# Rack and pinion.



## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

Don't everyone reply at once.


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## Jay 78 (Mar 2, 2011)

Ah...the beloved Ford power steering pump whine.

Are you using auto tranny fluid in it? Yes, I'm being serious.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

I don't know what's in there but it doesn't look good. I know you can use tranny fluid, one mechanic said the only difference between that and power steering fluid is an additive that makes a difference in color only. 

Another mechanic yesterday said I had to use Motorcraft power steering in Ford or it'll whine. 

Can the rack and pinion clear up or am I going to have to replace it? I guess I'll be finding out today regardless.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

Looks like I'm going to be replacing the rack and pinion.


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## sublime2 (Mar 21, 2012)

How about the supply lines? Maybe one has collapsed or is clogged?


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

I spoke with a mechanic who I've used before a few times. He said it's highly unlikely the rack and pinion will loosen up with a flush, of which I have yet to do. 

He said he'll flush it out, he has the machine to do it, but then if it doesn't work then I'll be looking at around $800 total, of which I'm sure he'll drop the flush charge. 

Thing is I can buy the entire set up, the rack and pinion, for $204 (Advance Auto Parts) and change walk out. Of that I'll receive a $90 core charge back. Then another mechanic will come to the house and do the job for $100 flat. That means I can get away with an entire new rack and pinion complete install for $214 total. But if I go to the other guy who I've used before and who has high overhead as he has a big shop and employees than it can cost me another $600. And if it the flush doesn't work and I end up using the other guy then I'll have lost $60.

I figure for $214 for an entirely new steering system, I've already had the new pump installed which only cost me $40 for the part, it's worth it to just get it over with. 

I'm taking it to the shop in the morning to see if a flush may be worth it, but like the guy said, most likely it won't work.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

The biggest thing is if I want to gamble with that $60. I just quit my job.


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## cjm94 (Sep 25, 2011)

I work at a ford dealer they come using atf no special fluids. And you are looking at a rack...if flushing works it will be short lived.


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## D-rock (May 23, 2011)

Not familiar with Ford pumps, but I doubt advance auto parts rack and pump will last too long either.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

D-rock said:


> Not familiar with Ford pumps, but I doubt advance auto parts rack and pump will last too long either.


 
Lifetime warranty!


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

This thing is a '98 that I paid $1350 dollars total for. I'm not going to the dealership for parts. :no:


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

An update. I just came back from having the system flushed and filled. No change but the mechanic noticed that the pump was not pumping properly. 

Great. He said that Ford power steering pumps are junk to begin with and if this one was a rebuilt from Advance Auto Parts than two plus two equals four. 

I called the other mechanic who's coming in the morning and told him what the first guy said and he agreed, told me a story about a friend of his who had to change the pump three times before finding one that actually worked.  

So now we may be changing the pump first, it's under warranty so that part is free, and seeing if that changes anything. If not then the rack and pinion.


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## Blujen56 (Apr 2, 2012)

*Rack and Pinion*

Your problem is contaminated system. If the fluid is as bad as you say, replacing the rack ans pump is the only option. Flushing is maintenance not repair. Advance should replace pump under warranty, get a new rack and it wouldn't hurt to replace both lines. After you replace the rack, you will need an alignment or at the least a toe in adjustment. You are wasting money and time doing anything else.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

I have a feeling that's what's going to have to happen. Most likely we'll start again with another new/rebuilt pump from Advance and then do the rack. 

Thanks for the insight.


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## Blujen56 (Apr 2, 2012)

*Rack and Pinion*

You're welcome, should take care of your problem :thumbsup:


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

New news; front end up in the air and everything works fine. Dood looked at the rack and pinion to find an adjustment, said it doesn't have one. I have some play in the wheels as well, tie rod ends. I'll get to that later.

Anyways, he thinks the rack and pinion is fine, stating that if the front end was up in the air and it was still hard to turn then the rack would be the issue but since it's turning easily than that's most likely not it. 

Next he notices that my tesnioner pulley is locked up meaning it's an automatic tensioner but it's stuck in the hardest position. The wheel on it is spinning so no problems there but the tension on the surpentine belt is way too tight. 

He also checked the pulley on the power steering pump, saying it was not loose enough, should spin much more freely, so the pump is not working properly either. 

I just bought the new tensioner and a new pump. Starting with the tensioner first. 

PS, on the new pump there is a sticker saying that the tension of the belt is very important and that too tight can cause serious damage to the pump.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)




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## Marqed97 (Mar 19, 2011)

I've always used amsoil ATF in my old ford generation II pumps...gets rid of the whine. At our dealership we have a friction additive that quiets them down too. But yeah, even with OEM pumps I've gotten several duds. I've replaced more R&P assemblies on windstars than I care to remember.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

Marqed97 said:


> I've always used amsoil ATF in my old ford generation II pumps...gets rid of the whine. At our dealership we have a friction additive that quiets them down too. But yeah, even with OEM pumps I've gotten several duds. I've replaced more R&P assemblies on windstars than I care to remember.


I keep hearing different things from different people concerning the fluid. Someone on here has already stated that atf is fine. Then a mechanic down the road from me who I stopped by to see if he can do the flush the other day said you can ony use Motorcraft power steering on Fords. Yesterday, after having the system flushed at another mechanic's shop, he filled it with atf, saying it was fine and cheaper. 

Today, this guy who's out on my driveway currently working on the van, said to ony use power steering fluid, protects the seals and is a lighter grade fluid.

Maybe I'll just mix it all together and make my own dang fluid. 

Ps, I'm hoping I can get away with it not being the r and p. I'll find out shortly.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

I just bought a new (remanufactured) rack and pinion. New pulley, new power steering pump and now the rack. 

So much for hoping...:thumbup:


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## Marqed97 (Mar 19, 2011)

Figured as long as I'm doing some training I'd take a gander in the ford workshop manuals to see what the 'official' fluid spec is. For a 98 windstar it says 'MERCON Automatic Transmission Fluid'. Hope this helps.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

Thanks for any and all help, it's always appreciated. Say hullo 2 meye littuh fren..


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## Marqed97 (Mar 19, 2011)

Hey, no prob. Stuck in a hotel 200 miles from home for Ford Factory Training anyway, gotta stay busy... I hate replacing racks. Always end up with ATF in my hair.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

Wish you would've posted the info on the fluid a few hours ago. I've already purchased six quarts of OEM power sterring fluid. 

Anyways, out with the old and in with the new.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

And that's all folks. Just a front end alignment in the morning to complete the job but now, with the new tensioner that can actually move, the new power steering pump and the new rack and pinion, I can blow on the steering wheel and it turns. Like butter as they say.

Thanks for all the insight everyone.


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## Marty1Mc (Mar 19, 2011)

Here is a link to Ford's TSB updating to Mercron V. Doc, if you put in power steering fluid, I would flush it out with the right product. 

http://www.stangnet.com/images/stories/docs/s197_TSBs/07-01-07.pdf 


Your Windstar is listed as using Mercron V.


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## Marqed97 (Mar 19, 2011)

As long as it's ATF you'll be fine. Just don't use regular 'power steering fluid'. That TSB was just the official notice to use mercV instead of Mercon since Mercon was phased out. MercV became the standard transmission fluid in the mid to late 90's. Since it doesn't make sense to stock an obsolete fluid just for PS systems, they decided mercV would be fine.


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## Marty1Mc (Mar 19, 2011)

Marqed97 said:


> As long as it's ATF you'll be fine. Just don't use regular 'power steering fluid'. That TSB was just the official notice to use mercV instead of Mercon since Mercon was phased out. MercV became the standard transmission fluid in the mid to late 90's. Since it doesn't make sense to stock an obsolete fluid just for PS systems, they decided mercV would be fine.



Agreed. But Doc stated he had "6 qts of power steering fluid" and wasn't sure what was supposed to be used. The notice simply clears doubt as to ATF or PS fluid.


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## Doc Holliday (Mar 12, 2011)

I used Advance Auto Parts brand ps fluid. It states for Gm, Ford and Chrysler vehicles.


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## Marty1Mc (Mar 19, 2011)

Doc Holliday said:


> I used Advance Auto Parts brand ps fluid. It states for Gm, Ford and Chrysler vehicles.


Personally, I would put the right stuff in there. It can be a pain to flush some systems, but if you can extend the return line to the reservoir, then it's not bad at all. 

I have seen tons of comments where it's stated "Power steering fluid and ATF are the same." If that was true, then it would be fine to put PS fluid in an automatic transmission, but you won't find anyone recommending that.

I have also seen plenty of systems running the wrong fluid (PS vs ATF) and work fine. Does it really matter? It's a debate you will find tons of pages of discussion, but no clear cut answers. I have also seen systems running PS instead of ATF fail. Was it due to the wrong fluid? Who really knows.

For me, if I went through all of the hassle to change out the entire system, I wouldn't short cut the last step. If it turns out it does matter, and your system fails in a year or two, what have you gained? I run the recommended fluid, period.


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