# Why is wood always grainy/not smooth after I paint/coat it?



## Track (Apr 9, 2011)

I'm new to painting wood, although I have some experience painting walls.

I like to use white wood/metal paint or just simple glaze to give the wood a deeper color and sheen.

But no matter how much I sand it (with my Bosch professional sander), then wipe and wash it under water..

After I paint, once it's dry, it's always extremely grainy and no longer smooth.

If anyone could help me with this, I would appreciate it very much!


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## Millertyme (Apr 20, 2010)

If you are using a water based latex paint the water in the paint will raise the grain. Some woods, such as southern yellow pine, will raise grain more than others. switch to an oil based paint and use a good primer also. After the 1st coat a light sanding with 220 grit sand paper will also help.


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## user1007 (Sep 23, 2009)

It does sound like you are trying to skip the primer. This is especially important for new wood. I like solvent based alkyd primers designed as enamel underlays. You can paint either oil or latex finishes over them.


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## Track (Apr 9, 2011)

sdsester said:


> It does sound like you are trying to skip the primer. This is especially important for new wood. I like solvent based alkyd primers designed as enamel underlays. You can paint either oil or latex finishes over them.


Hah.

What is this "primer"? I'm not aware of it.


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## user1007 (Sep 23, 2009)

Track said:


> Hah.
> 
> What is this "primer"? I'm not aware of it.


Primer has the sole purposes, in this case, of sealing the wood, blocking stains from knots, etc. and bonding a nice uniform layer of film to the surface. This film, especially if something like an enamel underlay, evens out the wood surfaces and provides something the paint will adhere too perfectly.

Typically, a professional paint job consists of a coat of primer and two coats of finish. 

I like solvent based alkyd primers for new wood but their are latex primers that work just as well. You cannot usually put oil based finishes over latex primers though. You can put either oil or latex over alkyd.


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## Track (Apr 9, 2011)

sdsester said:


> Primer has the sole purposes, in this case, of sealing the wood, blocking stains from knots, etc. and bonding a nice uniform layer of film to the surface. This film, especially if something like an enamel underlay, evens out the wood surfaces and provides something the paint will adhere too perfectly.
> 
> Typically, a professional paint job consists of a coat of primer and two coats of finish.
> 
> I like solvent based alkyd primers for new wood but their are latex primers that work just as well. You cannot usually put oil based finishes over latex primers though. You can put either oil or latex over alkyd.


No, I'm definitely using latex paint, which I guess you could call my 'finish'.

Could you link me to a 'primer'? I'm having small difficulty finding some. Do they come in different colors, or is it like silicone?


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## jsheridan (Jan 30, 2011)

Track said:


> I'm new to painting wood, although I have some experience painting walls.
> 
> I like to use white wood/metal paint or just simple glaze to give the wood a deeper color and sheen.
> 
> ...


I figure I'll be the first, surprisingly, to ask the question, in a loud voice, Why are you washing wood under water?


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## Track (Apr 9, 2011)

jsheridan said:


> I figure I'll be the first, surprisingly, to ask the question, in a loud voice, Why are you washing wood under water?


:laughing:

I can't think of a better way to remove the saw-dust left on it.


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## DangerMouse (Jul 17, 2008)

I use water to raise the grain for final sanding, but MY question would have to be: Why aren't you using a filler if you have heavily grained wood? (oak, for instance) Fill, sand and paint and you'll have a glassy finish!

DM


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## DangerMouse (Jul 17, 2008)

Track said:


> :laughing:
> 
> I can't think of a better way to remove the saw-dust left on it.


They have this MARVELOUS new invention now called a "vacuum cleaner"!

DM


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## bobtheblindguy (Dec 21, 2009)

I wouldn't run water over the wood to remove sawdust. That definitly will raise the grain. A vacum like DangerMouse suggested to get the majority off then wipe the wood with a tack cloth. You can find them in any paint dept. A good sealer is important. Go to your local paint store ( not home center) and ask for a good latex sealer for wood. After priming you could go over it with some fine steel wool 000. This will help smooth out the grain that the sealer raised. Then paint.


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## Track (Apr 9, 2011)

DangerMouse said:


> I use water to raise the grain for final sanding, but MY question would have to be: Why aren't you using a filler if you have heavily grained wood? (oak, for instance) Fill, sand and paint and you'll have a glassy finish!
> 
> DM


I'm confused as to what a "filler" is.

I hear the words "sealer", "filler", "primer", "varnish", and I just don't know how to make heads or tails of it.



DangerMouse said:


> They have this MARVELOUS new invention now called a "vacuum cleaner"!
> 
> DM


You know, you don't have to use sarcasm. I understand your message perfectly, I swear.



bobtheblindguy said:


> I wouldn't run water over the wood to remove sawdust. That definitly will raise the grain. A vacum like DangerMouse suggested to get the majority off then wipe the wood with a tack cloth. You can find them in any paint dept. A good sealer is important. Go to your local paint store ( not home center) and ask for a good latex sealer for wood. After priming you could go over it with some fine steel wool 000. This will help smooth out the grain that the sealer raised. Then paint.


I just didn't think that a cloth could remove 100% of the tiny wood particles, where as water always could. I did not think of the fact that it could raise the grain from inside the wood..

I don't know what would constitute a "local paint store" in Manhattan. I just go to Home Depot, and usually I find what I need.

Steel wool, huh? I have some, but never thought of using it.

Would it have the same effect of fine-grit sand paper?

Really, what I'm looking for, is leaving a wallpaper-smooth feel, almost plastic-like on my wood, using white paint.


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## DangerMouse (Jul 17, 2008)

..........................

Dm


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## Red Squirrel (Jun 29, 2009)

Ahh, Home Depot. Are you using Behr paint? If that's the case you can prime while you paint and paint while you prime! 

I don't have any experience with that paint but I think the others can outline some of their experiences. 

To brush off saw dust I usually just use a brush. A vacuum will work good too (probably better).


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## DangerMouse (Jul 17, 2008)

Sorry about the sarcasm. Google paste wood filler. Follow the directions and it'll be smooth as glass.

DM


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## user1007 (Sep 23, 2009)

I bought Benjamin Moore products inside of higher end hardware stores up and down both sides of Manhattan. The units were more than a paint department.


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## Track (Apr 9, 2011)

Red Squirrel said:


> Ahh, Home Depot. Are you using Behr paint? If that's the case you can prime while you paint and paint while you prime!
> 
> I don't have any experience with that paint but I think the others can outline some of their experiences.
> 
> To brush off saw dust I usually just use a brush. A vacuum will work good too (probably better).


No, I'm not using Behr. Now that you mention it, I remember the commercial. :laughing:

I would rather do it properly my first time. So, I need a primer and then paint.



DangerMouse said:


> Sorry about the sarcasm. Google paste wood filler. Follow the directions and it'll be smooth as glass.
> 
> DM


Don't worry about it. The internet makes people feel closed in.

When I google "wood filler" all I get is that product that fills in damaged wood.


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## Brushjockey (Mar 8, 2011)

I just have to say- you're looking for a glass like finish a pro would have to work at , and you haven't a clue. Sorry to be blunt, but you have set your sights pretty high...


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

Brushjockey said:


> I just have to say- you're looking for a glass like finish a pro would have to work at , and you haven't a clue. Sorry to be blunt, but you have set your sights pretty high...


 
I have been painting for 30+ years and still cannot get a glass like finish without a sprayer. Rinsing wood under water certainly would not help the situation


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## Track (Apr 9, 2011)

Brushjockey said:


> I just have to say- you're looking for a glass like finish a pro would have to work at , and you haven't a clue. Sorry to be blunt, but you have set your sights pretty high...


I disagree. There is nothing here that tells me that there is a specific skill that needs to be honed to get a smooth finish.

It's all about technique and I'll find it.


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## Track (Apr 9, 2011)

chrisn said:


> I have been painting for 30+ years and still cannot get a glass like finish without a sprayer. Rinsing wood under water certainly would not help the situation


I'm afraid I'm not too good with sprays. I can't get it to coat evenly. I get a similar result if I were to slap a huge gob of paint onto the wood..


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## user1007 (Sep 23, 2009)

Then be realistic about what you really hope to accomplish with your skill set and materials availed. Here is one primer I like for woodwork. It is alkyd so you can use either oil or water base finishes over it. 

If you are painting your trim a color you can tint the primer to 40 percent of the finish coat paint color formula.


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## Brushjockey (Mar 8, 2011)

Track said:


> I disagree. There is nothing here that tells me that there is a specific skill that needs to be honed to get a smooth finish.
> 
> It's all about technique and I'll find it.


The specific skill , knowledge and technique is what it all is. 
Best of luck.


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## Tom Struble (Dec 29, 2008)

Brushjockey said:


> The specific skill , knowledge and technique is what it all is.
> Best of luck.


 
that should only take 30 to 40 years to find:thumbup:


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## Track (Apr 9, 2011)

Brushjockey said:


> The specific skill , knowledge and technique is what it all is.
> Best of luck.


The technique comes from the knowledge. As for the skill, the meaning of it is subjective.

My point is, with the proper knowledge, it would only take a few months to develop perfectly repeatable results, not 30 years.

This is not heart surgery.

I thank you all, and will go find some primer.


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## chrisn (Dec 23, 2007)

Track said:


> The technique comes from the knowledge. As for the skill, the meaning of it is subjective.
> 
> My point is, with the proper knowledge, it would only take a few months to develop perfectly repeatable results, not 30 years.
> 
> ...


Now that statement is just wrong, it does take years, many of them, to develop acceptable results for us that are being paid to do a professional job. For you're intent, maybe not, maybe.

and if you keep dunking you're wood under water, it will take a lot longer:laughing:


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## 747 (Feb 11, 2005)

If you want interior wood to stand out. Zineers bulleyes oil based primer. Then go with a good oil based paint. Zineers make the best primers. Non oil base primer bulleye 123


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