# Finding underground electric wire for driveway lights.



## Marvin Gardens (Sep 30, 2008)

A metal detector would give you a good idea.

There are also utility locater's that do this service if you can't get a hold of a metal detector.


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## 1610 CUB (Jul 19, 2008)

I would think that the installer would have put the lights in equally. Every 6 or 8" or so? Measure any two and you can find the missing ones. When you get close use a probe (chop stick) gently pushed into earth till you find the wire. Thats how I would look for it anyway j


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## mitch21131 (Nov 1, 2008)

*Lights not evenly spaced*

The lights were not put in at even intervals. They were not even put in the same distance from the driveway edge - they are anywhere from 3' to 5' from the driveway edge.


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## Yoyizit (Jul 11, 2008)

If the lamps are drawing current you can make a 12" dia. wire loop with many turns, hooked to headphones, and then (in principle) you will hear the 60 Hz hum. 
The magnetic field given off by the cable may penetrate quite a few inches of dirt.

Also, some studfinders have a wire finding feature but this is not tested for earth penetration.


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## Sammy (Mar 11, 2007)

Dowse for em!

Take two steel wire coat hangers and cut/shape them so you have an "L" with about three inches on one leg and 7-8 inches on the other leg..

Bend the long part of the L so that it is a little more than 90 degrees. 

Hold the two short sides loosely, one in each hand and allow them to droop slightly in front of you. Walk slowly across the yard. As you approach a buried pipe or wire, the hangers will rotate in your hands and attempt to align with the buried line. Try it from two directions across the yard and mark each time you locate something. 

Works better on a wire carrying current but it will also locate water pipes, catv cables etc. 

It really works and is not a joke! 
:thumbup:


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## Wildie (Jul 23, 2008)

Sammy said:


> Dowse for em!
> 
> Take two steel wire coat hangers and cut/shape them so you have an "L" with about three inches on one leg and 7-8 inches on the other leg..
> 
> ...


 I will vouch for what you say!
Over the course of my life, I have had reason to locate buried cable and water etc.
Although, I used magnetic field detectors of various sorts, I always verified the findings by using #10 copper wire bent in an 'L' shape.
I have even used them to find water, before digging a well. And had 100% success.
I believe that the earths magnetic field is distorted by buried objects, and the wires dangling down, are affected by this distortion.


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## Sammy (Mar 11, 2007)

I have found buried lines using that method that utility locators have missed. 

Never have tried copper wires though.. Just used coat hangers cause they were handy. Hmmmm. 

Although back in my treasure hunting days I have heard people say they would coat the tips of the wires with gold if looking for gold etc.


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## gregmac (Mar 10, 2011)

Those of you who can find wires and pipes by "dowsing" (using those metal rods) should run, not walk, to claim the $1 million dollar prize that the James Randi foundation offers to anyone that can demonstrate abilities like this. FYI, it's been unclaimed for many years, despite thousands of people trying (not just dowsing, but other "paranormal" activities as well).


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## Saturday Cowboy (Nov 29, 2009)

THANK YOU. se the wikipedia article on the idio motor effect http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ideomotor_effect


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## Leah Frances (Jan 13, 2008)

gregmac said:


> Those of you who can find wires and pipes by "dowsing" (using those metal rods) should run, not walk, to claim the $1 million dollar prize that the James Randi foundation offers to anyone that can demonstrate abilities like this. FYI, it's been unclaimed for many years, despite thousands of people trying (not just dowsing, but other "paranormal" activities as well).


Good first post, newbie! :thumbsup:


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## Wildie (Jul 23, 2008)

gregmac said:


> Those of you who can find wires and pipes by "dowsing" (using those metal rods) should run, not walk, to claim the $1 million dollar prize that the James Randi foundation offers to anyone that can demonstrate abilities like this. FYI, it's been unclaimed for many years, despite thousands of people trying (not just dowsing, but other "paranormal" activities as well).


 Thanks for the link, it will be money in the bank for me! I'll be signing up immediately!

I made my living as cable locator and I never had a cable damaged by an excavator.
There are commercially built cable locators available, that work in much the same manner a military mine detector.
During my working career I always used electronic detectors and backed up the results with copper rods.
Using these rods isn't witchery, or magical. We live in a world that has magnetic lines running between the north and south poles. Our world is polluted with magnetic lines. Some are natural and others man made. 
Magnetic lines of force are used to make electric motors run, in directional compass's etc. It not a large leap to make a pair of copper wires move in your hand, in much the same manner as magnetic lines cause the copper wires in a motor to move.
Every human being on the earth can be taught to detect the warp of magnetic fields. Its this warp that is the key to the function.

I checked out the link and much to my disappointment, the money is to be paid for demonstrating paranormal ability.
Sadly, using a pair of wires to detect variations in magnetic lines of force, isn't paranormal.


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## Leah Frances (Jan 13, 2008)

:whistling:


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## Saturday Cowboy (Nov 29, 2009)

Wildie said:


> Thanks for the link, it will be money in the bank for me! I'll be signing up immediately!
> 
> I made my living as cable locator and I never had a cable damaged by an excavator.
> There are commercially built cable locators available, that work in much the same manner a military mine detector.
> ...


except copper is uneffected by magnetics 


and by their definition dowsing is paranormal.


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## COLDIRON (Mar 15, 2009)

Wildie said:


> I will vouch for what you say!
> Over the course of my life, I have had reason to locate buried cable and water etc.
> Although, I used magnetic field detectors of various sorts, I always verified the findings by using #10 copper wire bent in an 'L' shape.
> I have even used them to find water, before digging a well. And had 100% success.
> I believe that the earths magnetic field is distorted by buried objects, and the wires dangling down, are affected by this distortion.


"Even by using # 10 copper non magnetic ? "


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## Wildie (Jul 23, 2008)

COLDIRON said:


> "Even by using # 10 copper non magnetic ? "


 I have used #14 copper, but my favorite is a pair of #8 rods that I hang onto.
The lighter the guage, the more they are effected by the breeze.

In a previous post, it was stated that wire coat hangers were used. Iron may have residual magnetism that could possibly effect the behavior of the rods. For instance, if the rods are magnetised, they may be drawn to an survey stake. Which could be good or bad.
The earths magnetic lines will travel via the easiest route, be it water, communications cables, electrical cables and its when the lines bend to travel through an easy route that the rods can be moved.
An analogy that I like to think of, is water poured into a funnel, concentrates the water flow and I think that the earth magnetic lines become concentrated in buried media in the same way. And its this concentration that affects the rods.


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## Stubbie (Jan 7, 2007)

I never say never but an interesting story ... my neighbor always likes to show off, so he purchased a couple wires bent in an L (they look like coat hangers to me). His purpose was to wait for an opportunity to impress me. This opportuntiy presented itself when he asked for my assistance in running a extension wiring run for a couple added irrigation valves he had installed. He had just buried the poly pipe and didnt realize he could just go to the closest valve that worked and use some wires that were unused at that valve. Those wires ran all the way back to the controller so an easy deal. Except he made comment that he didn't know where the pipes were buried for us to cut the sod to bury the new wire. Ahh Haaa perfect time to show me his poly pipe locator. It was amazing how those coat hangers magically found the poly pipe.....:wink: 

Personally I like this one. I think it doubles as a radio when your not using it.

.


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## Leah Frances (Jan 13, 2008)

Stubbie said:


> Ahh Haaa perfect time to show me his poly pipe locator. It was amazing how those coat hangers magically found the poly pipe.....:wink:


:laughing:


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## Wildie (Jul 23, 2008)

Stubbie said:


> I never say never but an interesting story ... my neighbor always likes to show off, so he purchased a couple wires bent in an L (they look like coat hangers to me). His purpose was to wait for an opportunity to impress me. This opportuntiy presented itself when he asked for my assistance in running a extension wiring run for a couple added irrigation valves he had installed. He had just buried the poly pipe and didnt realize he could just go to the closest valve that worked and use some wires that were unused at that valve. Those wires ran all the way back to the controller so an easy deal. Except he made comment that he didn't know where the pipes were buried for us to cut the sod to bury the new wire. Ahh Haaa perfect time to show me his poly pipe locator. It was amazing how those coat hangers magically found the poly pipe.....:wink:
> 
> Personally I like this one. I think it doubles as a radio when your not using it.
> 
> .


 Thats quite interesting. I've been considering mounting my copper rods in handles, much in the same way as this device.

The first time I ever seen rods used, my friend a plumber demonstrated the technique to me!
He had me stand in the middle of his kitchen. A copper drain pipe for the kitchen sink ran below the floor, under my feet.
The rods remained parallel until he turned on a tap and water ran down the drain. As the water ran the rods pulled together and when it was turned off they swung away again. Then, when the water turned back on, the rods pulled together again.


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## COLDIRON (Mar 15, 2009)

Can't wait till Easter because the bunny will be bringing lots of eggs and candy.


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## Leah Frances (Jan 13, 2008)

COLDIRON said:


> Can't wait till Easter because the bunny will be bringing lots of eggs and candy.


This isn't a battle a skeptic can win. You called them out, pointed them towards a good reference, I'd save your breath if I was you.

I'm-a-'friend'-of-Randi-too


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## COLDIRON (Mar 15, 2009)

Leah Frances said:


> This isn't a battle a skeptic can win. You called them out, pointed them towards a good reference, I'd save your breath if I was you.
> 
> I'm-a-'friend'-of-Randi-too


:huh:


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## Wildie (Jul 23, 2008)

Using the copper rods can be entertaining! :yes:

The rods are made from a length of copper, about 24" each. They are bent into an L shape the foot being about 8" long.
The idea is to hold them in your hand, in a similar fashion to holding a pistol.
Try to hold these as loosely as possible, to avoid having friction interfere with their movement.
Holding rods about 6" apart, the long ends pointing forward. To learn how to use these, its best to practice on a known target, such as a buried cable that you know where its located.
Go to a point that is about 10 feet from the target, start walking towards it, holding the rods as I previously directed.
As you cross over the target, the rods swing in, towards each other, then once past they open up again. :wink:

There are some people out there who believe in witchcraft, so try to avoid using this procedure, in their presence, as they may wish to burn you at the stake.


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## k_buz (Mar 22, 2012)

Start at an existing light, dig carefully, and follow the wire. That is about the only thing you can do. If these are line voltage post lights, you will need to install accessible junction boxes where the lights have been removed.


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## techpappy (Jul 8, 2012)

A little off topic but wen I built my house 20 yrs ago I asked three well drillers to witch the area where I was interested in placing the well. All 3 of them used different apparatus/ - apperati? to find water..2 were of the hand held wire type while the third one was a very large iron construction bar that you balance across your index finger and the second one over from it ..hold it by your side and when over the water the front of the bar dips toward the ground ..I tried it and it worked! Don't know if it would work for metal detection too....BTW all three found the same location ...there was water at 50 feet but too much sand then hit the gravel and acquifer at 120 feet...great water 10 gpm.


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## bobelectric (Mar 3, 2007)

My well driller said where I live, he hits water 99% of the time. Hit at 50 'drilled 150' Best water until mining came through. Mingo Creek is still flowing.


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