# Recommendations for buying Drill



## fstellab (Nov 15, 2012)

Hi Folks,

I am new at DIY, I quickly found out that a varible speed drill is must have tool.

I purchased a Black & Decker DIR250 drill, which I am having problems with it.

I can not control the speed as much as I need, especially at slow speeds. 
When I squeeze the trigger, it goes from slow speed to High so fast I cannot use the slower speeds.

Is there a drill were you can set the speed before you start ? Are there drills that have better speed control in general ? 

I have 2 smaller cordless drills that work great, but sometimes they don't have enough power. I need a corded drill with power and speed control.

Thanks
-Fred


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## SeniorSitizen (Sep 10, 2012)

fstellab said:


> Hi Folks,
> 
> I am new at DIY, I quickly found out that a varible speed drill is must have tool.
> 
> ...


Yes, speed control drills have been made in the past so I suspect they can still be found*.*

This one is a corded Craftsman ( made in the USA ) I bought an an estate auction so I don't know when it was sold new*. *The black button on the trigger front is adjusted for the speed desired*.* I suspect it is nothing more than a positive stop since it is rotated cw to lower rpm and ccw to increase*.* The keyless chuck is handy but sucks as many do.

Better drills, yes. One of my best is a Makita corded with a keyed chuck that I've had for several years. Nearly un-stoppable.


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## jeffsw6 (Oct 28, 2012)

How slow do you want the drill to go? My DEWALT cordless drills are easy to control the speed, slow enough for screw-driving or fast enough for drilling through steel.

I have both the "compact" 20V MAX model and the bigger 18V model. If I could own only one, I would choose the bigger one. I got my compact 20V one recently and it is not strong enough for some things I do, but it is really nice to have a smaller drill for most tasks. EDIT: There is a "premium" 20V MAX drill of course, but I don't own that one. Didn't see any reason to throw out the 18V and replace it with a newer model yet.

I don't even own a "corded" drill anymore, except for a drill press. I do have a dedicated "screwdriver" for machine screws, etc. It's a cheap Black & Decker that cost about $30 at Home Depot. Small, works well, doesn't have a replaceable battery though, so when it runs out of juice, it's out until I charge it back up again.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

makita and bosch have the best speed control for cordless gear. 

with your black and decker drill i woiuldnt be surprised if the cluch burns up on it pretty quick if you do anything that requires extra torque. most of the gears on low end drills are made of either plastic or really low grade steel


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## fstellab (Nov 15, 2012)

*Should I consider a Hammer Drill ?*

Folks,

Can I sneak in a 2nd question ?

Should I consider a hammer drill ?

I do (or plan to do) a wide range of DIY projects from biulding shelves in the garage, to building a closet organizer and I plan to do some outside projects
like building a Outdoor Kitchen.

I have 2 small cordless drills that can drive 1 - 2 inch screws in a 1x4 no problem. My issue started when I was building garage shelves. I tried to
screw in a 3" screw to join 2x4's. The speed issue caused the drill to pop out of the screw, its hard to control the drill when it is at the higher speed.

Thanks for the replies ..

Cheers 

-Fred


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

if you need a hammer drill go corded.. cordless hammer drills dont do much. they dont have the power of a corded drill by the time you have 2 or 3 holes drilled the battery is dry


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

fstellab said:


> Should I consider a hammer drill ?


Sure you don't mean "impact Driver". That's a whole different animal than a hammer drill.


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## jeffsw6 (Oct 28, 2012)

If your driver bit is worn (they do wear out) replace it. If you are using one that is too big/small it will make the bit cam out or wreck the screw.

An impact driver would be more appropriate than a hammer drill for driving screws into 2x4s, but that should not be a hard task for most drills, unless you have made your own 2x4s from oak or something.

I have the DEWALT DCF885 1/4" impact driver. Plenty of other mfrs have cordless impact drivers these days, too; Makita would be my second choice. Impact tools are becoming popular with more trades.


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## joecaption (Nov 30, 2011)

For driving screws and dozens of other jobs an impact drill is the way to go.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

yup. impacts have much higher torque ratings than a drill. you can get away with a regular drill but they dont pack the same punch..

what irks me though is how companies focus on selling you the impact as opposed to the drill by lowering the torque on drills so you need the impact.. my first makita drill 10 years ago had all kinds of torque, where as the torque ratings on my current cordless drills is much lower.. which is why i also have 2 impacts..


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## toolaholic (Jul 31, 2011)

woodworkbykirk said:


> yup. impacts have much higher torque ratings than a drill. you can get away with a regular drill but they dont pack the same punch..
> 
> what irks me though is how companies focus on selling you the impact as opposed to the drill by lowering the torque on drills so you need the impact.. my first makita drill 10 years ago had all kinds of torque, where as the torque ratings on my current cordless drills is much lower.. which is why i also have 2 impacts..


My cordless V18lithium/ 18 volt nicadMilwaukee 0624 lok tor has 495" lbs in Low gear. An oldie but goodie made in Germany. It's very strong.


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## SeniorSitizen (Sep 10, 2012)

fstellab said:


> Folks,
> 
> Can I sneak in a 2nd question ?
> 
> ...


Sure you can sneeeek in a second question.

You don't have a speed problem as much as you have a procedure problem. A pilot hole approximately the diameter of the screw should be bored through the first 2x4. You'll see at least a couple of advantages to that including the two 2x4s will be drawn together tighter. And with finer projects a pilot hole and an anchor hole should be bored. Also I've seen very few phillips drivers that didn't need the tip lightly touched to a grinder for better performance.

I've lived a long time without a hammer drill and do just fine.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

if your driving any screw that requires any amount of torque you shouldnt be using philips in the first place. use robertson or grex screws. philips were designed to be for light duty. robertsons handle way more torque than phlips and then grex go even further. its the reason most composite decking companies use grex bits for their stainless steel color matched screws. they handle the extra torque and dont strip out


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## jeffsw6 (Oct 28, 2012)

toolaholic said:


> My cordless V18lithium/ 18 volt nicadMilwaukee 0624 lok tor has 495" lbs in Low gear. An oldie but goodie made in Germany. It's very strong.


*495* inch pounds sounds like a lot on paper, but if you compare to impact drivers, it isn't. Besides that, impact drivers don't require any effort from your hand/wrist! If you have never used one, you just don't know what you are missing.

The DEWALT DCF885 1/4" impact driver is good for 117 foot pounds of torque. That is *1404* inch pounds from a tool that weighs about as much as a beer. Makita, Milwaukee, I'm sure there are others too.

These things are not expensive, either. They cost about the same as a cordless drill. Just be sure to buy "impact bits" to use with it, because they will tear up regular bits quickly.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

your right, the milwaukee shockwave bits are the best ive used for impacts. easily well worth the money. .the dewalt impact bits only last slightly longer than the regular bits, im not sure about the bosch ones .. home depot is supposed to carry em but the bin is always empty


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## toolaholic (Jul 31, 2011)

jeffsw6 said:


> 495 inch pounds sounds like a lot on paper, but if you compare to impact drivers, it isn't. Besides that, impact drivers don't require any effort from your hand/wrist! If you have never used one, you just don't know what you are missing.
> 
> The DEWALT DCF885 1/4" impact driver is good for 117 foot pounds of torque. That is 1404 inch pounds from a tool that weighs about as much as a beer. Makita, Milwaukee, I'm sure there are others too.
> 
> These things are not expensive, either. They cost about the same as a cordless drill. Just be sure to buy "impact bits" to use with it, because they will tear up regular bits quickly.


I have a makita 14.4 impact diver rated at 1100 some inch lbs and a milwaukee 0883 v18 impact wrench( I have 1/4 hex adapter for it) that has 2200 inch lbs. Yeah the impacts really put out'!


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## ToolSeeker (Sep 19, 2012)

Right now till christmas there are some really good deals on drill/driver impact/driver combos this may be something to look at.


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## fstellab (Nov 15, 2012)

*Thanks to All .. Really good info*

Hi Folks,

The information is great! Thanks.

I learned fast, that Torax screws are the way to go, I don't even like the Square ones.

I will probably read over these replies several times, and then ask Santa to 
bring me one the the options.

Meanwhile, I went to a HF store near my house, I saw a nice looking drill for $12. So purchased the drill. I started using it ... nice speed control compared the the Skil I have. I needed to cut a 1 1/2 Inch hole, so I put on the blade bit, and started cranking away. In about 20 seconds, white smoke (I am not kidding) came out of the drill motor. I stopped right away. It really smelled bad. I let it cool down, and later in the day I started using it a with just screws.

Cheers!
-Fred:yes:


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## Oso954 (Jun 23, 2012)

Take a look at the Dewalt DCK235C combo. It has a drill/driver and impact driver w/batteries (18v nicad) and charger. Currently $169 at Lowes or Amazon.
It will out perform the corded drills you have mentioned.


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## itguy08 (Jan 11, 2011)

Oso954 said:


> Take a look at the Dewalt DCK235C combo. It has a drill/driver and impact driver w/batteries (18v nicad) and charger. Currently $169 at Lowes or Amazon.
> It will out perform the corded drills you have mentioned.


That's quite a bit for a NiCad set.

You'd be better off ponying up for the Milwaukee 2697-22CT at $229

Better batteries, better warranty, and more powerful drill and impact driver.


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## jeffsw6 (Oct 28, 2012)

I was able to buy the DCK280C2 combo, which is the DCD780 compact drill and DCF885 1/4" impact driver, plus two 1.5Ah batteries and a charger, for $199. This might have been a "Black Friday deal" but when I saw that price I sure didn't pass it up!

My DCD780 compact drill is not as strong as the "large" 18V one I've had for 12 years or so. It is, however, a lot smaller and has a very comfortable grip. I am not tossing out my big one until all my 18V batteries wear out, at which point I will need to buy the DCD980 "large" 20V drill.

The first task I did with the DCD780 was drill a 3/8" hole in my kitchen cabinet to run a cable for under-cabinet lighting. The cabinet is made of MDF, not hard wood. I used a brad-point bit and it really took some effort from me and the drill to get the hole done. I immediately thought, well, this drill is compact and easier to handle in a tight space; but it is only an addition to my tool kit, it is not a replacement for the larger one.

I had to re-drill to 5/8" to pass a second cable and I used a spade bit instead. It was not as clean but it did do the job.

I have used my 18V "large" drill to put holes in the steel bumper of my truck to install a trailer connector. It has no problem at all doing this. There is no way I would try that with the compact 20V model.


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## fstellab (Nov 15, 2012)

*I finally got a Drill and Impact Drill Set*

Folks,

I saw a good deal on a Porter-Cable PCL212IDC-2 Tradesman 12V Max Cordless Lithium Compact Drill / Impact Driver Combo Kit at the CTO site. 

How did I ever live without these tools, the impact driver made quick work of any screw I have. I have been using both tool every night this week, still has not run out battery, it only takes 30min to charge.

Yes, why did'nt I get the 18v set ? well $$ but more important weight, I like these nice light "green" tools.

I am a very happy camper.

-Fred

p.s do I have to worry about battery memory like the NIcad's ?


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## itguy08 (Jan 11, 2011)

Congrats. I love my impact drivers and also wonder how I did without them.

You can charge LiIon batteries whenever. It is not necessary to drain them or worry about the "memory effect". You really didn't with NiCads either unless you used them for exactly the same amount of time and recharged them at the same time. What killed NiCads and had a similar effect was crap chargers that would trickle charge them endlessly.

So go ahead and charge up whenever you want to! And enjoy the new tools.


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## jeffsw6 (Oct 28, 2012)

fstellab said:


> How did I ever live without these tools, the impact driver made quick work of any screw I have.


What kind of things are you doing with your 12V Impact Driver? I never thought of buying one "that small" but now I wonder if I would like to have one, too.


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## itguy08 (Jan 11, 2011)

I've built (with 1-1/2" to 3" deck screws and 2x4's):
Workbench
Ramp for the shed
Work surface for the shed
Put up pegboard 

I think I get 50-60 screws on a charge and with 3 batteries life is never an issue. I've got an adapter that lets it use 1/4 and 3/8 sockets so for little fasteners it also works great.

I use them for lots of little things around the house - the wife even loves it. If it needs to be screwed the impact comes out. 

The only thing I won't use it for is driving lags - the 18v drill comes out for that. It would do it but it's quicker to zip them in with a socket on a drill.


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## jeffsw6 (Oct 28, 2012)

Sounds like it would be really useful for places the 20V impact won't fit. I'll take a look at them next time I am in the tool section.


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## Jay 78 (Mar 2, 2011)

jeffsw6 said:


> Sounds like it would be really useful for places the 20V impact won't fit. I'll take a look at them next time I am in the tool section.


I'm hoping that when you use the term "20V", it's just to refer to that particular line of DeWalt tools, and not because you think they're actually 20 volts.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

the dewalt 20 volt line isnt actually 20 volts.. they upped the amperage slightly so they claim its 20v.. several trade mags tested them and they perform the same as most other brands 18v lines with the same runtimes


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## jeffsw6 (Oct 28, 2012)

Jay 78 said:


> I'm hoping that when you use the term "20V", it's just to refer to that particular line of DeWalt tools, and not because you think they're actually 20 volts.


A Ryobi rep told me they are actually 18V and explained the batteries may measure 20V when not loaded, hence the "Max." I understand that my truck battery is not exactly 12V, for example, the available voltage varies based on the load and charge state. I can hook up the VOM and watch the voltage from my trailer battery drop when I run the winch or jack.

I understand why DeWalt thinks this is a good way to market the tool. Some people may indeed assume it is "better than 18V" and there is less chance that people will mistakenly assume the 18V series tools have compatible batteries with the "20V" tools.

Even if I did not know this, I wouldn't feel tricked as long as I was satisfied with the tools.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

dewalt focuses way too much on marketing... their old line was.. " revolutionizing tools yet again with....." our new mitre saw... drill.... yet they were simply trying to match what makita, milwaukee or bosch have had out for 2 + years already


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## jeffsw6 (Oct 28, 2012)

Well, I bought the DeWalt miter saw because I am happy with my other DeWalt tools and I did not want to cough up the big bucks for the Bosch "gliding" model. I would say DeWalt's marketing is working well on me. I'm not unhappy with my tools.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

hate to say it though. the dewalt mitre saws cant compete with the bosch models.. i own a bosch 4212L which is a dual compound but doesnt slide and i have 2 dewalt 12" sliders at work.. my bosch is 6 years old hte dewalts are 5years and 2 years old yet cant even compete for accuracy or power. 

the cost thing is usually the deciding factor.. the only thing i like about hte dewalts in comparison is the weight..


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## fstellab (Nov 15, 2012)

*Garage Work Bench, Shelves and Closet Organizer*



jeffsw6 said:


> What kind of things are you doing with your 12V Impact Driver? I never thought of buying one "that small" but now I wonder if I would like to have one, too.


Hi Jeff,

Currently I am building a workshop in my Garage with Shelves any where I have free wall space. I purchased the 12v impact/drill set when I started to build a storage bin for wood stock. I have been using the 12v impact driver with 3" #8 deck screws. They go in so fast, and with so little effort, that I have to be careful not to drill the screw head way down in the wood.

The real test will be when I build a closet organizer for my wife, we are still choosing the hardwood, but I know she will choose the hardest wood around.

-Fred


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## jeffsw6 (Oct 28, 2012)

woodworkbykirk said:


> the cost thing is usually the deciding factor.. the only thing i like about hte dewalts in comparison is the weight..


Cost was definitely it for me. My DW 780 cost $400. I haven't seen the Bosch Glider for less than $680. I would really like to have the Bosch saw but I couldn't convince myself to spend the extra money.


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 25, 2011)

if your going to be using hardwood your better off using dadoes and finish nails screws are really unsightly even with wood plugs used


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