# Screws in framing?



## jomama45 (Nov 13, 2008)

Standard screws don't have the sheer strength of a framing nail, UNLESS they are made specifically for framing. Framing screws are hard to find & far more expensive than nails though.


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## kwikfishron (Mar 11, 2010)

jomama45 said:


> Standard screws don't have the sheer strength of a framing nail, UNLESS they are made specifically for framing. Framing screws are hard to find & far more expensive than nails though.


Not to mention nails are fast, screws are slow. Although I use screws here and there in remolding. Sometimes you just can’t get a nail in there.


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## CrpntrFrk (Nov 4, 2008)

Most people thinks screws are stronger. As mentioned the right type of screw will do but lots of people use the wrong type of screws. Most of them do not have the shear strength that a nail does. Drive say a 2 1/2" drywall screw down till there is only a 1/2" still exposed and then do the same with a 8d sinker. Take your hammer using a sideways swing hit the screw and nail head. Usually the screw head will snap and the nail will bend.


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## Daniel Holzman (Mar 10, 2009)

Oh the misunderstood screw. The shear strength of a steel screw or nail is controlled by the ultimate tensile strength of the steel itself, and the diameter of the screw or nail. A screw with the same root diameter as a nail, made of the same type of steel, is just as strong in shear, and a great deal more resistant to pullout. The key is to measure the ROOT diameter of the screw, not the THREAD diameter. Since the root diameter is always smaller than the thread diameter, comparing a screw with a thread diameter of 1/8 inch to a nail with a 1/8 inch diameter is incorrect, and can lead to the misunderstanding that screws are not as strong in shear.

Nails are certainly faster to install, however in critical applications like attaching roof sheathing to rafters in high wind (read hurricane or tornado zones), screws beat equivalent sized nails hands down for performance. For framing of non-critical members, nails are simpler and faster, but there is a place for screws. Check out the Simpson catalog, there are numerous types of framing rated screws described in there, and a few of their hangers require screws.


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## CrpntrFrk (Nov 4, 2008)

Daniel Holzman said:


> Oh the misunderstood screw. The shear strength of a steel screw or nail is controlled by the ultimate tensile strength of the steel itself, and the diameter of the screw or nail. A screw with the same root diameter as a nail, made of the same type of steel, is just as strong in shear, and a great deal more resistant to pullout. The key is to measure the ROOT diameter of the screw, not the THREAD diameter. Since the root diameter is always smaller than the thread diameter, comparing a screw with a thread diameter of 1/8 inch to a nail with a 1/8 inch diameter is incorrect, and can lead to the misunderstanding that screws are not as strong in shear.
> 
> Nails are certainly faster to install, however in critical applications like attaching roof sheathing to rafters in high wind (read hurricane or tornado zones), screws beat equivalent sized nails hands down for performance. For framing of non-critical members, nails are simpler and faster, but there is a place for screws. Check out the Simpson catalog, there are numerous types of framing rated screws described in there, and a few of their hangers require screws.


So once again...... the point is to get the right type of screw......


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## troubleseeker (Sep 25, 2006)

As posted, screws (especially drywall) are very brittle and do not have much shear strength. If you want to see this, drive a drywall or deck screw and a 16d nail about half way into a piece of wood and try to bend them over with a hammer. The screw will immediately snap off, while the nail will bend over until it lays flat on the wood.


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## rsclark67 (Jan 31, 2010)

Thank you all! Would you consider *deckmate* screws as a framing screw?


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## Skoorb (Oct 6, 2009)

Bump, because thread is not that old 



> If you want to see this, drive a drywall or deck screw and a 16d nail about half way into a piece of wood and try to bend them over with a hammer. The screw will immediately snap off, while the nail will bend over until it lays flat on the wood.


Although an interesting test here is another one:

Drive a drywall or deck screw (drywall are more brittle, though) and a 16d nail about half way into a floor joist. now use a pair of pliers to grab onto the bottom and see which one can hold your weight.

Diameter of thread root and nail aside, nails are more pliable and less prone to break when under shear forces, but they have far worse tensile, since they'll simply pull out, though a ring shank will hold well. Which is better for framing a structural wall I don't know--I'm inclined to say nails, since that's what code typically prefers, if not literally mandates.

Framing a non structural wall like for a basement finishing it seems to me screws have a benefit because they're more likely to avoid pulling out as the wood settles/dries in the wall. I'm doing mine now and have used screws--specifically deck mate--in most walls. I do prefer working with screws out of habit and replacing studs if necessary is obviously a thousand times easier because it can just be unscrewed.

Certainly none of the few hundred screws put in have snapped as the wood has dried out further.


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