to drive on. It plugs up the tire channels and you have racing slicks.


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## Bob Sanders (Nov 10, 2013)

Fishtailing is the result of loss of traction to the rear wheels. That's either not enough weight in the back, or too much horsepower to the rear wheels

I would suggest there may be something wrong with the Subaru AWD system and for what ever reason you're delivering more torque to the rear than to the front. (If torque was split properly between front and back the entire car would want to slide sideways as all 4 wheels lose traction).

There could also be something wrong with the traction control.

But just out of curiosity to eliminate it being merely a weight issue, you should throw 3 or 4 100LB sand bags into the back of the Subaru and see if that stabilizes things.


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## ukrkoz (Dec 31, 2010)

47_47 said:


> Slush is the worst to drive on. It plugs up the tire channels and you have racing slicks.



Booom!! He got it!! Slush is THE WORST hydroplaining medium on the road. This is why when I have slush between the lanes and I need to change lanes, I cross slush at very very small angle. Or it'll spin you out in heartbeat.
OP, toss a few cinder blocks into trunk. Like the guy said - low tread is packed with slush and you basically drive on bold tires.
Then again - it's kinda fun, aye, mate? Do a little TopGear style cornering:thumbup::thumbsup:


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## daveblt (Nov 7, 2011)

When it's slippery slow down enough for the turn before you make the turn. When you turn do not brake or accelerate also at the same time because then your asking the car to do too may things at one time .


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## jimn (Nov 13, 2010)

Get new tires . What might be enough tread for the summer maybe woefully inadequate for the winter. Most tires that come with cars are terrible winter tires. Some all season tires are much better in the winter than others . You want all seasons with the m&s (mud and snow) rating . Check the consumer rating magazine or the comments on tire rack dot com . Better yet, buy a set of true winter tires and rims . Swap them out by the season.


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## cjm94 (Sep 25, 2011)

jimn01 said:


> Get new tires . What might be enough tread for the summer maybe woefully inadequate for the winter. Most tires that come with cars are terrible winter tires. Some all season tires are much better in the winter than others . You want all seasons with the m&s (mud and snow) rating . Check the consumer rating magazine or the comments on tire rack dot com . Better yet, buy a set of true winter tires and rims . Swap them out by the season.



Also do you rotate regularly. Are the tread depth the same frome and rear if they are too different they will make the 4x4 system bind. And not function properly.


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## Drew404 (Dec 17, 2014)

If you have the stock OEM Subaru tires on it that is a big issue. They are a a junk all season and not a true snow tire. Put a better all season like the Continental DWS or a true snow tire and the car will drive a lot better.

Note
I sold Subarus for a living in the snow belt in the past and have owned 2.


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## 1985gt (Jan 8, 2011)

I'd do tires. My mom just got traded in her old Baja for a forester. Subaru vehicles make an very good car/wagon for the snow, her little Baja would go though things a lot of 4x trucks would have trouble with. Plus the fact they actually handle both stopping and going on ice better then most things I've ever driven.

While the tires may only have 25k miles on them the rubber in the tires gets harder with age, snow, ice, and slush you need to have softer tires.


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## 47_47 (Sep 11, 2007)

I'd measure the depth. Do you own or lease? 

If you own and tires above 6/32", corner slower in these slushy conditions for a month or so and put new on in the fall. 

Leasing, when does it expire? When I worked at a dealer, you saw many lease turn ins with new tires, because of the penalty of low tread remaining was more than the price of tires. If your leasing, and you won't make the remaining tread, get new tires now and use them.

As others said, AWD= 4 identical tires.


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## ukrkoz (Dec 31, 2010)

Hey, not to forget.
HOW IS REAR CAMBER?
Positive camber has devastating result on rear cornering stability. Even 0 camber. You MUST have negative camber, or rear end will be flying in corners. I KNOW. I experiemnted with that before.


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## Toller (Jan 2, 2013)

I have the original tires; Potenza RE92A. They are expensive tires, but get mediocre reviews.
I don't see a M&S on them, but they claim to be All Season. I don't find anything exactly on it, but I think the terms mean about the same thing?
I get them rotated when I get an oil change, about every 4,000 miles.
The tread is a bit under 3/16, so maybe they are due for replacement. 25,000 miles just doesn't seem like very good life.
I don't know about camber, but will have an oil change in the next week and can ask about that. Any idea what Subaru specifies?


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## ukrkoz (Dec 31, 2010)

I would NOT be inquiring about camber at oil place, unless you do oil at dealership. It's alignment question and camber slowly goes sour, as components wear out. 
I found ones for WRX, yours should be about same:
http://www.ehow.com/list_7504734_alignment-specifications-wrx.html

*Factory Recommended Tire Alignment Specifications*



 The factory recommended wheel alignment specifications for the Subaru WRX is as follow. The front right and left tire toe should be at zero and +/- 3mm. The front right and left tire camber should be set at zero, +/- zero degrees at three minutes. The rear right and left tire toe should be at zero and +/- 3 mm. The rear right and left tire camber should be -1.0 degrees and +/- zero degrees for 45 minutes. The WRX stock caster setting is approximately 3.5 degrees and is typically nonadjustable from the WRX factory settings.
 *Overview of WRX Factory Recommendations*



 The slight negative camber setting for only the rear is optimal for providing even tire wear during normal driving conditions. With the front and rear toe set at zero degrees it helps ensure solid, reliable handling as well as straight and even tracking. The zero front and rear toe setting is especially important for firm and straight driving at highway cruising speeds.


http://www.ehow.com/list_7504734_alignment-specifications-wrx.html


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## 1985gt (Jan 8, 2011)

Toller said:


> I have the original tires; . They are expensive tires, but get mediocre reviews.
> I don't see a M&S on them, but they claim to be All Season. I don't find anything exactly on it, but I think the terms mean about the same thing?
> I get them rotated when I get an oil change, about every 4,000 miles.
> The tread is a bit under 3/16, so maybe they are due for replacement. 25,000 miles just doesn't seem like very good life.
> I don't know about camber, but will have an oil change in the next week and can ask about that. Any idea what Subaru specifies?



They shouldn't really be a M&S on there, and some tire manufactures mean different things by "all Season".

I would go to a tire web site on line and read some reviews, go down to the local tire store and talk to them.

I read a few of the reviews quick on the tires you have and most seem to say after 20-30K the traction was lacking.

Have the tire shop check the alignment after they put the new tires on. A lot of the bigger tire shops around here do it for free with a tire purchase.


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## ChantryOntario (Apr 22, 2013)

I drive 2,000 miles per month in an Impreza, in snow conditions for 5 months. Best vehicle for traction that I've ever driven, using Nokian Hakkapolita snows. Worst car for traction I've ever driven using worn Yoko all seasons.... I agree with the poster that said the power distribution is everything, and in the Impreza, in my experience bad tires actually seem to make it much worse than a two wheel drive vehicle, because until you lock up the diff you're basically dragging the rear end around in an 80/20 power split. With all seasons the slush just packs the tires in a few minutes then they are basically slicks like previously posted. The front is normally getting 80% power so it will pull into the corners a bit, but the back just slides.

Don't try this at home, but if you get on the throttle enough to spin the backs which locks up the center diff, the traction actually improves greatly, but you soon realize that 50/50 front/back power does not equal better stopping power......


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