# GAF Timberline Shingles



## kangaroofer

Hi all, I am new here...and fairly new to the roofing business as well.
Just a quick question, does anyone know approx. how many shingles of the GAF Timberline come in a bundle?

Thanks!


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## oldfrt

1/3 square or 33 1/3 sq/ft


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## kangaroofer

oldfrt said:


> 1/3 square or 33 1/3 sq/ft


 
Thanks for your quick reply. That is what I thought, but what I really want to know is how many actual shingles come in the bundle?

Kangaroofer


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## Slyfox

Usually 26 shingles per bundle, sometimes 25.

If your a roofing contractor you should introduce your self in the Contractor Talk forum and ask future questions about your/our trade there.
This is a sister forum gauged toward home owners seeking advice in DIY projects or questions about hiring contractors to do it for them.


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## oldfrt

Slyfox said:


> Usually 26 shingles per bundle, sometimes 25.
> 
> If your a roofing contractor you should introduce your self in the Contractor Talk forum and ask future questions about your/our trade there.
> This is a sister forum gauged toward home owners seeking advice in DIY projects or questions about hiring contractors to do it for them.


 If you go to CT,fill out your profile first,introduce yourself,and pre read some threads to get a feel for the site before posting anything that may get you roasted.


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## Scuba_Dave

The latests GAF shingles were ~39" long & less per bundle
Not sure why they changed the length?


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## Slyfox

I know some plants produce metric and some standard which is the same for all the manufacturers.


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## Ed the Roofer

Metric sizes or US Standard measurement sizes?

Also, with your User Name, are you a Member of RSI, Roofers Success International?

That "Joey" for your avatar is one of their trademarked logo Images.

Ed


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## kangaroofer

Ed the Roofer said:


> Metric sizes or US Standard measurement sizes?
> 
> Also, with your User Name, are you a Member of RSI, Roofers Success International?
> 
> That "Joey" for your avatar is one of their trademarked logo Images.
> 
> Ed


Ed, No I am not, I found that Kangaroo on Google images and just copied it as I found it suited the name. I suppose I should remove it? Oops


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## paul100

oldfrt said:


> 1/3 square or 33 1/3 sq/ft


 
It depends on which timberline shingle you are using. The heavier wieght (longer warranty) shingles come four bundles to a square.


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## Ed the Roofer

kangaroofer said:


> Ed, No I am not, I found that Kangaroo on Google images and just copied it as I found it suited the name. I suppose I should remove it? Oops


It was very close to the one, but not actually the same.

But for your reading pleasure and visual enjoyment, please check out one of our internet friends website to see why I said what I did.

http://www.brinkroofingcompany.com/

*Yours:*

 



*His:*













Ed





.


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## sheltonfox

*too few shingles per bundle*

I have GAF timberline 30 shingles which are labeled as 3 bundles = 1 square and "at least 20 shingles per bundle" and '5 5/8" exposure per course'. 

Actually, each bundle contains 20 shingles. A shingle is 39 1/4" long and is suitable for 5 1/2" exposure. That works out to 30 sq ft per bundle or 10% less than labeled. 
Even if applied with 5 5/8" exposure which reveals slightly more than obviously intended, a bundle covers less than 30.7 sq ft which is 3 bundles per 92 sq ft. 

Did I compute incorrectly? OR Is there a class action regarding this fraud? Is GAF offering any kind of refund?


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## Slyfox

Did I compute incorrectly?

Yes.


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## sheltonfox

please be more specific as to what is incorrect

39.25" x 5.5" x 20 pc/bundle / 144 sq in/sq ft = ~30 sq ft/bundle


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## KarlJay

So the longer life shingles have less per bundle? I thought 3/sq was some kinda standard, this means I have to buy more bundles yet the per bundle price is a bit more.


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## KarlJay

Just checked HD and 30 year dim is 33.3 vs limited lifetime at 25 $66/sq vs $88/sq


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## sheltonfox

printed on the package is 3 bundles per square, i.e., 33.33 sq ft per bundle. Actual contents of package is 30 sq ft


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## Slyfox

KarlJay said:


> So the longer life shingles have less per bundle? I thought 3/sq was some kinda standard, this means I have to buy more bundles yet the per bundle price is a bit more.



Yes, some shingle brands have 4 and 5 bundles per square.


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## Slyfox

sheltonfox said:


> printed on the package is 3 bundles per square, i.e., 33.33 sq ft per bundle. Actual contents of package is 30 sq ft




Fiberglass Asphalt Construction
Standard weight design
30-Year Ltd. Transferable Warranty
5 Yr. Smart Choice® Protection
100 mph Ltd. Wind Warranty1
StainGuard® ltd. warranty (available in all areas except the Western Region)
Listed Class A Fire – UL 790
Passes UL 997 Wind Test, modified to 110 mph3
ASTM D7158, Class H
ASTM D3161 Type 1, Class F3
ASTM D3018 Type 1
ASTM D34623
CSA A123.5-98
Dade County approved3
ICC Report Approval3
Florida Building Code approved
Texas Department of Insurance3
Approx. 64 Pieces/Sq. (Metric)
Approx. 78 Pieces/Sq. (English)
Approx. 3 Bundles/Square
Approx. 256 Nails/Sq. (Metric)
Approx. 312 Nails/Sq. (English)
Exposure: 5 5/8" (Metric)
Exposure: 5" (English)


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## Slyfox

sheltonfox said:


> printed on the package is 3 bundles per square, i.e., 33.33 sq ft per bundle. Actual contents of package is 30 sq ft


If you go through 1000 consecutive bundles and find each bundle two shingles short of the norm '22' you may have a legal standing to accuse them of fraud, but if it happens once or twice in several thousand bundles than it's an exceptable mechanical/machinery error that happens from time to time.


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## MJW

Notice they say "approximate". You can easily notice many bundles being thicker than some of the others while unloading. Noticed it with a few different brands, not just GAF.

The Timberlines we put on today were so thin, I can't believe they can warrant putting a per square weight on them. They sure do cut easy though.


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## sheltonfox

I counted the shingles in eleven bundles at home plus several bundles at The Home Depot. Each of those bundles had only 20 shingles. A bundle with 22 shingles would still be a bit short.

Mr slyfox posted that I had computed the area incorrectly. I have not seen his explaination of what I did incorrectly.


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## KarlJay

...
Approx 256 nails/sq. (metric)
Approx 312 nails/sq. (English)

What?! English sq is different than Metric sq ?
I thought 100 sq ft = 1 sq

Also 312 nails/sq. = 4.7 per sheet (assuming 66/sq) and 5.2 if you get 20/bundle for a total of 60.

I thought 4 nails per were the standard

So I guess the question is: how many shingles make 1 sq and how many nails are used for each one.


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## sheltonfox

The poster quotes the package as having:

Approx. 64 Pieces/Sq. (Metric) 
Approx. 78 Pieces/Sq. (English) 
Approx. 3 Bundles/Square 
Approx. 256 Nails/Sq. (Metric) 
Approx. 312 Nails/Sq. (English) 
Exposure: 5 5/8" (Metric) 
Exposure: 5" (English) 

The exposure (metric) of 5 5/8 is somewhat inadequate. However, using that exposure, the area of 64 metric pieces is:

64 x 39.25 x 5.625 / 144 = 97.9

A square is 100 sq ft and not 97.9 sq ft. 65 pieces yields only 99.4 sq ft.

BTW, GAF recommends six nails per piece for enhanced wind resistance. The value 256 is 64 x 4.


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## sheltonfox

the older (discontinued?) "english" size shingles are smaller; therefore more pieces to the square.


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## Slyfox

sheltonfox said:


> I counted the shingles in eleven bundles at home plus several bundles at The Home Depot. Each of those bundles had only 20 shingles. A bundle with 22 shingles would still be a bit short.
> 
> Mr slyfox posted that I had computed the area incorrectly. I have not seen his explaination of what I did incorrectly.


 
I posted my explanation, all you need do is notice the Approx- comment made by the manufacturer.
I wasn't trying to tell you you can't add/multiply, just that you were not fully reading the manufacturers spec's.

I have no idea why you found so many bundles with only 20 shingles,
if it happened to me I would be letting the sales rep at the supply store I purchased them from and he would reinburst me.


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## seeyou

Slyfox said:


> I posted my explanation, all you need do is notice the Approx- comment made by the manufacturer.
> I wasn't trying to tell you you can't add/multiply, just that you were not fully reading the manufacturers spec's.
> 
> *I have no idea why you found so many bundles with only 20 shingles,
> if it happened to me I would be letting the sales rep at the supply store I purchased them from and he would reinburst me*.


I'm gonna have to count some bundles. We've been running a little short frequently.


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## MJW

Talk to your Rep or supply store Salesman guys. There have been recent changes in the "approximation". 3 bundles doesn't necessarily mean 100 square feet.


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## Slyfox

seeyou said:


> I'm gonna have to count some bundles. We've been running a little short frequently.


The last time I had an abundant of light bundles delivered was back in April/May of this year with a Certainteed Landmark job I did, I called the supplier and they took care of the issue.

Had it happen a couple times with OC, never with Gaf/Elk or Tamko.
Not sure about IKO or Atlas.

Atlas was actually giving us 100+square feet per square for years but than they realized it and shortened the length of their shingles.


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## Gringo Jon

*Shingles per square*

Elk changed the length of the shingle to try to keep out mixing of the different grades of roofing.
"English Cut" refers to the original pattern of Timberline with a 5" exposure. Most factories run the 5 5/8" metric.
When I was an installer the 5" shingles came 81 per square, meaning 27 per bundle. The metric Elk three tab, long gone, had 63 per square or 21 per square.
My concern is that most people don't know that the GAF floor shingles at Home Depot have less curb appeal, or less blending, and have less of a wind warranty than the standard High Definition Timberline most professional roofing companies use. I really wouldn't be surprised if they weigh less too. With all of Home Depot's buying power they could have special runs of material that are inferior in many ways.
We have bought 3n1's, also called auto caulks, at Home Depot that had the grommet completely disintegrate in four years. This has never happened with the same flashings we've purchased at roofing wholesalers.
They also get you on the nail weight and quality. The metal stacks are caulked and not soldered and I've seen felt there that when torn was white in the middle.
I've been a roofing contractor in Dallas for 31 years and was an installer in high school and college. We are Master Elites for GAF and Master Rooers for Certainteed. I believe the products are comparable. Tamko is fine. Owens Corning is mediocre but getting better. Atlas, Malarkey, and Pabco are awful and morally devoid. The only word Atlas and Malarkey's warranty departments know is "no." I'm not even going to take a chance on Pabco.


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## APHomeImp

Slyfox said:


> Usually 26 shingles per bundle, sometimes 25.
> 
> If your a roofing contractor you should introduce your self in the Contractor Talk forum and ask future questions about your/our trade there.
> This is a sister forum gauged toward home owners seeking advice in DIY projects or questions about hiring contractors to do it for them.


 
How and where do i find the contractor talk forum? can you provide a link?


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## seeyou

APHomeImp said:


> How and where do i find the contractor talk forum? can you provide a link?


http://www.contractortalk.com


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