# ProClassic for trim



## ToolSeeker (Sep 19, 2012)

Yes the latex version is really my go for trim. Have used both but not very much with the waterborne. I really thought the latex was better for base and trim which was brushed the waterborne was sprayed so really maybe not a good comparison.


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## Jmayspaint (May 4, 2013)

I guess your looking for a comparison between the two. I have not yet used the hybrid variety, but do like the regular PC for trim work. It does has a propensity to run (most any good leveling paint does) but the leveling is far superior to Superpaint for sure. 

If you go with the regular PC for the rest of your trim, let us know how you compare two.


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

i have used both. Hybrid version dries more and looks more well like oil. Takes longer to dry kind of seems to have a stick to it for a bit. As far as hardness hybrid may be marginally harder. But key is hybrid will look better IMO. Levels better and dried looking more like an oil. Any latex semi don't matter the kind will never have same seen and look as oil semi, The hybrid is just there to try to change that. When oil semi dries it looks more like your car if you will. Like there is a smooth layer of clear over top of the color. Not sure if any of that info helps you,


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

Did you find the hybrid more difficult to work with in terms of drips and sags? If the latex is going to make fewer problems for me, I'm OK with the looks. I'm sure the ProClassic will look at least as good and maybe marginally better than, say, SuperPaint for trim, if only because of the better leveling. So I can live with the look, but if it's going to be just as difficult as the hybrid, I see no reason to use it.


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

i spray all my trim. that said hybrid will be more problems for you. Just like an oil it has that extra time to level which means sags and or runs. to be honest SW is not my go to paint but i have used them. If your going to go with SW than the normal latex will be easier if you will to use.


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

I have it in my head that since I did the living room with SW, I want to continue the rest of the house with the exact same color. But I'm sure it can be color matched if you have a recommendation for another all latex semi-gloss that you think would level well.


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

thats a scary question. Its like asking a GMC lover to recommend u a truck other than what he loves. Every 1 on this forum will have there own fav paint or there own go to super paint. it all comes down to whats the best product for the price your willing to spend. I have painted 100s of custom homes as well as appt and larger commercial jobs like teachers board and malls. Im happy to help you with any products or methods u may have questions about. Just PM and we can go into more detail.


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

Oh don't worry, we mention that stuff here all the time. Even if you say Behr I'm fine with it! I have accounts at SW and BM and have also used Behr, Valspar, Duron, ICI Dulux, etc.


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

i like a product called Monamel from General Paints. Its really just a waterborne melamine enamel. Levels nice and goes insanely hard. i use it on all trim. Proclassic is a great product just extremely over priced imo.


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## ToolSeeker (Sep 19, 2012)

From what I'm reading General Paint is a Sherwin Williams company. I have used SW for years and don't remember seeing it. Is it just a local paint ? Clean-up with mineral spirits isn't that a pita though?


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

SW just bought general. They won't have it at a sw. U need to buy from a general paint location.


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

Sorry its waterborne clean with soap and water.


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

I have never even heard of General, I suppose because you're in Canada? Anyway, Monamel sounds like a good paint for shelves and kitchen cabinets.


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

i like it on trim. I never use it on cabinets. Any normal waterborne paint i dont care who makes it or what it claims is not cabinet/furniture grade. Not monamel not benny more advance or SW pro classic to name the more commonly used. If i ever do cabinets, stairs, selves ext i only use Pre-Cat Epoxy. 5-10 times harder as well as chemical resistant for cleaners grease and so on. Thats just me tho. here are some picks i have used of pre-cat (cabinets) and Trim in Monocoat fireplace in pre-cat


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

Since you brought it up alpha, can you explain to me how a single component paint can be an epoxy? I was in a SW store the other day and we had some time to kill and there were no other customers, so the girl was showing me a can of epoxy. The only way I can imagine it can work is that oxygen is literally a catalyst for it. Otherwise, how can it be an epoxy? Obviously I understand how hard epoxies can be, and why they'd be good for cabinets. I've used them for garage floors (real 2 part epoxies.)


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

well im not a scientist so don't take this as fact, Just my own thoughts. Most paints work under same printable of evaporation. Whether its oil or water based. The age old idea that oil is harder than water is not really correct any more. Just because something is water based (clean up with water) does not mean its weaker. Hence precat epoxy. Where most high grade epoxy come in a 2 piece kit this cure from a chemical reaction. That is why it heats up when u mix it and why it has a pot life of say 30 min. Unlike oil or latex based that cure from the exterior in much like a oven cooks. outside-in. 2 parts cure as if it where in an oven and microwave at once. Outside and inside. Now as far as Pre cat it has an unlimited pot life because instead of a chemical it dried from evaporation. All the main components are there to make an epoxy there just suspended in water until the water evaporates. Different at a chemical level. Thats the basic ideas as far as im aware. I do alot of commercial and industrial work lol.


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## Jmayspaint (May 4, 2013)

I don't think it is single component Jeff, technically anyway. Pre-Catalyzed implies that the catalyst has already been added. 

Im not sure either but Alpha's explanation sounds about right. Something like the reaction happens after, or during evaporation of the water.


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

Interesting. So you're saying it's a 2-part epoxy, premixed, but it doesn't cure until the water evaporates. Interesting chemistry. I have always thought that so-called 1-part epoxies were a scam. Or maybe some are and some aren't.

I have never trusted this, for example. But they don't even pretend it's a 2 part epoxy. It seems there might be a difference between premixed 2-part epoxy in a single can, and whatever they are calling 1-part epoxy, which to me means it's not really epoxy.
http://www.behr.com/consumer/produc...ne-part-epoxy-concrete-and-garage-floor-paint


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

the link u posted is the same printable as pre cat. both are waterborne. I mind you its probably overkill for trim unless you never want to have to do it again for around 20 years lol.


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

any thing that's 2 part mixed in 1 can is impossible. As i said the chemical reaction would start to take place. Buy the time u purchased the can, took it home and opened it. It would be a brick lol. When the 2 parts mix its called canalizing. Than they go hard. ill try do draw a little demo bare with me 

this is 2 part part 1 ###### part 2 $$$$$$ when u mix them you get #$#$#$#$# that starts the chemical reaction. Finish result is &&&&&&&&. The 2 parts combine to make a new sold product instead of a liquid. 

1 part looks like this #--$--#--$--#--$--#--$--#--$ the parts are the same except now there is water. that's the --. as it starts to dry you get #-$-#-$. less water until finally they meet #$#$#$#$ and once again final result is &&&&&&. 

sorry if that made no sense at all to you


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## Jmayspaint (May 4, 2013)

Well the reactions take place over different time intervals with different products. Certainly some two part products have a very short pot life and are dry in a few hours after mixing, but not all of them. 
For example the SW Pre-Cat lacquer I use. It's catalyzed at the moment of purchase* and has a pot life of 6 months after that. 

The waterborne stuff has a shelf life of three years. I'm curious if its the same principal on a longer time scale that allows it to be "catalyzed" at the factory. 

*not in all cases


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

Your correct. I have used 2 parts with a 2 hour pot life. I have used 2 part with a 20 min pot life. AS far as catalyzed at the production plant (pre-cat) i beleive it not Catalyzed in the sense your thinking. I don't believe the product is Catalyzed until the water starts to evaporate and the 2 parts meet. I could be wrong tho don't take this as fact.


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## jeffnc (Apr 1, 2011)

AlphaWolf said:


> any thing that's 2 part mixed in 1 can is impossible. As i said the chemical reaction would start to take place. Buy the time u purchased the can, took it home and opened it. It would be a brick lol. When the 2 parts mix its called canalizing. Than they go hard. ill try do draw a little demo bare with me
> 
> this is 2 part part 1 ###### part 2 $$$$$$ when u mix them you get #$#$#$#$# that starts the chemical reaction. Finish result is &&&&&&&&. The 2 parts combine to make a new sold product instead of a liquid.
> 
> ...


I assume you meant catalyzing.

I see what you mean, but there must be more to it than that. You drew a linear progression in 2D, but in 3D liquid in the can, the # molecules and $ molecules would actually be bumping into each and catalyzing. Maybe the way it works is that the water molecules somehow chemically block the bonding spots for the # and $ molecules, and it's not until the water evaporates that the bonding sites are exposed, allowing the molecules to bond.


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

Sounds good to me lol. AS i said not a scientist. That was my best guess. But either way 1 parts a real spread the word  Also let us know how your trim goes for you and toss us some pictures. We like pictures.


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