# Asbestos concern when wiring old house



## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

Maybe if you do it every day all day. Doing one job every now and then will pose no lasting health risk.....IMO.

If it concerns you wear a respirator when you are near the stuff.


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## fw2007 (Jul 11, 2007)

Thanks for your opinion. I think the respirator is a good idea regardless of asbestos, as there is a lot of dust in those places.
For the most part, I will avoid running wiring in the same wall space as plumbing, but it appears that at least one receptacle that I want to rewire, and use as an access to bring up new lines does have the hot water heat pipes in the same space.

FW


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## 220/221 (Oct 9, 2007)

Get rid of it while you are up there.

If a home inspector ever sees it you wil pay thousands to have it removed.

I did mine when I repiped it 20 years ago and I'm still alive.


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## joed (Mar 13, 2005)

Wet it. Don't work it dry. It's the dry fibers in the air that are the problem.


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## 220/221 (Oct 9, 2007)

I used a sawsall to cut my old asbestos insulated plumbing out.:jester: 


I pulled my tshirt up over my nose/mouth and tried to hold my breath.


People were tougher in the olden days.:laughing:


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## USP45 (Dec 14, 2007)

joed said:


> Wet it. Don't work it dry. It's the dry fibers in the air that are the problem.


Thats right. We had to get certified for asbestos and lead. If you need to work around it use a spray bottle filled with water and plenty of dish liquid. The soapy water will help bond the fibers and keep them from getting airborn. water by itself is fine but evaporates too quick. The soap will last longer.


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## billie_t (Feb 17, 2008)

1 fibre sucked into your lung is enough to cause you irreversable damage...once one is in your lung..you can never get it out..it is too fine...you can not cough it up....it can move around and cause scar tissue that will shorten your breath or worse....it can take up to 25-30 years to show up any damage...it is not to be taken lightly....sure teh oldtimers never wore any protection and they are still here...well some are..some are dead because of it

leave it alone and have it professionally disposed of

if you have been exposed...dont take it home to your family...dispose of your clothing in the proper manner...shower... and make a report (at least in canada) to your employer so you have it recorded with WSIB in case you develop problems in the future

work safely


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

billie_t said:


> 1 fibre sucked into your lung is enough to cause you irreversable damage...


THE SKY IS FALLING!!! :laughing: 






billie_t said:


> and make a report (at least in canada) to your employer so you have it recorded with WSIB in case you develop problems in the future


Your attorney thanks you. :whistling2:


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## billie_t (Feb 17, 2008)

Speedy Petey said:


> THE SKY IS FALLING!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


tell that to my latest x-ray petey...30 years in the iron work trade and i have high amounts of scar tissue in my plural plaques and 1 nodule in my lower left lung.. all confirmed to be from asbestos...and i never touched the stuff..but worked in the vicinity of inuslators insulating the buildings i helped erect...30 years ago they put this stuff everywhere because it worked and was cheap...now they know how bad it is but people like you refuse to believe it....it is not safe to be around if it gets disturbed...do a little research on it...1 fibre CAN kill you .... maybe it won't but the chance is there...

so you are right...the sky is falling...dont let it land on you!


*below is just a littel reading for you to start pete*
*People may be exposed to asbestos in their workplace, their communities, or their homes. If products containing asbestos are disturbed, tiny asbestos fibers are released into the air. When asbestos fibers are breathed in, they may get trapped in the lungs and remain there for a long time. Over time, these fibers can accumulate and cause scarring and inflammation, which can affect breathing and lead to serious health problems (6). 
Asbestos has been classified as a known human carcinogen (a substance that causes cancer) by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, the EPA, and the International Agency for Research on Cancer (2, 3, 7, 8). Studies have shown that exposure to asbestos may increase the risk of lung cancer and mesothelioma (a relatively rare cancer of the thin membranes that line the chest and abdomen). Although rare, mesothelioma is the most common form of cancer associated with asbestos exposure. In addition to lung cancer and mesothelioma, some studies have suggested an association between asbestos exposure and gastrointestinal and colorectal cancers, as well as an elevated risk for cancers of the throat, kidney, esophagus, and gallbladder (3, 4). However, the evidence is inconclusive. 
Asbestos exposure may also increase the risk of asbestosis (a chronic lung disease that can cause shortness of breath, coughing, and permanent lung damage) and other nonmalignant lung and pleural disorders, including pleural plaques (changes in the membrane surrounding the lung), pleural thickening, and pleural effusions (abnormal collections of fluid between the thin layers of tissue lining the lung and the wall of the chest cavity). Although pleural plaques are not precursors to lung cancer, evidence suggests that people with pleural disease caused by asbestos exposure may be at increased risk for lung cancer (9). 
*


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

billie_t said:


> so you are right...the sky is falling...dont let it land on you!


 I CERTAINLY will not. :thumbsup: 

Working with it or around it every day is a FAR different thing than "one fiber". I mean let's get real. 
I too have seen it sprayed all over buildings, just like today's foam. I bet it was nasty back then for those working with it or around it day in and day out.

Today I just am careful not to disturb it and it does not disturb me.


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## billie_t (Feb 17, 2008)

i am glad you make a point not to disturb it..i was just replying to the original poster who asked if he should be concenred about disturbing it..i did now want to lead him or anyone else to think they will die instantly from being near it..but caution on the safe side...the fibres are so small---1000 yes one thousand times thinner than a human hair....they can be airborn and you cant even see them....if you move a bat of this insulation to get to a wire and are as careful as you can possably be...you will still likely be breathing it without even knowing it..in fact if you go in any attic you should wear breathing protection...once there..if it is asbestos...leave ... or at least read about the stuff...weigh the risk and proceed with at least the knowledge of what you are really dealing with...there..im done..to the relief of many i suppose..but i hope i have caused some young man to reconsider lilft that asbestos batt

billie


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## elkangorito (Sep 10, 2007)

billie_T is correct. A tiny amount of asbestos can kill you.

In Australia, all the horror stories have been revealed via the James Hardie fiasco. This company happily sold asbestos products without any warnings whatsoever. As a matter of fact, they insisted that it was harmless for a long period of time.

The use of asbestos products is now totally banned in Australia & thanks to the government, most of the population are fully aware of the hazards.

To all those who think, "A little bit is not a problem", go ahead...suck in a "little bit" of asbestos dust & then just hope that you don't die a most miserable death.

The below link is an Australian site but "asbestos is asbestos"...anywhere in the world. The documents on this site may be of some assistance for people who need to handle it. Also, there are about 3 types of asbestos, all of which can kill you.

http://www.ascc.gov.au/ascc/AboutUs/Publications/NationalStandards/ListofNationalCodesofPractice.htm


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## fw2007 (Jul 11, 2007)

Wow! Seems like I hit on a sensitive issue!
I have been living in this house a long time. I'm 52 now, but who knows.
I never got close to the pipe wrapping, knowing well that it might contain asbestos.
I figured best thing was to leave it alone, and it didn't seem to be falling apart.

I will follow your advice and spray with soapy water, and wear the respirator.
So far I have seen it only on small areas of pipe, not along the entire length.
Perhaps the previous owner removed what was there. The vast majority of our pipes are clean.

About how much can kill you; I think it's kind of like smoking. Some can smoke for an entire lifetime and never get cancer, while others who smoked as kids and quit get cancer in their 50's.

When I was a kid we lived in a house that had asbestos shingles. We replaced many of them, having to cut them with a hacksaw. It was always outdoors, so I am sure the risk is lower, but if we had known then what we know today, no one would have worked with the stuff.
Our current home has asbestos shingles too, but we haven't touched anything.

Thanks for the heads-up on asbestos inspection when selling the home.

FW


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## pcampbell (Feb 7, 2008)

I still haven't found a great respirator. Can someone suggest one. Price isn't a huge concern. The biggest problem I have is if I wear a respirator, googles fog up. Seem to be able to only wear one or the other and both are very important.


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## Maintenance 6 (Feb 26, 2008)

Speedy Petey said:


> THE SKY IS FALLING!!! :laughing:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You'll think the sky is falling in 10 years if, god forbid, your wife or kids come down with a lung disease. You'll be wondering if YOU caused it by doing something irresponsible by sawzalling pipe insulation. If you think holding your breath helped, then realize that microscopic asbestos dust can remain airborne for months, and when it settles on a surface it can become airborne over again when disturbed. And a T-shirt pulled over your face hardly qualifies as a filtering device. Asbestos was and still is an excellent insulator. It is a naturally occuring element. Everyone breathes a certain amount of fibres during thier lifetime. If the material is in good condition, the best thing you can do is leave it in place and encapsulate it or protect it. Wrap it with something if you have to work around it temporarily. If you are going to work in an area that you suspect may have residual dust present, wear at least a well fitting half mask respirator with P100 cartridges. Wet down dust with soapy water. The soap doesn't make the dust "stick" together, it breaks the surface tension of the water and allows it to penetrate better. And don't hand your dusty clothes to your wife to clean. That was one of the problems with shipyard and construction workers. They wore their dirty clothes home so thier wives and kids could be exposed to the same risks they had at work. If you've ever seen asbestos fibres under a microscope you'll know that they are shaped like irregular splinters with barbs and hooks on them. The same qualities that allow them to stick together so well to make certain products is what makes them especially dangerous, in that once they stick to lung tissue they won't dislodge. Since the body can't dissolve them, it begins to encapsulate them as they are an irritant. If you are lucky the encapsulation process won't turn cancerous, but it can lead to asbestosis. Most people I've run into are poorly informed about asbestos. They tend to think that since it doesn't make you sick immediately that the danger is over rated or that it is something produced by the devil himself. Respect it and it won't bite you. I hate to see someone hurt themselves because of thier ignorance. I hate even more to see someone pass thier ignorance and arrogance along. I'll get off of my soapbox now.
P.S. I'm certified as an asbestos contractor/supervisor for over 10 years.


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

Maintenance 6 said:


> You'll be wondering if YOU caused it by doing something irresponsible by sawzalling pipe insulation.
> 
> That was one of the problems with shipyard and construction workers. They wore their dirty clothes home so thier wives and kids could be exposed to the same risks they had at work.


No, I am obviously not stupid enough to sawzall through the stuff, give me SOME credit.

Here you go.....ship yard workers.....insulation sprayers.....pipe fitters and insulators......people working with it ALL day all the time. 
This equates to bar tenders never smoking a cigarette in their lives, yet coming down with lung cancer due to smoke inhalation. 

It's the chicken little folks who make regular folks think that if they even look at the stuff they will instantly get cancer.





Maintenance 6 said:


> P.S. I'm certified as an asbestos contractor/supervisor for over 10 years.


So you have a vested stake ($$$$$$) in making sure folks are aware of how dangerous it is. Just like the lawyers and insurance folks.


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## billie_t (Feb 17, 2008)

fw2007 said:


> Wow! Seems like I hit on a sensitive issue!
> I have been living in this house a long time. I'm 52 now, but who knows.
> I never got close to the pipe wrapping, knowing well that it might contain asbestos.
> I figured best thing was to leave it alone, and it didn't seem to be falling apart.
> ...


how much can kill you.....well if you are unlucky 1 fibre..if you are lucky..it will never hurt you if you breath a bushel of it

in your home if it is undisturbed and left in your attic you will be safe

if you have real concerns, read about this stuff, that is the best thing to do...just like everything else you attempt...your own wiring...your own building...you wouldn't (i dont think) tackle these jobs without some prior knowledge or study....treat your asbestos the same...you have now been told by someone besides me this stuff CAN be dangerous....so now it is up to you to see how dangerous it can be

i will tell you this..worst case...if you were in your attic and walked on the rafters and they were covered with asbestos..you have allready put fibres in the air...on your clothes and in your hair...you dont have to see dust to be contaminated (even a little) the fibres are so small (1000 times thinner than a human hair) just brushing against them can send them into the air...now you wear your resperator..and do your work lifting the asbestos batts and replacing them carefully..job done and you are fine....you crawl back downstairs. and throw your itchy clothes in the hamper... (they are contaminated) ..your wife picks them up and gives them a shake before throwing them in the washer..she has now released some into the air..she may inhale a few....your toddler runs in to see what mommy is doing..she inhales a few too....life goes on...you are now 70 years old..healthy as a horse never a problem....your wife is still right beside you also healthy..but you are now both standing with your grand kids at the side of your 50 year old daughters grave..she died from asbestos, and as far as you know...she has never been near the stuff!....i hope this never happens but that is how asbestos can work.....you can suck in a barrel and never have a complication..or you can breath one fibre and in 25 or even 50 years it can kill you


if you choose to work haphazardly around this stuff with no concerns remember,,,the life you take may not be your own!...be careful out there


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## fw2007 (Jul 11, 2007)

As far as I know, the only place I will find any asbestos in my home is on the heating pipes, and that has mostly been removed way before we bought the house 35 years ago.
The only that remains is wrapped around some of the pipes in the basement where they go up into the walls. 

In the attic, we have bats of fiberglass insulation. I know that's what it is because I put it there. I hope fiberglass doesn't prove to be as dangerous as asbestos, or we're all in trouble, as we use the attic for storage, and some of the bats are falling down now.

We have Rockwool blown into the upstairs walls and between the joists of the attic floor.
I only hope that when the asbestos was removed from the pipes in the basement that it was done properly. When we bought the house in 1972, there were no laws about asbestos.

FW


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## PBX11 (Mar 29, 2008)

*Asbestos*

Hi,

There appears to be a mixture of speculation, flippancy and hysteria connected with this subject, this is typical when dealing with asbestos.

Each case and the risks associated need to be looked at on an individual basis.

Yes asbestos is dangerous however the amount of exposure will be linked to the type of asbestos, condition, activity, location and duration of the work being carried out.

Most laymen will not recognise the majority of asbestos products, over 500 have been used here in the UK, I suspect many of the same ones used in North America.

The best advice is simple, do not disturb suspected products, get them tested or have a survey. You can then make an informed decision.

Apart from the obvious health effects spreading asbestos around your home will cost much more to clean up than removing it in-situ in say the basement. I have seen £3000 asbestos removal projects escalate to £200,000 on professional sites.

Good luck


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## elkangorito (Sep 10, 2007)

As I type this post, there are thousands of Australians dying of asbestosis. A large percentage of these people are/were not people who worked in an industry that used asbestos products. These people were "home renovators". There was one tragic story on telly about a woman who recently died from Asbestosis. She only helped her husband cut asbestos sheets (for their house) for 2 days. 20 years later, she fell ill.

Go and find an Australian & ask them about asbestos. They will not tell you things like "you'll be ok if you don't work with it all the time". They'll probably say, "Don't go near that stuff unless you know what you are doing."

Quite simply, ANY amount of asbestos dust is bad. Smart people will adopt a zero tolerance for any kind of asbestos dust.


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## jrclen (Feb 20, 2008)

We jump in our automobiles every day and zip off to work or shopping or even (heaven forbid) to the local bar for a few beers. We thing nothing of it at all. We put on a seat belt to protect us.

Some of us here are working electricians. Go find some movies about "arc flash." If we were like some of the chicken littles around here, no electrical work would get done at all.

But some are petrified of things like asbestos. This makes no sense to me. There are lots of things in this world that can "get you." No one every made it out of this world alive.

My uncle worked in an factory that used asbestos. He said the air in the shop was thick with the dust. No masks or respirators were even thought of back in those bad old days. When the big scare hit, he worried a lot about asbestosis. He was obsessed with it for a few years. He lived to old age, had both legs amputated, and eventually died, due to diabetes. My point is, he worried himself about the wrong thing.

Be aware of the hazard, take proper precautions, use approved methods for dealing with it.


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## billie_t (Feb 17, 2008)

jrclen;
Be aware of the hazard said:


> the above statement says it all...and all the "chicken littles" have have told you the hazards with asbestos
> 
> one fibre if you inhale it and it makes it to your lungs...will NEVER be expelled from your lung...if you are LUCKY and it stays in one place and your body makes a growth over it and it doesnt turn to cancer you will not die from it
> 
> ...


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

How do some of you get by every day??? Worried about ONE fiber? You know how many things in this life _MAY_ harm you????????? 

I bet you are all the same folks who go/went to bars wher the smoke hung thick and you cam home smelling like you just smoked three packs. Or how about the ones who DID/DO smoke two or three packs a day. HOW can you live with all those cancerous smoke molecules in your lungs??????  



Gee, billie, it's really curious how you conveniently left all the other parts out about how folks dealt with this stuff EVERY DAY for YEARS and never got sick, nor did their families get sick. 
This whole thing is typical of anything that is done to excess for LONG periods of time. If you deal with certain things every day for years chances are those things will have an effect on you or your health.


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## Nhrafan (Mar 2, 2007)

I just can't help but wonder if all the tiny little fibers can become so airborne how much is being blown out into the neighborhood when i turn on my whole house fan and it blows through the attic and out the gable vents? Are people polluting the entire neighborhood when this happens?
Believe me, I am in NO way trying to start anything by this but it makes me think. If there is so much talk about 1 fiber causing hell for people isn't there a great chance that your breathing at least 1 per day from some kind of source?
i have a boatload in my attic I'm sure because the house was built in 65 and the insulation says Johns Manville on it. Wonderful, I thought the first time I saw it, now I wonder. I mean we store things up there and go up and down a few times a year. I'm assuming we are disturbing and kicking this up every time. Then I turn on the whole house fan during the summer and that blows right up into the attic creating a huge draft which goes right out the gable vents. 

Wonder how many other houses are like this all over the world??


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## billie_t (Feb 17, 2008)

Speedy Petey said:


> How do some of you get by every day??? Worried about ONE fiber? You know how many things in this life _MAY_ harm you?????????
> 
> I bet you are all the same folks who go/went to bars wher the smoke hung thick and you cam home smelling like you just smoked three packs. Or how about the ones who DID/DO smoke two or three packs a day. HOW can you live with all those cancerous smoke molecules in your lungs??????
> 
> ...


i did say in an earlier post that you could breath a bushel of the stuff and never have a reaction petey..and then i also said you could breathe in one fibre and get sick or die from it..and i will agree that a one time exposer may not harm you (that is the scary part..may not) the part you dont seem to understand or want to argue on is that a one time exposer can kill you.... if you were to read up and learn about this stuff you may see that is is much more dangerous than you seem to believe..

as for your cigerette smoke i guess it can work the same way ..if you search the net you can find medical facts that link smoking and 1200 deaths per day in the USA..this is a small number of actual smokers and you seem to think that is ok by your last post...i am glad i, at least dont have to take that risk and i treat smokes as i do asbestos..i try to keep away from it ..i know there are many things that can kill us through our lungs besides cigarette smoke and asbestos but i choose to at least to illiminate these two

i did not want the original question poster to take this stuff lightly (as it seems you do) so i posted the gravest dangers to him in hopes that he would investigate on his own and learn about it..and i see others have posted after me ..some agreeing and some (like you) disagreeing makes for a good informational discussion

i see you related asbestos to working on electricity..well i bet you would not work on high voltage lines while hot without the proper protection...i hope .. becasue you learned not to do it from books or teaching..but if you did and had an "arcflash" and got away with it you would chalk it up to experience and not likely do it again...there is a big difference between this and asbestos...when you work with asbestos hap hazardly and get exposed...it may be too late for a second chance..the damage (fibres in your lungs) may allready be present 

in closing i would like to make it clear..i will agree with you that long time exposer does increase your risk...but..i still stick to my original post that a one time exposer is a lower risk.. but can and has lead to many breathing disorders...asbestosis...mesothelioma..and cancer

if you are going to play in this stuff..LEARN all you can before you start


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## bofusmosby (Apr 30, 2007)

OK, now you got ME thinking. Gezz. Did they ever put this stuff in plaster? The plaster I am working with right now (my home) is from the 1920s, and it looks like a stucco finish, really thick. Please say it wasn't ever used in plaster?


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## billie_t (Feb 17, 2008)

bofusmosby said:


> OK, now you got ME thinking. Gezz. Did they ever put this stuff in plaster? The plaster I am working with right now (my home) is from the 1920s, and it looks like a stucco finish, really thick. Please say it wasn't ever used in plaster?


it may well be in 1920s plaster..i dont know how much and i dont know how often..and i cant say for sure your's has it...but i am sure some on this site would say go ahead knock it off..sweep 'er up and go on with your life..something is going to kill you someday anyway

i would say treat it with respect...take a small piece (handled safely) and have it tested (i have read tests are done for 20 or 30 bucks)..then you can make an informed decision on how to proceed

i have also read that some plaster can contain from 6 to 20 percent asbestos

i dont want you to be as petey has called me ..a chicken little ..the sky is falling...kind of guy..but please do get some education on this stuff..and get your plaster tested ..you may find it has none and i hope that is what you find...but if you find it has asbestos in it you can also find out how to proceed with your alterations in a safe manner

good luck


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## jrclen (Feb 20, 2008)

Worry and stress will kill you too. Medical fact. No IFs involved. :whistling2:


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

jrclen said:


> Worry and stress will kill you too. Medical fact. No IFs involved. :whistling2:


And a LOT quicker than asbestos will. :whistling2:


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## billie_t (Feb 17, 2008)

Speedy Petey said:


> And a LOT quicker than asbestos will. :whistling2:


yep it will..go see your doctor and before he gives you any medication he will try and find out what is causing it and see if he can get you away from it... go and tell him you dont presently smoke but think you might like to try it cause it looks like fun and you dont think you wills moke more than a few day..see what he says..i bet he says if you dont smoke now I recomend you dont start...now tell him you know your attic is full of asbestos insulation but you need to do some wiring up there and you are going up without any protection or any thought about how you might be transporting it down into the house but you think because it will be a one time thing you dont think it will hurt you...he will likely say something like....it may not hurt you but i dont recomend doing it that way..you should hire professionals...or come in and tell him you have allready done your work in the asbestos filled attic and wonder if there is any concern...he willl likely write that you had an exposer in your chart and then tell you..naw..not likely anything to worry about but dont do it again.....then a year or two when you go back to him for a check up he will give you the once over..declare you perfectly fit and as you are putting your shirt back on ..and he is writing your good numbers in your chart he will see his remarks on your exposer and say to you....when was the last time you had a chest xray..i think we will send you in for one..just to be on the safe side...now why would he do that..maybe he is concerned for your health


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

You know Billie, I read like the first few words of that and then just stopped. :laughing:


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## billie_t (Feb 17, 2008)

Speedy Petey said:


> You know Billie, I read like the first few words of that and then just stopped. :laughing:


good..that means we can quit


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## jrclen (Feb 20, 2008)

billie_t said:


> good..that means we can quit


Sounds good to me. :thumbsup:


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## Maintenance 6 (Feb 26, 2008)

I don't think anyone on here said you should worry about one fibre. All the "chicken littles" on here want you to do is make an informed decision about whether you choose to protect yourself. As I said earlier, respect the stuff and it won't bite you. Disrespect it and it still may not bite you, but the odds start to shift. My grandmother had a trivet made of the stuff that she used in her kitchen for years and she's 92 now. Everyone can point to the person who worked around it for years and never had a problem. Same with the guy who smoked 3 packs a day and died of old age. But the statistics won't back you up. The last breath you took, probably included an asbestos fibre. Stand on a street corner while an older car comes to a stop and you'll inhale a few. They don't all stay in your lungs. If you sawzalled it off of a heat pipe, how many thousand fibres do you think you inhaled? How many of those thousands did you exhale? How many stayed stuck in your lung tissue? Same with crumbling floor tile and textured plaster ceilings and a whole host of other products including high temperature wire insulation. It's all a matter of odds. I hold an asbestos abatement certificate, but I only do it on company owned properties, so I don't have any financial interest in abatement one way or the other.
In response to the plaster question: Yes plaster can have it. Dpending on the area you live in. Where asbestos processing was close by, it was sometimes used in place of gypsum. It can be found in drywall, drywall compound, common in 9x9 floor tiles, sheet vinyl flooring, all types of insulating products. Textured plaster is notorious for containing it. Wiring insulation on stoves and boilers, caulking, lots of roofing products. Anything constructed up into the mid 1980s may have it somewhere. If you choose to have a product tested, make sure the lab can test using the PEL method. They will send you a report on the type of asbestos present if any, and the percentage quantity present in the bulk sample. Anything over 1% is considered an abestos containing material. If you have it in your home, and it's in good condition, leave it alone. It is an excellent product...... if you respect it.


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## bofusmosby (Apr 30, 2007)

Well, the problem with my plaster, is part of it is falling, and a few weeks ago, I had to use a circular saw to cut the edges (trying to save as much as I can, being an historical house) and when I was cutting it, the dust was so think, like a very thick smoke. I was wearing a mask, but I know that I was breathing this stuff in. Now, I have completely stopped, trying to find a place in Tampa Florida to test this stuf. Well, if there IS this stuff in my plaster, I know that in time, I may be a gonner. This same type of textured plaster is in the living room, as well as the dining room. My concern also is if this stuff gets a positive result, I have no idea as to how I can ever afford to have it taken care of. I know that this work isn't cheap.

I'm not the type to panic like chicken little, but I try to look at it realistically. If its there.... "Houston, we have a problem".....


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## Krichton (May 2, 2006)

I lived with my grandparents as a small child in the 70s all the way into my early 20s. The floor was covered with vinyl tiles which I can only assume contained asbestos since it had been there for as long as I could remember. The tiles would chip and break occassionally so I definately breathed in whatever was in the air. Didn't know anything about asbestos then. I also ripped up about 2 square feet of vinyl flooring 2 years ago in my current apt. At the time I didn't think nothing of it but after learning about asbestos I had the tile analyzed and it contained 25% Chrysotile asbestos fibers. I wonder how badly I've fcuked myself on that one.


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## jrclen (Feb 20, 2008)

The only asbestos that can possibly harm you is air born particles. That which is locked up in floor tile and other solids is completely harmless. But you should be very leery of riding in cars and buses. Now THAT is dangerous.


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## handifoot (Feb 19, 2006)

I would like to weigh in on this subject. The world of science and medicine deals in predictions based on large numbers of people over long periods of time. After data are studied then risk groups are identified. Rarley will you read in medical journals that, A causes B. You can save those kind of statments for the evening news, (fear report)
What does this mean for you? Small exposures to known carcinogens may place you in a slightly higher risk group than the guy who has never been exposed at all just the same as driving your car 100 miles a day increases you risk of a motor vehicile accident than the guy who drives 5 miles a day. I don't think anyone would tell you not to drive because driving causes accidental deaths.
Anecdotal information is of no use. We all know someone who likes to quote a story that they know a person who smoked every day of their lives and lived to be 97 so you can't tell them that smoking is bad for you. Same sort of thinking. The world's just not that black and white.
My advice to you, and everyone, would be minimize or eliminate your exposure to asbestos, wear a saftey belt and get plenty of fiber in your diet. Most of all, think criticaly based on evidence, not emotionally based on fear.


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## bofusmosby (Apr 30, 2007)

I spoke to the guy from Accukits LLC, and will be sending him a sample tomorrow. I DO hope that there was none of the asbestor in my plaster, but I can't help being concerned. I was also informed how to eleminate a lot of the dust (Hepa vac) and he also told me about using "wet-wipes" to get the dust (and asbestos) cleaned up to a certan degree, he also stated that even IF I have been exposed to a high amout, the exposure over a few weeks in not nearly as bad as working with this for years. He told me to not worry, and just send in the samples. Well, I will do this, and I will post back the results when I get them. Its funny, my wife isn't even concerned?????

Thanks for the info on asbestos......I think.


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## billie_t (Feb 17, 2008)

thought i was done here..but one more time..

there are many true statements in earlier posts..but this one... "one exposure will not kill you" is likely a safe bet..... but not a true statement

i will agree totally..."one time exposure is likley nothing to worry about"

now these are also true...if (and it is likley) that your one time exposure created dust in the air and you inhaled it...that some asbestos fibres made it to your lungs...these fibres will cause damage..enough to kill you ..not likley but damage will be done.

once an asbestos fibre in in your lung..it NEVER comes out

you should not let a one time exposure worry you to death..but you should ..if you never (that you know of) have been exposed..KEEP IT THAT WAY

if you have been exposed and have questions..ask your doctor..and read about all the research and make informed decisions on what you should do in the future..do not let neither us "chicken littles" or those whom think it is nothing to worry about make your choices for you...there have not likely been many (or any) experts on the subject post any comments yet

i have been in an asbestos study for the last two years..i have been educated first hand by experts (allthough that doesnt make me one) and am passing along information i have been given...believe it or not.... it is your health


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## bofusmosby (Apr 30, 2007)

Well billie_t, if there is asbestos in my plaster, I am worried. This is why I am trying to find out the truth about what may have happened. The dust was so thick, if there is asbestos, then I KNOW I got one heck of an exposure. Am I concerned??? YES. I googles asbestos, and the various pages I read said NOTHING about plaster. Well, thanks to you guys here on this forum, I found that yes, it MIGHT be in the plaster. Thats why I have not gone any further with my work on the ceiling. I have stopped mid-stream.

As far as seeing my doctor, well, since my homeowners insurance has gone from $1200 to $4000 a year in just 6 years, I could not afford the health insurance. So going to a doctor is out of the question. If ANY insurance company ever found out I had a bad exposure to asbestos, then I would never be able to get health insurance again, besides, from what I have read, there is nothing a doctor could do for me now. I'll just have to waite until I get the test results of the plaster.


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## Krichton (May 2, 2006)

Asbestos is in everything. Plaster, mastic glue, insulation, vinly tile, linoleum, siding.


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## Speedy Petey (Feb 1, 2004)

bofusmosby said:


> ....., he also stated that even IF I have been exposed to a high amout, the exposure over a few weeks in not nearly as bad as working with this for years. He told me to not worry, and just send in the samples.


BINGO!
This is straight from a professional.





billie_t said:


> i have been in an asbestos study for the last two years..i have been educated first hand by experts (allthough that doesnt make me one) and am passing along information i have been given...believe it or not.... it is your health


Well, I thought were done too. 
IMO this quote above speaks volumes. 
You are in an asbestos study? So you are being "educated" on this are you? By whom??? 
You are being told just what they want to tell you. Studies are a joke many times. I bet there is a pharmaceutical, or medical, or insurance company behind this "study". That can come up with whatever results they want and will have a bunch of good little soldiers to fight for them when they are done.

Just like those TV ads for #%*@# asbestos lawyers. Saying if you've EVER been "exposed" to asbestos you can sue everyone in the northern hemisphere and get millions of dollars because someone wronged you.


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## billie_t (Feb 17, 2008)

pete..i am in a study.yes..will i ever be compensated for what is now in my lungs...NO..i volenteered for this study like everyone else in it..so that more can be found out about it..and possably some better treatments..the study is a joint venture, funded by local unions..government health care and the WCB..so i guess you could say evryone funding the thing has different "agendas" as you would like to have me believe...the unions want what is best for their members...the health care maybe want money and jobs..and the WCB wants to prove there is no danger (like you seem to think) so they will never have to pay anything out.....i would like the think those nodules in my lungs and the scar tissue is only a shadow in the MRI scan or that tomorrow morning i have one big honking cough and spit them out and live for another 40 years but i realize it aint going to happen..i jus t live like they are not there and hope each time i have an MRI it comes back...no change.

you may think i am a chicken little...and a scare monger...i assure you i am not...i have said a one time exposer is likely a safe bet that you wont die from asbestos...but why take the chance?

and this all started with a fellow whom went into his attic and from what i could gather from his post...had no idea of what he had really done...which could be..expose himself in the attic...come back down from the attice with this stuff in his hair..on his clothes...and quite possably exposed his family members...so i tried to tell him the dangers of asbestos so he would 1..not do it again without proper equipment and 2... clean up every thing he could where he was to eliminate any further exposure from particles that may have come back down from the attic with him

i did not come here to get in a pissing match with you..
you are entitled to believe that what ever you want about asbestos as i am..
and everyone else whom reads this forum can take what they want from it as well....i only hope anything i have posted helps in others getting educated and making their own mind up about if it could harm them or not 
THE END for sure..lol


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## elkangorito (Sep 10, 2007)

I think that "quality of life", as one chooses it, is all important here. If you are a smoker & get enjoyment from it, good for you. I'm sure you're well aware of the dangers. A smoker may also know that if they stop smoking, their lungs may "clear" after a period of time unlike the lungs of a person who has breathed asbestos. Mind you, smoking is considered a "pleasure" amongst many people. I've never met one person who claims that getting an electric shock is pleasurable, although I'm sure that these people are around. Nor have I met anyone who finds that breathing asbestos dust is pleasurable. I don't know if any such people exist.

If you fear walking out of your front door because;
1. you might catch a disease or
2. you might get hit by an automobile or
3. you might get shot/attacked,

then you are living in fear with little to no quality of life. I'm sure that billie_t will agree with this.

I feel that the "chicken littles" here, are not the type of people to worry about points 1 to 3 above. I do believe that they support the idea of "pleasure" & "quality of life" as perceived by the individual.

For example, my grandfather died at 88. He died of old age, although he did smoke since he was 9 years old. At 75, he had a mild infarction (a mild heart attack). The doctor & thence my grandmother, banned him from smoking. I used to "sneak" him cigarettes & we would go to the shed to smoke. He told me, "Robert, don't let anybody tell you how to live your life. It's your life & you can do with it what you want, no matter how bad it is for you." Quite simply, he got great pleasure from smoking. He suffered greatly when the "cigarette police" came into being. His quality of life diminished greatly.
But this is about "simple pleasures"...& not doing things that harm you when there is no pleasure involved in doing so.

All I can say is that if you get any pleasure from breathing in asbestos dust, you should market the product. Since nobody I know gets pleasure from such a thing, you'll be wasting your money. To those who think that suicidal people may choose to buy such a product, I don't think that they will have the patience to wait 20 to 40 years for "death" to happen.


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## bofusmosby (Apr 30, 2007)

Well, I just got back the report on my plaster worries concerning the possibility of being made with asbestos. I am happy to report that the test results came back negative! I apprecaite all the info about asbestos, and about all the different products that did have asbestos in it. Now I can get back to work, and finish up my ceiling.

Thanks guys for the feedback. A person can never be too informed when it comes to ones health!


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