# Very little auto knowledge, found flange nut in wife’s hubcap.



## Daniel22 (Nov 27, 2020)

I have essentially no mechanical knowledge, but like to learn about things when given the chance. My wife’s 2017 explorer has has a rattling sound in the left rear tire. So today I popped off her hubcap and found a large flange nut (I think) in the center of the wheel. Can’t figure out via Google what this might have been attached to/purpose it serves and how series of an issue it is/how difficult or expensive to fix. Anyone able to help?


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

Maybe a picture of the wheel with out a hubcap would help.Did you check to see if a lug nut was missing?


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## Daniel22 (Nov 27, 2020)

Daniel22 said:


> I have essentially no mechanical knowledge, but like to learn about things when given the chance. My wife’s 2017 explorer has has a rattling sound in the left rear tire. So today I popped off her hubcap and found a large flange nut (I think) in the center of the wheel. Can’t figure out via Google what this might have been attached to/purpose it serves and how series of an issue it is/how difficult or expensive to fix. Anyone able to help?
> View attachment 634986


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## Daniel22 (Nov 27, 2020)

Daniel22 said:


> I have essentially no mechanical knowledge, but like to learn about things when given the chance. My wife’s 2017 explorer has has a rattling sound in the left rear tire. So today I popped off her hubcap and found a large flange nut (I think) in the center of the wheel. Can’t figure out via Google what this might have been attached to/purpose it serves and how series of an issue it is/how difficult or expensive to fix. Anyone able to help?
> View attachment 634986


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## Daniel22 (Nov 27, 2020)

Nealtw said:


> Maybe a picture of the wheel with out a hubcap would help.Did you check to see if a lug nut was missing?


Just posted under original post. No lugnut missing


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

Daniel22 said:


> Just posted under original post. No lugnut missing


That is a hub cap I want to see the wheel?


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## Daniel22 (Nov 27, 2020)

Nealtw said:


> That is a hub cap I want to see the wheel?


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

Daniel22 said:


> View attachment 634989


Take the hub cap off and take a picture of the wheel?


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## Mike Milam (Mar 3, 2017)

I'm pretty sure that's the axle nut. I wouldn't drive it until you pull the wheel. The axle likely has slid back into the hub bearing. That is not safe to drive. Jack it up and put some jack stands under it. Look behind the brake and steering knuckle and you will probably find the axle has slid inboard. You should be able to push it back into the hub and put the nut back on.


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## Daniel22 (Nov 27, 2020)

Mike Milam said:


> I'm pretty sure that's the axle nut. I wouldn't drive it until you pull the wheel. The axle likely has slid back into the hub bearing. That is not safe to drive. Jack it up and put some jack stands under it. Look behind the brake and steering knuckle and you will probably find the axle has slid inboard. You should be able to push it back into the hub and put the nut back on.


Ok I’ll give that a go. Thanks!


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## Mike Milam (Mar 3, 2017)

This is more than you need, but it will show you the setup.

rear axle shaft 2017 explorer - YouTube


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## Daniel22 (Nov 27, 2020)

Mike Milam said:


> This is more than you need, but it will show you the setup.
> 
> rear axle shaft 2017 explorer - YouTube


Alrighty thanks sir.


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## raylo32 (Nov 25, 2006)

Holy cow, batman, how did that axle nut come loose on its own?? That is pretty scary.


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## chandler48 (Jun 5, 2017)

That is a rather large nut, but aren't hub nuts usually castle nuts with cotter pins through them? Or am I too old to know about new cars?


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## raylo32 (Nov 25, 2006)

I was thinking the same thing... but most of those I remember like that were the fronts on RWD cars that did not have any drive halfshafts. I did work on a VW bug way back when and the rear drive wheels had big castle nuts. But I don't recall if they had cotter pins.



chandler48 said:


> That is a rather large nut, but aren't hub nuts usually castle nuts with cotter pins through them? Or am I too old to know about new cars?


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## huesmann (Aug 18, 2011)

Watch one of Mike Milam's videos; apparently these rely solely on the torque to keep them in place—no cotter, no staking. Looks like about 120 ft-lb.


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## raylo32 (Nov 25, 2006)

Man, if it were me I think I'd apply a little blue Loc-tite. Interesting you mention staking. I have never done that except on motorcycles.



huesmann said:


> Watch one of Mike Milam's videos; apparently these rely solely on the torque to keep them in place—no cotter, no staking. Looks like about 120 ft-lb.


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## Jackofall1 (Dec 5, 2010)

How long has she been driving around hearing that noise, it is surprising the whole assembly didn't fall off. Did she recently have any work done, I have never heard or seen anything like that, usually it take a pretty big impact gun to remove that nut from the axle.


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## Mike Milam (Mar 3, 2017)

Jackofall1 said:


> How long has she been driving around hearing that noise, it is surprising the whole assembly didn't fall off. Did she recently have any work done, I have never heard or seen anything like that, usually it take a pretty big impact gun to remove that nut from the axle.


Yep, in that video shows the guy using a long breaker bar to get that nut loose. Locktite is a great idea and I should have mentioned that.


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

chandler48 said:


> That is a rather large nut, but aren't hub nuts usually castle nuts with cotter pins through them? Or am I too old to know about new cars?





chandler48 said:


> That is a rather large nut, but aren't hub nuts usually castle nuts with cotter pins through them? Or am I too old to know about new cars?


It's an axle not a spindle. A spindle nut is not torqued but is used to adjust the wheel bearing.


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## Jackofall1 (Dec 5, 2010)

Nealtw said:


> It's an axle not a spindle. A spindle nut is not torqued but is used to adjust the wheel bearing.


Nope disagree with that analysis, spindle nuts are castilated and housed in a dust cap, that is definately an axle nut.


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

Jackofall1 said:


> Nope disagree with that analysis, spindle nuts are castilated and housed in a dust cap, that is definately an axle nut.


Sounds like you are agreeing with me.


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## Jackofall1 (Dec 5, 2010)

Here for those who need a picture of an Ford Explorer front axle.....no bearing adjustment here just hold the front assembly together. @Nealtw spindle typically carry the bearings and the castilated nut adjusts, axles usually pass through a splined assembly which carries the bearings, at least thats how I have see them. Tomato ,,,,, Tomaato


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

Jackofall1 said:


> Here for those who need a picture of an Ford Explorer front axle.....no bearing adjustment here just hold the front assembly together. @Nealtw spindle typically carry the bearings and the castilated nut adjusts, axles usually pass through a splined assembly which carries the bearings, at least thats how I have see them. Tomato ,,,,, Tomaato
> View attachment 635048





Jackofall1 said:


> Nope disagree with that analysis, spindle nuts are castilated and housed in a dust cap, that is definately an axle nut.


I guess you missed the part where I was answering a question posed by @*chandler48*


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## Jackofall1 (Dec 5, 2010)

Nealtw said:


> I guess you missed the part where I was answering a question posed by @*chandler48*


Ah yes says the blind man 👀


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## Nealtw (Jun 22, 2017)

Jackofall1 said:


> Ah yes says the blind man 👀


I see said the blind man as he picked up his hammer and saw.


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## LawrenceS (Oct 21, 2020)

Ok am I the only one who doesn't see an axle in his photo with the wheel cover removed?

Lastly is your explorer 2 wheel drive? Because it I'm not seeing an axle and it looks like ford might have gotten lazy and used AWD rear hub assembly's for 2WD vehicles because it kind of looks like there is a rusty splined hole in the middle of the hub assembly like it has never had an axle in it. Chrysler has been doing it for years.

In which case if it is 2WD it looks like someone was playing a prank on you.


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## lenaitch (Feb 10, 2014)

I gave up when post 3 showed an alloy wheel and post 4 showed a hub cap.


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## LawrenceS (Oct 21, 2020)

lenaitch said:


> I gave up when post 3 showed an alloy wheel and post 4 showed a hub cap.


No that looks like some dumb **** ford would do, as you can see there is no actual "Hub cap" or center cap as people call them and look at the brake dust accumulation on the wheel. I'm assuming it's probably some intermediate appearance package where they can use painted alloy wheels on the lower trim and make them look fancy with chrome wheel covers on the appearance package. I know the older fusions had steel wheels that were 5 spoke design with matching spoke wheel covers versus the standard drilled hole steel wheel.


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## AngelArs (Sep 8, 2012)

Daniel22 said:


> Can’t figure out via Google what this might have been attached to/purpose it serves and how series of an issue it is/how difficult or expensive to fix. Anyone able to help?
> View attachment 634986


Should be a wheel on the other side of the car that you can compare it to. When you say "f_ound a large flange nut (I think) in the center of the wheel._" does that mean *you* took this nut off the center? Other wise how would you know where it was? That nut needs to stay on the wheel, and it needs to be torqued a specific amount with a torque wrench. Do not drive this car before proper installation.

As Jackofall1 has mentioned, usually you need special tools to remove that nut, and I also have never seen nor heard of one coming off by itself. Those nuts are *NOT* reusable once they are removed, and you will need to buy a new one before installation for safety purposes.


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## AJean (Aug 21, 2018)

AngelArs said:


> Should be a wheel on the other side of the car that you can compare it to. When you say "f_ound a large flange nut (I think) in the center of the wheel._" does that mean *you* took this nut off the center? Other wise how would you know where it was? That nut needs to stay on the wheel, and it needs to be torqued a specific amount with a torque wrench. Do not drive this car before proper installation.
> 
> As Jackofall1 has mentioned, usually you need special tools to remove that nut, and I also have never seen nor heard of one coming off by itself. Those nuts are *NOT* reusable once they are removed, and you will need to buy a new one before installation for safety purposes.


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## AJean (Aug 21, 2018)

AJean, post: 6353426, member: 549161"]

I tend to think the most prudent thing to do is take the car back immediately to the last place that worked on that tire or anyone who may be responsible for working on that quadrant of the car if that is applicable. If not, take it to your qualified mechanic, explain the situation and, when resolved, ask them to explain what they can about it. If you know little about cars/mechanical you won't be able to correct this on your own and it could be dangerous if not repaired correctly.. so let it be a learning experience. Probably either a mechanic who was repairing this part of the car left the nut unbolted or untightened, or it came loose and landed there. Whatever it was,, it looks like it needs to be fixed pronto by a knowledgeable and skilled mechanic.. That's what i would suggest.


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## raschwar (Nov 22, 2020)

AJean said:


> AJean, post: 6353426, member: 549161"]
> 
> I tend to think the most prudent thing to do is take the car back immediately to the last place that worked on that tire or anyone who may be responsible for working on that quadrant of the car if that is applicable. If not, take it to your qualified mechanic, explain the situation and, when resolved, ask them to explain what they can about it. If you know little about cars/mechanical you won't be able to correct this on your own and it could be dangerous if not repaired correctly.. so let it be a learning experience. Probably either a mechanic who was repairing this part of the car left the nut unbolted or untightened, or it came loose and landed there. Whatever it was,, it looks like it needs to be fixed pronto by a knowledgeable and skilled mechanic.. That's what i would suggest.


That _is_ the axle nut. I've removed them before. They are essential. Before driving at least put it back on TIGHTLY. They are meant to be used only once and should be replaced, especially if it came off. Also it requires a lot of torque to tighten securely. Don't remember off-hand but it's close to 200 ft/lbs. Definitely should not have come loose.


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## Mike Milam (Mar 3, 2017)

axle nut 258 ft lb torque


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## LawrenceS (Oct 21, 2020)

AJean said:


> AJean, post: 6353426, member: 549161"]
> 
> I tend to think the most prudent thing to do is take the car back immediately to the last place that worked on that tire or anyone who may be responsible for working on that quadrant of the car if that is applicable. If not, take it to your qualified mechanic, explain the situation and, when resolved, ask them to explain what they can about it. If you know little about cars/mechanical you won't be able to correct this on your own and it could be dangerous if not repaired correctly.. so let it be a learning experience. Probably either a mechanic who was repairing this part of the car left the nut unbolted or untightened, or it came loose and landed there. Whatever it was,, it looks like it needs to be fixed pronto by a knowledgeable and skilled mechanic.. That's what i would suggest.


Knowledgeable skilled mechanic here, see avatar showing that I'm an ASE L1 master tech. Also go back and look at my first reply.

I don't know if I'd call big sockets special tools.


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## huesmann (Aug 18, 2011)

Maybe not special, but uncommon. People who don't do lots of axle work don't have them.


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## raylo32 (Nov 25, 2006)

Sounds about right. Back when I was a lad just starting to wrench a few of us got a clapped out VW and decided to overhaul the engine. We could not remove the axle nuts with the available tools. After a few beers I came up with the idea to let the ground stop the ratchet or wrench and drive the car... forward for one side and reverse on the other to break the nuts loose. Worked like a champ. The engine after we "overhauled" it? Not so much.



Mike Milam said:


> axle nut 258 ft lb torque


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## Mike Milam (Mar 3, 2017)

raylo32 said:


> Sounds about right. Back when I was a lad just starting to wrench a few of us got a clapped out VW and decided to overhaul the engine. We could not remove the axle nuts with the available tools. After a few beers I came up with the idea to let the ground stop the ratchet or wrench and drive the car... forward for one side and reverse on the other to break the nuts loose. Worked like a champ. The engine after we "overhauled" it? Not so much.


I've put a piece of pipe on a strong arm many times, lol.


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## raylo32 (Nov 25, 2006)

That's what I do these days. I have a few different lengths and diameters of cheater pipes around. Although I am not sure they would work well with the axles on a manual tranny car since that amount of torque might overpower the parking brake. That may have been the issue we had... I just don't remember that well, except for finally driving the car to crack the nuts. Had a similar issue once upon a time on the crank bolt on a Pontiac big block V8 with 4 speed... torque spec was ~200 lb ft. Again, I don't recall how I locked the car down whilst tightening that. But I do remember at first it was trying to move... and wanting to come off the jack stands.



Mike Milam said:


> I've put a piece of pipe on a strong arm many times, lol.


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## surferdude2 (Nov 21, 2019)

The guess the disc brake caliper helped kept the hub/wheel assembly from falling off. All the cars I've had lately have had staked nuts in that application. I agree with the blue 242 Locktite application for the OP's situation but tightening it properly is probably all that's needed. >200 ft lbs. = long breakover or cheater pipe.


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