# Laser Level Advice



## Mr Chips (Mar 23, 2008)

I picked up a Black & Decker set at one of the big box stores years ago. Came with a tripod and TWO levels (one cross-line and one single line) I think they were closing it out cheap, has served me well around the house


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

Shaotzu said:


> Any thoughts/opinions/other options? Not looking to spend a ton, but if it speeds work along or accuracy, $200 isn't a big deal.


A good level and a chalk box is all you need.


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## oh'mike (Sep 18, 2009)

kwikfishron said:


> A good level and a chalk box is all you need.


I agree----Spend the money on something more useful--You will be happier.


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## Mr Chips (Mar 23, 2008)

kwikfishron said:


> A good level and a chalk box is all you need.





oh'mike said:


> I agree----Spend the money on something more useful--You will be happier.


For the homeowner, who is often working alone, a laser level and tripod is a pretty useful tool. I use mine a lot more then I ever expected to. The ease of use and accuracy can't be beat. If you don't imagine you'll use much once the basement is done you might want to look into renting one, but I think a laser is the way to go for what you're doing. Sure, you could do without it and be fine, but it's going to make life a lot easier, especially for a DIY'er working alone.


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## oh'mike (Sep 18, 2009)

I own a few myself,however only the layout lazers see much action. (tile layout)


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## DexterII (Jul 14, 2010)

Going back to layout, I agree that sometimes simpler is better, or at least as good as. A dumpy level, laser level, transit, or whatever, often has limitations in a basement, due to obstructions, lighting, etc., so many times it is actually faster and easier with a level, framing square, tape measure, and some basic math. A lot depends on how straight and square your walls are, but I often start out with a mason line and a couple of bricks, just to get a rough idea of what I am working with, and once I've checked out what I consider to be critical, start chalking lines. For 90 degree corners, don't forget the fact that they are 3-4-5 triangles, and that opposing angles are the same. In my opinion, that's easier than trying to cut an angle with an electronic device, and certainly accurate enough for what you are doing.


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## Shaotzu (Mar 22, 2011)

Agree completely on the level, square, math, and chalk - those will be done as well! And really, that's one reason why I'm thinking of only a $200 or so purchase - it's not going to be a main workhorse by any stretch. But, $200 is an easy purchase IF it can help speed things along anywhere and that's why I'm looking at it. My main concern is the ceiling line in which I'm thinking a laser might be easier and straighter than string and more accurate than a 48" level . . . As for 90-degree walls, the laser would just be an assist, and as mentioned previously, for a solo DIY guy - anything to help the work is a good investment. At the same time, I found a $1200 laser level set . . . I wouldn't even begin to know what to do with it, and THAT is definitely overkill!

Oh, and I figure a cross-line laser will be helpful for later as well (another reason to justify the purchase) - hanging and tiling, so why not. Again, $200 isn't a huge investment, so I'm good with that. However, if anyone has some experience that a certain level is or isn't worth it, or that they aren't any good until you spend $400+, then I'll go with the old tools without hesitation.


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

Shaotzu said:


> they aren't any good until you spend $400+


Setting up foundations.:thumbsup:

Large commercial acoustic ceilings.:thumbsup:

Layout laser for tile as mentioned.:thumbsup:

For these applications the laser is well worth the investment.

You will not save time but in fact will spend more time using a laser to plumb a wall, create a line on a surface or just about anything else construction related.

Looks great on TV, you can have the straightest row of pictures on the block. But truly a laser wont save you any time on a remodel.

They can be a fun toy (cats love them) and it’s your money but your $200 would be better served on a purchase of a new router or some other tool that has some real worth IMO.:yes:


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## fixrite (Mar 1, 2009)

I have that bosch unit and it is a great asset to me. Although I might use mine more than you as I do reno's for a living it will not let you down. I have only good to say about that unit.


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## Shaotzu (Mar 22, 2011)

Thanks for the advice everyone. I actually went ahead and made two purchases to start my framing work:

1) Laser Level
2) Plumb bob

I added both to my spirit levels, chalk lines, corner squares, tape measures, etc. Honestly, the store has a 30 day return and I figure if the laser level doesn't get used much in the next week or so, I'll take it back (no restock fee or anything, so little risk there). So far, it seems like it is helpful in assisting in the solo jobs that might have been easier with two people as well as helping to get straight lines without chalking. I've already used it to test lay some lumber out as well as finally hang a medicine cabinet in my bath. Double checked the cabinet work with the my standard level, and it was straight!!! LOL

My hope is to start framing here in the next week, so the usefulness of the level will be decided there. If it works - great . . . if I don't find it helpful or useful and am still using the spirit level every 5 minutes, I can send it back and spend the $200 on something else. So far though, it's an extra set of hands and has been helpful.


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## dvatt (Mar 18, 2009)

People r posting to many negatives about lasers bc they don't understand how to use them to their advantage bc they r noobs.

Buy a good one.


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## Ron6519 (Mar 28, 2007)

It's a basement wall, not a space shuttle component.
A simple square and the 3-4-5 triangle methodology will work fine.
Ron


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## Bud Cline (Mar 12, 2006)

I have a rotary laser that will scope a horizontal line on a wall or turn and scope a floor or ceiling. It is super beneficial and takes less time than a spirit level trying to run around a room.

I also have a cross hair laser that will layout both a horizontal and vertical line on a wall at the same time. Love it!

I think they are well worth the money and they don't cost that much these days.

What is most important is that you have a solid mount. Some of the tripods and extendable poles leave a lot to be desired when it comes to wobble created by a rotary level.


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

dvatt said:


> People r posting to many negatives about lasers bc they don't understand how to use them to their advantage bc they r noobs.
> 
> Buy a good one.


Well count me in as one of the noobs.

Give me any examples of an advantage that a laser will give you in building walls that simple basic tools of the trade won’t. :whistling2:


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## Shaotzu (Mar 22, 2011)

Bud Cline said:


> I have a rotary laser that will scope a horizontal line on a wall or turn and scope a floor or ceiling. It is super beneficial and takes less time than a spirit level trying to run around a room.
> 
> I also have a cross hair laser that will layout both a horizontal and vertical line on a wall at the same time. Love it!
> 
> ...


Photographer here so I know the importance of a good tripod! And I love the fact that mine has mounts for both tripod mount screws!!!


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## Bud Cline (Mar 12, 2006)

Actually my laser tripod is one I have had for about forty years. It is left over from my old photography days. Solid as a rock, extendable legs suitable for a sod planting with rotary head and elevator along with tilt. Makes a helluva laser tripod.


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## dvatt (Mar 18, 2009)

kwikfishron said:


> Well count me in as one of the noobs.
> 
> Give me any examples of an advantage that a laser will give you in building walls that simple basic tools of the trade won’t. :whistling2:



For starters-How can you tell if a concrete floor is level without using a laser level? You think you can just drag around your 6 ft level????


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

dvatt said:


> For starters-How can you tell if a concrete floor is level without using a laser level? You think you can just drag around your 6 ft level????


If the concrete floor is what it is, level or not and your building a wall on it how is a laser going to help?

I never said there is no place for lasers in construction. If you would have read the entire thread you would see that.

OP is building a few walls and thought he needed to spend a couple hundred bucks on a laser to assist in having plumb, square, and straight walls. You do not need a laser to do this and my opinion is that the $200 could be better spent on something more useful to assist with finishing the basement.

I can’t think of even one contractor I’ve ever known that uses a laser to frame walls, not to say is hasn’t been done.


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## dvatt (Mar 18, 2009)

I use them to frame. Attach bottom plate to the floor. Shoot laser up to attach top plate secure and then install studs


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

dvatt said:


> I use them to frame. Attach bottom plate to the floor. Shoot laser up to attach top plate secure and then install studs


You can do it any way you choose.:thumbsup:

My answer stays the same. You don’t need to spend $200 on a laser to frame a wall.:no:


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## dvatt (Mar 18, 2009)

Buy used for 50......


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## Shaotzu (Mar 22, 2011)

Thanks for all the advice everyone. And after having framed everything up with the exception of a spot where I need a gas line moved, I can say this about the laser level.

Is it necessary? Absolutely not.

Did it help? Most definitely.

The big thing that it did for me was provided an easy way to lay out lines while working solo. The wife normally would be a great help, but at 8 months pregnant, she was chasing the toddler around and left me to my own destructive devices in the basement.  Yes, I used a plumb bob, a 4' level, a straight 2x4, a steel square, speed square, math, sharpie and chalk line quite a bit too, but the laser line was helpful!

Now, was it worth $200?

Honestly, if I was only going to be using it for framing the basement and had help, it would have been a fun gadget, but not much more. For solo work, it helped speed a lot of things along and I'd put it as a good tool to have around, so I'm glad I had it.


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## pwilson2011 (Sep 13, 2011)

I used a rotating laser level for pipe work in my basement to get everything level - it was a pacific laser system - worked like a dream


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## 12penny (Nov 21, 2008)

...doing a basement now. I work alone for the most part. Have for years. A bob, a tape, an assortment of good levels and the occasional straight 2x is all I've ever used and IMHO thats all thats required. 

All this talk of not being able to build straight, plumb walls without a laser is disheartening to say the least.


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## Daniel Holzman (Mar 10, 2009)

I picked up a combination laser level and rotating laser for under $100 at a big box closeout. Never figured it would be useful, but I am a sucker for tools. Well guess what. I found that rotating laser invaluable when I laid out my deck, it gave me a line I used to set the top of the footings and to cut off the posts. Of course I could have done it with a transit or a level, but I work alone most of the time, so the rotating level was great.

Here is another oddball use for a laser. I do a lot of work checking for sag in beams. Shooting a laser parallel to the beam allows me to check deflection solo, works really well. Can also be used to measure how far out of plumb a wall is by using the rotating laser in a vertical orientation. This is very difficult to do solo quickly and accurately any other way.


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## Tom Struble (Dec 29, 2008)

kwikfishron said:


> You can do it any way you choose.:thumbsup:
> 
> My answer stays the same. You don’t need to spend $200 on a laser to frame a wall.:no:



then again your level seems to spend quite a few days off:jester:


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

Tom Struble said:


> then again your level seems to spend quite a few days off:jester:


Smart level knows... there’s no reason to show up if it’s only purpose that day would be creating eyesores. :whistling2:


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## Tom Struble (Dec 29, 2008)

at least the windows will work:thumbsup:


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## Willie T (Jan 29, 2009)

You Techies would laugh at me using my water level...... but I would be done setting up a ceiling (or chair rail... or window sills, etc.) in six rooms before you finished getting ready to shoot the third room.

Water Level= One setup anywhere in the house, and just drag a tiny hose around to any room, anywhere. Every mark identical.

Laser= Reset every time you may not have 'line of sight'. A real pain in a cut-up house with a ton of rooms.

Lasers have their purpose, but I probably use a stick level (or water level) more.

Water levels aren't a problem to read in bright sunlight either. Some lasers are.

Also, set up that water level in a safe, undisturbed place, and just leave it sitting for days. (Like inside a linen closet) It will always be there, ready to give you the exact same elevation mark anytime, anywhere.

BTW, "Yes", I do have a couple of lasers. One is specifically for transferring a mark on the floor to the ceiling directly overhead (chandeliers)


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

I still use a water level when working alone (no one to hold the stick) setting up decks.

I do have a laser I use quite often on walls but that’s just to see how high I can get the cat to jump.


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## Willie T (Jan 29, 2009)

A friend and I bought identical water levels years ago. They are 'trick' jobs with adjustable, graduated tape scales on the reading end. He just completed a beautiful masonry and wood fence down his property line with his. He set up a semi-permanent block pedestal at the center point of the fence, and just plopped his water level up there each morning or afternoon that he felt like working. Took him something like two or three months to get the thing done, but in all that time he never had to even bother to check the level position each day. (Although, I'm sure he still did.)


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## TrapperL (Jul 23, 2011)

I can see in a remodeling scenario a laser won't bring much value to the game. In new work, we are required to furnish the builder with a State required document showing the elevation changes across a new slab in a 10 foot gradient. I use a laser for that and shoot it at a 5 foot gradient. This gives the builder the advantages of knowing exactly what the grades were before the framing starts. From those numbers, any changes in the slab can be noted across the warranty period. Sometimes we find a slab out of level over the accepted 2% +/-. Most of the builders won't let us build on a slab that's 1 1/4" out. The laser makes this easy to find. We also use the laser for the high dollar homes to straighten any crooked studs before insulation/drywall. These homes are in the million dollar bracket and the builders pay handsomely for a 100% straight wall that only a laser can provide. Same goes for cabinet blocking, just putting it in the area doesn't get it on a high dollar home- they want it like cabinet work. There's a ton of uses for a laser but you have to know how to use one. Otherwise, they are an expensive toy. My rotating unit is a Hilti and I think I paid about $3500. for it. It's paid for itself many times already.


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## Dave88LX (Nov 10, 2011)

Willie T said:


> A friend and I bought identical water levels years ago. They are 'trick' jobs with adjustable, graduated tape scales on the reading end. He just completed a beautiful masonry and wood fence down his property line with his. He set up a semi-permanent block pedestal at the center point of the fence, and just plopped his water level up there each morning or afternoon that he felt like working. Took him something like two or three months to get the thing done, but in all that time he never had to even bother to check the level position each day. (Although, I'm sure he still did.)


I've never used a water level but have watched some videos on how to use them. Does evaporation play a part in them over time, or how does that work?


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

Dave88LX said:


> Does evaporation play a part in them over time, or how does that work?


The water gets dumped when you're done. Fill it up again the next time.


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## Dave88LX (Nov 10, 2011)

kwikfishron said:


> The water gets dumped when you're done. Fill it up again the next time.


Oh, I was under the impression that each day he went out to work on the fence and continued on with the level where he left off.


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

Dave88LX said:


> Oh, I was under the impression that each day he went out to work on the fence and continued on with the level where he left off.


I guess I should have read the quote. :laughing:


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## Dave88LX (Nov 10, 2011)

Quotes -- how do they work!:whistling2::laughing:


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